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Hello Dakkanauts,

It's been a while since I've been around, and I'm planning to get back into the fray sometime soon.

I have plans drawn up for a converted Defiler, but the design of which leaves little availablity to swap the HF and AC for the extra CCWs should I change my mind later. So I'm trying to get some feedback on which version you guys prefer.
Do you load up with CCW and bum rush, or leave standard the guns?
For that matter, is the power scourge worth it?

Most of the Defiler action I've seen has been the shooty, so I recommend that. Also, not sure if CSM have it, but Soul Grinders seem to be better than Defilers in terms of overall killing and mobility.

 jreilly89 wrote:
Most of the Defiler action I've seen has been the shooty, so I recommend that. Also, not sure if CSM have it, but Soul Grinders seem to be better than Defilers in terms of overall killing and mobility.

and durability...and point cost.

I wanted to vote:

Convert into Soul Grinders or Brass Scorpions or Plague Hulk

I converted mine into an imperial knight,..

Yeah Its hard to use a deflier and feel like you are getting your points worth.

 koooaei wrote:

 jreilly89 wrote:
Most of the Defiler action I've seen has been the shooty, so I recommend that. Also, not sure if CSM have it, but Soul Grinders seem to be better than Defilers in terms of overall killing and mobility.

and durability...and point cost.

I've never played a Defiler, but I loveeeee my Soul Grinders. So many options, most of them usable. With Defilers, I feel like you only play them with fluff armies or you REALLY love the model.

 jreilly89 wrote:

 koooaei wrote:

 jreilly89 wrote:
Most of the Defiler action I've seen has been the shooty, so I recommend that. Also, not sure if CSM have it, but Soul Grinders seem to be better than Defilers in terms of overall killing and mobility.

and durability...and point cost.

I've never played a Defiler, but I loveeeee my Soul Grinders. So many options, most of them usable. With Defilers, I feel like you only play them with fluff armies or you REALLY love the model.

I actually fething hate the model. Stupid box-crab. That's why I'm making my own.
Wouldn't be that hard to change it to a Soul Grinder, though. I'll have to look into them a little more.

Melee is the only optiion since the battle cannon makes all other guns snapshot anyway.

 Ashiraya wrote:
Melee is the only optiion since the battle cannon makes all other guns snapshot anyway.

That was my initial thought. But then if you lose the cannon and become immobilized, it's effectively useless. Hence the quandary.

It would be pretty bad luck seeing as Defilers are quite immune to crew shaken and crew stunned and you'd have to take two hits which would then have to make it immobilised and then randomly take out the battle cannon.


It's already overcosted, don't bother pushing the cost up by adding more guns, if you really want more guns, say it is a soul grinder.

I would do anything other then running a defiler at all.

Look at Plague Hulks. They're a Soul Grinder of Nurgle from Forge World but CSM can take them.

Plague Hulks also win the award for most pointless weapon upgrade. Apart from that they are pretty damn good alternate Nurgle Soul Grinders.

Point for point though, I prefer Hulks over Grinders. They just do their job, and damn well at that. CSM need that kind of reliability and love. Forge World delivered with that.

If you don't like the model, and want shooty, then the forgefiend (and a 20 point discount) is for you.

If you don't like the model and want punchy, then the maulerfiend (and a 70! point discount) is for you.

If you want to keep both aspects but actually be pretty decent at both, then MoN obliterators are for you, though it's gonna cost you 33 points for the privilege.

If you want a high str large blast, then the vindicator (and a 50 point discount, after siege shield and daemonic possession) is for you.

Friends don't let friends (or anyone else for that matter) take Defilers.

Well deffies I believe that if you want a hybrid CC and shooty unit this is your choice for you... Sadly why... Why in the world would you want that... CSM is entirely based around that concept look at how far that got em! Also, can someone please post a batrep that is a mutilator, possessed, defiler list vs ta fluffy darkangels list? I think this will get the message across about how bad those units are.

So... Seems pretty clear that everyone hates Defilers. I haven't played an actual game since 5th Ed, so I'm pretty far out of the loop.
Thanks for the suggestions.

They should have simply been >50 pt cheaper. That's it.

Theoretically, they have some sort of okish durability due to 4 HP, av12, 5++, almost immunity to Shakes and Stuns, IWND. They can still get 1-shot easilly but what vehicle can't other than Serpents and alike.
And being able to do both shooting and chopping is fine and CSM could use that battlecannon. Fleet makes it semi-reliable with charges and running forward when needed.

But the price tag is what spoils everything. There are cheaper options that do definite things better. In other words, you're paying full price for all the possible upgrades that you're never gona use to full potential. It's like buying apower fist for your laz havok's champion. Yep, it might get handy but you're better off spending this points elsewhere.

I don't mind the Defiler model, but like everyone else, I think it is overpriced and underperforming.

Sidenote: I do love how some people still defend FW, saying it is not OP, when 90% of the Tactics responses (myself included) say "Use it as a FW proxy".

In this case, FW is Codex +1 while Codex is What Should Have Been -1

FW has it's cheeze but plague hulks are not this case. They're simply good.

For the same points in C:CSM big kits, I think you get the Maulerfiend.

For the same crab claw base, you play as Daemons Soul Grinder.

If you want to play Defiler, probably best to roll back the clock to an earlier Codex.

Or, house rule the current Defiler to be considerably cheaper.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

Chaos Incarnate wrote:
I actually fething hate the model. Stupid box-crab. That's why I'm making my own.

That's easy enough...



(Yes, I need to lose the extra guns).

 JohnHwangDD wrote:
For the same points in C:CSM big kits, I think you get the Maulerfiend.

For the same crab claw base, you play as Daemons Soul Grinder.

If you want to play Defiler, probably best to roll back the clock to an earlier Codex.

Or, house rule the current Defiler to be considerably cheaper.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

Chaos Incarnate wrote:
I actually fething hate the model. Stupid box-crab. That's why I'm making my own.

That's easy enough...



(Yes, I need to lose the extra guns).

Uh, what are those supposed to be?

Defilers, of course! See the gun?

Then I guess I'm making my Defiler just for shiggles. Cool. :]