Alabama takes the next step in voter ID laws

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**skyth**

Once you get voter ID laws on the books, close down all the offices that will give out ID's to Blacks...

http://www.rawstory.com/2015/10/alabama-to-stop-issuing-drivers-licenses-in-counties-with-75-black-registered-voters/#.Vg1F_BIdFhM.facebook

**-Shrike-**

So they closed down 8 of the 10 offices in counties with the highest percentage of registered black voters, and also closed down an additional 23? If the issue is closing down that many offices, I can see the point. Claiming racism because a quarter of the offices closed were in counties with a lot of black people? I'm going to need some more evidence.

**Kilkrazy**

You think it's equal opportunity registration denial then?

**hotsauceman1**

Are there really people that think Voter ID laws are not racist?
Cause as have been said before, Voter Fraud is Non-existent.

**whembly**

hotsauceman1 wrote:
Are there really people that think Voter ID laws are not racist?

Yup.

Cause as have been said before, Voter Fraud is Non-existent.

Demonstratively false.

Just look up the state of Georgia.

**Kilkrazy**

http://www.msnbc.com/msnbc/records-cast-more-doubt-georgia-fraud-probe-claims

http://www.occupydemocrats.com/georgia-republicans-found-guilty-of-rampant-voter-disenfranchisement-electoral-fraud/

Well, it didn't take much effort or time to find your claim false.

**hotsauceman1**

Well then, tell my why those disproportionately affected by Voter ID laws are minorities?
Oh and georgia, where the fraud claims are not being exposed as possibly fraudelent?
http://www.msnbc.com/msnbc/records-cast-more-doubt-georgia-fraud-probe-claims

**whembly**

Kilkrazy wrote:
http://www.msnbc.com/msnbc/records-cast-more-doubt-georgia-fraud-probe-claims

http://www.occupydemocrats.com/georgia-republicans-found-guilty-of-rampant-voter-disenfranchisement-electoral-fraud/

Well, it didn't take much effort or time to find your claim false.

msnbc and "occupydemcrats"... really Killkrazy?

:cracks knuckes:

Guys ready?

**hotsauceman1**

For Fox news? Sure

**whembly**

hotsauceman1 wrote:
For Fox news? Sure

Naw... I'm on the hunt...

http://www.ajc.com/news/news/despite-voter-id-law-minority-turnout-up-in-georgi/nR2bx/

More to come if you want...

**hotsauceman1**

"On the other hand, Georgia’s top elections official could not point to a single case of ballot fraud the voter ID law had prevented."'
http://www.washingtonpost.com/news/wonkblog/wp/2014/06/03/study-finds-strong-evidence-for-discriminatory-intent-behind-voter-id-laws/
So tell me, if it has no real effect and has racial intent, why keep it?

**CptJake**

The Alabama Law Enforcement Agency announced today that driver license examiners will no longer work at 31 part-time satellite offices not owned by the state.

The Alabama Department of Conservation and Natural Resources announced that five state parks will close on Oct. 15.

Also, six National Guard armories will close in addition to 15 that were already expected to be closed and consolidated.

The Alabama Department of Economic and Community Affairs will close a warehouse for surplus state property in the town of Eva in Morgan County on Jan. 1. The four staff positions there will be moved to the warehouse in Montgomery.

ALEA spokeswoman Anna Morris said that examiners from ALEA's district offices will no longer spend a portion of their week traveling to and working in the county satellite offices.

That means people won't be able to test for a new driver's license in those county offices. But the counties could still provide services such as license renewal.

Law Enforcement Secretary Spencer Collier said ALEA's General Fund appropriation was reduced from $56 million to $45 million.

Collier said the Driver License Division, which issues 1.2 million licenses a year, is understaffed and has 103 vacant positions.

The 31 satellite locations handle less than 5 percent of driver license transactions, according to ALEA.

http://www.al.com/news/index.ssf/2015/09/state_announces_to_close_becau.html#incart_river_home

And note, there are a LOT of IDs besides drivers licenses acceptable for voter ID in Alabama:

Valid Driver's License
Valid Nondriver ID
Valid Alabama Photo Voter ID card
Valid State Issued ID (Alabama or any other state)
Valid Federal Issued ID
Valid US Passport
Valid Employee ID from Federal Government, State of Alabama, County, Municipality, Board, or other entity of this state
Valid student or employee ID from a public or private college or university in the State of Alabama (including postgraduate technical or professional schools)
Valid Military ID
Valid Tribal ID

If a voter does not have one of the valid forms of photo ID, then that voter may obtain a free Alabama photo voter ID card or a free nondriver ID for purposes of voting.

http://www.alabamavoterid.com/validIDatPolls.aspx

So, inability to get one of those valid IDs at places that processed less than 5% of that type probably is not gonna have a big effect, unless you are a race baiting turd ball stirring up gak.

**Frazzled**

skyth wrote:
Once you get voter ID laws on the books, close down all the offices that will give out ID's to Blacks...

http://www.rawstory.com/2015/10/alabama-to-stop-issuing-drivers-licenses-in-counties-with-75-black-registered-voters/#.Vg1F_BIdFhM.facebook

Absent actual facts which this story is light on, commenting is just the usual. If the 31 were related to actual traffic received...ok. If large numbers were in majority white then the article is meaningless as well. If all closures were in poor counties not ok (I'd bet thats closer to the truth here). if its disproportionately majority minority then there's an issue. We literally have no worthwhile information here.

**CptJake**

Frazzled wrote:
We literally have no worthwhile information here.

Look at the links I posted.

**skyth**

Sorry, but if you voter ID laws, you need to make it as easy as possible to get valid ID's. In a republic, ensuring that everyone has the ability to vote and encouraging them to vote should be the #1 priority.

First they changed the laws to keep people from voting.
Now they change things to make it even harder.

**Frazzled**

CptJake wrote:
Frazzled wrote:
We literally have no worthwhile information here.

Look at the links I posted.

The 31 satellite locations handle less than 5 percent of driver license transactions, according to ALEA.

Good. Now we have to compare if there are other satellite offices closed that had higher rates than 5%, and inversely are their offices left open with less than 5%.
Additionally, can you still get non DL ID's there?

If not, and there's nothing else in the county the Fed is going to come down on them like Frazzled going through a bake shop, and rightly so.
I really hope there's nothing untoward here.

Automatically Appended Next Post:

skyth wrote:
Sorry, but if you voter ID laws, you need to make it as easy as possible to get valid ID's. In a republic, ensuring that everyone has the ability to vote and encouraging them to vote should be the #1 priority.

First they changed the laws to keep people from voting.
Now they change things to make it even harder.

I'm with Skyth on this. I'm very much for proper ID, but in turn, the ease of legally valid persons of getting that ID has to be unfettered.
Alabama has not had the best record in this area.

**CptJake**

Fraz, those 31 combined handled less than 5% total of the DL tests (so way less than 1% each on average). And yes, they still offer all services except taking the drivers test for a new license.

**Chongara**

hotsauceman1 wrote:
Are there really people that think Voter ID laws are not racist?
Cause as have been said before, Voter Fraud is Non-existent.

Sure. People deny all kinds of realities. From the moon landing to basic dental care and everything in between.

**cincydooley**

skyth wrote:
Sorry, but if you voter ID laws, you need to make it as easy as possible to get valid ID's. In a republic, ensuring that everyone has the ability to vote and encouraging them to vote should be the #1 priority.

First they changed the laws to keep people from voting.
Now they change things to make it even harder.

Voting in the United States is absurdly easy.

You don't even need to leave your house.

FWIW, I think everyone in the US should be provided a free ID card. It would be beneficial in any number of situations.

**Frazzled**

CptJake wrote:
Fraz, those 31 combined handled less than 5% total of the DL tests (so way less than 1% each on average). And yes, they still offer all services except taking the drivers test for a new license.

Well, thats total, I'd like to see the data on each and you betcha the fed will demand it.

If they still provide government issued ID at those offices then that mitigates MUCH of the concern. If you are going for a driver test you could drive to another county (I guess...meh).

Automatically Appended Next Post:

Chongara wrote:
hotsauceman1 wrote:
Are there really people that think Voter ID laws are not racist?
Cause as have been said before, Voter Fraud is Non-existent.

Sure. People deny all kinds of realities. From the moon landing to basic dental care and everything in between.

If you saw my teeth you would deny basic dental care existed as well.

**Relapse**

Alabama isn't exactly the richest state. I wonder if this was part of a number of services being curtailed due to budget needs.

**CptJake**

Relapse wrote:
Alabama isn't exactly the richest state. I wonder if this was part of a number of services being curtailed due to budget needs.

Read my links, it is a small part of a very big cut back.

**Ghazkuul**

6 of the 10 counties listed also are in the top 10 for LOWEST population, with them holding the #1,2 and 3 spots. Of the remaining 4 two of them "Hale 14th smallest population" and "
Macon 21st smallest population" have low populations. The other two which I guarantee ARE NOT being closed are Dallas and Montgomery and also have the biggest populations.

The 8 smallest of the 10 counties total around 101k people....around 75% of which are non white so really only about 75-80k people....not exactly HUGE numbers, but lets not let facts get in the way of our racist conspiracy theories.

**Relapse**

CptJake wrote:
Relapse wrote:
Alabama isn't exactly the richest state. I wonder if this was part of a number of services being curtailed due to budget needs.

Read my links, it is a small part of a very big cut back.

It's pretty much what I thought, after reading your links. Alabama doesn't have money to keep crap open, so it's no big conspiracy. It's a case of the state being broke.

**sebster**

Frazzled wrote:
If they still provide government issued ID at those offices then that mitigates MUCH of the concern. If you are going for a driver test you could drive to another county (I guess...meh).

I think this is probably the best way forward. At some point I think the Federal government has to recognise voter disenfranchisement is a Federal issue (civil rights and all that), and put in place a scheme that lets anyone get a national ID card for free.

Automatically Appended Next Post:

Relapse wrote:
It's pretty much what I thought, after reading your links. Alabama doesn't have money to keep crap open, so it's no big conspiracy. It's a case of the state being broke.

Sure, but with the budget pressures in mind it probably would have been a really smart idea not to put a really unnecessary voter ID law that meant you'd have to either maintain services in each county, or risk leaving some voters disenfranchised.

**Co'tor Shas**

It's a pretty useless law too, voter fraud is practically non-existent.

**Ghazkuul**

sebster wrote:
Frazzled wrote:
If they still provide government issued ID at those offices then that mitigates MUCH of the concern. If you are going for a driver test you could drive to another county (I guess...meh).

I think this is probably the best way forward. At some point I think the Federal government has to recognise voter disenfranchisement is a Federal issue (civil rights and all that), and put in place a scheme that lets anyone get a national ID card for free.

Automatically Appended Next Post:

Relapse wrote:
It's pretty much what I thought, after reading your links. Alabama doesn't have money to keep crap open, so it's no big conspiracy. It's a case of the state being broke.

Sure, but with the budget pressures in mind it probably would have been a really smart idea not to put a really unnecessary voter ID law that meant you'd have to either maintain services in each county, or risk leaving some voters disenfranchised.

You can walk into any County clerk office in the United States and get a valid ID card. You can walk into any Post office in the USA and get a valid US Passport. Either of which are enough to satisfy the Voters ID law. What is the problem?

**Co'tor Shas**

Doesn't that cost money? Which is the main concern? Maybe it's just NY.

Anyway, the law it'self is unnecessary.

**whembly**

Co'tor Shas wrote:
Doesn't that cost money? Which is the main concern? Maybe it's just NY.

Anyway, the law it'self is unnecessary.

Pretty sure NY requires so sort of ID to vote (and voting is ever on 1 day).

Do you hear of any disenfranchisement in NY???

**Relapse**

sebster wrote:
Frazzled wrote:
If they still provide government issued ID at those offices then that mitigates MUCH of the concern. If you are going for a driver test you could drive to another county (I guess...meh).

I think this is probably the best way forward. At some point I think the Federal government has to recognise voter disenfranchisement is a Federal issue (civil rights and all that), and put in place a scheme that lets anyone get a national ID card for free.

Automatically Appended Next Post:

Relapse wrote:
It's pretty much what I thought, after reading your links. Alabama doesn't have money to keep crap open, so it's no big conspiracy. It's a case of the state being broke.

Sure, but with the budget pressures in mind it probably would have been a really smart idea not to put a really unnecessary voter ID law that meant you'd have to either maintain services in each county, or risk leaving some voters disenfranchised.

How do they ID people for liquor and cigarette sales, though, just to name a couple of the first things that come to my mind. I imagine the ID used for that is good enough to use at the polls.