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The gene-seed does not always take on a new recruit space marine. Sometimes, it just doesn't work out.

So, I was wondering how much we know about what happens to these failed astartes. I'm sure a good number of them die (that's just how it goes if you're trying to mutate your body). What happens to the others?

The Space Wolves probably don't have to worry about it- if the seed doesn't take, the wolf probably dies before he can make it back to the citadel (space wolf trials are a little hard core).

Do other chapters turn them into servitors? Or are the failed astartes the robed attendants that we often see depicted in the artwork (apparently, there are a lot of guys in robes following astartes around, some of them are extremely short).

Or does failure always result in death?

They get told to find work with Abaddon and his Black Legion.

Death or being made into a servitor are the most likely fates for an aspirant who doesn't make the cut.

Servitor or a round trough the head

Some become Serfs, other get assigned to other duties. In Hell in a Bottle a failed aspirant where the Gene - seed doesn't take gets assigned to new duties and left to maintain one of the Chapters training devices. Death is predominant.

Generally, "the gene seed didn't take" means the aspirant's body violently rejected the changes that were happening to it, and the aspirant died. So yeah, 99.9% there's nothing left to do with failed aspirants but incinerate the body. Otherwise, it's servitor time. Guys with secret Astartes modifications in their bodies (who are probably crippled for life, if the mods didn't work properly and didn't kill them) aren't going to be free to wander on the streets.

In Damnation Crusade, the newly recruited Raclaw (who has just gone through the surgical process) is forced to fight and kill another recruit whose body reacted violently to the process and has mutated. So I guess they use the recruits, failed or not, however they can. They'll use the failed recruits as training tools if they're still able to fight or as serfs if they're more worthy. The rest are either put down or turned into servitors.

In the HH novels, Garro has a Housecarl who is a failed applicant.

I swear I remember reading that applicants who can't take all the Geneseed can end up as soldiers in the PDF under the Space Marines' control. Like being in charge of the Fortress' defences.

Most of chapter serf's leadership I'd imagine are failed aspirant's, or descended from them, depending on the chapter o/c. I

I'm fairly sure that most don't die on the operating table. With the 5/10 random recruit's they get a year, It doesn't seem likely that most die under the knife. The youth's surging hormone's seem to be one of those thing's that adapt's the inductee to the implant's, or the implant's have been genericised (is that a word) enough to not matter.

If we go all the way back to the space marine novel, Out of 10/15 random people, only 1 had a inverse effect to the implant's. His Ossmodula went bonkers, Iknow there's a chapter that's decended from the Fist's that it's a problem with. Can't remember who it is, Dragon something, something dragon

It usually seem's to be a mental exercise they've failed. Not showing enough aggression, showing to much, etc.

They'd still press gang people from the pubs, like the British, and french I guess, navies used to do though, Someone's got to man them cannon's and spy through them looking glasses.

If their body rejected the implants they will likley die. If they failed their tests but still showed promise there's plenty of fluff showing they become serfs. I'm sure some chapters are brutal and might kill failed aspirants, but to get to the point of being trained means they were already among the recruting planet's best and brightest so it would be waste not to utlize them. I forget which HH book it is but there is musing on this subject and there was no dishonor from not making it as not everyone can be a space marine.

 odinsgrandson wrote:
The gene-seed does not always take on a new recruit space marine. Sometimes, it just doesn't work out.

So, I was wondering how much we know about what happens to these failed astartes. I'm sure a good number of them die (that's just how it goes if you're trying to mutate your body). What happens to the others?

The Space Wolves probably don't have to worry about it- if the seed doesn't take, the wolf probably dies before he can make it back to the citadel (space wolf trials are a little hard core).

Do other chapters turn them into servitors? Or are the failed astartes the robed attendants that we often see depicted in the artwork (apparently, there are a lot of guys in robes following astartes around, some of them are extremely short).

Or does failure always result in death?

In the book Rynn's World, it describes a large number of serfs working for the Crimson Fists that were once part of their recruits but failed at some point in their trials. The lead serf, in particular, had made it through all of the trials, but failed the final implant.

If the geneseed rejection doesn't kill or mutate them (in which case they are killed), they are taken in as serfs to perform supportive duties.

Dead, serf, or servitor (though I think this is more of a "mercy conversion" in the case of these servitors) for the ones who get far enough to the Geneseed process. As for those who never get to the augmentation, I'd imagine they're thrown back to the recruiting worlds.

It will depend on the Chapter as much as anything else.

The ultra-grim "fight to the death for the one-in-a-hundred spot" Chapters aren't going to blink once at killing a failed aspirant. It's the price of failure.

Others aren't going to waste the time, money and know-how that went into him even if he can't take up the PA and bolter. He will do something for the Chapter, as his ablities allow. As low as garbage disposal servitor or as high as commanding all Chapter assets on a Cruiser.

the ancient your thinking of the Black Dragons, who grow bone blades out of their forearms and heads because of the defect. In the fluff some would cover the blades in adamantine and keep them ultra sharp.

There are no wolves on Fenris...

Thanks. I guess the title we'd use for them is failed aspirant, and it looks like they can end up in any number of roles (I like the ideas that come from the books- especially that they find uses for the horribly mutated failed aspirants).

BrianDavion wrote:
There are no wolves on Fenris...

Um... is it all a big conspiracy?

^Read some of the Horus Heresy novels and find out

Heres a better question - what happens to the gene-seed of the failed astartes? Like in the example given from Rynns World, the one serf made it through all but the final gene-seed implantation, so he has whatever 20 out of the 21 or whatever organs, right? Does he keep the rest of those organs? Do they then perform a surgery to remove them?

chaos0xomega wrote:
Heres a better question - what happens to the gene-seed of the failed astartes?

They'll harvest the progenoid glands when matured, just as they would with a full marine. It's not like there's anything wrong with them - the AdMech uses slaves to grow the 1000 sets for founding a new Chapter after all. Marines think that a set harvested from a veteran fallen in battle will somehow magically make a better marine, but there's really no evidence of that. If the Chapter has this belief the serf will likely be allowed to carry the chest gland until his death while the neck gland will be removed after the five years it takes to mature just as usual.

Any organs his body accepted will remain in his body as the surgery to remove them would probably be lethal. If he failed at the last stage he only lacks the black carapace and is incapable of using Astartes power armor. He's still a very powerful and dangerous man, useful in any number of roles a Chapter might need filled with reliable men.

Spetulhu wrote:
If he failed at the last stage he only lacks the black carapace and is incapable of using Astartes power armor. He's still a very powerful and dangerous man, useful in any number of roles a Chapter might need filled with reliable men.

If he misses just the BC, he will probably just stay in the Scout Company.

- Unless he is seen as a "Failure" or worse, a "Mutation." If he's seen as a failure (if failure for the gene-seed to take is blamed on divine will or his own unworthyness) then we can't let him contaminate the good scouts in training. He could be used for something else, but I don't think it will be an honorable combat role.

But that's an odd thing. I've been playing for a long time, and the scout company used to use veteran sergeants in full power armor. But now, the scout sergeants look just like the other scouts (and the Space Wolves don't train using their scout company anymore). It feels like something was ret-conned here.

 odinsgrandson wrote:
Thanks. I guess the title we'd use for them is failed aspirant, and it looks like they can end up in any number of roles (I like the ideas that come from the books- especially that they find uses for the horribly mutated failed aspirants).

BrianDavion wrote:
There are no wolves on Fenris...

Um... is it all a big conspiracy?

It's STRONGLY implied the wolves ARE failed Aspirants.

Not "failure" as such.. But does anyone ever just say "Thanks but no thanks?" to being recruited?
I realise on many worlds there's no choice, but elsewhere, do folks get any say in the matter?

I remember the old Dark Angel book where one aspirant changes his mind to joining the Dark Angels, the Space Marine kills him on the spot for being indecisive.

Most die, the rest will be made into servitors or become serfs depending on the chapter.

In the graham McNeil books they mention that the space ships are crewed mostlyy by failed initiates and that the temples and facilities are caredfor by faile initiates.

Plenty have been cut before you get to all the implantation.

Pony_law wrote:
In the graham McNeil books they mention that the space ships are crewed mostlyy by failed initiates and that the temples and facilities are caredfor by faile initiates.

Plenty have been cut before you get to all the implantation.

It'll I imagine depend on the way they select their aspirants too. Given how the ultramarines recruit (from the top percent of the military schools) every member of the Ultramar Auxillery is technicly a failed aspirant.

Given the large number of implants, and the many and various ways that they can fail, and the many, many different recruiting practices of different Chapters, you've got thousands of variations.

I think you could have anything from:

First implantation is rejected, aspirant survives, is released with honor (after all, he had to be pretty impressive just to get chosen). This is possible for a Chapter who doesn't recruit secretly, or conceal their nature from the recruitment populace.

all the way to:

Aspirant mutates into a monster and is gunned down.

With everything in between.

We know that there are occasions when aspirants are killed (heck, the recently re-released Angels of Darkness has an aspirant killed before any implantation, just to spare his family the disgrace and rejection of receiving a rejected aspirant). We know that other Chapters use failed aspirants as loyal, valued serfs. We know that sometimes they mutate. It's just all over the place. It's like asking, "Who gets fired from a job, and what happens to them?"

All depends on what the fail is, if there wrecked dead, if there minds gone but bofpdy good, well servitor need replacement every so often.

And if body and brain good, even one semi upgraded is a stronger than average human, a chapter needs serfs and their already semi proven and why waste their potential, even if not as a full marine.

Iron hands well their serfs are very low but a fleet based chapter may have a good reason to keep a strong loyal crew.

 Buttery Commissar wrote:
Not "failure" as such.. But does anyone ever just say "Thanks but no thanks?" to being recruited?
I realise on many worlds there's no choice, but elsewhere, do folks get any say in the matter?

Probably depends on the chapter. Most chapters seem to recruit in a way that makes it difficult to say no, but I don't see why they wouldn't accept it. From feral worlds where people fight to with the right to join, where someone could just refuse to even start that process, to chapters that take hive scum and offer them a chance to become powerful and get away from the misery of life in the deep hive, but taking someone who does not go would not be worth it, to chapters that recruit from the military, where they take the best of the best, and offer them the chance to be the best of the best of the best where it would be an honor, but someone who said no would probably be best left as it would make recruitment more difficult. In most cases forcing someone who says no is probably more hassle than it is worth, and probably does not happen all that much. In many cases it would be seen as the highest honor, in the case of military schools it is what they hope for from day one, or in the case of feral worlds it's like an angel comes and asks you to join the army of god.