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Made in us
Fresh-Faced New User





The intention of this thread is to present and fine tune a simplified rule set for players to use chess clocks in timed tournament games of 40k. Please share any questions that came up during real games or any constructive feedback that you may have.


Basic rules for using chess clocks in Warhammer 40k.

When does time start:
.


Time starts when the first pregame action or dice roll happens. Depending on the tournament this might be deciding sides, placing objectives etc.

Rules:

1.The player is responsible for their own time. It is the players right but not their obligation to make sure that their time is being handled properly. A player can always pass a phase, action or even a turn.

2. Any major rule discrepancies result’s in a paused time scenario. The time is to remain paused until a formal judge is called to the table and hears the argument. It is then the judges call whose time is started while the dispute is resolved.

3. If a player’s time runs out during a unit’s action, the player can finish that unit’s action only. (moving, shooting, charging etc.)

4. If a player runs out of time he can no longer do any voluntary actions.

a. This includes drawing maelstrom cards, rolling for reserves, rolling to rally, moving, casting psychic powers, denying psychic powers, shooting, taking look out sirs, running in any form (flat out, turbo boosting, jump pack moves etc.), charging, swinging in close combat and consolidating.

5. A timed out player may do involuntary actions including;

a. Involuntary moves to keep them one inch from the enemy such as moving from tank shock, pile in moves, taking saving throws and scoring objectives of any sort that they already hold.

So that’s it five basic rules is all you need to use chess clocks in tournaments and solve all time issues. The most important rule is rule number 1. This is most important because it puts time in your control and solves the issue of both players interacting in most phases of the game. It is the players right to pass the time to his opponent whenever it’s not his action.

Some examples of this are as follows:

1. You put 20 wounds on a unit containing multiple ic’s and models with different saving throws. Pass the clock to your opponent so he can make his look out sir rolls and saving throws.

2. Your opponent has to make 3 ld tests after the shooting phase is over. Pass the clock the clock to you opponent while he makes these ld tests and the resulting moves if some units fail.

3. You destroy a vehicle and your opponent has a large squad inside that he wants positioned just right. Pass the clock to him while he arranges his models.

4. You do 5 power fist wounds and 5 regular wounds to a unit that contains IC’s that might be effected by instant death. Pass the clock to your opponent while he decides what saves to take on which models.

These examples are limited but should show the basic concept. You manage your own time and it is up to you to pass the clock. If you burn your own time it is not your opponents fault.

When does the game end.

Games end naturally depending on random game length rolls or at the start of a new turn when neither player has greater then (xxx) time left on the clock to start as new turn. I suggest five minutes but can be anything.

This message was edited 3 times. Last update was at 2016/02/15 15:51:56


 
   
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Dankhold Troggoth






Shadeglass Maze

I think passing the clock for each series of rolls for your opponent is going to be pretty awkward in practice...

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2016/02/14 23:38:01


 
   
Made in au
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Making Stuff






Under the couch

Yeah, chess clocks are the sort of idea that sounds great on paper, but would just be awkward and irritating in practice, and really, really open to abuse.

How do you account for the time taken when an opponent questions an action you are in the middle of taking, or when smaller rules discussions ensue? A determined opponent could very easily just whittle away at your time in small bites.

Frankly, I can't see it being worth the bother. If tournaments are having serious issues with players finishing on time, I'd be looking at lengthening the rounds or reducing the army size before going down this route.

 
   
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Lieutenant Colonel






Chess clocks work in chess, where both sides have equal armies in every respect outside of first turn.

40k has very unequal armies, in terms of power, model count, phases they need to participate in, # of dice needed to participate, ect ect.


If you think you got slow played, tell a TO, time clocks simply add another action into a game where you have less then 4 seconds per turn per model to do everything you need to do.

Even WMH has 2 hours slotted in tournaments despite it being a pale # of models compared to 40k, and having what I consider a much faster set of rules/set up/ect.




 
   
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Blood-Drenched Death Company Marine




Little Rock, Arkansas

It's mainly the incredible awkwardness of passing time back and forth for tiny subphases that tears it down for me. Like after your every initiative step in melee.

The amount of time passes also seems pretty staggering. It wouldn't surprise me if by the end of the game, both players had spent 10 minutes each messing with the clock. They could've just had 20 extra game minutes right there instead.

I don't think the 40k situation merits chess clocks. Slow play exists, but it's not a titanic problem. The big problem most of us are talking about is games being too big to finish naturally, through no real fault of the players. AKA getting to round 5 and calling it there when the game rules specify that RGL should be rolled.

I'm also not buying a chess clock. I probably won't participate in an event that uses them. Too impersonal for what is supposed to be a gentlemen's game.

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Sure. As long as you buy mine at every GT I attend.




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[ADMIN]
President of the Mat Ward Fan Club






Los Angeles, CA

t wrote:

3. Some army’s need more time- All armies are equal under chess clocks. This is the beauty of it, each player is treated equal and fairly. If a player chooses to bring an army that they feel might take more time, then they need to become very efficient with it or suffer the consequences of running out of time. The current system is not far in that it punishes opponents of players that choose to play army’s that they are slow with.


This is not "the beauty of it".

Why should a player who wants to take a Tyranid or Ork army to a tournaemnt that contains lots of models be expected to be an absolute master of it? Because other players and TOs have pushed the point and time limits for each round to the point where that's the only type of player that can possibly take these types of armies?

Do you really want to try to push people away from taking all varieties of armies instead of doing the sensible thing and decreasing point values and/or increasing round times?

Let me be clear: in spirit, I'm fine with the use of chess clocks for 40k tournaments if people like the challenge, but it should *not* be used as a way to fix games not finishing in lieu of fixing the real issue, which is that point limits are too high and round times are not long enough.

40k is designed so that players can take a wide variety of different types of armies, some with a few models and some with many, many models. Tournament rules that effectively prohibit all but the most skilled players from taking the latter type of army are doing a great disservice to everyone, because novice players have a limited choice of armies they can take to a tournament and in general the tournament field will become more homogenous (almost all armies that are quick and easy to play).

   
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Fresh-Faced New User




think passing the clock for each series of rolls for your opponent is going to be pretty awkward in practice...


These rules are from the result of practice and game testing and work really well. Remember you control your own time and you do not have to pass the clock. In reality you usually only pass it when your opponent has a large pool of saving throws to take and not just a single one.


Yeah, chess clocks are the sort of idea that sounds great on paper, but would just be awkward and irritating in practice, and really, really open to abuse.

How do you account for the time taken when an opponent questions an action you are in the middle of taking, or when smaller rules discussions ensue? A determined opponent could very easily just whittle away at your time in small bites.


These rules are from play testing. Remember you control your own time, if you allow your opponent to waste it you only have yourself to blame. Also, you can always pause time and call a judge. This makes rules abuse really obvious.

Chess clocks work in chess, where both sides have equal armies in every respect outside of first turn.

40k has very unequal armies, in terms of power, model count, phases they need to participate in, # of dice needed to participate, ect ect.


I agree completely this is the beauty of chess clocks everyone has equal time regardless of what army they bring.


If you think you got slow played, tell a TO, time clocks simply add another action into a game where you have less then 4 seconds per turn per model to do everything you need to do.


In my experience this never works and only plays in to the hands of the offender. Anyway under a chess clock system you won't have to worry about slow play because it's not possible. The slow player will only be able to waste their own time.
'

It's mainly the incredible awkwardness of passing time back and forth for tiny subphases that tears it down for me. Like after your every initiative step in melee.

The amount of time passes also seems pretty staggering. It wouldn't surprise me if by the end of the game, both players had spent 10 minutes each messing with the clock. They could've just had 20 extra game minutes right there instead.


The first few games are awkward but then it becomes second nature and works smoothly.

The big problem most of us are talking about is games being too big to finish naturally, through no real fault of the players.


I am not sure I agree with this but its your opinion and you are entitled to it. From what I have experienced, under a timed system you really see who is spending the time and for what reasons.

But in any case the clocks make all timed tournament games end fairly and naturally.

I posted these rules as a solution to a problem that obviously exists in timed tournament games. I should have mentioned in the previous post that I intended this thread as a place where people can share their real game experiences so that we can tweak the rule set and make it complete.

While everyone is entitled to their opinion, I ask that you please try the rules and then provide constructive feed back from your games in this thread.

On a final note please remember rule number 1, that you control your own time you will see that the system works very well in timed tournament games.
   
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Leader of the Sept






Problems with chess clocks with 40k
1: Multiple phases that each require time, unlike WM/H where a model goes, and another one goes
2: Unlike WM/H, which, to my knowledge only has your opponent going in your phase for a Tough roll, 40k has Numerous things that you opponent takes during your turn, saves, FNP, deny, explosions, hell I have found explosions slow the game down considerably.
3: Cost: 40k tournaments are effing huge, 100+ tables. thats alot, and even FLG, one of the biggest tournament runners in the countrie is a small business. and at the LVO, people stole table numbers, terrain, and other stuff, they are gonna steal chess clocks. WM/H, their large tournaments are funded by PP
4: punishes horde armies

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VA

If events had distinct delineation between regular guys and top table players, and felt they could successfully run both events, then I could see possibly using clocks in the "competitive" arena. By and large the majority of a tournament field is not competing for top table, and is often populated by players not interested in doing so. Requiring chess clocks slams the door pretty hard in the face of less experienced or more casual players. Coming into tournament play, I probably wouldn't have registered for an event that required chess clocks.

   
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Under the couch

t wrote:
These rules are from play testing. Remember you control your own time, if you allow your opponent to waste it you only have yourself to blame. Also, you can always pause time and call a judge. This makes rules abuse really obvious.

The same can be said about playing without the clock.

From curiosity, you say that this has been playtested. Has it been playtested against someone subtly wasting your time at every opportunity?

Because that's where this would fall down. 40K turns simply have too much involvement from both players for this to have any hope of working unless both players are actively trying to make it work. At which point actually having the clock is uneccessary anyway.






I agree completely this is the beauty of chess clocks everyone has equal time regardless of what army they bring.

Which, as yakface said, is a problem, not a benefit.

There is absolutely no incentive under this system to ever bring a horde army to a tournament. Expecting a Grey Knight army and an Ork army to take the same amount of time to carry out a turn is crazy.

 
   
Made in nz
Trustworthy Shas'vre






While I disagree with chess clocks in 40k, you can get free chess clock apps for your smartphone that alleviate the problems of cost. Most people in WMH tournaments use phone apps to control time.

One major issue I have with chess clocks in 40k is that one player can force the other to spend time. Every time I shoot you, time gone. Every time I assault you, time gone. Every initiative step in combat, time gone. WMH works because out-of-turn actions are rare (maybe one spell or model per army will have Counter-charge or admonition, and tough rolls are a single dice and time is not usually switched for these). You can't make your opponent do anything.

In my experience, the time spent switching clocks for each player action slows down the game more than deliberate slow playing. MOST slow playing (in my experience) is just that 40k is a slow game with tons of random rolls, tons of context switching between models, and tons of book keeping.
   
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Fresh-Faced New User




The intention of this thread is to present and fine tune a simplified rule set for players to use chess clocks in timed tournament games of 40k. Please share any questions that came up during real games or any constructive feedback that you may have.

There are some interesting opinions being expressed here and while I value them I think that they are better suited in an opinion thread debating when to use chess clocks.

I am going to edit the original post to better reflect the intention of this thread.
   
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Flower Picking Eldar Youth




I think chess clocks are a great idea. Of course they have flaws and it's not a perfect system, but it is much better than the current situation. I am sure that everyone here has had a loss (or possibly a win) because their opponent used much more time than they did. Slow play is certainly not always intentional, but that doesn't mean it's not an issue.

There is no reason that chess clocks can't be used in addition to smaller armies or a longer round. I don't see any aspect of it that makes the game worse.

Somebody mentioned that chess clocks could be stolen so they shouldn't be used. For that reason, why use terrain? People can steal that as well.

 yakface wrote:

40k is designed so that players can take a wide variety of different types of armies, some with a few models and some with many, many models. Tournament rules that effectively prohibit all but the most skilled players from taking the latter type of army are doing a great disservice to everyone, because novice players have a limited choice of armies they can take to a tournament and in general the tournament field will become more homogenous (almost all armies that are quick and easy to play).



I disagree with this. I believe that both players are entitled to half of the time allotted. If you bring an army that eats up 75 percent of the time because you want to play a horde, that's not fair to me. You don't get to use more time than me just because you or your army is slow. At the very least, the clock is an effective reminder to both players that there is a limited amount of time to finish the game.

The major issue that I foresee is rules questions and calling a judge over. This is the aspect with the most potential for abuse, IMO. One solution is giving each player 5-10 minutes less than the actual round time, so that the clock can be paused during these interludes without running over schedule. It's still not perfect, but I think it's a much better system than now. All players are held accountable and egregious examples of stalling or slow play becomes transparent.

Try playing a game or two like this, it is truly not that difficult after one game. I intend to start bringing a chess clock to tournaments for my own personal use.
   
Made in us
Fixture of Dakka




t wrote:
think passing the clock for each series of rolls for your opponent is going to be pretty awkward in practice...


These rules are from the result of practice and game testing and work really well. Remember you control your own time and you do not have to pass the clock. In reality you usually only pass it when your opponent has a large pool of saving throws to take and not just a single one.


Yeah, chess clocks are the sort of idea that sounds great on paper, but would just be awkward and irritating in practice, and really, really open to abuse.

How do you account for the time taken when an opponent questions an action you are in the middle of taking, or when smaller rules discussions ensue? A determined opponent could very easily just whittle away at your time in small bites.


These rules are from play testing. Remember you control your own time, if you allow your opponent to waste it you only have yourself to blame. Also, you can always pause time and call a judge. This makes rules abuse really obvious.

Chess clocks work in chess, where both sides have equal armies in every respect outside of first turn.

40k has very unequal armies, in terms of power, model count, phases they need to participate in, # of dice needed to participate, ect ect.


I agree completely this is the beauty of chess clocks everyone has equal time regardless of what army they bring.


If you think you got slow played, tell a TO, time clocks simply add another action into a game where you have less then 4 seconds per turn per model to do everything you need to do.


In my experience this never works and only plays in to the hands of the offender. Anyway under a chess clock system you won't have to worry about slow play because it's not possible. The slow player will only be able to waste their own time.
'

It's mainly the incredible awkwardness of passing time back and forth for tiny subphases that tears it down for me. Like after your every initiative step in melee.

The amount of time passes also seems pretty staggering. It wouldn't surprise me if by the end of the game, both players had spent 10 minutes each messing with the clock. They could've just had 20 extra game minutes right there instead.


The first few games are awkward but then it becomes second nature and works smoothly.

The big problem most of us are talking about is games being too big to finish naturally, through no real fault of the players.


I am not sure I agree with this but its your opinion and you are entitled to it. From what I have experienced, under a timed system you really see who is spending the time and for what reasons.

But in any case the clocks make all timed tournament games end fairly and naturally.

I posted these rules as a solution to a problem that obviously exists in timed tournament games. I should have mentioned in the previous post that I intended this thread as a place where people can share their real game experiences so that we can tweak the rule set and make it complete.

While everyone is entitled to their opinion, I ask that you please try the rules and then provide constructive feed back from your games in this thread.

On a final note please remember rule number 1, that you control your own time you will see that the system works very well in timed tournament games.


I first applaud your effort in trying to improve the tournament experience for those who participate in them. The world needs a number of problem solvers equal to the number of problem finders. That being said, I did notice that you seem to be of a split mind in your post, if I read it correctly about calling a judge to the table in the event of sandbagging.
You first suggest pausing time and calling for a judge, which really does nothing for your fast timeframe you are trying to accomplish. Judges can be spread pretty thin in tournaments I have attended, and it might take one several minutes to get to you if they are dealing with a group of issues at once. You then say in another part of this same post that in your experience, calling judges doesn't work and only plays into the hands of the offender. This has me puzzled as to what your real thoughts are on this.
Further down, in answer to someone saying it seems awkward, you state it's only awkward for the first few games. Most tournaments I have attended are usually consist of only three of four games. It doesn't sound attractive to slog through three or four awkward games, or for that matter, even two.
I think the answer has already been put forward in knocking down the number of points, or if that puts certain armies at a disadvantage, then extending the game length.
With clocks, there are too many variables that can't be adequately covered.
   
Made in us
Fresh-Faced New User




I first applaud your effort in trying to improve the tournament experience for those who participate in them. The world needs a number of problem solvers equal to the number of problem finders.


Thank you, the idea is to make a concise set of rules for players to use in timed tournament games.

That being said, I did notice that you seem to be of a split mind in your post, if I read it correctly about calling a judge to the table in the event of sandbagging.


Sandbagging is not possible because it is your right to put your opponent on his clock. If real issues of sportsmanship arise, pause the time and call a judge. If this becomes a recurring issue by the same offending player it will be very easy to notice and the TO can describe what penalties those players will face upfront. The clocks make these type of offenses extremely transparent. Play a few games and you will see.

You first suggest pausing time and calling for a judge, which really does nothing for your fast time frame you are trying to accomplish. Judges can be spread pretty thin in tournaments I have attended, and it might take one several minutes to get to you if they are dealing with a group of issues at once.


These are great questions. So time should be paused for any major rule issue. This should not happen that often and if it does consistently happen for the same player the judge should have the power to impose a penalty designated by the TO. Additionally I think there is room for discussion about total time having a pause time buffer added to it. This is very simple to implement because it only effect each players total time and it would be done equally. I would really like to hear some TO's with chess clock experience constructive feed back on this topic.


You then say in another part of this same post that in your experience, calling judges doesn't work and only plays into the hands of the offender. This has me puzzled as to what your real thoughts are on this.


This is in reference to the current tournament system and players who game it by playing slowly. There are several threads and posts about these types of tactics on dakka. However, this is not possible under the proposed rules because they would only be wasting their own time. Remember you control your own time.

Further down, in answer to someone saying it seems awkward, you state it's only awkward for the first few games. Most tournaments I have attended are usually consist of only three of four games. It doesn't sound attractive to slog through three or four awkward games, or for that matter, even two.


I assume people will play these initial games at home fist to prepare themselves for timed tournament games that are using chess clocks. It only takes a few games to get a hang of it if you follow these simple rules.

I think the answer has already been put forward in knocking down the number of points, or if that puts certain armies at a disadvantage, then extending the game length.


I started a different thread to discuss opinions on the pros and cons of using chess clocks. Thank you for your questions, please try the system at home for a few games and post anymore that you might have. Also, I hope that these rules make your future timed tournament game experience's better.


With clocks, there are too many variables that can't be adequately covered.


Please focus one most important variable time and the main rule you need to remember is that you control it.
   
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[MOD]
Dankhold Troggoth






Shadeglass Maze

t wrote:
There are some interesting opinions being expressed here and while I value them I think that they are better suited in an opinion thread debating when to use chess clocks.

I am going to edit the original post to better reflect the intention of this thread.

t wrote:
I started a different thread to discuss opinions on the pros and cons of using chess clocks. Thank you for your questions, please try the system at home for a few games and post anymore that you might have.

I just wanted to clarify that, all discussion regarding the chess clock idea from the OP here (or really, any other chess clock ideas) should be discussed in this thread - we do not need a separate thread for this.

As someone who plays both 40K and Warmachine, I can definitely see the appeal of chess clocks... but I just don't think it fits 40K nearly so well, and while I wouldn't be opposed to trying it, I don't think it's an ideal solution for this game.
   
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Los Angeles, CA

DaGrippster wrote:
I disagree with this. I believe that both players are entitled to half of the time allotted. If you bring an army that eats up 75 percent of the time because you want to play a horde, that's not fair to me. You don't get to use more time than me just because you or your army is slow. At the very least, the clock is an effective reminder to both players that there is a limited amount of time to finish the game.

The major issue that I foresee is rules questions and calling a judge over. This is the aspect with the most potential for abuse, IMO. One solution is giving each player 5-10 minutes less than the actual round time, so that the clock can be paused during these interludes without running over schedule. It's still not perfect, but I think it's a much better system than now. All players are held accountable and egregious examples of stalling or slow play becomes transparent.

Try playing a game or two like this, it is truly not that difficult after one game. I intend to start bringing a chess clock to tournaments for my own personal use.


I am not implying that one player should get more than 50% of the time if they're bringing a horde army. I am saying that implementing chess clocks to combat a mass amount of games not being finished is a terrible idea that does not address the root problem, and worse, helps to push the tournament hobby into a very boring environment where new players are effectively encouraged to only bring armies that are easy to play (low model count).

The point is, if you implement a chess clock system, and a player playing at a reasonable pace with a horde army isn't able to finish their game, this is not their fault, but a problem with the tournament having too high a points limit for the available round times.

People purposefully slow-playing is a relatively small percentage of players, and honestly it can much better be caught by tracking a player's ability to finish their games across multiple tournament years, and that way only the people that are perpetually slow-playing are punished, as opposed to chess clocks and too short a round time, which unfairly affects anyone trying to play an army with a lot of models.

t wrote:The intention of this thread is to present and fine tune a simplified rule set for players to use chess clocks in timed tournament games of 40k. Please share any questions that came up during real games or any constructive feedback that you may have.

There are some interesting opinions being expressed here and while I value them I think that they are better suited in an opinion thread debating when to use chess clocks.

I am going to edit the original post to better reflect the intention of this thread.

I appreciate that, but you started the thread with the OP originally stating an editorial opinion that chess clocks were a great solution to solve a specific problem. I firmly disagree with that supposition, so I felt compelled to respond. I see that you've now edited your OP to remove that editorial, and as such I will try to refrain from further polluting this thread with my opinion on why chess clocks are not a good solution to combat tournament 40K games not being finished en masse.

   
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London

Start the clock for start of turn, end for end of turn. Players have reasonable time for defensive rolling in opponents turn. Typically i;d roll while the other guy checks his codex and count the dice for a little extra time.

As an eldar player I'm extremely sensitive to such an unfair advantage that nearly slow play has on me if i go second. Knowing that turn 5 is the last turn means I can safely turbo boost my characters and bike squads to objectives without worrying about a turn 6 and their being shot to pieces.

Its little things like this that seem silly but actually win games,against the spirit of the game for me too.
   
Made in us
Trustworthy Shas'vre





Cobleskill

The posters on this thread are deliberately at loggerheads. YOU ARE ALL INSANE.

I agree that chess clocks are an elegant solution to such problems. I will also note that I tend to bring relatively low model count armies to such games.

With that said though, horde armies are not against the rules. And having played Guard, I do feel for those who would be unduly limited by such constraints.

How to fix such games?
1. Get rid of TLOS.
2. Play on whiteboard or chalkboard tables where you can mark the field for whatever terrain you want to use. Area terrain, LOS blocking?
3. Encourage the use of movement trays.

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'THE ENEMY!!!' 
   
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Longtime Dakkanaut





Eye of Terror

I abhor the use of timers after watching them uses in warmahordes but to say international slow play rarely occurs is just untrue and there should be some punishment for it.

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CA

I wont do it. I feel like blaming slow play is an excuse you get when you lose at bottom tables.

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Downers Grove Il

I really want to try a timed game.

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Fresh-Faced New User




You should try it, I suggest this clock: http://www.amazon.com/DGT-1001-Digital-Chess-Clock/dp/B016E3WSVA/ref=sr_1_3?s=toys-and-games&ie=UTF8&qid=1456961976&sr=1-3&keywords=dgt+1001

I switched to it because it does negative time.

Also, one of our FLGS are starting to use chess clocks in their monthly tournaments.

http://draxtargames.com/calendar-events/40k-event-1850-points-2/

They that draw 20-30+ people for each event. If you live in the area you should play in them. They are well run and its a great place to play.
   
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[MOD]
Dankhold Troggoth






Shadeglass Maze

Negative time seems like a great feature, particularly for practice games! I've actually ordered that chess clock, will let you know how I like it

Although to be honest, I got it for use with Warmachine/Hordes
   
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Longtime Dakkanaut






Getting my broom incase there is shenanigans.

Everyone always says that it is too expensive for TOs. Well, why to they have to be the ones to provide them? Players can buy and bring there own if they want to use them.




Automatically Appended Next Post:
 Its_Rumble wrote:
I wont do it. I feel like blaming slow play is an excuse you get when you lose at bottom tables.


Have you ever played battle company at a tournament and end the game on a dice roll?

There is nothing worse than losing a game only because you ran out of time, that you would have won if it came to its natural conclusion.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2016/03/13 10:03:58



 
   
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Focused Fire Warrior




If you really want to save some time out of games you should just mandate a single tablet with a proper dice rolling app be on the table side for both parties to use. Would it be fun? Hell no. Would people bitch and moan about it being lame? Yup. But you could easily mandate that for any dice roll over say.. 20 dice and save quite a bit of time over the course of the match.

I think it would be nearly as lame as a chess clock, but whatever.

And yes Blackmoor, I've actually finished up games against Battle Companies naturally. You really do just need to play smart and fast to keep things moving, and of course nudge your opponent if they are taking time out during their own movement/shooting phase for small talk/talking with neighbors, etc.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
 RiTides wrote:
Negative time seems like a great feature, particularly for practice games! I've actually ordered that chess clock, will let you know how I like it

Although to be honest, I got it for use with Warmachine/Hordes


Let us know how it goes RiT. I'd certainly be intrigued to hear how you and your mates find it in practice.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2016/03/13 12:50:36


NYC Warmongers

2016 ATC Team Tournament Third Place Team: Tank You Very Much
2016 Golden Sprue Best Overall
2015 Templecon Best General
2014 Mechanicon Best General/Iron Man
2013 Mechanicon Best General  
   
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Dakka Veteran




Can you point to a decent dice rolling app that can handle something like 30 dice, hit on 4s, wound on 3s? How about rerolling 1s once? Or adding a dice for every 6 to hit? Serious question. I've looked but never found one that was faster to use in all but the most basic scenarios than just rolling the dice by hand.
   
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Death-Dealing Ultramarine Devastator




Downers Grove Il

There are tons of dice roling apps. Hero lab and Army Builder have nice dice rollers built in that allow you to role huge numbers of D what ever. As far as DX+X that I am not sure.

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Dakka Veteran




Rolling X dice is easy. Manipulating the results and ending up with something usable in real game situations is hard. Every app I've tried takes more effort getting to the final usable results than just grabbing a handful of dice and rolling them. As the number of dice to be rolled decreases, the discrepancy increases.
   
 
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