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So to provide some context, I have been playing IG for 11 years now and for the last 4 I have been using Footguard.

I am currently taking part in a league and have played 5 games. I smashed the first 3 games all against very good space marine lists (faced about 8 storm ravens alone). But then my 4th and 5th games have been against Eldar. I got tabled in the 4th games which shocked me because I had 251 men! I managed to claw a draw in the 5th but the Eldar List was not very good, No D weapons or storm, and this also worried me.

The problem I have is that Eldar have the ability to wipe out whole flanks with Eldritch Storm. But my Tanks are also useless due to D weapons.

What was crazy to me was that every Eldar unit I was facing had awesome special rule, For example, Guardians with Free missile launcher only cost 60 points. If you take into account the fact the heavy weapon costs 30 points, you are effectively paying 3 points per guardian, which is the same as a conscript!

The only way I can think of beating them is Flyer Spam. Both Eldar lists I faced lacked AA.

A rough list could be:

HQ:
CCS
Priest

Troops
Platoon:
PCS
Infantry Squad
Infantry Squad
50 Conscripts

Veterans

Fast Attack
3x Vendetta
3x Vendetta
3x Valkyrie with missile pods

The tactic would be to put each of the 10 man squads in the Valks and the 5 man command squad in 1 vendetta from each squad. Have the 50 Conscripts with Priest sit in some cover and survive until the air support arrives.


Does anyone else have any ideas?

Er, imho, grab an ADL with comm relay. You need those flyers come in Turn 2. Also, grab a psyker or two. Get that DtW to nullify the Eldar offensive power, while fish for the invisibilty or shrouded to let your guys more survivable behind that ADL or any kind of cover. Also, IG has the best artilery. Bring some wyveens, put them out of LOS and pound those guardians sitting back.

I am also interested to know what those two Eldar player have. It may help come out some idea better

1 had 2 WK Farseer, Avatar, Vauls wrath, Hemlock fighters, Vyper, Warwalker 30 guardians.

other had loads of harelquins and a seer council.

my blasts were useless both games due to invis and outflanking

You lost to invisibility. Take a number.

 FatBoyNoSlim wrote:
So to provide some context, I have been playing IG for 11 years now and for the last 4 I have been using Footguard.

I am currently taking part in a league and have played 5 games. I smashed the first 3 games all against very good space marine lists (faced about 8 storm ravens alone). But then my 4th and 5th games have been against Eldar. I got tabled in the 4th games which shocked me because I had 251 men! I managed to claw a draw in the 5th but the Eldar List was not very good, No D weapons or storm, and this also worried me.

The problem I have is that Eldar have the ability to wipe out whole flanks with Eldritch Storm. But my Tanks are also useless due to D weapons.

What was crazy to me was that every Eldar unit I was facing had awesome special rule, For example, Guardians with Free missile launcher only cost 60 points. If you take into account the fact the heavy weapon costs 30 points, you are effectively paying 3 points per guardian, which is the same as a conscript!

The only way I can think of beating them is Flyer Spam. Both Eldar lists I faced lacked AA.

A rough list could be:

HQ:
CCS
Priest

Troops
Platoon:
PCS
Infantry Squad
Infantry Squad
50 Conscripts

Veterans

Fast Attack
3x Vendetta
3x Vendetta
3x Valkyrie with missile pods

The tactic would be to put each of the 10 man squads in the Valks and the 5 man command squad in 1 vendetta from each squad. Have the 50 Conscripts with Priest sit in some cover and survive until the air support arrives.

Does anyone else have any ideas?

Stick a Culexus Assassin in one of those flyers.
If eldar are investing the points in getting off invisibility and fortune, it's a big slap in the face to just fly up an negate all those blessings.

I suggest cover/ignores cover for one - D weapons are usually low shot numbers so cover can seriously hinder their effectiveness (D-scythes and rolling 6s not withstanding). A WK with his cannons twin linked could kill 2 tanks a turn and is almost certain to kill at least one. A 4+ cover halves that pain.

Ignores cover can cripple wave serpents and bikes by preventing them jinking and many other eldar units rely on terrain cover saves for survival too.

Flyers are also a good shout as eldar usually lack good AA - missile launchers sometimes feature but not so much in competitive lists and the crimson death formation will rule the skies but is less common as the models are expensive. Even saying that they are weak to other flyers so if you have enough they will go down.

Master of ordnance + ignores cover order can do fun things to bikes. Even better with a psyocculum inquisitor and some servo skulls.

Vets in valkyries with plasma guns and monster hunter rules can have fun with WKs. Can also fold in melta-toting command squads for giggles.

If you can take Elysian drop troops, then that might go over well. Fliers should wreck D weapons as they can't be assaulted and blast templates can't target them.

Culexus assassin as mentioned is sexy. 3 Primaris psykers can work well. I don't know if russes are all that good. I think chimeras/tauroxes might do better as you get lots of shots that can still snap fire against invisible squads and don't hurt as badly when they get sucked into the warp by D weapons.

Allied librarian with hood might be handy. Should decrease the amount of eldritch storms going on. You gain some pods which might let you bring in special weapons squads or demo vets for some boom.

 FatBoyNoSlim wrote:
1 had 2 WK Farseer, Avatar, Vauls wrath, Hemlock fighters, Vyper, Warwalker 30 guardians.

First off, this Eldar player is a douchebag. He's doing exactly what people on the internet are complaining about expecting to happen. He gives the rest of us Eldar players a bad name. You should speak with whoever is running the league, and ask why multiple Lord of War gargantuan creatures are being allowed. Most tournaments limit this sort of thing by limiting lords of war and/or gargantuan creatures to 1.

 FatBoyNoSlim wrote:

What was crazy to me was that every Eldar unit I was facing had awesome special rule, For example, Guardians with Free missile launcher only cost 60 points. If you take into account the fact the heavy weapon costs 30 points, you are effectively paying 3 points per guardian, which is the same as a conscript!

Second, this isn't exactly right. Guardians with a free missile launcher platform are 90 points, so if your opponent only paid 60, he cheated.



Both those things said, bear in mind that the multiple wounds from an individual roll on the D-weapons chart are only applied to a single model. So, if he was rolling on the D-weapons chart against your horde and wiping multiple models off at a time, he was doing it wrong. A wraithknight's D-cannons vs. hordes pretty much suck. They can each only ever kill 1 model per turn.

Based on what you said they had, I'm assuming it was 1500 points?

HQ:
CCS w/ Master of Ordnance, Vox Caster, Medipac, Camo Gear, Laurels of Command, Kurov's Aquila
1 Commisar

Troops:
Platoon 1:
Platoon Command Squad w/ Vox Caster, Heavy Weapons team w/ Missile launcher + flakk missiles
Infantry squad w/ Vox Caster, Heavy Weapons team w/ Missile launcher + flakk missiles, Flamer, Melta Bombs
Infantry squad w/ Heavy Weapons team w/ Missile launcher + flakk missiles, Flamer, Melta Bombs
2 Heavy Weapon Squads w/ 3x Missile launcher + flakk missiles
50 Conscripts

Platoon 2:
Platoon Command Squad w/ Vox Caster, Heavy Weapons team w/ Missile launcher + flakk missiles
Infantry squad w/ Vox Caster, Heavy Weapons team w/ Missile launcher + flakk missiles, Flamer, Melta Bombs
Infantry squad w/ Heavy Weapons team w/ Missile launcher + flakk missiles, Flamer, Melta Bombs
1 Heavy Weapon Squad w/ 3x Missile launcher + flakk missiles
1 Heavy Weapon Squad w/ 3x Missile launcher

Heavy Support:
1 Manticore w/ Camo Netting
3 Wyverns

Fortification:
Aegis Defense Line

The above list could probably do well against either one of them if it was run right. It's also designed as an all comers list, rather than tailored to those eldar players, so it's still useful against other things you might face. Put the commisar in with the 50 conscripts and you basically have a fearless mob with objective secured. You can use them to screen for other units, providing a cover save in a pinch, but their real use in this particular list is to march fearlessly across the board to secure and contest objectives. You can also have them multi-charge and tie up units in CC that you don't want getting to your rear lines(Great against invisible units). Overall, that unit is just about map control.

The rest of the list forms your gun line. Your command squad should ideally be hidden from LoS, positioned to give the preferred enemy bonus and morale bonus from Kurov's Aquila and Laurels to as many special weapons teams and infantry platoons as possible. You can keep 2 of the units outside of this range and still get tank hunter/monster hunter on them for rerolls to pen/wound from orders. Vox casters are there to ensure those orders don't fail.

You've got 18 missile launchers in this list firing at 48" range. Then you have the manticore on top of that at 72" of devastation. The Wyverns add in some anti-horde firepower to your potent anti-vehicle / anti-monstrous creature force.

If you focus fire your entire army at something like wraithknights, even if the wraithknight had a 4+ save(which is difficult to claim a 4+ cover on a wraithknight), you'd be able to put about 4 unsaved wounds per turn on them. That's after calculating rerolling to hit on 1's from preferred enemy, rerolling to wound from 2 units having monster hunter, the WK's 4+ cover save, plus FnP, etc. With a cover save, your chance to eliminate a WK in the first round is roughly 30%.

If the wraithknight can't claim cover(More likely), your chances of eliminating the WK in the first round double, up to 62%. The fact that your opponent's WK, if kitted out with D-weapons, will only be able to respond back killing a few of your models at a time will spell his doom. And multiple expensive Hemlock wraithfighters will HATE to see all those flakk missiles. Because of how slowly WKs will kill infantry outside of melee, the Hemlocks should always be first priority to take out if they're on the table. You can always go back to chipping away at the WKs after they're dead.

Further, you should see if your local meta still accepts the rules from Escalation, as it's a 40k book, and it specifically states the following:

40k Escalation wrote:If one or more players choose to include a Lords of War unit in their army, the additional mission special rule and secondary objective described below automatically apply in any mission that you play.
Furthermore, if your opponent has a Lords of War unit as part of their army, your Warlord can choose to roll on the Escalation Warlord Traits table shown below instead of one of the Warlord Traits tables normally available to your Warlord.

It goes on to say that you basically score a victory point for every 3 health points or hull points lost by enemy lords of war. Against 2 WKs, if you killed them both, that's an additional 4 victory points! The warlord trait table in escalation also gives specific warlord traits that give you bonuses to fighting against LoWs, but they're not that great if they're not on a combat oriented HQ. Anyhow, I hope you found my post helpful. Good luck in your future endeavors.


EDIT: Meh, I just realised I made an 1850 list instead of 1500. Adjust to whatever your points level is. You get the idea.

"First off, this Eldar player is a douchebag. He's doing exactly what people on the internet are complaining about expecting to happen. He gives the rest of us Eldar players a bad name."

What? Building the best list he can from the legal resources that GW willingly published? Trying to win is NOT being a douchebag. The guy who allowed the Eldar to go to print is the douchebag.

Martel732 wrote:
"First off, this Eldar player is a douchebag. He's doing exactly what people on the internet are complaining about expecting to happen. He gives the rest of us Eldar players a bad name."

What? Building the best list he can from the legal resources that GW willingly published? Trying to win is NOT being a douchebag. The guy who allowed the Eldar to go to print is the douchebag.

He is. As a member of his local gaming community, he should have brought the issue to the attention of whoever is running the league and helped put rules in place to protect the integrity of the game from GWs failing. It's a league. It's not a tournament. Which means it's people he plays with regularly. Ideally even "friends". This isn't the way to handle a situation with friends.

If this was a tournament, I'd agree with you, and place the blame on the TO and GW. Mostly the TO, because by now we should all expect GW to make poor decisions.

 BetrayTheWorld wrote:

Martel732 wrote:
"First off, this Eldar player is a douchebag. He's doing exactly what people on the internet are complaining about expecting to happen. He gives the rest of us Eldar players a bad name."

What? Building the best list he can from the legal resources that GW willingly published? Trying to win is NOT being a douchebag. The guy who allowed the Eldar to go to print is the douchebag.

He is. As a member of his local gaming community, he should have brought the issue to the attention of whoever is running the league and helped put rules in place to protect the integrity of the game from GWs failing. It's a league. It's not a tournament. Which means it's people he plays with regularly. Ideally even "friends". This isn't the way to handle a situation with friends.

If this was a tournament, I'd agree with you, and place the blame on the TO and GW. Mostly the TO, because by now we should all expect GW to make poor decisions.

It's not the players job to police GW's gak unless we're being paid for it. Yeah,the league organizer could have done something, but for most games, the default rules are sufficient. GW is the special snowflake again.

" the integrity of the game "

This phrase made me LOL with respect to GW.

Forge the narrative harder?

Or let him deploy first. Then concede. He wins the match, you win the game.

(Don't actually do that...)

More seriously, if someone is fielding multiple LoWs, its going to be hard to reasonably compete.

Wyverns are always a big problem for my Eldar when I fight the Guard. I'm either forced to hide my guardians, jetbikes, and other non-mechanized infantry units at the back of the table where they won't be threatening anybody, or keep them in reserves to stop the whole squad getting shredded like so much cheddar. And going after the Wyverns in the back of the guard's deployment zone, behind all his defences and tanks and men, is a tough ask - and it means not being able to take care of other stuff that threatens EVERYTHING in my army like russes and blobs of infantry.

Usually I can get the wyverns down by turn 3 or 4 - but by then the damage is done, either with shooting or just being enough of a presence to completely stop my infantry from doing their job.

They're cheap, they can (and should!) be squadded, and in my experience they absolutely COMPLETELY demolish any infantry. I've yet to see a non-vehicle unit take anything less than 50-60% casualties from a round of shooting from wyverns. 90% of the time they just wipe the unit completely - two is more than enough to kill a guardian squad.

 Jambles wrote:
Wyverns are always a big problem for my Eldar when I fight the Guard. I'm either forced to hide my guardians, jetbikes, and other non-mechanized infantry units at the back of the table where they won't be threatening anybody, or keep them in reserves to stop the whole squad getting shredded like so much cheddar. And going after the Wyverns in the back of the guard's deployment zone, behind all his defences and tanks and men, is a tough ask - and it means not being able to take care of other stuff that threatens EVERYTHING in my army like russes and blobs of infantry.

Usually I can get the wyverns down by turn 3 or 4 - but by then the damage is done, either with shooting or just being enough of a presence to completely stop my infantry from doing their job.

They're cheap, they can (and should!) be squadded, and in my experience they absolutely COMPLETELY demolish any infantry. I've yet to see a non-vehicle unit take anything less than 50-60% casualties from a round of shooting from wyverns. 90% of the time they just wipe the unit completely - two is more than enough to kill a guardian squad.

Good thing Eldar have the best transport in the game. Still.

But if everything is in Serpents, then you're only facing half the Eldar infantry you would otherwise. And if less than everything is in Serpents then the Wyverns eat the things that aren't.

Bharring wrote:
But if everything is in Serpents, then you're only facing half the Eldar infantry you would otherwise. And if less than everything is in Serpents then the Wyverns eat the things that aren't.

So there's a weapon that actually makes the Eldar pretend to pay attention to what's going on on the table. Somehow, my BA have no tears for them. Use transports, kill the Wyverns with OP WKs and Scatbikes. Problem solved.

Wyverns may not be answers to WKs, but they shred the 30 Guardian Defenders memtioned something fierce. Especially since there is no Serpents mentioned (at least another *330* points!).

As for Jetbikes, Wyverns will do some damage to them too. Not a perfect counter (what's the Wyverns AV?), but can do work. Especially if you can LOS them.

They don't hurt WKs, sure. But WKs aren't a great answer to them. Sure, the WKs can kill a little less than one a round at range *provided no cover*, but since when is losing a single Wyvern per WK a terrible thing? Even assuming you're dumb enough to not get cover?

So, sure, Wyverns aren't counters to WK. But they aren't useless against most Eldar lists.

Martel732 wrote:

Bharring wrote:
But if everything is in Serpents, then you're only facing half the Eldar infantry you would otherwise. And if less than everything is in Serpents then the Wyverns eat the things that aren't.

So there's a weapon that actually makes the Eldar pretend to pay attention to what's going on on the table. Somehow, my BA have no tears for them. Use transports, kill the Wyverns with OP WKs and Scatbikes. Problem solved.

Such vitriol! Show me on the doll where the bad space elf touched you...

I can't speak to how to counter wraithknights - I just saw a lot of infantry in that theoretical army, much in the same way I run my infantry in eldar, and knew that Wyverns always gave me a lot of trouble.

Sure, a wraithknight could probably handle a wyvern at range - but that's a damn powerful and expensive unit that just took out a unit that's a quarter of it's cost. It's the same story for me with my anti-tank, I can put my fire prism/bright lance/missile launcher shots into the wyverns at the back where they're getting lots of cover, or try and take out the punisher/demolisher/executioner that's up front and busy tearing me a new butthole. Either way I'm in a bad spot - I generally just play to objectives and hope I don't get tabled, with little success so far.

Bharring wrote:
Wyverns may not be answers to WKs, but they shred the 30 Guardian Defenders memtioned something fierce. Especially since there is no Serpents mentioned (at least another *330* points!).

As for Jetbikes, Wyverns will do some damage to them too. Not a perfect counter (what's the Wyverns AV?), but can do work. Especially if you can LOS them.

They don't hurt WKs, sure. But WKs aren't a great answer to them. Sure, the WKs can kill a little less than one a round at range *provided no cover*, but since when is losing a single Wyvern per WK a terrible thing? Even assuming you're dumb enough to not get cover?

So, sure, Wyverns aren't counters to WK. But they aren't useless against most Eldar lists.

I was saying the opposite. They CAN do something if you demech Eldar, or the Eldar player chooses to use footdar.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Jambles wrote:

Martel732 wrote:

Bharring wrote:
But if everything is in Serpents, then you're only facing half the Eldar infantry you would otherwise. And if less than everything is in Serpents then the Wyverns eat the things that aren't.

So there's a weapon that actually makes the Eldar pretend to pay attention to what's going on on the table. Somehow, my BA have no tears for them. Use transports, kill the Wyverns with OP WKs and Scatbikes. Problem solved.

Such vitriol! Show me on the doll where the bad space elf touched you...

I can't speak to how to counter wraithknights - I just saw a lot of infantry in that theoretical army, much in the same way I run my infantry in eldar, and knew that Wyverns always gave me a lot of trouble.

Sure, a wraithknight could probably handle a wyvern at range - but that's a damn powerful and expensive unit that just took out a unit that's a quarter of it's cost. It's the same story for me with my anti-tank, I can put my fire prism/bright lance/missile launcher shots into the wyverns at the back where they're getting lots of cover, or try and take out the punisher/demolisher/executioner that's up front and busy tearing me a new butthole. Either way I'm in a bad spot - I generally just play to objectives and hope I don't get tabled, with little success so far.

Vitriol for Eldar is but one of the services I provide. Come to think if it, I bet warp spiders are probably a good unit to dust these things.

Bharring wrote:
But if everything is in Serpents, then you're only facing half the Eldar infantry you would otherwise. And if less than everything is in Serpents then the Wyverns eat the things that aren't.

People forget the wyvern has a max range making it impossible to both "hide those wyverns on the Back of your table edge in cover" and "target those infantry (not in transports)at the back of your opponents table edge." You usually get one or the other not both. As it is only 48in range it's not exactly hard to keep foot infantry in the back of your deployment zone covering an objective until the wyvern is taken out. Wyverns are a good deferent but not an answer to elder for guard.

You need a mix of flyers punishers, vendetta, valks; wyverns and basilisks or artillery platforms from forgeworld are cheaper, Cortez and guard blobs behind an aegis. If he is playing d cannon knights take vanquisher w beast hunter shells from forgeworld and coaxial gun. Go chimera autocanon turret, heck autocanon spam str7 ap4 is good for most elder although a few 3+ armour saves for no reason but to make eldar players feel special snowflakes over thier dark eldar cousins.

Your not going to get off much psychic powers with most competitive elder lists since they deny the crap out of token psyker armies.
Regardless looking at the cheese list your opponent brought your simply going to lose unless you list tailor directly against his exact list and get lucky on rolls. Eldar are just brokenly overpowered. Your league organizer screwed up by not playing comp rules to nerf eldar cheese and your going to have to accept no choice but to loose vs that list.

Question can flyers bombing runs ignore invisibility it is not a shooting atk and done in the movement phase?

48" range puts you 30" average beyond the range of most Eldar infantry.

Only the EML can match that range, and that's 1 Missile Launcher per 10 Guardians.

48" is quite a range.

Hi there I'm the wraith king I can deep strike, ignore intervening terrain move 12in plus 6 in wraith host tower over most Los blocking terrain shoot 2 d wpn then fire 8 str6 scatter lasers into that av10 unit followed by charging 12in with 5 str10ap2 atks and stomps.

Those wyverns don't stand a chance.
And in case some av decided to live I think I hear a hemlock coming ready to strip d3 hull off those 3 hill units.

What still having issues I think I hear a squad of firedragons or wraithgaurds being dropped off by thier serpent right on top of those wyverns

What still having issues? I think I saw some warp spiders dancing around those blast templates every time you shoot at them ready to kill that av 10 vehicle

In fact the only unit that cares about wyverns is foot eldar and jetbikes who still get 3+\4+ armour saves. Hardly terrifying to wyverns considering scar bikes can stand back out of range move then fire 36in str6 4x per bike into a av10 unit.

Next turn feel free to walk any units that the wyvern threatened anywhere off the board.

Do you get the point yet current eldar are insanely fast and annihilate armour.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

Bharring wrote:
48" range puts you 30" average beyond the range of most Eldar infantry.

Only the EML can match that range, and that's 1 Missile Launcher per 10 Guardians.

48" is quite a range.

Who cares!!!
You don't need to sit in range of wyverns
If you are running mass eldar infantry across 4 feet of board you are doing it wrong
Even so sipsce out and use those 4+ or 3+ armour saves. The wyvern doesn't rack up hits unless your eldar are playing Grabass with each other

When the OP faces *30* 5+ infantry models, those Wyverns are going to hit quite a bit. And a 4+ or 3+ save can't help a 5+ model, as they *don't have it*.

Of course the WK kills it. What doesn't the WK kill. But only one per round or (quite likely) less, if you manage any sort of Cover Save. SD is no stronger vs AV10 than AV14.

And, if Serpents are moving up into range for their Fire Dragons or Wraith guard, from a safe distance away, they are cheating. Any more than 6' on the Serpent and they can't disembark. Matters a lot when your range is 6". Especially when they aren't in the list.

Bikes are 3+, other units have 4+
The point is you can avoid letting unprotected low sv infantry die by not placing them in range and use 1 of the dozen other units that can easily kill a wyvern to take care of it. Also I never said to keep a serpent out of range it doesn't care about str4 wyverns. Wyverns are not a magical threat to eldar like you make them out to be

I didn't mean threat range of Wyverns. I meant threat range of other things.

Wyverns alone won't do it, but if you're having trouble with footfdar, adding some Wyverns would be good.

Of course, even the lowly heavy bolter is good against footdar.

Why is everyone focusing on the 1 unit of wyverns in that 1850 point list that includes 117 Infantry models with 18 missile launchers and a manticore?

If the WKs went for the wyverns first, GREAT, the missile launchers get an extra free round of shots at the WKs. If they fire at infantry squads, WONDERFUL, they can only take out a max of 2 models per turn outside of melee, without additional shoulder mounted weapons. The best thing the WKs could do is target the manticore. It's the highest value unit, but it also has barrage, so can be outside of LoS while firing it's ordnance blasts. The point is, WKs just don't threaten horde armies outside of melee, and can't multicharge. So, against MSU units that ALL have tools capable of putting wounds on WKs, they will be gone by turn 4 with basically nothing your opponent can do about it.

Furthermore, even if your opponent DOES take out the manticore, all of the wyverns, and half of the infantry missile launchers before they die, you still have a 50 man fearless blob of objective secured conscripts vs his NON OBSEC troops, so you win stalemates with both units on an objective, and the beautiful thing about those missile launchers is, they're also great for targeting basically EVERYTHING in your opponents army. Blasts for troops, flakk for air, krak for knights.

With investing in 2 WKs, your opponent simply won't have the firepower necessary to remove that many models from the table, as long as you keep him from engaging lots of models in melee and stomping through you. And if you HAVE to engage his WK in melee to tie him up, use your 50 man conscript unit to do it, and try to multicharge with them. If your 50 conscripts can tie up 2 WKs in CC for 2 rounds(possible), that's more than enough time for the rest of your army to wipe out everything else your opponent has on the table. Imagine the rage. A guy who brings 2 WKs to a game essentially loses to a unit of WS2/BS2 Conscripts with a 25 point Commisar. Beautiful.

He wraithknight can fire 1 or 2 str d at the manticore and still fire 8 str 6 shots any chimera chassis or infantry. A suncsnnon wraith knight annihilates hordes of course no eldar takes that version why because it's completely redundant. So claiming a d cannon knight is only marginally decent vs hordes at range with two scatterlasers which it can fire at as many targets as it wants. Is hardly a detriment to the wraithknight; with eldritch storm and scatter lasers, hemlocks and dscythe wraiths hordes even super durable necrons are a joke to eldar. And the worst part is the units in eldar lists that are ideally suited for hordes or infantry are just as good at killing light vehicles and sometimes heavy vehicles. Str6 scatterlasers destroy av10/11, dscythe guard or super ranged hemlocks strip hull points off the heaviest armour with ease.

No a d cannon wraith knight is quite capable of dealing with most infantry it just doesn't need too. And with5x int5 str 10 ap2 with stomp and hammer of wraith it's easily one of the best assault units in the game able to kill most dedicated assault units before they can hit back.

Way to much defending of eldar broken codex when countless battlereps have shown that ultra competitive eldar cheese lists like the above are tabling most armies no matter how well built or well played they are. I haven't seen or read a single battlerep or played a game where if the eldar player goes all our he doesn't win unless the game is heavily comped, the person is list tailoring against the eldar and has good luck with rolls.

But hey keep telling the originally poster it's his fault he can't beat the eldar list that tabled him no matter what he takes in an uncomped league game.

There are a variety of rules and pts cost mistakes in your post OP that worry me whether the CWE players were being upright.

The pts for guardian units were off by a lot. Eldritch storm is wiping out entire flanks? etc. A warp charge 4 (3 with stones) power with an Apoc Blast which can do 1 HP to vehicles and 1 wound that allows cover should not be wiping anywhere near a flank out. It should also not be an easy thing to manifest and require a lot of dice to get off.

I am also curious about the "very good space marine lists (faced about 8 storm ravens alone)". How did stormraven end up equaling very good SM lists? IME that is usually the opposite and equates out to a relatively soft SM list.

I would avoid going with a flyer heavy IG. This tends to give you a significantly weaker list than a stronger ground presence would have.

Some of the things that can help against CWE are;
*ADL with Get back into the fight order. Giving your most damaging units a 2+ cover save and then getting to return fire can really mess up a CWE list where they tend to be somewhat less durable than they were last edition.
*Reserve you mobile scoring units. Outflank and DS are your friends. The CWE deal out a lot of damage. If you allow them to kill your scoring units you will struggle to win. If you keep them in reserves before you can start thinning the CWE players units down it can really help. Comms relay on the ADL is very useful for this.
*Barrage is your friend. Wyverns, Forgeworld Thudd guns, and Forgeworld Earthshaker Heavy Artillery Carriages all can do a real number of CWE. You will need some can openers to help the thudd guns and wyverns deal with wraithknights and serpents though. However if the opponent brought a lot of serpents then you are going to take a lot less damage then you could have.
*Get cover with your tanks. A leman russ is relatively easy to pop with the wraithknight's D cannons without cover but as soon as you have a 4+ or 5+ cover it becomes much more problematic. Use those ruins to force those saves or at least bring a barricade for 10 pts to get them.
*CCS can give ignores cover or monster hunters to units. That can make a huge difference on taking down a wraithknight.
*Concentrate on damage dealers first rather than on the big guys. In your case you said you had a lot of infantry. Take out the opponent's scatter laser and anti infantry (which is fragile compared to a wraithknight). If you have the resources to focus down a wraithknight in 1-2 turns and the wraithknight is not going to get it's cover save then go for it but you are usually better off killing the opponent's less durable units first and letting the wraithknights do what they will.

Hopefully some of that helps. More specific advice would require mission types you all play, your list, and some idea of the type of CWE lists fielded (they don't sound like the typical scatbikes + wraithknights netlists).

Or perhaps you're misreading the intent of many posters in the thread? I thought I was particularly blunt about facing multiple WK and other such shenanigans upthread.

We're not saying that he's a failure for not beating CW Eldar. We're saying here are some things that might help against some things.

And we're calling out some BS. CW Eldar is broken. But I'm not going to not point out factual innacuracies.

FOr instance, most dedicated CC units *aren't* fully destoryed before striking in CC. Just look at the stock ASM squad. One of the "weakest" dedicated CC squads. 5 WK attacks. Each attack is (1/2)(5/6)(1). Average dice kill 25/12 Marines. Or a little over two. Less than half. In fact, to kill all would have the odds of (3125)/(243*1024). Just over 1%. So no. The WK is broken, but killing most CC units before they swing? Maybe a few poorly teched against it. But not most.