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Recently, the Space marines received a new codex update. However, there was something interesting about the new space marine codexes. The fluff was mostly about an upcoming war (as always), but I checked out a few other codexes (Necrons, Orks and Eldar) and saw that the fluff was taking a similar turn as we saw in the prologue of Warhammer Fantasy's End Times. As most 40k players agree, 7th edition was a bit of a flop. With less definite/specific rules e.g. jump pack infantry and buildings and strange modifications to the 6th edition, sales slightly went down these last few months. But with the End Times event, sales went high for GW. I checked for more info if there was going to be a 40k End Times, and I received a following quote from DLW398:

- End Times for Fantasy was a great way to reboot Warhammer Fantasy for both old veterans and new players. A 40k end times would be fascinating as well. Only question is if we're going to go ahead and do it.

So what do you think? Do you think that a 40k End times is inevitable and will happen soon?

It would be a good way for GW to circle the drain even faster than it already is.

This has been going on for years. The Blood Angels codex in 5th edition mentioned this thing. 40k is already at "The End Times" and it's not going anywhere.

Yeah, this is just speculation based on some vague fluff. I would close this thread untill some solid rumors pop up.

Yep, not even a real rumour. 40k isn't going anywhere, it would be far too risky for their main product line.

Wasn't "at the eve of the 41st Millennium" a quote used a lot in third edition? It's been in the back of my mind for ever, the whole Minutes to Midnight troupe is what the fluff has been built on since then.

No

End Times Fantasy happend because WFB was dead.

When 40K is dead, there'll be no campaign books written about it. There'll only be new companies moving into Nottingham office-spaces.

I didn't realize that this was the Speculation and Conjecture forum.

 SkaerKrow wrote:
I didn't realize that this was the Speculation and Conjecture forum.

We should really have one of those so mods can just shuffle all these threads in to it

First the "Time of Ending" would not be the End of 40K. In WHFB the one world was swallowed by Chaos and there is some speculation as to what the New 9th Ed will look like.

As for "Time of Ending"

As per the Da codex, "The Lion" is asleep waiting to be awaken.

Necron 5th ed there is a "Primearc" in Tanzini the Infinites collection.

As per a White Dwarf With the First of the Imperial Knights show in it for 6th ed Guilmain is healed and waiting to be awaken.

As per the Fluff in the BRB, and the current mechanice's Codex's "The Golden Thrown is broken beyond repair" "And the had to make a Deal with the Dark Elder to post pone its failing.

All the fluff in all the current Codex's point to a massive battle where things get shaken up.

The Nids are drawn to the Golden Thrown.

The Orcs are building a WAGHHH of all the ORC's in known space.

The Necrons are awaking.

The Eldar are preparing for the "Time of Ending"

All in all, with the given success of WHFB's "End Times" there is a very strong chance that 40K will see something similar which, while not ending the 40K universe will advance the story.

SELECTED: DENTRICA III OF XX
ENGAGE NEURAL CONGRESS – WIRELESS AUTOSHUNT ACQUIRED
UPLOADING… + THE END TIMES +

(cue music...)

There are those who believe... war here... began out there... ...far across the Universe... with tribes of humans, genetically augmented warriors, inhuman constructs, xenos creatures, carnivorous horrors, and warpspawned corruptions of reality...

Some believe that there may yet be brothers of mankind... who even now fight to survive—somewhere beyond the heavens!

(...end music)

And... this would be different for the 40K universe how?

 BLADERIKER wrote:

The Eldar are preparing for the "Time of Ending"...

All in all, with the given success of WHFB's "End Times" there is a very strong chance that 40K will see something similar which, while not ending the 40K universe will advance the story.

The Rhana Dandra is coming...

It's a 'fluffy way' for GW to jump the shark and take the game into the 42nd millennium if/when they feel they have to break the emergency glass.

How are sales of 40K going? Have they started to see WHFB-like declines? When that starts happening, I wager GW execs will start to think about a 'reboot'... depending, of course, on how well the WHFB/9th ed/AoS 'reboot' goes.

But if sales are strong - they'll continue on their current course.

Personally - I think 40K is actually in -desperate- need of a rules-reboot. As each edition has worn on, it just seems to get more and more out of hand. Broken codices, powercreep, broken rules, broken weapons, broken units, broken 'formations'... The game rules are in desperate need of some level of 'balance' - which I know most of you hiss and laugh at. But player frustration doesn't -usually- engender a sense of excitement to play the game - or purchase product, at least that I have seen.

In the meantime... prepare for the end, humanity!

I thought the current 40k fluff was the end times, as in the 13th Black Crusade is it. Although the 13th Black Crusade outcome years ago seems to have been brushed aside by GW - didn't Chaos win or something?

You see, chaos at the end has so totally warped the universe during the 13th crusade, it has inadvertently suspended reality at the final moments.

The ripples of this ending can be seen and felt in the various retcons of history... new things came about years before they had originally, some things disappeared as if they never existed...

The future ended long, long ago... it is just that nobody realizes it yet...

 Rashbold wrote:
You see, chaos at the end has so totally warped the universe during the 13th crusade, it has inadvertently suspended reality at the final moments.

The ripples of this ending can be seen and felt in the various retcons of history... new things came about years before they had originally, some things disappeared as if they never existed...

The future ended long, long ago... it is just that nobody realizes it yet...

^Probably the best I've ever heard it described.

 Mort wrote:

Personally - I think 40K is actually in -desperate- need of a rules-reboot. As each edition has worn on, it just seems to get more and more out of hand. Broken codices, powercreep, broken rules, broken weapons, broken units, broken 'formations'... The game rules are in desperate need of some level of 'balance' - which I know most of you hiss and laugh at. But player frustration doesn't -usually- engender a sense of excitement to play the game - or purchase product, at least that I have seen.

In the meantime... prepare for the end, humanity!

Yikes. Very cynical, I strongly disagree. I think since I've started playing in fourth, the rules have been getting better and better. Sure, some point and click units we can do without, but they tend to shift. 'End times' is completely unnecessary. I would be disappointed if they did such a thing. Mankind is already beset on all sides.

End Times was a way to send off a system which wasn't making enough money (You can argue whether that was the right call or not)

I don't think GW as managed could endure the same financial weakness in it's flagship (sole?) contributing game long enough to enact an End Times series.

Sure GW could do a 40k End Times. They got a title and everything.

It's called, "The Horus Heresy", and its set 10,000 years earlier

40k end times already happened.. Eye of terror campaign way back in 2003 I think, can't remember the year, but suffice to say at the time gw didn't have the balls to follow it through and has since retconned it to be just prior to the 40k end times, short answer chaos won, almost completely, the imperium won in space but that is about it, cadia was over run, and pretty much every sector that mattered was in chaos hands.

These days however they may actually follow through, but we're not likely to see a world wide campaign like we used to have, gw are just not interested in doing that anymore.

 Formosa wrote:
40k end times already happened.. Eye of terror campaign way back in 2003 I think, can't remember the year, but suffice to say at the time gw didn't have the balls to follow it through and has since retconned it to be just prior to the 40k end times, short answer chaos won, almost completely, the imperium won in space but that is about it, cadia was over run, and pretty much every sector that mattered was in chaos hands.

These days however they may actually follow through, but we're not likely to see a world wide campaign like we used to have, gw are just not interested in doing that anymore.

I remember that, in the good old days

It is a pity though, as it would have been a great way to advance the time line back then. Now, even with the retconning, it still just dosnt feel.... Right.....

When 40k sales are bad there will be a 40k End Times. Fantasy End Times was purely because fantasy was nearly dead, so they're rebooting it now trying to bring in new players/bring back some veterans. Gw doesn't give a damn about story or fluff, they want sales. Atm I don't think sales are down enough for them to have an End Times anytime soon, but at the rate they're releasing and people are dropping out, I'd say 40k end times down the road.

So maybe we will finally have the Rhana Dandra and the new Eldar god will beat back the Chaos Gods and the Eldar will be reborn?

nightshae007 wrote:
As most 40k players agree, 7th edition was a bit of a flop.

I think the general consensus of Dakka Dakka probably doesn't reflect the 40k player base as a whole. This is a vocal minority we interact with here online - most folks are just playing with their buddies in their garage and don't give two licks about the gak we argue about in YMDC!

I'm with most of the posters here. The lore of 40k has been as much "The End Times" themed as you can get since forever. If you're talking specifically about a total this-game-is-dead reboot of the setting? I think 40k has to get a lot worse, and by that I mean make a lot less money, before GW decides to burn it down and start over.

The real End Times is Necron wake up, kill everyone.

Except the Eldar. Who then get pissed and destroy all of the planets in the galaxy.

GAME OVER!

I don't know if the necrons could truly kill the Orks either. Mankind would be boned without a doubt.

 Talys wrote:
Sure GW could do a 40k End Times. They got a title and everything.

It's called, "The Horus Heresy", and its set 10,000 years earlier

^ This

It's a long and ongoing storyline that's set to cataclysmically change the game world, and has actual plot stuff happen and not just more "This time it's REALLY grimdark!" It's just that we already know what comes next, so nobody's worried that they're going to lose what they put so much work into.

 Jewelfox wrote:

 Talys wrote:
Sure GW could do a 40k End Times. They got a title and everything.

It's called, "The Horus Heresy", and its set 10,000 years earlier

^ This

It's a long and ongoing storyline that's set to cataclysmically change the game world, and has actual plot stuff happen and not just more "This time it's REALLY grimdark!" It's just that we already know what comes next, so nobody's worried that they're going to lose what they put so much work into.

Unless GW actually pulls an Endless Waltz?

 carldooley wrote:

 Jewelfox wrote:

 Talys wrote:
Sure GW could do a 40k End Times. They got a title and everything.

It's called, "The Horus Heresy", and its set 10,000 years earlier

^ This

It's a long and ongoing storyline that's set to cataclysmically change the game world, and has actual plot stuff happen and not just more "This time it's REALLY grimdark!" It's just that we already know what comes next, so nobody's worried that they're going to lose what they put so much work into.

Unless GW actually pulls an Endless Waltz?

What do you mean by that?

 carldooley wrote:

 Jewelfox wrote:

 Talys wrote:
Sure GW could do a 40k End Times. They got a title and everything.

It's called, "The Horus Heresy", and its set 10,000 years earlier

^ This

It's a long and ongoing storyline that's set to cataclysmically change the game world, and has actual plot stuff happen and not just more "This time it's REALLY grimdark!" It's just that we already know what comes next, so nobody's worried that they're going to lose what they put so much work into.

you mean that GW might actually pull an endless waltz?

Aren't all waltzes supposed to be timeless?

It's actually more like a Groundhog's Day, because the needle never moves to 41k

I guess if Games Workshop wanted to do a reboot with a "hope" theme, they could always write Warhammer 50k, and carve out a theme like Sigmar where the light is defeating the dark. Emprah dies, his essence goes into new wee emprah, blitzes the galaxy defeating Necron and Tyranid. Whole Baby Jeebus thing! Engineers new geeneseed that is flawless. Huzzah, mankind is saved!

The Phoenix Lord Maugan Ra single handedly slays most of the Necron Suhbekhar Dynasty. The Orks have formed a super-waaaaaagh and rampaged through most of the Ultima Segmentum, leaving the Tau in tatters.

Meanwhile, the Chaos Gods have forged a pact with the Dark Eldar to subvert control of Warp travel....

CrashGordon94 wrote:
What do you mean by that?

http://gundam.wikia.com/wiki/Gundam_Wiki:Timelines
ugh. This is why the alternate timelines in Star Trek could really confuse me. GW has been making revisions to its game's history for a number of years (as we all know), but (AFAIK) it has yet to embrace alternate timelines (except to point towards Tzeentch when this sort of thing comes up).

Back in school my introduction to the Gundam Universe was to Gundam X first, with a follow up with Endless Waltz. My understanding was that Endless Waltz had been a 'what if' OVA (like Escaflowne's) where if it had led to a peaceful resolution to the conflict between the Colonies and Earth, it would have made Gundam X (and its Colony Drop) fundamentally unlikely to happen.

I suppose that it is why I thought that FF8 was wonderful, and never got very far in FF7, in that FF8 was where I started my Final Fantasy experience.