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My opponents platoons were regenerating D3 models for each squad in the platoon. What rule is this and where can I find it?

Thanks

Um. What?

No such rule exists, that I'm aware of.

The closest thing you have to that is the It Will Not Die USR that only comes up if you take the Death Mask of Ollanius on a character and is granted only to that character (along with a 4+ invulnerable save and the Fear USR).

Unless he was using a home brewed rule set, or told you about it before the game, etc, then he was cheating.

No Guard force anywhere has any kind of regeneration wounds rule. Once your guardsman dies, he's dead. The only exception to this is if you happen to have a medic in a squad, which can only be in a Platoon or Company Command Squad, and only gives those 5 man squad the Feel No Pain (5+) USR to roll if the model fails his armor save and isn't double-toughness'ed out.

Hope this helps. Take it easy.

-Red__Thirst-

What about in Imperial Armour or some other forge world book?
Also could this be in Militarum Tempestus or some dataslate?

There is no such rule in any ruleset for guardsmen, including Chaos Renegades, Death Korps of Krieg, Elysians or Solar Auxillia. The closest thing is a couple of formations and/or lists for renegades/krieg that let them bring back a unit that was completely destroyed on a successful roll. Solar Auxillia can get feel no pain, but I doubt he was using a 30K list.

In short, there is no "bring back D3 models per squad in combined squad" rule in the game. He was cheating.

It has to be real, he said this is his tournament list. Every turn he was rolling 4 D3 and putting back that many model back in the platoon. Said it was some re-inforcememt rule.

If it's real, ask him to show you the rule - or at least ask which Forgeworld book it's from.

The rule rings a bell, but as part of an Apocalypse formation (which obviously isn't legal in 'normal' 40k).

Well unfortunately he lives 2 and a half hours away, so I won't see him for a while, I sent him a message though asking what it is.

Nope, as a long time IG player I can safely say that there is no such rule.

Your friend was cheating son.

Doesn't exist in the current, or even last edition IG codex, or for any of the current formations.

*Edit* Is this the same guy that had that mysterious FAQ for their chimeras and such?

If so, this guy sounds like a grade A donkey-cave.

Is this the endless waves rule I heard talk of a long time ago? i do mean long long ago.

I heard mention of it here on these forums.

I don't know if someone was asking for the rule to be back or if they wanted the AM version of the Tyranids endless swarm rule.

This may help point you in a direction.

At any rate if it is the rule I've heard spoken of it would be in ages past.

Found it. It's an apocalypse only formation:

(Listed at the 1D4 Chan tactics forum: http://1d4chan.org/wiki/Warhammer_40,000/Tactics/Imperial_Guard%287E%29#Formations_2 )

'Imperial Shield' Infantry Company (Apocalypse) - A CCS commands 3+ Infantry platoons.

At the end of each break, every company can regain d3 casualties up to their starting strength.'

I assume "Break" is game turn, and that's every COMPANY, not Squad, so you get 1xD3 for the entire company.
If he was only rolling 4x D3 then he was double-cheating.

Firstly, it's an apocalypse formation for starters. So no use in regular 40k games, let alone in any kind of tournament I've ever heard of. Secondly, that's one COMPANY command squad and 3+ Infantry PLATOONS. Not Squads, PLATOONS.

That's a Company Command Squad (5 models), followed by three Platoons at 25 models each minimum (5 man Platoon Command Squad and two 10 man Infantry Squads). So 80 infantry models at the absolute minimum to field this formation.

If he was rolling 4x D3 that means he should have had a CCS (5 models), four PCS's (20 models), and EIGHT infantry squads (80 models) on the table, or 105 infantry total at the absolute minimum.

If he was running this, then at least he had the proper number of models on the table, and all told this formation isn't *that* powerful in the grand scheme of apocalypse formations.

However, if he only had 1x CCS, with 1x PCS and 4x Infantry Squads (10 man each) and was rolling a D3 per squad instead of per company, then he was cheating and needs to be made aware of it.

Personally, I'd give the guy the benefit of the doubt and expect he misread or misinterpreted the formation and how it works, but any and all future games I played against him would require a written or printed list, and copies of all rules and/or formations being used, and where they came from so I could check to make sure he wasn't trying to pull a fast one.

Hope that helps. Take it easy for now.

-Red__Thirst-

 Blacksails wrote:
Doesn't exist in the current, or even last edition IG codex, or for any of the current formations.

*Edit* Is this the same guy that had that mysterious FAQ for their chimeras and such?

If so, this guy sounds like a grade A donkey-cave.

Yes this is the same guy lol

And thanks Red_Thirst that sounds like what he was using but he did this for each platoon. He had three platoons, two with 4 las cannon teams. But he was regenerating 4 D3 for the las cannon platoons and 5 D3 for the other platoon I believe.

 IXLoiero95XI wrote:


Yes this is the same guy lol

And thanks Red_Thirst that sounds like what he was using but he did this for each platoon. He had three platoons, two with 4 las cannon teams. But he was regenerating 4 D3 for the las cannon platoons and 5 D3 for the other platoon I believe.

Do yourself a favour and ask to see the codex (hard copy in hand or on tablet) every single time he makes up a rule you're unsure about. Make sure you have a list from him with clear and accurate point values. Every time he claims something, open the codex, read it, then go from there.

If its not in the codex, it doesn't exist anywhere else, or he has the relevant FW books for whatever FW unit he's using. He'll keep pulling bs rules out of his ass until someone calls him on it.

 Red__Thirst wrote:
At the end of each break, every company can regain d3 casualties up to their starting strength.'

I assume "Break" is game turn, and that's every COMPANY, not Squad, so you get 1xD3 for the entire company.
If he was only rolling 4x D3 then he was double-cheating.

A "break" in an Apocalypse game isn't a game turn, it's defined as the scheduled time for lunch or other amenities (every three to four hours), so you'll likely only get one or two in a game that's less than a day.

Always swap lists before a match and make sure bring all rules with you to a game. I had a friend like this before and the enjoyment to play against them is zero

Ooo busted. What a cheater. NO MERCY!

Dude probably lost anyway. Even if basic IG had that rule, they would still be worse then other armies. Cant regenerate d3 dudes when whole squads die in a single turn.

Makumba wrote:
Dude probably lost anyway. Even if basic IG had that rule, they would still be worse then other armies. Cant regenerate d3 dudes when whole squads die in a single turn.

he basically wipped my full army out in 2 turns


Automatically Appended Next Post:
That was because he launched 3 missiles from his Manticor turn one. Getting very lucky with the barrage flips.

Later we found out he could only fire one a turn.

LOL what could possibly lead this dude to believe he could fire more than one missile in one turn? Holy crap this guy is the worst cheater I've ever heard of.

I dont know if he did this all on purpose, this all could be honest mistakes.

 IXLoiero95XI wrote:

Makumba wrote:
Dude probably lost anyway. Even if basic IG had that rule, they would still be worse then other armies. Cant regenerate d3 dudes when whole squads die in a single turn.

he basically wipped my full army out in 2 turns


Automatically Appended Next Post:
That was because he launched 3 missiles from his Manticor turn one. Getting very lucky with the barrage flips.

Later we found out he could only fire one a turn.

Stop playing this guy until he sits down and actually reads his codex and the core rules.

 IXLoiero95XI wrote:

Makumba wrote:
Dude probably lost anyway. Even if basic IG had that rule, they would still be worse then other armies. Cant regenerate d3 dudes when whole squads die in a single turn.

he basically wipped my full army out in 2 turns


Automatically Appended Next Post:
That was because he launched 3 missiles from his Manticor turn one. Getting very lucky with the barrage flips.

Later we found out he could only fire one a turn.

You can not launch more than 1 a turn.

He sounds as bad as my friend whom was trying to bring OP homebrewed characters and, as I eventually worked out, twice the points allowance of the game.

 IXLoiero95XI wrote:
I dont know if he did this all on purpose, this all could be honest mistakes.

No. If you're saying "oh GW faqed extra armor values on my vehicles" and using a clearly labeled apoc formation to four times it's intended effectiveness, you know what you're doing.

There is zero reason for anyone to believe the manticore should fire more than once per turn. It's weapon is "ordnance D3" and it has a rule that says " may only fire four times per game".

To be fair I have always interpreted it as:

You have 4 missiles

You can only fire 1 missile a turn

Each Missile is Heavy D3 Large Blast

I would prefer to give him the benefit of the doubt and assume he is misinformed about the FAQ and that he just had played the rules wrong.

That being said, I have obtained a copy of both Astra Militlarum and Militarum Tempestus and I want to hi-jack my own thread because I have a few more rules queries.

Can a unit receive more than one order? If so...
Can a unit receive both the ignores cover and twin linked orders? From my understanding ignore cover is an AM order and Twin linked is MT order.

Thanks

Man I wish my manticore could fire all its rockets at the sam etime.

1) no. A unit may only receive one order a turn. A company commander (or creed) may issue multiple orders per turn, but they must be different units.

And, before you ask: the unit being ordered must not be embarked in a vehicle-the commanding unit may only be embarked in a chimera.

No, FRFSRF only affects LASGUN weapons, you may not FRFSRF plasma guns.

No, you don't get the MT orders if you're ordering a MT squad.

I use psychic powers to TL stuff, then use orders to give them ignores cover.

Next time he tells you GW faqed something make sure you take note of the fact that GW hasn't faqed ANYTHING since 7th ed dropped.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 master of ordinance wrote:
To be fair I have always interpreted it as:

You have 4 missiles

You can only fire 1 missile a turn

Each Missile is Heavy D3 Large Blast

That is exactly how it works but there's no need younger prey anything because it uses the exact same rules as literally everything else in the game when it comes to how it shoots.

Wow, as a Guard player... I am shocked that somebody could misinterpret, abuse/cheat the rules that badly. GW is notorious for having some vague rules... But there is nothing vague the way that the Guard operate. That boy needs to read the rulebook and codex again.

Thanks for the clarification on the Break. It's been YEARS since I played any kind of apocalypse game and had forgotten about the breaks.

So yea, he was using it even more incorrectly, trying to get a D3 back per *TURN*. Buh.

This guy sounds like one of two people, neither of which I would want to ever play.

One: A willful cheater, which is how I think this guy operates based on his behavior of having "FAQ's for Chimeras" (Sorry I missed that thread.), firing more than once a turn with a vehicle that obviously only fires once a turn, and trying to use an extremely bastardized form of an Apocalypse formation in regular 40k, and then having the gall to say it was a 'tournament' list. Dude needs to be skull drug a few yards for this level of douche-baggary.

Two: Someone very new to the game and over-eager to the point of reading what he wants to read in a rule or rules rather than what's *actually* written. This person needs to be educated, and then have it explained that if this kind of tom-foolery continues he will rapidly find nobody wants to play him, and that he'll be excluded from any tournaments he tries to enter with such a reputation for being so slip-shod with his rules interpretations.

That's just my opinion. Take it for what you will.

Take it easy for now.

-Red__Thirst-

 IXLoiero95XI wrote:
I would prefer to give him the benefit of the doubt and assume he is misinformed about the FAQ and that he just had played the rules wrong.

That being said, I have obtained a copy of both Astra Militlarum and Militarum Tempestus and I want to hi-jack my own thread because I have a few more rules queries.

Can a unit receive more than one order? If so...
Can a unit receive both the ignores cover and twin linked orders? From my understanding ignore cover is an AM order and Twin linked is MT order.

Thanks

No, it even makes the order of operations quite clear.

Start of shooting phase is when you issue orders, once a unit is ordered it must immediately perform whatever action is ordered before anything else happens. It cannot receive any further orders till the next turn.