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Hello!

As most of you know, GW just released a new Imperial Knight Renegade kit. (Basically an imperial knight gone bad)

Does anyone know if a renegade knight can be used in a WH40k Chaos Space Marines army?

Thanks,

You can ally in 1-3 in as a detatchment for CSM.

They are their own faction, but are battle brothers both to chaos marines and daemons.

They have a detachment by themselves, called a Forsworn Detachment (obviously meant as a counterpart to the Oathsworn Detachment).

It can't be your primary detachment - although there may (for all we know) be a counterpart to the household detachment as well.

If you specifically want a knight as a lord of war 'within' a chaos detachment (because of a specific command benefit, for example), get a Forgeworld Chaos Knight - it has a slightly improved combat weapon and the option (for points) of daemonic rules.

If you want a knight in a chaos marine army, then you can just as easily take the renegade - you can have a perfectly legal detachment of just one bolted into a chaos army, and you get access to all the various arm and carapace weapons not available to the forgeworld version.

And can dual-wield the shooting weapons.

Good Stuff!

This means CSM and Daemons are finally getting a knight with Carapace weapons and more shooting options for the arms.

Great, even more OP toys for the chaos factions to shenanigans with.

Sweet, knights I can ally with my orks. Is there a book or white dwarf that has the rules for this "forsworn" detachmemt?

geargutz wrote:
Sweet, knights I can ally with my orks. Is there a book or white dwarf that has the rules for this "forsworn" detachmemt?

You get it by buying the kit

Pain4Pleasure wrote:

geargutz wrote:
Sweet, knights I can ally with my orks. Is there a book or white dwarf that has the rules for this "forsworn" detachmemt?

You get it by buying the kit

Though I'm willing to bet they'll release the PDF online like they did with the DW:O datasheets.

I'm not terribly experienced with Imperial Knights, though I have one I haven't built yet. I want to add one to my Daemonkin- but I'm not sure what kind to have. Does anyone have any thoughts about a dual Gatling cannon knight? Would it be as good as it seems or would it suffer from diminishing returns?

Has anyone thought of how it would work using double melee weapons?

 labmouse42 wrote:
Has anyone thought of how it would work using double melee weapons?

From my understanding the double melee one has always been a knight option anyways. As has a double ranged weapon one. The only thing that is new is the double same ranged weapon.

Edit: Feel free to ignore this, I was incorrect.

 Ignatius wrote:

 labmouse42 wrote:
Has anyone thought of how it would work using double melee weapons?

From my understanding the double melee one has always been a knight option anyways. As has a double ranged weapon one. The only thing that is new is the double same ranged weapon.

Sorry, I should have been more clear?
Does anyone think this is viable? Would having three knights with double melee weapons throwing themselves into enemy ranks be effective?

Imperial forces have generally been more shooty, but if you are taking them with daemons, there is no reason not to just take a rotswarm and three of these.

 labmouse42 wrote:

 Ignatius wrote:

 labmouse42 wrote:
Has anyone thought of how it would work using double melee weapons?

From my understanding the double melee one has always been a knight option anyways. As has a double ranged weapon one. The only thing that is new is the double same ranged weapon.

Sorry, I should have been more clear?
Does anyone think this is viable? Would having three knights with double melee weapons throwing themselves into enemy ranks be effective?

Imperial forces have generally been more shooty, but if you are taking them with daemons, there is no reason not to just take a rotswarm and three of these.

Unless Knights have specific special rules for wielding two melee weapons - like the Klaw Stompa in IA 8 - then most definitely not. You're going to be getting a grand total of 1 attack CC swing if you equip two melee weapons, and a choice of which weapon you want to 'swing' with.. If that matters, why swing with anything other than D?

So basically it's 1 extra melee attack or a noticeable amount of very powerful fire power, each for about the same points cost. Which do you think is going to be better?

 labmouse42 wrote:

 Ignatius wrote:

 labmouse42 wrote:
Has anyone thought of how it would work using double melee weapons?

From my understanding the double melee one has always been a knight option anyways. As has a double ranged weapon one. The only thing that is new is the double same ranged weapon.

Sorry, I should have been more clear?
Does anyone think this is viable? Would having three knights with double melee weapons throwing themselves into enemy ranks be effective?

Imperial forces have generally been more shooty, but if you are taking them with daemons, there is no reason not to just take a rotswarm and three of these.

Well they've got their stomp attacks, so no matter what you put on them they will do fine in combat. The only question is if you want a natural D weapon in combat. If you do then the chainsword will do fine. Even with the Thunderstrike and chainsword you're only getting one extra attack compared to- say- a chainsword and gatling cannon armed one.

The difference is cost. Going dual weapons is only 325 points. You might say "The gatling cannon is only 50 points more" but that's still 50 more points. If you are bringing 3 of them, that's a difference of 150 points.
It's the same gearset as a Knight Errant. The question is, do you see people fielding Knight Errant's in armies that are assault oriented?

It's one extra attack. Since the knights only have 3 attacks, that's 33% more attacks in the assault phase. That's a good amount of damage. Sure, you are 'sacrificing' firepower, but since the rest of your army is rushing to assault, does not this fit as well?

But I've never played one. That's why I am asking your experience

Gallants only really make sense when there isn't points for anything else.


Do note the box doesn't contain the parts to make two Gallants or a single dual gattling cannon.

Anyone know of a third party that makes gatling cannon substitutes?

hold on a sec, dual guns are a choice?
I mean that it is possible to equip 2x melta cannons, rapid fire battle cannons or avenger gatlings?

 carldooley wrote:
hold on a sec, dual guns are a choice?
I mean that it is possible to equip 2x melta cannons, rapid fire battle cannons or avenger gatlings?

Yes. You lose the D-weapon, but double your shooting.

The most practical one I can see is the Gat-Knight shooting 24 STR 6, AP3 rending shots at BS4.

As a correction, the dual melee knight is a Knight Gallant. Errant is the one with a single melee and the thermal cannon.

Honestly if you're going to go with anything melee, be sure to spend the 10 points on the thunderstrike gauntlet. If you kill a vehicle with that, you get to hurl it at something else causing a large blast template explosion in that area. If you're playing with enough points to warrant a knight then the 10 points should be nothing to spare.

 labmouse42 wrote:

 carldooley wrote:
hold on a sec, dual guns are a choice?
I mean that it is possible to equip 2x melta cannons, rapid fire battle cannons or avenger gatlings?

Yes. You lose the D-weapon, but double your shooting.

The most practical one I can see is the Gat-Knight shooting 24 STR 6, AP3 rending shots at BS4.

pray tell. where are the rules for these loadouts?

 mmzero252 wrote:
As a correction, the dual melee knight is a Knight Gallant. Errant is the one with a single melee and the thermal cannon.

Honestly if you're going to go with anything melee, be sure to spend the 10 points on the thunderstrike gauntlet. If you kill a vehicle with that, you get to hurl it at something else causing a large blast template explosion in that area. If you're playing with enough points to warrant a knight then the 10 points should be nothing to spare.

I love the Thunderstrike Gauntlet. Not only do you kill your opponent's Riptide, you spike it like you just won the goddamn Super Bowl!

 carldooley wrote:

 labmouse42 wrote:

 carldooley wrote:
hold on a sec, dual guns are a choice?
I mean that it is possible to equip 2x melta cannons, rapid fire battle cannons or avenger gatlings?

Yes. You lose the D-weapon, but double your shooting.

The most practical one I can see is the Gat-Knight shooting 24 STR 6, AP3 rending shots at BS4.

pray tell. where are the rules for these loadouts?

Google for it, their are images leaked all over. the dual avenger build is 425 points.

If the space marine variant also has the same build option, I feel like GW is telling everyone to start bringing terminators else all your infantry is just going to be wiped away.

 carldooley wrote:
pray tell. where are the rules for these loadouts?

http://www.spikeybits.com/2016/04/new-chaos-renegade-knight-rules-spotted.html


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Grizzyzz wrote:
If the space marine variant also has the same build option, I feel like GW is telling everyone to start bringing terminators else all your infantry is just going to be wiped away.

3 of these knights is a definite hard counter to the scat bike/WK/warp spider spam.

The triple knight have their own hard counters, however. An Infernal Tetrad is something they don't want to be across from, as they won't be able to do enough wounds before the Tetrad wrecks every knight. Large fearless blobs in cover will also cause problems.

 EnTyme wrote:

 mmzero252 wrote:
As a correction, the dual melee knight is a Knight Gallant. Errant is the one with a single melee and the thermal cannon.

Honestly if you're going to go with anything melee, be sure to spend the 10 points on the thunderstrike gauntlet. If you kill a vehicle with that, you get to hurl it at something else causing a large blast template explosion in that area. If you're playing with enough points to warrant a knight then the 10 points should be nothing to spare.

I love the Thunderstrike Gauntlet. Not only do you kill your opponent's Riptide, you spike it like you just won the goddamn Super Bowl!

WELCOME TO BLOOD-BOWL 40K XL!

But in all seriousness, I think I need one of these now, that sounds amazing.

 labmouse42 wrote:

 carldooley wrote:
pray tell. where are the rules for these loadouts?

http://www.spikeybits.com/2016/04/new-chaos-renegade-knight-rules-spotted.html


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Grizzyzz wrote:
If the space marine variant also has the same build option, I feel like GW is telling everyone to start bringing terminators else all your infantry is just going to be wiped away.

3 of these knights is a definite hard counter to the scat bike/WK/warp spider spam.

The triple knight have their own hard counters, however. An Infernal Tetrad is something they don't want to be across from, as they won't be able to do enough wounds before the Tetrad wrecks every knight. Large fearless blobs in cover will also cause problems.

played a elder vs 4 imperial knights list sunday. I had 1 wraigthknight 4 units of scatter bikes, 1 WS with firedragons, 2 prisms, a dire avengers shrine formation and aspect shrine (included fire dragons and 2 units min size of dark reapers) using cover and keeping a 4+ cover on the WK he weathered all the fire pretty well and while he dies turn 5 he had taken out 2 knights by then

locarno24 wrote:


If you specifically want a knight as a lord of war 'within' a chaos detachment (because of a specific command benefit, for example), get a Forgeworld Chaos Knight - it has a slightly improved combat weapon and the option (for points) of daemonic rules.

speaking for myself I'm not sure I'd let someone use the FW chaos knight rules. they're labeled as experimental and now GW's put out actual rules for a chaos knight.

Just played a game using the dual Avenger Gatling Cannon Knight with the Stormspear Missile Launcher. Pretty points heavy unit, which takes away from my ability to run a MSU Khorne Daemonkin army like I generally do.

That said, it was extremely effective at killing Marines, Wolfen, and Thunderwolves (go figure). The 36" range doesn't hamper it at all, as most of the rest of my army is always up about 0-12" away from the enemy. It just kind of floated around the middle of the board blasting as it went. I haven't tried the Dual Battle Cannon or Thermal Cannon yet, but I am impressed with the amount of firepower it was able to put out.