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Do you think some Codex should be rolled up into one larger unit?

ex gratia:

All space marines should be in one codex
Imperial Guard, (Astra Militarum if your funny that way) Adeptus Mechanus, and Militarum Tempestus should all be one codex
Adeptus Sororitus, Inquisition, & Grey Knights should all be one codex
Every Imperial Armor could be rolled up into 2 separate volumes.
Also, would you rather codex come out one at a time or have them all update on a 4 year cycle?

Dark Angels and Blood Angels could be rolled into the vanilla codex, but Space Wolves and Grey Knights are WAY too unique to just toss in there.

"Unique" isn't exactly the first thing that comes to mind when I think of Space Marines

rrll wrote:
"Unique" isn't exactly the first thing that comes to mind when I think of Space Marines

Look into the Space Wolves fluff. They're pretty unique, which is part of why they have their own codex.

This is exactly what Supplements should have been used for. When they revealed that they were going to be a thing, I thought it was a perfect solution for the Space Marine situation. Look how that turned out.

What we should have is Codex: Space Marines and then Supplements for Blood Angels, Dark Angels, Space Wolves, etc. These would restrict units/rules in exchange for new ones and a set Chapter Tactic. Grey Knights should be their own, still.

rrll wrote:
Do you think some Codex should be rolled up into one larger unit?

ex gratia:

All space marines should be in one codex
Imperial Guard, (Astra Militarum if your funny that way) Adeptus Mechanus, and Militarum Tempestus should all be one codex
Adeptus Sororitus, Inquisition, & Grey Knights should all be one codex
Every Imperial Armor could be rolled up into 2 separate volumes.
Also, would you rather codex come out one at a time or have them all update on a 4 year cycle?

Yes on Space Marines.
Guard and Scions should be together yes, but Ad Mech on their own, they have absolutely no crossover with Guard. Imperial Knights could/should be thrown in with AdMech.
Inquisition and Grey Knights yes, but Sisters are Ecclisiarchy not Inquisition and the two being closely linked is not a given.
No. Imperial Armours are more like campeign books, you get a specific setting and story and rules for the units and characters within. Besides, we have IA1 and 2 already that have Guard and Marine vehicles and they are not small to begin with.

 Frozen Ocean wrote:
This is exactly what Supplements should have been used for. When they revealed that they were going to be a thing, I thought it was a perfect solution for the Space Marine situation. Look how that turned out.

What we should have is Codex: Space Marines and then Supplements for Blood Angels, Dark Angels, Space Wolves, etc. These would restrict units/rules in exchange for new ones and a set Chapter Tactic. Grey Knights should be their own, still.

Exactly - but lots of people would have been upset that some of the focus would not have been on Marines.............

I'd would have loved a proper Codex for those Chapters that don't conform to the Codex Astartes but instead we go Codex of Wolfy Wolf Wolf and Bloody Blood marines with Blood missiles................

 Frozen Ocean wrote:
This is exactly what Supplements should have been used for. When they revealed that they were going to be a thing, I thought it was a perfect solution for the Space Marine situation. Look how that turned out.

What we should have is Codex: Space Marines and then Supplements for Blood Angels, Dark Angels, Space Wolves, etc. These would restrict units/rules in exchange for new ones and a set Chapter Tactic. Grey Knights should be their own, still.

I think they should be developed as a single project, but released in this manner (core codex + supplements), otherwise we'd still get power creep in supplements and efforts to add new stuff in every release. All I really want as new kits for marines are chapter-specific unit variants, perhaps reflecting their chapter tactics.

The biggest problems are the new units we already have; Blood Angels and Dark Angels were fairly easy to roll back in when Blood Angels only really had Death Company as a unique unit, and Dark Angels just had flavours of regular units, but now they have a lot of unique stuff as well. I'd be fine with them overriding Codex: Space Marines units where they make sense (for example, specialised veterans are kind of covered for DA by Deathwing Knights/Black Knights, Ravenwing don't need Scout Bikes etc.) but this starts to make the supplements increasingly large.

We definitely need to get away from this Angels of Death nonsense; it's just even more for the basic codex, but does little to really help the chapters that need more; we still have no Iron Hands special characters, some new detachments just aren't very good and so-on. Marines may be a big part of the game, but spending so much time on them and dragging releases out all over the place hurts everyone, so they need to be handled in as few updates as possible.

So yeah, I want to see chapters turned into supplements, but the loyalist marines should be approached as if they were making a single giant book, i.e- one project, but with a foundation codex + supplements released all at the same time as balanced as possible. I'd like to see the same for other armies too, like Eldar getting Craftworld supplements as part of one big release, traitor legions getting similar treatment to the loyalists and so-on. It'd also be nice to see Astra Militarum with Cadian, Catachan etc. rules.

The Mechanicus armies should become one book (should have been in the first place really, seeing as how they came out so close together). Imperial Knights should remain separate I think, same with assassins and such; we have the models we need for these so they just need their rules refreshed each edition.

I'm 100% against consolidation of Marine Codices because we know what happened last time GW did that.

I'm all for combining some books, but it has to be done right.
1 Space Marine book would be too thick and too convoluted.
At best you could re-combine the BA's and DA's as they were in the ORIGINAL Angels of Death codex, but SWs are too unique and have almost no "over-lapping" units.

Grey Knight + Inquisition works, possible with Sisters, but only after plastic sisters get released.....so never.

Eldar + Harlequins, Dark Eldar + Corsairs
Nids + GSC

Unfortunately, this will never happen. GW has put itself in a position that is has too many books and sources out to have 1 book replace 2-3. They like it this way, not only to make you buy more books, but to provide "more variety in ways to play your minis"

--

 Galef wrote:
I'm all for combining some books, but it has to be done right.
1 Space Marine book would be too thick and too convoluted.
At best you could re-combine the BA's and DA's as they were in the ORIGINAL Angels of Death codex, but SWs are too unique and have almost no "over-lapping" units.

Grey Knight + Inquisition works, possible with Sisters, but only after plastic sisters get released.....so never.

Eldar + Harlequins, Dark Eldar + Corsairs
Nids + GSC

Unfortunately, this will never happen. GW has put itself in a position that is has too many books and sources out to have 1 book replace 2-3. They like it this way, not only to make you buy more books, but to provide "more variety in ways to play your minis"

--

riiighhht so Space Marine Chapters are more diverse than a combination of Grey Knights, Inquisition and Sisters of Battle...........
More diverse than Eldar and Harlequins...........

nope - not really, there are some signature units for Chapters........and increasingly "flavour" (with a bad taste) units and conjured up - wolves riding wolves etc but most of these can be done with simple unit options:

So you can have a cavalry option for non codex adherent chapters, An Elite Jump Infantry option.
Add an option for tactical squads to take close combat weapons for a cost
Combine tactical and assault terminator squads - cos why not.........
etc etc

Its really not hard and could be done in at most two books..........and you would have customisable marine armies

I would combine the core units of SM in a main book and have supplements for each Legion that contain their unique units, objectives, psychic powers, rules etc.

Same for Ork Klans, Eldar Craftworlds, Chaos legions, etc etc.

Also the rules for everyone (core, faction, supplement) need to be extremely cheap or available for free.

That's how I would do it personally.

Will never happen of course, because you've just got to buy some expensive books that encompass all of the faction, even the parts you don't really care for.

 Frozocrone wrote:
I would combine the core units of SM in a main book and have supplements for each Legion that contain their unique units, objectives, psychic powers, rules etc.

Same for Ork Klans, Eldar Craftworlds, Chaos legions, etc etc.

Also the rules for everyone (core, faction, supplement) need to be extremely cheap or available for free.

That's how I would do it personally.

Will never happen of course, because you've just got to buy some expensive books that encompass all of the faction, even the parts you don't really care for.

Sounds good - and we do that now anyway

Why the hell are Sisters rolled up with the Inquisition even though they have no ties to it in the fluff? Or is this just a matter of "eh I don't know about them, so screw it, I'll be lazy".

 curran12 wrote:
Why the hell are Sisters rolled up with the Inquisition even though they have no ties to it in the fluff? Or is this just a matter of "eh I don't know about them, so screw it, I'll be lazy".

It would seem so along with

The Space Marine Chapters are all so special and so very different and unique, oh wait When you compare them to the vast diversity of the Imperial Guard its pretty laughable....

 curran12 wrote:
Why the hell are Sisters rolled up with the Inquisition even though they have no ties to it in the fluff? Or is this just a matter of "eh I don't know about them, so screw it, I'll be lazy".

Partly because the Ecclesiarchy and the Ordo Hereticus are at least loosely linked, and partly because the old Witch Hunters codex put the two together, mainly. Otherwise, I'd agree, they should be off to the side: they're as likely to act independently or in support of the Guard as they are to act with the Inquisition.

I would agree that a core book then the supplement is the way to go.
Common equipment stat rules and vehicles, I hate it when Rhinos or Razorbacks have different points values.

Supplements should focus on that flavor army specific items, characters and fluff stories.
It would then state what armies the supplement can be used with.

Space Marines core book with all the common equipment.
Supplements for all the differing chapters.
Yes, that includes Deathwatch (makes sense since ANY chapter can join).
This may be odd but I think Chaos Space Marines should be a VERY large supplement (keep all the marine equipment common).

All the various Mechanicus stuff really has no reason to be separate including some Imperial Knight rules.
Speaking of IK, it should be a supplement, an add-on to a codex (many), not to have their own... some may not agree.

I still think separating daemons from CSM was a mistake.
BUT have Daemons as the primary book and use the CSM "supplement" I proposed with these guys.

One big Inquisition book for all their flavors.
Suppliments are Grey Knights, Sisters of Battle, Deathwatch and Tempestus Scions.
Before I see the complaining of the SOB they ARE assigned to Inquisition's Ordo Hereticus.
They are card carrying members of the "Chamber Militant" which are all the groups I listed.

Eldar could be used as the primary.
Dark Eldar, Harlequin and various craftworld flavors as suppliements.

Tau, well, they are pretty much set how they are.

Orks, the various factions they have could be spun-off in interesting ways, that should be done.
I would really like to see some proper rules for looting by the Deathskulls.
Plus Blood Axes to be discussed later...

Necrons... not sure.
I suppose some of them could be separated between "kill them all" or "subjugate, then seek "volunteers" to join the ranks".

Tyranid: I really think some slight differences between each Hive would be awesome.
Could add a "proper" gene-stealer cult supplement that can be used here and...

Imperial Guard! Primary book will be a beast.
Supplements... gene-stealer cult I think would be awesome, Tempestus Scions, some Forgeworld books.
Blood-Axes! Yes! The more organized Orks that like to march around and have "propah" tanks.
Deathskulls! So they can loot at will... though this may need to attach to other main codex's (all primary other than Tyranid, or CAN they loot EVERYTHING???)

<whew!> I hate to say I was rather excited of how this mix would work.
By this method no little add-on group gets left behind on major updates.
How to keep it all sane, easy to update and still get the various faction flavors everyone wants/needs with a little allies stuff going on.
You do not need a bloody allies list: if the supplement lists it, it is yours to play with.