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This thread is a pretty straightforward spin-off from all the ongoing favorite threads. Within all those threads, only the absolute favorites were being picked. Many great legions were being neglected, with the Luna Wolves having a total of zero (!) votes in the Which Legion is your favorite? thread.
The despair in the community was total:
j31c3n wrote: Poor, poor Luna Wolves. Nobody likes them.
So, here's your chance to discuss their merits! Simply rank all the Legions (pre-Heresy, not counting the two unknown legions) according to your personal preference. You can explain your reasoning if you want to as long as you rank them all. Keep in mind that this is strictly 30k and pre-Heresy.
My personal list:
1. Dark Angels
2. Luna Wolves (Sons of Horus)
3. Night Lords
4. Alpha Legion
5. Thousand Sons
6. Word Bearers
7. Emperor's Children
8. Iron Warriors
9. Death Guard
10. Ultramarines
11. Imperial Fists
12. Raven Guard
13. World Eaters
14. Space Wolves
15. White Scars
16. Blood Angels
17. Salamanders
18. Iron Hands
Spoiler:
I like Dark Angels because I like both their fluff and their stern look. I like how they were basically operating as proto-Astartes even before the Emperor arrived and how they took the convoluted hierarchy of the Order with them. Plus all that monster fighting stuff.
The Luna Wolves were just badass all around, with their focus on decapitating strikes exemplifying what it means to be Astartes. Their Sons of Horus look makes them even cooler and is downright my favorite look out of any of the Legion.
The Alpha Legion I like because of their tactics and how they utilize non-Astartes operatives, basically using every resource available to maximum effectiveness. Probably have my favorite philosophy on warfare out of any of the Legions.
The Thousand Sons I like because well.. psykers. Great coordination on the battlefield, plus interesting look.
The Emperor's Children I like because of their quest to perfect the art of warfare, treating it quite differently than the other legions. It's also interesting for Astartes to care so much about their looks and to be that arrogant and flamboyant. *Downgraded after reading Fulgrim!
I'll get to the rest at some point
*List is currently in flux, with the Word Bearers catapulting up the ranks as I learn more about them!
This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2015/03/11 06:41:38
And the Angels of Darkness descended on pinions of fire and light... the great and terrible dark angels.
He was not the golden lord. The Emperor will carry us to the stars, but never beyond them. My dreams will be lies, if a golden lord does not rise.
I look to the stars now, with the old scrolls burning runes across my memory. And I see my own hands as I write these words. Erebus and Kor Phaeron speak the truth.
My hands. They, too, are golden.
2015/02/25 04:58:17
Subject: Re:Rank your favorite Legions (pre-Heresy)
1) death guard
2) raven guard
3) alpha legion
4) Imperial fists
5) Iron Hands
6) Salamanders
7) Blood Angels
8) space wolves
9) Luna Wolves
10) Ultramarines
11) Dark angels
12) Iron Warriors
13) Night Lords
14) Thousand Sons
15) White scars
16) Word Bearers
17) world eaters
18) emperor's children
For me, I just like the really tough and somber legions along with being stealthy as needed. I dislike the flamboyant ones. I always liked the thoughts of special agents as well as strong stoic warriors. "Man's man" sort of thing when I was growing up I guess.
+ Thought of the day + Not even in death does duty end.
1. Blood Angels
2. Raven Guard
3. Night Lords
4. Alpha Legion
5. Iron Warriors
6. Ultramarines
7. Thousand Sons
8. Luna Wolves
9. World Eaters
10. Space Wolves
11. Death Guard
12. Salamanders
13. Iron Hands
14. Emperor's Children
15. Imperial Fists
16. White Scars
17. Dark Angels
18. Word Bearers
Surely you must like some more than others? You seem to like the Iron Hands a lot for example. I don't find their fluff that interesting so I'd be interested in seeing your perspective. They seem oddly temperamental to me for a chapter/legion so focused on technology and unfeeling iron.
And it seems the Alpha Legion are pretty popular all around even when they're not the first choice!
And the Angels of Darkness descended on pinions of fire and light... the great and terrible dark angels.
He was not the golden lord. The Emperor will carry us to the stars, but never beyond them. My dreams will be lies, if a golden lord does not rise.
I look to the stars now, with the old scrolls burning runes across my memory. And I see my own hands as I write these words. Erebus and Kor Phaeron speak the truth.
My hands. They, too, are golden.
2015/02/25 21:08:37
Subject: Re:Rank your favorite Legions (pre-Heresy)
1. Dark Angels
2. Iron Warriors
3. Word Bearers (they were damn effective)
4. Thousand Sons
5. Alpha Legion
6. Blood Angels
7. Luna Wolves
8. Space Wolves
9. White Scars
10. Emperor's Children
11. Iron Hands
12. Ultramarines
13. Imperial Fists
14. Night Lords
15. Raven Guard
16. Death Guard
17. Salamanders
18. World Eaters
Surely you must like some more than others? You seem to like the Iron Hands a lot for example. I don't find their fluff that interesting so I'd be interested in seeing your perspective. They seem oddly temperamental to me for a chapter/legion so focused on technology and unfeeling iron.
And it seems the Alpha Legion are pretty popular all around even when they're not the first choice!
That's mostly because Iron Hands are the chapter tactics I currently use, honestly, so that's where my fluff attention is focused right now.
1. Dark Angels
2. Iron Warriors
3. Word Bearers (they were damn effective)
4. Thousand Sons
5. Alpha Legion
6. Blood Angels
7. Luna Wolves
8. Space Wolves
9. White Scars
10. Emperor's Children
11. Iron Hands
12. Ultramarines
13. Imperial Fists
14. Night Lords
15. Raven Guard
16. Death Guard
17. Salamanders
18. World Eaters
Dark Angels! Interesting! I wouldn't have thought that! And I agree about the Word Bearers but I find them rather bland before the Heresy, despite some interesting stories. Once they go bad they quickly jump up in my ranking.
j31c3n wrote: That's mostly because Iron Hands are the chapter tactics I currently use, honestly, so that's where my fluff attention is focused right now.
Fair enough. I'm just really curious about what everyone's preferences are. So far it seems the Alpha Legion is universally liked! All of us have them in our top 5.
1) death guard
2) raven guard
3) alpha legion
4) Imperial fists
5) Iron Hands
6) Salamanders
7) Blood Angels
8) space wolves
9) Luna Wolves
10) Ultramarines
11) Dark angels
12) Iron Warriors
13) Night Lords
14) Thousand Sons
15) White scars
16) Word Bearers
17) world eaters
18) emperor's children
For me, I just like the really tough and somber legions along with being stealthy as needed. I dislike the flamboyant ones. I always liked the thoughts of special agents as well as strong stoic warriors. "Man's man" sort of thing when I was growing up I guess.
Don't the Dark Angels fit the somber and stoic warriors dead-on?
And the Angels of Darkness descended on pinions of fire and light... the great and terrible dark angels.
He was not the golden lord. The Emperor will carry us to the stars, but never beyond them. My dreams will be lies, if a golden lord does not rise.
I look to the stars now, with the old scrolls burning runes across my memory. And I see my own hands as I write these words. Erebus and Kor Phaeron speak the truth.
1.) Dark Angels (valued honesty above all else, I love it)
2.) Blood Angels (They were basically humble EC, with CC tendencies)
3.) Luna Wolves (basically civilized Space Wolves)
4.) Iron Hands (anti-weakness, just like me)
5.) Alpha Legion
6.) Ultramarines
7.) White Scars
8.) Thousand Sons
9.) Imperial Fists
10.) Iron Warriors
11.) Space Wolves
12.) Raven Guard
13.) Salamanders
14.) World Eaters
15.) Night Lords
16.) Death Guard (no brotherhood, no loyalty)
17.) Emperor's Children (Pompous cockmongers who think their superior to everyone else, when, in fact, they're weaker than everyone else)
18.) Word Bearers (whiny babies, too weak to go without the comfort of Gods)
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2015/02/26 03:57:33
To quote a fictional character... "Let's make this fun!"
Tactical_Spam wrote: There was a story in the SM omnibus where a single kroot killed 2-3 marines then ate their gene seed and became a Kroot-startes.
We must all join the Kroot-startes...
2015/02/26 06:04:53
Subject: Re:Rank your favorite Legions (pre-Heresy)
1) Alpha Legion 2) White Scars 3) Iron Warriors 4) Word Bearers 5) Imperial Fists 6) Night Lords 7) Emperor's Children 8) Sons of Horus 9) Ultramarines 10) Iron Hands 11) Death Guard 12) Raven Guard 13) World Eaters 14) Thousand Sons 15) Salamanders 16) Blood Angels 17) Space Wolves 18) Dark Angels
Note, that I love all the Legions for what they each present to the fluff, this is just how I rank them as far as how much they peak my interest and how much I actually know about them. I know a good bit about all of them, but I know more about some than others, and thus it affects how much I can appreciate some of them.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2015/02/26 06:06:45
1.) Dark Angels (valued honesty above all else, I love it)
2.) Blood Angels (They were basically humble EC, with CC tendencies)
3.) Luna Wolves (basically civilized Space Wolves)
4.) Iron Hands (anti-weakness, just like me)
5.) Alpha Legion
6.) Ultramarines
7.) White Scars
8.) Thousand Sons
9.) Imperial Fists
10.) Iron Warriors
11.) Space Wolves
12.) Raven Guard
13.) Salamanders
14.) World Eaters
15.) Night Lords
16.) Death Guard (no brotherhood, no loyalty)
17.) Emperor's Children (Pompous cockmongers who think their superior to everyone else, when, in fact, they're weaker than everyone else)
18.) Word Bearers (whiny babies, too weak to go without the comfort of Gods)
Dark Angels as number 1! Interesting, always thought you liked the Blood Angels best. I wouldn't call the Emperor's Children weak though. They were perfectionists so they spent all their time training and trying to be perfect. Well, when they weren't polishing their armour and feasting and writing poetry and... ok I guess they spent a lot of time doing other stuff too
1) Alpha Legion
2) White Scars
3) Iron Warriors
4) Word Bearers
5) Imperial Fists
6) Night Lords
7) Emperor's Children
8) Sons of Horus
9) Ultramarines
10) Iron Hands
11) Death Guard
12) Raven Guard
13) World Eaters
14) Thousand Sons
15) Salamanders
16) Blood Angels
17) Space Wolves
18) Dark Angels
Note, that I love all the Legions for what they each present to the fluff, this is just how I rank them as far as how much they peak my interest and how much I actually know about them. I know a good bit about all of them, but I know more about some than others, and thus it affects how much I can appreciate some of them.
Ranking the Dark Angels last out of all the legions! Blasphemy!
But yea, I'm like that too. The more I know about a legion the better I can appreciate them. And I didn't realize the huge amount of fluff there was in the Forge World series. Holy Terra! Gonna have to read up on that.
And it's a shame the books are so expensive and it's all so spread out. I hope they make a concise volume like the Index Astartes with only the basic fluff describing the legions, plus all the nice and shiny images of the heraldry and different units.
Oh and I was actually hoping some of the more prolific posters on this forum would post their lists.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2015/02/26 14:42:29
And the Angels of Darkness descended on pinions of fire and light... the great and terrible dark angels.
He was not the golden lord. The Emperor will carry us to the stars, but never beyond them. My dreams will be lies, if a golden lord does not rise.
I look to the stars now, with the old scrolls burning runes across my memory. And I see my own hands as I write these words. Erebus and Kor Phaeron speak the truth.
1.) Dark Angels (valued honesty above all else, I love it)
2.) Blood Angels (They were basically humble EC, with CC tendencies)
3.) Luna Wolves (basically civilized Space Wolves)
4.) Iron Hands (anti-weakness, just like me)
5.) Alpha Legion
6.) Ultramarines
7.) White Scars
8.) Thousand Sons
9.) Imperial Fists
10.) Iron Warriors
11.) Space Wolves
12.) Raven Guard
13.) Salamanders
14.) World Eaters
15.) Night Lords
16.) Death Guard (no brotherhood, no loyalty)
17.) Emperor's Children (Pompous cockmongers who think their superior to everyone else, when, in fact, they're weaker than everyone else)
18.) Word Bearers (whiny babies, too weak to go without the comfort of Gods)
The Emperor's Children are weak in that they are prideful and arrogant. This is a severe weakness that leads them to overestimate themselves and underestimate their allies, which inevitably leads to terrible consequences. And the Horus Heresy Dark Angels were actually how I came across 40k in the first place. Blood Angels are nice, but their main plus is that they have an awesome Primarch, while the Dark Angels whole mantra during the Great Crusade was no lies or misdirection ever, which was a huge part of the Order that their organization and teachings were based off of. I love that, and I also love how they're actual soldiers, not peacocks (EC), berserkers (WE, SW), tribals (WS), or some other completely unrealistic style of warfare or philosophy to base their warfighting on.
This message was edited 4 times. Last update was at 2015/02/26 15:20:07
To quote a fictional character... "Let's make this fun!"
Tactical_Spam wrote: There was a story in the SM omnibus where a single kroot killed 2-3 marines then ate their gene seed and became a Kroot-startes.
We must all join the Kroot-startes...
2015/02/26 22:44:26
Subject: Re:Rank your favorite Legions (pre-Heresy)
Don't the Dark Angels fit the somber and stoic warriors dead-on?
I think I'm just colored in my opinions of the dark angels by their 40k counterparts as they are very focused and driven by a concept that often disrupts their stocism. Oh look a fallen, abandon all tactical objectives.... rawwwwrrrr repent!!! so while they appear very stoic and somber, they are actually really zealous and the whole thing feels more religious crusade rather than cold military grimdarkness. (incidentially, DKoK are my favorite faction <_<
In 30k, I guess they were more of the type I was mentioning, but really still felt like they were more of the britonian knigts but their rankings suffered when I was just gauging my internal feelings on them (especially as I was exposed to the 30k versions much later than the 40k versions from over 10 yrs ago)
+ Thought of the day + Not even in death does duty end.
2015/03/04 13:24:12
Subject: Re:Rank your favorite Legions (pre-Heresy)
1. Emperor's Children
2. Blood Angels
3. Thousand Sons
4. Luna Wolves
5. Alpha Legion
6. Dark Angels
7. Iron Warriors
8. Raven Guard
9. Salamanders
10. Death Guard
11. Ultramarines
12. Space Wolves
13. Imperial Fists
14. White Scars
15. World Eaters
16. Iron Hands
17. Night Lords
18. Word Bearers (burn the archtraitors!)
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2015/03/04 13:24:30
Jinx Magiga wrote: 1. Emperor's Children
2. Blood Angels
3. Thousand Sons
4. Luna Wolves
5. Alpha Legion
6. Dark Angels
7. Iron Warriors
8. Raven Guard
9. Salamanders
10. Death Guard
11. Ultramarines
12. Space Wolves
13. Imperial Fists
14. White Scars
15. World Eaters
16. Iron Hands
17. Night Lords
18. Word Bearers (burn the archtraitors!)
You mind explaining the attraction to the EC for me? I've never really seen it, but I'd love to find a reason to love another Legion
To quote a fictional character... "Let's make this fun!"
Tactical_Spam wrote: There was a story in the SM omnibus where a single kroot killed 2-3 marines then ate their gene seed and became a Kroot-startes.
1. Death Guard
2. Dark Angels
3. Luna Wolves
4. Emperor's Children
5. Iron Warriors
6. Night Lords
7. White Scars
8. Ultramarines
9. Salamanders
10. Thousand Suns
11. Raven Guard
12. Imperial Fists
13. Alpha Legion
14. Blood Angels
15. Space Wolves
16. World Eaters
17. Iron Hands
18. Word Bearers
1) Word Bearer
2) Night Lords
3) Salamanders
4) Thousand Sons
5) Emperor's Children
6) World Eaters
7) Ultramarines
8) Dark Angels
9) Raven Guard
10) Alpha Legion
11) Iron Hands
12) Blood Angels
13) Luna Wolf
14) Imperial Fist
15) Death Guard
16) White Scar
17) Iron Warrior
18 ) Space Wolf
2015/03/04 17:07:00
Subject: Re:Rank your favorite Legions (pre-Heresy)
1) blood angels
2) raven guard
3) iron warriors
4) alpha legion
5) night lords
6) sons of horus
7) imperial fists
8) word bearers
9) dark angels
10) ultramarines
11) salamanders
12) emperors children
13) thousand sons
14) death guard
15) world eaters
16) white scars
17) iron hands
18) space wolves
1. Alpha Legion
2. Iron Warriors
3. Raven Guard
4. Iron Hands
5. Death Guard
6. Salamanders
7. Blood Angels
8. Thousand Sons
9. White Scars
10. Emperor's Children
11. Night Lords
12. Dark Angels
13. Luna Wolves
14. Imperial Fists
15. Space Wolves
16. World Eaters
17. Ultramarines
18. Word Bearers
Gods? There are no gods. Merely existences, obstacles to overcome.
"And what if I told you the Wolves tried to bring a Legion to heel once before? What if that Legion sent Russ and his dogs running, too ashamed to write down their defeat in Imperial archives?" - ADB
1. Emperor's Children
2. Raven Guard
3. Death Guard
4. Thousand Sons
5. Dark Angels
6. Night Lords
7. Word Bearers
8. Alpha Legion
9. Imperial Fists
10. Iron Warriors
11. Salamanders
12. World Eaters
13. Blood Angels
14. Luna Wolves
15. Iron Hands
16. White Scars
17. Space Wolves
18. Ultramarines
1. World Eaters
2. Ultramarines
3. Iron Warriors
4.Word Bearers
5. Death Guard
6. Imperial Fists
7. Alpha Legion
8. Raven Guard
9. Dark Angels
10. Sons of Horus
11. Salamanders
12. Night Lords
13. Space Wolves
14. Iron Hands
15. Blood Angels
16. Thousand Sons
17. White Scars
18. Emperors Children
never in the field of human conflict, has so much been fired at so many, by so few.
My name is Maximus Decimus Meridius, Commander of the armies of the North, General of the Felix Legions. Loyal servant to the true emperor Marcus Aurelius. Father to a murdered son, husband to a murdered wife. And I will have my vengeance, in this life or the next.
Please leave your message after the tone...
2015/03/05 05:47:43
Subject: Re:Rank your favorite Legions (pre-Heresy)
dusara217 wrote: You mind explaining the attraction to the EC for me? I've never really seen it, but I'd love to find a reason to love another Legion
Well for me it really does just come down to their look. I mean seriously, they look frigging glorious. How can you not love this look?
Spoiler:
That and I also like the way they fight the Megarachnids in Horus Rising . That whole duelist thing, as seen in the FW models.
Yea, pretty silly reasons actually. Maybe Viridian has a more substantial reason for liking them?
But yea, after reading some more HH and FW stuff, I'm not so sure about my rankings. The Word Bearers also look glorious but that seems to be their traitor look:
Spoiler:
^I love the look of this dreadnought, best pic in the entire FW series! Has a KOTOR/Sith vibe to it
And I'm loving all these new lists, hope to see more!
And the Angels of Darkness descended on pinions of fire and light... the great and terrible dark angels.
He was not the golden lord. The Emperor will carry us to the stars, but never beyond them. My dreams will be lies, if a golden lord does not rise.
I look to the stars now, with the old scrolls burning runes across my memory. And I see my own hands as I write these words. Erebus and Kor Phaeron speak the truth.
My hands. They, too, are golden.
2015/03/06 04:18:30
Subject: Re:Rank your favorite Legions (pre-Heresy)
Night Lords VIII
Dark Angels I
Salamanders XVIII
Imperial Fists VII
Iron Warriors IV
Emperor's Children III
Luna Wolves XVI
Raven Guard XIX
Thousand Sons XV
Alpha Legion XX
Iron Hands X
Blood Angels IX
White Scars V
World Eaters XII
Ultramarines XIII
Death Guard XIV
Word Bearers XVII
Space Wolves VI
“There is only one good, knowledge, and one evil, ignorance.”
2015/03/06 05:04:43
Subject: Re:Rank your favorite Legions (pre-Heresy)
Night Lords VIII
Dark Angels I
Salamanders XVIII
Imperial Fists VII
Iron Warriors IV
Emperor's Children III
Luna Wolves XVI
Raven Guard XIX
Thousand Sons XV
Alpha Legion XX
Iron Hands X
Blood Angels IX
White Scars V
World Eaters XII
Ultramarines XIII
Death Guard XIV
Word Bearers XVII
Space Wolves VI
Ahh, interesting. I thought you'd like the Emperor's Children more because of the "Eternally-Stimulated Slaanesh Dreadnought" rank thing. Btw, do you like the Dark Angels from the novels more or ADB's version from the short stories involving the Night Lords?
And the video is blocked where I am so I watched a video of Brando swallowing a bug instead
Spoiler:
But yea, I've watched Apocalypse Now. I like the theme but I'm not too keen on the names. Curze might work but the M'Shen/Martin Sheen reference kinda ruins the immersion for me.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2015/03/06 05:05:44
And the Angels of Darkness descended on pinions of fire and light... the great and terrible dark angels.
He was not the golden lord. The Emperor will carry us to the stars, but never beyond them. My dreams will be lies, if a golden lord does not rise.
I look to the stars now, with the old scrolls burning runes across my memory. And I see my own hands as I write these words. Erebus and Kor Phaeron speak the truth.
I've seen horrors... horrors that you've seen. But you have no right to call me a murderer. You have a right to kill me. You have a right to do that... but you have no right to judge me. It's impossible for words to describe what is necessary to those who do not know what horror means. Horror... Horror has a face... and you must make a friend of horror. Horror and moral terror are your friends. If they are not, then they are enemies to be feared. They are truly enemies! I remember when I was with Special Forces... seems a thousand centuries ago. We went into a camp to inoculate some children. We left the camp after we had inoculated the children for polio, and this old man came running after us and he was crying. He couldn't see. We went back there, and they had come and hacked off every inoculated arm. There they were in a pile. A pile of little arms. And I remember... I... I... I cried, I wept like some grandmother. I wanted to tear my teeth out; I didn't know what I wanted to do! And I want to remember it. I never want to forget it... I never want to forget. And then I realized... like I was shot... like I was shot with a diamond... a diamond bullet right through my forehead. And I thought, my God... the genius of that! The genius! The will to do that! Perfect, genuine, complete, crystalline, pure. And then I realized they were stronger than we, because they could stand that these were not monsters, these were men... trained cadres. These men who fought with their hearts, who had families, who had children, who were filled with love... but they had the strength... the strength... to do that. If I had ten divisions of those men, our troubles here would be over very quickly. You have to have men who are moral... and at the same time who are able to utilize their primordial instincts to kill without feeling... without passion... without judgment... without judgment! Because it's judgment that defeats us.
This was the video. Make an army that does not feel remorse, that does not feel guilt, that does not feel, and you will break the enemy. Because they will be willing to do whatever is necessary, for the greater good. Use the morality of the enemy against them- to bind them, restrain them, and strangle them.
Also, M'shen was poorly executed because she fails in the role of the main character in Heart of Darkness, and Sheen's character in Apocalypse Now. They both broke. They broke because they realized that what everyone called a madman was right and through insanity understood the world better then anyone else.
This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2015/03/06 06:56:22
“There is only one good, knowledge, and one evil, ignorance.”
I've seen horrors... horrors that you've seen. But you have no right to call me a murderer. You have a right to kill me. You have a right to do that... but you have no right to judge me. It's impossible for words to describe what is necessary to those who do not know what horror means. Horror... Horror has a face... and you must make a friend of horror. Horror and moral terror are your friends. If they are not, then they are enemies to be feared. They are truly enemies! I remember when I was with Special Forces... seems a thousand centuries ago. We went into a camp to inoculate some children. We left the camp after we had inoculated the children for polio, and this old man came running after us and he was crying. He couldn't see. We went back there, and they had come and hacked off every inoculated arm. There they were in a pile. A pile of little arms. And I remember... I... I... I cried, I wept like some grandmother. I wanted to tear my teeth out; I didn't know what I wanted to do! And I want to remember it. I never want to forget it... I never want to forget. And then I realized... like I was shot... like I was shot with a diamond... a diamond bullet right through my forehead. And I thought, my God... the genius of that! The genius! The will to do that! Perfect, genuine, complete, crystalline, pure. And then I realized they were stronger than we, because they could stand that these were not monsters, these were men... trained cadres. These men who fought with their hearts, who had families, who had children, who were filled with love... but they had the strength... the strength... to do that. If I had ten divisions of those men, our troubles here would be over very quickly. You have to have men who are moral... and at the same time who are able to utilize their primordial instincts to kill without feeling... without passion... without judgment... without judgment! Because it's judgment that defeats us.
This was the video. Make an army that does not feel remorse, that does not feel guilt, that does not feel, and you will break the enemy. Because they will be willing to do whatever is necessary, for the greater good. Use the morality of the enemy against them- to bind them, restrain them, and strangle them.
Also, M'shen was poorly executed because she fails in the role of the main character in Heart of Darkness, and Sheen's character in Apocalypse Now. They both broke. They broke because they realized that what everyone called a madman was right and through insanity understood the world better then anyone else.
Interesting... I remember this from the movie. But in this case didn't this just precipitate their fall to Chaos? And they did more than what was necessary and started to lose themselves in the excess. Doesn't Sevatar confront Kurze about this when he enters his mind? That in spite of his attempt to moralize things, the real reason for his actions was simply that he enjoyed causing suffering? They went down the rabbit hole and lost themselves. I guess in this way they are quite Slaaneshi.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2015/03/06 08:19:38
And the Angels of Darkness descended on pinions of fire and light... the great and terrible dark angels.
He was not the golden lord. The Emperor will carry us to the stars, but never beyond them. My dreams will be lies, if a golden lord does not rise.
I look to the stars now, with the old scrolls burning runes across my memory. And I see my own hands as I write these words. Erebus and Kor Phaeron speak the truth.
I've seen horrors... horrors that you've seen. But you have no right to call me a murderer. You have a right to kill me. You have a right to do that... but you have no right to judge me. It's impossible for words to describe what is necessary to those who do not know what horror means. Horror... Horror has a face... and you must make a friend of horror. Horror and moral terror are your friends. If they are not, then they are enemies to be feared. They are truly enemies! I remember when I was with Special Forces... seems a thousand centuries ago. We went into a camp to inoculate some children. We left the camp after we had inoculated the children for polio, and this old man came running after us and he was crying. He couldn't see. We went back there, and they had come and hacked off every inoculated arm. There they were in a pile. A pile of little arms. And I remember... I... I... I cried, I wept like some grandmother. I wanted to tear my teeth out; I didn't know what I wanted to do! And I want to remember it. I never want to forget it... I never want to forget. And then I realized... like I was shot... like I was shot with a diamond... a diamond bullet right through my forehead. And I thought, my God... the genius of that! The genius! The will to do that! Perfect, genuine, complete, crystalline, pure. And then I realized they were stronger than we, because they could stand that these were not monsters, these were men... trained cadres. These men who fought with their hearts, who had families, who had children, who were filled with love... but they had the strength... the strength... to do that. If I had ten divisions of those men, our troubles here would be over very quickly. You have to have men who are moral... and at the same time who are able to utilize their primordial instincts to kill without feeling... without passion... without judgment... without judgment! Because it's judgment that defeats us.
This was the video. Make an army that does not feel remorse, that does not feel guilt, that does not feel, and you will break the enemy. Because they will be willing to do whatever is necessary, for the greater good. Use the morality of the enemy against them- to bind them, restrain them, and strangle them.
Also, M'shen was poorly executed because she fails in the role of the main character in Heart of Darkness, and Sheen's character in Apocalypse Now. They both broke. They broke because they realized that what everyone called a madman was right and through insanity understood the world better then anyone else.
Interesting... I remember this from the movie. But in this case didn't this just precipitate their fall to Chaos? And they did more than what was necessary and started to lose themselves in the excess. Doesn't Sevatar confront Kurze about this when he enters his mind? That in spite of his attempt to moralize things, the real reason for his actions was simply that he enjoyed causing suffering? They went down the rabbit hole and lost themselves. I guess in this way they are quite Slaaneshi.
Only some of them went down the Rabbit Hole, guys like Cyrion who fell prey to reveling in the act of the kill. The true fall was that they started to spread fear for the sake of fear, instead of having higher goals. They also became the very thing they originally sought to destory.
“There is only one good, knowledge, and one evil, ignorance.”
Wyzilla wrote: Only some of them went down the Rabbit Hole, guys like Cyrion who fell prey to reveling in the act of the kill. The true fall was that they started to spread fear for the sake of fear, instead of having higher goals. They also became the very thing they originally sought to destory.
I thought the majority of them went down the rabbit hole when Nostramo returned to its old ways in the Night Haunter's absence and started supplying the legion with gutter trash. And it seems that Curze was keenly aware of this but did nothing to stop it (going by Prince of Crows here).
I'm not questioning why you like them (they rank pretty highly in my list as well) but I do think their philosophy on war was doomed to failure from the very beginning since there could be no other result than them becoming the monsters they were supposed to fight. But I guess this was the way it was written with Curze's visions? A self-fulfilling prophecy. Do you like them because of that or in spite of it?
And the Angels of Darkness descended on pinions of fire and light... the great and terrible dark angels.
He was not the golden lord. The Emperor will carry us to the stars, but never beyond them. My dreams will be lies, if a golden lord does not rise.
I look to the stars now, with the old scrolls burning runes across my memory. And I see my own hands as I write these words. Erebus and Kor Phaeron speak the truth.
Wyzilla wrote: Only some of them went down the Rabbit Hole, guys like Cyrion who fell prey to reveling in the act of the kill. The true fall was that they started to spread fear for the sake of fear, instead of having higher goals. They also became the very thing they originally sought to destory.
I thought the majority of them went down the rabbit hole when Nostramo returned to its old ways in the Night Haunter's absence and started supplying the legion with gutter trash. And it seems that Curze was keenly aware of this but did nothing to stop it (going by Prince of Crows here).
I'm not questioning why you like them (they rank pretty highly in my list as well) but I do think their philosophy on war was doomed to failure from the very beginning since there could be no other result than them becoming the monsters they were supposed to fight. But I guess this was the way it was written with Curze's visions? A self-fulfilling prophecy. Do you like them because of that or in spite of it?
Their tragedy. Sevetar and Talos speak on how were they to come from another world, they would have been champions, potentially the greatest the Imperium ever seen, arbiters of justice dealing retribution as willed. Instead Curze landed on Nostramo, and knew his fate from childhood, along with the fate of his legion and the rest of the Galaxy.
“There is only one good, knowledge, and one evil, ignorance.”
