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Is there anyone who have won against tau with the new orks codex and would like to share tips ans tactics.

What units worked?
usefull tactics?

thanks in advance

Managed it (barely) in a solo test game last night.

The lists:

Tau:
Cadre Fireblade
12x Fire warriors
15x Sniper Kroot
Riptide - Ion, Stims, EWO

Orks:
Painboy
9x Shoota Boys, 1x Big shoota
10x Gretchin, 1x Runtherd w/ squig hound
Morkanaut - KFF
Mek Gunz - 3 Lobbas

What worked:
The morkanaut at AV13 proved immutable to the tau firepower, except once a riptide got a lucky glancing hit off on it with the Ion Accelerator. The Riptide eventually got caught up in CC with the morkanaut where they slugged it out for 2 or 3 turns, but the morkanaut won out in the end with the claw of MORK.
The lobbas were amazing, for the points. the barrages were the only thing that inflicted casualties on the tau lines except for a few stray shots and cc from the morkanaut.

What didn't work:
Infantry. The tau obliterated each of my infantry units in a single shooting phase. Ripple-fire SMS, overcharged ion Blasts, and waves of pulse rifle fire cut through my boy's KFF and FNP like butter. I had the infiltrate USR warlord trait, i should have outflanked the shoota boys.

How the game ended:

Tau took an early lead on VP's through objectives, slay warlord, and first blood. The orks struggled to catch up, but managed to get the morkanaut into CC with the riptide. After the tau's heavy hitter died, the morkanaut was left to mop up. the game went fully to turn 7, and if the cadre fireblade's unit had not fallen back and failed to regroup on turn 7, the tau would have (rightfully) won 9-4 at endgame. As it stood, the falling back fire warriors and HQ were removed as casualties and so the tau counted as tabled at end of game. Orks won, but undeservedly so, based on casualties and VP differential.

Ideas going forward:

If you know you're facing tau ahead of time, i would place favor on the following units: (this is based on my experience as a tau player, i am very new at orks right now)

-Battlewagons. Aside from fusion blasters (who takes those?) Tau struggle vs high AV at range. A battle wagon or 2 can help get those boyz across the table, where they want to be.

-Stompa - AV13 super heavy with 12 Hull points. fill it with meks to repair the inevitable damage, upgrade it to 5 supa-rokkits and rain large blast death across the tau lines.

-Mork/Gorkanaut - this is only about a 1/2 recommendation. A unit of tank-hunting broadsides with missiles can glance one of these to death faster than you might think. A KFF helps but isn't a surefire save. I think they're handy but not required.

-Artillery - Lobbas, lobbas, lobbas! Even vs crisis suits, a full sized unit of lobbas can put so many wounds on a target that they eventually fail their saves. The range and barrage fire mode lets you put them in a safe place while they cause damage. Give each gun an ammo runt if you have points, and use those models to find the first shot with a re-roll. Very effective.

-Anything Fast - Bikes, Deffkoptas, Trukk-missiles, etc. If it can get into the tau DZ, and quickly - do it. Expect casualties on the way in. Expect a lot of casualties. But it only takes a few boyz making it into combat to eviscerate a fire warrior or even a kroot unit.

Fortifications - a firestorm redoubt with 2 battle cannons, or a fortress of redemption with a krakstorm missile launcher and icarus lascannon are points-expensive - but they give a great place to plunk down your lootas as well as offer some blistering high-strength firepower to match (or outmatch) what the tau can bring to bear.

Luck - you'll need a ton of it, and good luck to boot. Tau vs Orks is as lopsided a matchup as Dark Eldar vs Tyranids. Their strength matches the enemy weakness to a fault.

This may not help, but I did play my Tau againts an Ork force at my local Tueday night 500 point game. From my perspective, the thing that killed me was a 30 boyz mob all with 'eavy armour and a pain boy providing FNP. Between the 4+ armour saves and the 5+ FNP on 30 boyz, I could not kill them dead enough quickly enough. You can check out the battle report here:
http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/603086.page

Thanks for the help.

So, lobbas and fortifications...fun...really... (Edit) Not aimed at you tetrisphreak, just hate being forced by lack of game balance.

Is there really no hope at all?

I was planning to take a number of large boyz mobs (4x30) and some deffkoptas for outflanking but i have to choose between painboy, mek and warboss.

Lots of fast and tough targets.

Lots of Battlewagonz full of meganobz/boyz. They're tougher than before with lower chances of exploding outright.
Lots of bikers - even if tau do ignore their 3+ cover, they need to waste all the markers for it.
Serious backfield support. Lobbas have alwayz worked vs tau and now they're even better.

Footslogging hordes don't work in general - leave alone tau and such. Too slow. Too vulnerable.

With 4 squads of 30 you could to two CAD and then have more HQ's which seems to be your initial problem. There is some hope though I personally think it is in Mek Gunz and the ability to take 10 Lobbas or Kannons and then bomb the crap out of their lines and hope that you can weather the storm of bullets.

In personal experience Tau are one of the hardest things to fight for my orks. I used to run Green Tide in 6th at 1k and 1500 pts. What almost always happened was that the KFF would be negated by marker lights and then just get shot to bits. Now it is slightly different with being able to take painboyz and being able to make all our mobs 'ard boyz.

If you are thinking of the big mobs then I would suggest a few being 'ard boyz up front to absorb large hunks of firepower that your other boyz can't handle.

On one final note though Defkoptas are hilarious for suprising the heck out of Tau players as they scout, move, turbo boost and are sitting literally 2 inches away from their most valuable units! Makes them get super jumpy and honestly psycological warfare like that is just plain fun. Bikes do this to a far less extent.

The problem with koptas is that you can't take a nob in there. Note that even regular firewarriors can beat 1-2 koptas in mellee if they manage to stay in combat after you've charged. And crysis suits have real chances of beating koptas in mellee.

More interesting stuff. Switching from my Tau hat to my Orky hat, it sounds like my investment in 8 Deffkoptas might be a good thing. After GenCon I hope to pad my force up to 2 full squads of Deffkoptas.

I figure a force with 2 deffkopta squads and then boys for the rest should be ok at lower points.

Thanks,
Duncan

The more units you can field - the better. It's alwayz better to have 3,3 and 2 rather than 4 and 4. In 6 i've even used single koptas as distraction. They work vs tau forcing to waste fire on them inevitably resulting in overkill.

 koooaei wrote:
The more units you can field - the better. It's alwayz better to have 3,3 and 2 rather than 4 and 4. In 6 i've even used single koptas as distraction. They work vs tau forcing to waste fire on them inevitably resulting in overkill.

I can see that being effective either 6 koptas charge and bog you down or you individually kill them all with what would certainly be overkill

gona have to bash up some koptas!

Stormboyz would be good

I didn't realize it was such a bad match-up. I've been looking at Ork lists in terms of what my Tau will be up against and the sheer volume of quick assaulting threats and high rate of fire/barrage shooting looks really intimidating,

I'll have to look for some Batreps to see how it plays out.

As a tau player I fear BattleWagons, Mek Boyz, and large units of Boyz. The Scouting BW formation is almost impossible for Tau to deal with, AV14 loaded with assault is damned scary as Tau lack almost any effective form of long ranged anti AV14. Outside of a NOVA charged Ion accelerator and close ranged Fusion and Fusion Drops which are already too late on T2, Tau really can't dal with an wall of AV14.

Also, Mek Gunz are nuts, and really pack the hurt and are very difficult to deal with at range.

Lots of tactics to consider but no one has won any battles against them at all?

I don't play Orks...but If you can get into contact, you're golden...but that's true even if you play Guard. I'd suggest looking at Kommandos, and Stormboyz. That might give you the fast contact you need. Tau have always been the very best at light to medium AT, so moar Truks may not help.

I'd think that Painboyz, and KFF's would make the slog easier.

The BW tactic only works against tau because it basically means turn 1 odds are the tau does no damage, as VERY little of our arsenal can damage AV14 at a distance outside the hammerhead or nova-charged riptides, both of which arent exactly reliable against AV14 either but they can do it.

By the time the BW's side armor is exposed or our fusion bombs have deepstriked, the battlewagons arent even the threat anymore. They have already dumped off their 60-100 boyz and MANz and now serve as tankshock platforms (which can be annoying if we dont have an ethereal LD10 bubble).

I have both orks and tau but never faced either with either army. Ork players dont exist in my meta outside me, and the other 3 tau players generally already have an opponent when i show up without one (the few times that is). Im speaking purely on theorycrafting my armies together, and battlewagon spam seems the most reliable unless i list-tailored for it....which i dont do i prefer general lists.
EDIT: Also, back on the tankshock thing, i happen to know from experience that is a VERY good tactic against Tau. My tau field 2 devilfish and a skyray, all 3 of which are usually up front ramming into things forcing leaderships or bad positioning for pi-plating goodness. I have tankshocked a crisis team and forced them to flee many times, which basically nullifies their existence until the turn AFTER they regroup (as theyre constantly fleeing 2D6 and only fire snaps until the turn after they regroup). Thats huge, as their guns are virtually useless without markersupport and if they do that then other units dont get the markersupport since snapfiring units take a LOT more lights to be brought back to effectiveness.
You can also use Tankshock to split units apart. Remember our supporting fire is a 6" reach between units. Tank shock in between two units, if they fail they run away if they pass you pushed them away from the other unit. Had one opponent do that to me with a couple Rhinos i decided to ignore like an idiot since they were empty - he separated my FW bubble from my Broadsides so i lost a TON of overwatch power.

 jhnbrg wrote:
Lots of tactics to consider but no one has won any battles against them at all?

I haven't gotten to play against Orks yet this edition, but I'm worried about when I have to. I simply don't have the volume of fire in my FE list to deal with many of the Ork Builds. If they bring the BW formation of judiciously use FNP and a KFF most of my army will just bounce off theirs and they'll box me in quickly.

The older Gunline Tau builds are much more problemeatic for Orks, short of the BW formation. But, lucky for Orks Gunlines are a liability in this edition so its not as likely to be that common of a build.

Here's a quick list I whipped up that might be able to put up a fight against a lot of different lists:

Blitz formation:
5 battlewagons w/ 4 rokkits, reinforced ram: 5 x 135 = 675
CAD:
Warboss, mega armour, lucky stikk, bp = 130
Mad dok grotsnik = 160
20 Boyz, nob, pk, bp = 160
19 Boyz, nob, pk, bp = 154
20 Boyz, nob, pk, bp = 160
15 Lootas = 210
15 Tankbustas, nob, bp = 210
4 Deffkotpas, tl rokkits = 120
3 Deffkotpas, tl rokkits = 90
3 Deffkotpas, tl rokkits = 90

Total = 1999

Megaboss goes in with the Lootas, Grotsnik with the 19 Boyz. With the Lucky Stikk he can jump up out and do work on his own or tank overwatch and the Lootas can move and fire if he sticks with em. Keeping the front armor facing their guns will be crucial and in many cases difficult but if you can get the Warboss and some Boyz into popular units like the Broadsides they should melt. If he's mech'ed up you at least have 45 Rokkits to pump into him before going in + rams and Lootas. I think this list at the very least would be fun to play...and fast!

Green tide vs standard Tau codex lists = humiliating defeat for the Orks. Similarly, Kanz and dreds are weak vs castled Tau. Farsight Bomb is weak(er) vs Orks, but still a real tough fight.

Of my now 4 games w/ new Orks:

-Big winner as everyone knows is Lobbas.
-The humble slugga boy is also on my list with 'ard boy upgrades delivered by trukks. Lots of truks.
- megas accompanied by a mega KFF and pain boy? Mwah <kissing fingertips> magnifique. Only issue is not being able to flat out with them. Trukk explodes midfield. But who's going to wade into 4 power klaws, and a poison weapon. With models that are 2+/4++ and 5+ FNP? Draigo or some warp spawn is about all.
-Lootas too... Yawn.
-with deffrollas gone, I'm not enthused about my 5 battle wagons. They count as trukks now.
-how could I forget about the Ork outflanking Jetbikes with free twin linked S8 shots. 25 pts more gets you a hit and run power klaw. Hello parking lot.

 doktor_g wrote:
Green tide vs standard Tau codex lists = humiliating defeat for the Orks. Similarly, Kanz and dreds are weak vs castled Tau. Farsight Bomb is weak(er) vs Orks, but still a real tough fight.

Of my now 4 games w/ new Orks:

-Big winner as everyone knows is Lobbas.
-The humble slugga boy is also on my list with 'ard boy upgrades delivered by trukks. Lots of truks.
- megas accompanied by a mega KFF and pain boy? Mwah <kissing fingertips> magnifique. Only issue is not being able to flat out with them. Trukk explodes midfield. But who's going to wade into 4 power klaws, and a poison weapon. With models that are 2+/4++ and 5+ FNP? Draigo or some warp spawn is about all.
-Lootas too... Yawn.
-with deffrollas gone, I'm not enthused about my 5 battle wagons. They count as trukks now.
-how could I forget about the Ork outflanking Jetbikes with free twin linked S8 shots. 25 pts more gets you a hit and run power klaw. Hello parking lot.

Emphasis mine - this is untrue. The S&P rule states that the unit with that rule cannot go flat out. A trukk or Battlewagon has no such rule - it's occupants do not change the speed at which it can move. So you can put MANz in a trukk and move it 24" on turn 1, so they'll be able to assault turn 2.

Yea if SNP prevented a vehicle from going flat out, you would never ever see mega armor lol. They would literally never get anywhere.

Remember, SNP confers to the unit if one model has it. A vehicle does NOT count as part of the unit that is embarked, that is why they can fire at two targets. The only oddball rule hinting its the same unit is charging a unit after popping the transport, but that also makes sense to allow anyway.

5 BW is not a bad tactic. Remember by the time the Tau can reliably kill the BW you have already dumped off their units anyway and now the wagons arent even the issue, but the crapload of boyz they dumped off. A tau player that actually uses Hammerheads might take one BW at a distance, odds arent in their favor though since its a 5+ to pen and a 4+ to pop. Not that many tau use them though outside people like me that just love the model, and i dont know a single tau player that nova charges their Ion Accelerator for S9 Ordnance pi plate lol.