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Three common proposed rules that always float around are:
-Allow all saves to be taken
-Use modifiers instead of just straight AP against armor checks (so AP3 powersword is better than AP- no weap against Termies)
-Tac Marines and Termies don't live up to what they are.

The problem with the first is it massively unbalances the game, and makes SS Termies unkillable at range. And slow down the game. But Armor then Invuln is a lot of fun and fast in WHFB.

The problem with the second is that it makes Termies die too easily, and Power Armor so impotent
-The problem with the third is debatable. I'll leave that to the other thread for now.

But what if we did all 3 together? And probably with a few other tweaks. My thoughts on how:

-Saves taken in this order: Cover, Armor, then Invuln.

-Base cover saves (terrain, Jink, intervening, etc) are all reduced by 1, minimum 6+.
-Shrouded gives +1, not +2

-Armor Saves are reduced by AP as follows:
-AP 6/- : -0
-AP5 -1
-AP4 -2
-AP3 -3
-AP2 -4
-AP1 -5

-Base invulns are all reduced by 1 (minimum 6+)

-Reroll 1s/failed saves that don't specify a type allow the user to pick one save type

What do you guys think? Cover now matters to Marines, and their powerswords don't get linked by 2+s anymore?

This is how second edition looked (though there were no cover or invincible saves).

It worked but you then had to spend ages working out which hits gave which penalty to armour etc.

There were Invulnerable Saves in 2nd - they were called "Unmodified Saves", and could generally be taken in addition to your normal armour save. Things like Conversion Fields, Displacer Fields, Dodges, etc were what conferred them.

Cover in 2nd, on the other hand, conferred To Hit modifiers making it harder to land the shot in the first place.

I think an ap modifier system would be best:

Ap - and 6 become -0
Ap 5 and 4 become -1
Ap 3 becomes -2
Ap 2 becomes -3
Ap 1 becomes ignores all armor

Each ap gets a slight debuff against their old target, but is now useful against all enemies. Notably, ap2 gets the biggest debuff with 3+ and 2+ getting a 6+ and 5+ respectively.

Cover as -1 to hit would be best, with fortifications offering -2. Things like go to ground, stealth, and other modifiers can't make further improvements. Everyone benefits even when wearing 2+ armor, but blast weapons are now (realistically) more practical against cover. Alternate cover system is to improve armor saves by 1.

Your practical result would be a much, much slower game that Jetseers would up and win every time.

Hi folks.
A complete re-write where all models get an armour value from 0 to 14.
All weapons get an AP value from 4 to 20.

To pass an armour save, roll a D6 add your AV.If this is higher than the weapon hit AP you pass your save roll.

EG SM have AV of 4.
If the SM was hit by a CSM bolter AP 6.
The SM needs to roll 3+ to pass their save roll.(3+4+7.7 is higher than 6.)

If the SM was hit by a Lasgun AP 5, the SM needs a 2+ to save.(2+4=6, 6 is higher than 5)

If the SM was hit by a Heavy bolter AP7, The SM needs a 4+ to save.(4+4= 8.* is higher than 7.)

This needs no additional modifiers.It just uses 2 opposed values for all models armour and all weapons armour penetration values.

I may need to explain that better?

I like the concept of high strength weapons having an affect on AP. Like, a tyrannofex rupture cannon, iirc, is str 10, ap4. Can rip holes in a land raider but bounces of terminator armor like a pebble. That seems wrong.

Maybe something like if your weapon is capable of ID your target, the target gets a -1 modifier to his armor saves.

And making saves be cumulative, which kind of makes sense, would make things with high armor and invluns almost unbeatable. And would also complicate things substantially.