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being free the from the emperor's control im surprised that the CSM of all people aren't looting stuff to use in there long war against the false emporer especially of there loyalist kin such as whirlwinds, land raider variants etc or even xeno's tech

does anyone have explanation for this?

They have their own forgeworlds and warpsmiths, no need to sully their hands with the filthy technological spawn of lesser races.

what about the warbands without forgeworlds of their own?

They loot everything, but aren't very tech savvy. So they get stuck with stuff that their warpsmiths and dark mechanicus allies can maintain, which is the older kit.

In the ADB night lords omnibus, they seem to loot EVERYTHING. There's a point the main character carves a left arm off another night lord the second he gets shot because he needs a replacement. There's also instances of both looting loyalists armor in/post battle and raiding munitions factories. They also "liberate" a ship from Hurons fleet, claiming it was theirs once and therefor is theirs still. It's a pretty damned amazing novel, but never mentions looting from xenos. They may be traitors, but they're still human. As such, most are hesitant at best to work with alien races tech.

Fluffwise they loot things all the time.

Ruleswise you can't field them because GW doesn't want you to. It's like the marine codices: Before unbound came along if you wanted to field an all Terminator force you had to use Dark Angels or Space Wolves, even though most Codex Chapters can muster a Terminator detachment large enough for a 40k army (hell, even the Scythes of the Emperor used to be able to field 25 Terminators *after* the chapter was all but annihilated). Likewise Blood Angels used to be the only way of fielding a pure Assault army, even though fluffwise they have no more (regular) assault marines than any other codex chapter.. (they did bring in some guff about Tactical marines happily pulling double duty as Assault, but that only appeared to justify Assault squads becoming troops in the previous 'codex').

 Gashrog wrote:
Fluffwise they loot things all the time.

Ruleswise you can't field them because GW doesn't want you to. It's like the marine codices: Before unbound came along if you wanted to field an all Terminator force you had to use Dark Angels or Space Wolves, even though most Codex Chapters can muster a Terminator detachment large enough for a 40k army (hell, even the Scythes of the Emperor used to be able to field 25 Terminators *after* the chapter was all but annihilated). Likewise Blood Angels used to be the only way of fielding a pure Assault army, even though fluffwise they have no more (regular) assault marines than any other codex chapter.. (they did bring in some guff about Tactical marines happily pulling double duty as Assault, but that only appeared to justify Assault squads becoming troops in the previous 'codex').

Well that and each company armory had enough jump packs to outfit their tactical squads with. Doesnt say how often its done, or if its common practice, but they have the ability according to the ward dex

AFAIK, Chaos Space Marines are making loyalist gene-seed deposits a top-priorty target. They need this stuff to maintain their constantly warp-decaying DNA and maintain their numbers. I've read somewhere the Iron Warriors looted the Imperial Fists' repository on some world, only to gain access to new gene-seed.

They tried other ways to make new Marines with Fabius Bile's terrible bio-magical-devices known as Daemonculaba but it was not really reliable.

Regarding military technology, I don't think they need so much innovation as they have plenty of demons and warp power to do the trick in battle against loyalists.

 Gashrog wrote:
Fluffwise they loot things all the time.

Ruleswise you can't field them because GW doesn't want you to. It's like the marine codices: Before unbound came along if you wanted to field an all Terminator force you had to use Dark Angels or Space Wolves, even though most Codex Chapters can muster a Terminator detachment large enough for a 40k army (hell, even the Scythes of the Emperor used to be able to field 25 Terminators *after* the chapter was all but annihilated). Likewise Blood Angels used to be the only way of fielding a pure Assault army, even though fluffwise they have no more (regular) assault marines than any other codex chapter.. (they did bring in some guff about Tactical marines happily pulling double duty as Assault, but that only appeared to justify Assault squads becoming troops in the previous 'codex').

Purely this.

GW thinks it would be unfair to make Chaos marines into loyalist marines with spikes, marks, daemons, and daemontanks added on.

They use everything loyalist chapters use and more. They have access to some weapons from before the HH, they have stuff from every era of mankind since, they have access to looted alien artefacts, they have access to things the Dark Mech make.

Some chaos armies would look exaclty like 30k legions. Some would look just like 40k loyalists. Some would have tons of Daemonic stuff. Some would be a mismass of all of the above. The only cosntant is that there is no constant. Increasing Entropy.

They don't "loot", they "Pillage"

Ha chaos don't need storm see shields, those are for cowards.

Loot things... of course they loot. They loot gears, guns, ammo, armor, vehicles, gene-seed and living beings. They trade the gene-seed for recruits for a warband if they can, they trade the slaves for wargears and war machines with the Dark Mechanicus.

They loot stuff all the time. They're often forced to scavenge armor and weaponry as their own stuff gets worn out. Not every CSM can afford the prices that the daemon forges and dark mechanicus charges for gear.

The most successful bands will capture loot and slaves to trade for gear, but the poorer groups will have to make do with what they can take off the dead.

I'm not reading anyone else's comments, so maybe this is being said, but they loot gak constantly. It's definitely one of they major ways they resupply. Lots of instances in the fluff

I do find it bizarre however, that as soon as a chapter/company turns to chaos, they magically lose all their new tech. Say a chapter turned to chaos, and up until that point they were using centurions, whirlwinds, storm shields etc etc, why would they suddenly abandon all this tech they have been reliably using, and possibly built many of their tactics around?

 statu wrote:
I do find it bizarre however, that as soon as a chapter/company turns to chaos, they magically lose all their new tech. Say a chapter turned to chaos, and up until that point they were using centurions, whirlwinds, storm shields etc etc, why would they suddenly abandon all this tech they have been reliably using, and possibly built many of their tactics around?

Don't forget that the Chapter Master also loses one of his wounds

And pretty much every army in the history of ever loots, so to think these guys don't is crazy. Now, whether they loot anything they can use in wartime is another story. Maybe some scopes off bolters or some nice power weapons, but nothing like an entire tank. Usually commanders let loose their men on a conquered area for them to plunder what they wish, and is rarely really too organized. I imagine the chaos marines take things like slaves, trophies (skulls, hands, ears, whatever they collect), maybe a sword or two, and whatever they use to barter with each other. The rest is probably just ignored or destroyed.

Which chaos homies had centurions?

Is there something the CSM would absolutely NOT loot? They like having food and ammo, new weapons and armor is always nice and new slaves to carry your pack is never wrong.

But some of these guys are so deranged that they might loot just about anything you can imagine finding in the setting. A collectible item (valuable or not), a fun item (fun for the CSM or fun to use on a slave...), My Little Pony figures. Loot for the loot gods!

 statu wrote:
I do find it bizarre however, that as soon as a chapter/company turns to chaos, they magically lose all their new tech. Say a chapter turned to chaos, and up until that point they were using centurions, whirlwinds, storm shields etc etc, why would they suddenly abandon all this tech they have been reliably using, and possibly built many of their tactics around?

Because Centurions are bad and uninspired, And when they go Chaos they can abandon them.

 Khonsu wrote:

 statu wrote:
I do find it bizarre however, that as soon as a chapter/company turns to chaos, they magically lose all their new tech. Say a chapter turned to chaos, and up until that point they were using centurions, whirlwinds, storm shields etc etc, why would they suddenly abandon all this tech they have been reliably using, and possibly built many of their tactics around?

Because Centurions are bad and uninspired, And when they go Chaos they can abandon them.

What about stormbolters then? They're not a bad weapon, and in some situations would be beneficial to them. Why would they suddenly dump them?

Stormbolters jam very easily.

"Take what you can and give nothing back"

 statu wrote:
I do find it bizarre however, that as soon as a chapter/company turns to chaos, they magically lose all their new tech. Say a chapter turned to chaos, and up until that point they were using centurions, whirlwinds, storm shields etc etc, why would they suddenly abandon all this tech they have been reliably using, and possibly built many of their tactics around?

Whilst they do a lot of looting and keep a lot of their weapons in the fluff, it'd basically make CSM's the same as Loyalist Astartes in the game. In Forge World stuff however, you can have a gak load of stuff that the Loyalists have.

I think when they loot a chassis with complicated weapon systems they strip it down and rebuild it with weapon systems that are easier to maintain/acquire ammo for.

Perhaps some weapons are considered emblematic of the imperium so are avoided too (similar to how chaos marines will strip/deface any aquilas on things they loot as quickly as possible).

 statu wrote:
I do find it bizarre however, that as soon as a chapter/company turns to chaos, they magically lose all their new tech. Say a chapter turned to chaos, and up until that point they were using centurions, whirlwinds, storm shields etc etc, why would they suddenly abandon all this tech they have been reliably using, and possibly built many of their tactics around?

Well, there is a combo of GW not making the rules represent the fluff and not wanting to make CSM the same as Vanilla marines, just with spiky bits.

Just finished reading "Atrophy" and in it even the Crimson Sabers, before they became the "Crimson Sluaghter" looted. one has a veteran taking an CSM weapon and says its his right when told to just leave it as it was tainted

If you want loyalist gear..... use the loyalist codex....

Or just wait for a LoyalistKin codex in a few months....

I see GW as choas, officially they dont loot much, but we all know theyre thieving gits.