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So, my BFF's idea of a weekly friendly game is to spam Knights and TEQ, which is rather annoying. If he wants to be competitive, I can be competitive. Does anyone have any tips how I can make my current CSM force more competitive?
I've got a Land Raider, 2 Helbrutes and a bunch of Termi's, which make up my heavy armour.

Throw an invisible Lord Of Skulls at him with the help of Be'lakor!

Mix Daemons and Daemon Engine CSM. The counter to Knights is to throw long range/high Strength guns or melta at it until it dies, Forgefiends and Screamers are the most efficient ways I know of for Chaos. The Land Raider is schizoid and should be avoided; Terminators should get bogged down by the cheapest units you can find while you reinforce them with summoned units.


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The invisible heavy-duty unit is an option but it's hard-countered by Stomps, so do it to something you're pretty sure you can keep away from the Knight.

With what you haveCombi-plas and combi-melta on 3 man termicide squads is a good place to start. From there i would consider the helbrute formation so you can deepstrike them in for some pot shots as well. You can burn up 9 terminators on this for the cost of a knight if you need to. Throw in a comms relay to get them at the same time and land in terraon for cover and to force knight charges to simul with your fists

Actually, I think one of your best answers lies in the same model. Kharn the Betrayer stands a very good chance of killing an Imperial Knight by himself, plus wrecks most 2+ armor units.

On the charge, he has 7 strength 7 ap 2 attacks that hit on 2's (with a re-roll if he's your warlord) AND they have armorbane AND they strike at initiative 5 AND he even has a BS5 plasma pistol to hurt TEQs.

Overall, I wouldn't say he's super competitive...but he's pretty effective at killing those particular enemies.

I'm starting to think Blood slaughterers are a good option against knights. Kind of mutually assured destruction but you are paying less points.
2 BS charging a knight will give you an average of 12 st10 attacks (16 if outnumbered with rampage, but thats unlikely with knights). Hitting at the same time at WS5. Only costs you 260pts.
If he gets the charge it drops to 8 st10 attacks. But that could still seriously harm a knight. Plus you can try to make sure you get the charge by putting sacraficial speed bumps in between them.

 Matthew wrote:
So, my BFF's idea of a weekly friendly game is to spam Knights and TEQ, which is rather annoying. If he wants to be competitive, I can be competitive. Does anyone have any tips how I can make my current CSM force more competitive?
I've got a Land Raider, 2 Helbrutes and a bunch of Termi's, which make up my heavy armour.

TEQ is not competitive per say,

 raiden wrote:

 Matthew wrote:
So, my BFF's idea of a weekly friendly game is to spam Knights and TEQ, which is rather annoying. If he wants to be competitive, I can be competitive. Does anyone have any tips how I can make my current CSM force more competitive?
I've got a Land Raider, 2 Helbrutes and a bunch of Termi's, which make up my heavy armour.

TEQ is not competitive per say,

CSM teq with combi-weapons are quite solid as a suicide drop.

I advocate Kharn. He's a knight slayer. Put him in a landraider with a bunch of melta chosen. Don't forget they've got 4 attacks on the charge even with meltas cause they've got both bp + ccw and bolters. 5 attacks if tyou take MoK. one hidden fist or power axe will be solid too. Be' Lakor to make LR and than the unit invis. You've got a rock-hard counter-squad.

Another option could be Cypher + a blob of 20 marines with melta + combi-melta sarge + some brutal indep - be it Kharn once again or Huron to make everyone infiltrate. Crymson Slaughter chosen with plazma or melta in a rhino are a sound pick in this situation.

Unlike loyalists, you can make a knight-hunting termie squad with chainfists. It's not super-reliable, however cause he always has a chance of rolling a 6 on stomp.

Siphen wrote:
Actually, I think one of your best answers lies in the same model. Kharn the Betrayer stands a very good chance of killing an Imperial Knight by himself, plus wrecks most 2+ armor units.

On the charge, he has 7 strength 7 ap 2 attacks that hit on 2's (with a re-roll if he's your warlord) AND they have armorbane AND they strike at initiative 5 AND he even has a BS5 plasma pistol to hurt TEQs.

Overall, I wouldn't say he's super competitive...but he's pretty effective at killing those particular enemies.

Roll him with 9 friends (or termies) in a dreadclaw. Guaranteed T1 deepstrike + 18" flat out move (fast skimmer). Jink anything that comes your way, then T2 move 6" disembark, and throw kharn into something that needs to die.

 Robisagg wrote:

Siphen wrote:
Actually, I think one of your best answers lies in the same model. Kharn the Betrayer stands a very good chance of killing an Imperial Knight by himself, plus wrecks most 2+ armor units.

On the charge, he has 7 strength 7 ap 2 attacks that hit on 2's (with a re-roll if he's your warlord) AND they have armorbane AND they strike at initiative 5 AND he even has a BS5 plasma pistol to hurt TEQs.

Overall, I wouldn't say he's super competitive...but he's pretty effective at killing those particular enemies.

Roll him with 9 friends (or termies) in a dreadclaw. Guaranteed T1 deepstrike + 18" flat out move (fast skimmer). Jink anything that comes your way, then T2 move 6" disembark, and throw kharn into something that needs to die.

The only problem is that a dreadclaw has a chance of eating Kharn but it's not a huge chance. Like 1.6% at start and per every next attempt.

 koooaei wrote:

 Robisagg wrote:

Siphen wrote:
Actually, I think one of your best answers lies in the same model. Kharn the Betrayer stands a very good chance of killing an Imperial Knight by himself, plus wrecks most 2+ armor units.

On the charge, he has 7 strength 7 ap 2 attacks that hit on 2's (with a re-roll if he's your warlord) AND they have armorbane AND they strike at initiative 5 AND he even has a BS5 plasma pistol to hurt TEQs.

Overall, I wouldn't say he's super competitive...but he's pretty effective at killing those particular enemies.

Roll him with 9 friends (or termies) in a dreadclaw. Guaranteed T1 deepstrike + 18" flat out move (fast skimmer). Jink anything that comes your way, then T2 move 6" disembark, and throw kharn into something that needs to die.

The only problem is that a dreadclaw has a chance of eating Kharn but it's not a huge chance. Like 1.6% at start and per every next attempt.

This is true, however it's worth the risk imo to deliver that hard of a punch t2. Bonus points, if you fill it up with CSM (Mok, CC, 1x melta/flamer 1x combi) that dreadclaw is obsec. Nice to have floating around grabbing objectives (especially in maelstrom)

 Robisagg wrote:

 koooaei wrote:

 Robisagg wrote:

Siphen wrote:
Actually, I think one of your best answers lies in the same model. Kharn the Betrayer stands a very good chance of killing an Imperial Knight by himself, plus wrecks most 2+ armor units.

On the charge, he has 7 strength 7 ap 2 attacks that hit on 2's (with a re-roll if he's your warlord) AND they have armorbane AND they strike at initiative 5 AND he even has a BS5 plasma pistol to hurt TEQs.

Overall, I wouldn't say he's super competitive...but he's pretty effective at killing those particular enemies.

Roll him with 9 friends (or termies) in a dreadclaw. Guaranteed T1 deepstrike + 18" flat out move (fast skimmer). Jink anything that comes your way, then T2 move 6" disembark, and throw kharn into something that needs to die.

The only problem is that a dreadclaw has a chance of eating Kharn but it's not a huge chance. Like 1.6% at start and per every next attempt.

This is true, however it's worth the risk imo to deliver that hard of a punch t2. Bonus points, if you fill it up with CSM (Mok, CC, 1x melta/flamer 1x combi) that dreadclaw is obsec. Nice to have floating around grabbing objectives (especially in maelstrom)

Just for clarification, it's 1.6% cause it has 1/6 to eat someone and than 1/10 that it'd be Kharn. If there are less guyz inside, it's gona be greater than 1/10. So, if there's just Kharn alive, i'd think twice before entering the Dreadclaw. Maybe if it's just a desperate situation.

 koooaei wrote:

 Robisagg wrote:

 koooaei wrote:

 Robisagg wrote:

Siphen wrote:
Actually, I think one of your best answers lies in the same model. Kharn the Betrayer stands a very good chance of killing an Imperial Knight by himself, plus wrecks most 2+ armor units.

On the charge, he has 7 strength 7 ap 2 attacks that hit on 2's (with a re-roll if he's your warlord) AND they have armorbane AND they strike at initiative 5 AND he even has a BS5 plasma pistol to hurt TEQs.

Overall, I wouldn't say he's super competitive...but he's pretty effective at killing those particular enemies.

Roll him with 9 friends (or termies) in a dreadclaw. Guaranteed T1 deepstrike + 18" flat out move (fast skimmer). Jink anything that comes your way, then T2 move 6" disembark, and throw kharn into something that needs to die.

The only problem is that a dreadclaw has a chance of eating Kharn but it's not a huge chance. Like 1.6% at start and per every next attempt.

This is true, however it's worth the risk imo to deliver that hard of a punch t2. Bonus points, if you fill it up with CSM (Mok, CC, 1x melta/flamer 1x combi) that dreadclaw is obsec. Nice to have floating around grabbing objectives (especially in maelstrom)

Just for clarification, it's 1.6% cause it has 1/6 to eat someone and than 1/10 that it'd be Kharn. If there are less guyz inside, it's gona be greater than 1/10. So, if there's just Kharn alive, i'd think twice before entering the Dreadclaw. Maybe if it's just a desperate situation.

I don't usually re enter my dreadclaw, the assault unit goes and does its thing and then the dreadclaw rolls around doing heatblast attacks and grabbing objectives.