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And because I already own 3 of them

Grimnar's War council + Bjorn the Fell-Handed + Callidus Assassin = Twin-Linked 3+ Seize the Initiative.

Find a way to put all of those HQs to good use (Iron Priest with Thunderwolves, Rune Priest with Biker Wolf Guard, Njal with TH/SS Terminators, Ulrik as Warlord with Long Fangs?) and you all but guarantee first turn.

Lots of hitting potential there.

Hey, different subject really quick, not sure if anyone noticed,. Helfrost weapons will automatically remove artillery from play, as they have no strength value. So if that quad gun is really bugging you, zap it with your stormwolf once and be on your way.

Is that really how it plays? That's lovely if it's true.

Yeah, artillery has 0 strength. Each wound dealt with Helfrost forces a Str test or remove from play. They autofail str test since they have a 0.

whoa, so true for TFC's too? assuming its not hitting the Techpriest



Automatically Appended Next Post:
So a lot of GK players seem to be really stoked about dropping in Purifiers via SW drop pods. I'm not the most versed in GK tactics/combos, but it seems like theres some merit to it. What kind of SW force would compliment this strategy well?

 gwarsh41 wrote:
Hey, different subject really quick, not sure if anyone noticed,. Helfrost weapons will automatically remove artillery from play, as they have no strength value. So if that quad gun is really bugging you, zap it with your stormwolf once and be on your way.

Wow - that's broken

 karlosovic wrote:

 gwarsh41 wrote:
Hey, different subject really quick, not sure if anyone noticed,. Helfrost weapons will automatically remove artillery from play, as they have no strength value. So if that quad gun is really bugging you, zap it with your stormwolf once and be on your way.

Wow - that's broken

I like.

You still need to hit and wound, but yeah, it's really good, especially on fliers that can get to hard-to-reach artillery.

It's not really that broken since the good artillery sits in cover. Being able to snipe them withPOTMS is nice though.

I am too tied up using it to ice FMCs to really waste it on something like that (though great option for a Drop Pod dread! Turn one...goodbye, Thunderfire Cannon!).

I'm entertaining a couple of new builds lately, one of them involves downgrading my Long Fangs to five Multi Meltas with a Melta Gun on the Ancient, putting them in the Imperial Bunker, and deploying it as far forward in the center of my deployment zone as possible.

CRAZY, I know, but hear me out! I've been using Lascannons and frankly they don't cut it. They excel at killing MCs, but vehicles seem to roll right by them a lot of the time as I am usually firing from a long distance and there's always cover, etc. People generally ignore the Lascannon Bunker because the shots are mitigated by long firing lines with iffy line of sight and plentiful cover.

This build will cost me a lot less in points, and will create a gross cone 12 inches from the firing points that no one is going to want to get near if they have armor, especially if I take the Ammo Store which will let me re-roll 1s. I'm hoping to create a decent denial area that people will take a wide berth around in a lot of cases. The hope is this will lead them to split up and feed into my army divided, somewhat.

My other unit that is coming in to make up for lost long range firepower is a squadron of 3 Speeders with Typhoon MLs and Heavy Bolters. This should do more damage than Long Fangs would to infantry, as they are putting out 6 blast templates and 9 HB shots. They should also be maneuverable enough to score some points on distant objectives and pick off vehicles on side armor (or overwhelm T6 MCs). The plan with these guys is to flank up the side of the board, keep extreme range to minimize response and camp objectives I intentionally place near the far table edge.

With these two threats, my smallish 3-man TWC unit should be able to move up and the Iron Priest riding with them can potentially break off to engage two targets, and my Stormwolf will come on the same side to support them.

With this setup I'm not sure what to do with troops and HQs, though. I definitely want to fit in some more dreadnoughts or Terminators, maybe I will go that route.

To be honest, I think I'm putting my long fangs away for a while...

Yeah, with the changes, SW went from having nice melee and ranged, to mainly just having super melee. I don't really feel like long fangs are going to be worth it.

 gwarsh41 wrote:
Yeah, with the changes, SW went from having nice melee and ranged, to mainly just having super melee. I don't really feel like long fangs are going to be worth it.

Well, really, the changes to 6th and then 7th killed Long Fangs. The new codex just didn't fix them. Mass missile launchers and low ROF heavy weapons don't do the trick from a static position.

I'd rather have a stormwolf than a squad of long fangs anyday.

gwarsh41 wrote:Yeah, with the changes, SW went from having nice melee and ranged, to mainly just having super melee. I don't really feel like long fangs are going to be worth it.

pretre wrote:To be honest, I think I'm putting my long fangs away for a while...

Hmm I was afraid of all this about a year before the Codex dropped. 5x ML LFs were good for their time, but they were obviously going to get the nerf-hammer. I didn't expect Lascannon Fangs to be lackluster though.

Lately I've been running Vindicators... not so much for their AT capabilities, but more because they're relatively cheap and they provide some serious threat overload, combined with my Rhino armour saturation and TWC barreling down the field. They don't get all that many kills, but they definitely pay for themselves with all the attention they draw away from my other units.

5 Lascannon fangs are expensive. For the same price, you can get a lot of better options.

What type of core do you guys think would be good to form a non-MSU/drop-pod list around at 1500-1850 points?

non-MSU and non-drop pod?

Rhinos or Stormwolves.

My core is where I have the most trouble, honestly. Part of me wants 10-man drop pod units, but the cost makes me only want two of them and they frankly lack the punch they once had.

Another part of me screams "Go all Blood Claw, save the points" but that seems very limited.

going all blood claw is go big or go home. Either go for a butt-ton or go for minimums.

Using 5 blood claws as a 60 point ob-sec tax for Stormwolves isn't a bad idea though.

I prefer my Stormwolf empty, honestly.

Objective Secured is great but it has come up very rarely in my experiences, and only matters most against other Ob-Sec stuff. Which by late in the game is mostly dead, or at least enough that a decently geared GH squad has little to fear from it.

On the other hand, an obsec stormwolf can fly over an objective with almost no chance of a normal scoring unit touching it.

You still need to fly low to claim it, I believe, which for me is something I don't want it doing -- I want him in the sky being scary absorbing shots.

Nevermind.

Ok, so long long time want of mine was to run a 100% dreadnought list. I know it isn't too competitive, but I always thought it would be a blast.

I will have a contemptor (assault cannon/power fist), and several magnetized dreadnoughts with, lets assume, all possible weaponry.

First, is there any ally worth considering. I know there is a FW HQ dreadnought for salamanders who is a serious boss, however then I would be required to take some sort of troops.

I plan on going almost full drop pod assault on this one too.
My thoughts so far-

Bjorn, plasma cannon, drop pod (think helfrost would be better?)
1 contemptor with assault cannon in fast attack pod
2 axe shield dreads in pods
2 dual autocannon dreads on the field
1 helfrost dread in pod
2 multimelta dreads in pod

leaves me 10pt to give a few mastercrafted weapons. Looking over the list of possible dread upgrades we can take, has anyone ever considered a dual heavy flamer dreadnought? Twin linked on one arm and standard in the other?

That's a tough nut to crack.

The Heavy Flamer dread in a pod is pretty brutal, especially if you have others to crack armor open for him on turn 1.

I'd use Helfrost wherever you can, just because you are going to need the flexibility in a list like this.

Given any thought to Murderfang here? Or Bjorn's formation? That would add some longevity.

For troops you are looking at minimized Blood Claws, I think universally that's our only decent choice. You could mech them up to add AV saturation, though.

 gwarsh41 wrote:
Ok, so long long time want of mine was to run a 100% dreadnought list. I know it isn't too competitive, but I always thought it would be a blast.

I will have a contemptor (assault cannon/power fist), and several magnetized dreadnoughts with, lets assume, all possible weaponry.

First, is there any ally worth considering. I know there is a FW HQ dreadnought for salamanders who is a serious boss, however then I would be required to take some sort of troops.

I plan on going almost full drop pod assault on this one too.
My thoughts so far-

Bjorn, plasma cannon, drop pod (think helfrost would be better?)
1 contemptor with assault cannon in fast attack pod
2 axe shield dreads in pods
2 dual autocannon dreads on the field
1 helfrost dread in pod
2 multimelta dreads in pod

leaves me 10pt to give a few mastercrafted weapons. Looking over the list of possible dread upgrades we can take, has anyone ever considered a dual heavy flamer dreadnought? Twin linked on one arm and standard in the other?

Hmm, a potential weak spot would be hoard armies. In keeping with your desire to play all dreads, maybe some Deathwind upgrades on some of the Drop Pods? It would save you from having to try for another dread.

Deathwind Launchers are pretty awesome now. Remember that contrary to 6th, you can fire them the turn you arrive.

Btw, potential use for Scouts - if you run a FA heavy or TDAWG that you want on the table T1, you can take a pod in FA, a pod for the Wolves, and put the TDA in the FA pod, thus giving you the ability to deploy both squads and only leaving the empty drop pod in reserve. Big for alpha strike armies.

But, the problem is, why are those Wolf scouts worth having on the table without being a tax? Well, I found two loudouts that work pretty well.

First is simple. Take camo cloaks, a plasma cannon and Infiltrate on an objective. They're not OBS, but not every squad has to be. Works in any list as cheap support scoring/firepower.

The other loudout works best in aggressive list. You take SM shotguns on everyone, and take a Multi-melta. 80 points for 5 + MM. Infiltrate will put them 18" from the enemy. Scout will put them at 12". In melta range. Either that, or the enemy has to commit to keep you away, opening him up for flanking melta/plasma hunters or TDAWG. A squad of Scouts could shift the game in your favout from the start, if you're going first. At the very least, they can be used to control deployment of enemy infiltrators and create a 24" range around the objective no Rhino or Chimera will want to get near.

 Araenion wrote:
Btw, potential use for Scouts - if you run a FA heavy or TDAWG that you want on the table T1, you can take a pod in FA, a pod for the Wolves, and put the TDA in the FA pod, thus giving you the ability to deploy both squads and only leaving the empty drop pod in reserve. Big for alpha strike armies.

But, the problem is, why are those Wolf scouts worth having on the table without being a tax? Well, I found two loudouts that work pretty well.

First is simple. Take camo cloaks, a plasma cannon and Infiltrate on an objective. They're not OBS, but not every squad has to be. Works in any list as cheap support scoring/firepower.

The other loudout works best in aggressive list. You take SM shotguns on everyone, and take a Multi-melta. 80 points for 5 + MM. Infiltrate will put them 18" from the enemy. Scout will put them at 12". In melta range. Either that, or the enemy has to commit to keep you away, opening him up for flanking melta/plasma hunters or TDAWG. A squad of Scouts could shift the game in your favout from the start, if you're going first. At the very least, they can be used to control deployment of enemy infiltrators and create a 24" range around the objective no Rhino or Chimera will want to get near.

Hmm, this is good to hear. I haven't given much thought to Wolf Scouts yet, but I'm glad to see that their major nerf didn't make them totally useless, they still can fit a niche.