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Made in gb
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Et In Arcadia Ego





Canterbury

No no, not Timecube, calm down.


http://phys.org/news/2016-09-crystals.html


(Phys.org)—Are time crystals just a mathematical curiosity, or could they actually physically exist? Physicists have been debating this question since 2012, when Nobel laureate Frank Wilczek first proposed the idea of time crystals. He argued that these hypothetical objects can exhibit periodic motion, such as moving in a circular orbit, in their state of lowest energy, or their "ground state." Theoretically, objects in their ground states don't have enough energy to move at all.

In the years since, other physicists have proposed various arguments for why the physical existence of time crystals is impossible—and most physicists do seem to think that time crystals are physically impossible because of their odd properties. Even though time crystals couldn't be used to generate useful energy (since disturbing them makes them stop moving), and don't violate the second law of thermodynamics, they do violate a fundamental symmetry of the laws of physics.
However, now in a new paper published in Physical Review Letters, physicists from the University of California, Santa Barbara (UCSB) and Microsoft Station Q (a Microsoft research lab located on the UCSB campus) have demonstrated that it may be possible for time crystals to physically exist.
The physicists have focused on the implication of time crystals that seems most surprising, which is that time crystals are predicted to spontaneously break a fundamental symmetry called "time-translation symmetry." To understand what this means, the researchers explain what spontaneous symmetry breaking is.
"The crucial difference here is between explicit symmetry breaking and spontaneous symmetry breaking," coauthor Dominic Else, a physicist at UCSB, told Phys.org. "If a symmetry is broken explicitly, then the laws of nature do not have the symmetry anymore; spontaneous symmetry breaking means that the laws of nature have a symmetry, but nature chooses a state that doesn't."
If time crystals really do spontaneously break time-translation symmetry, then the laws of nature that govern time crystals wouldn't change with time, but the time crystals themselves would change over time due to their ground-state motion, spontaneously breaking the symmetry.
Although spontaneously broken time-translation symmetry has never been observed before, almost every other type of spontaneous symmetry breaking has been. One very common example of a spontaneously broken symmetry occurs in magnets. The laws of nature do not impose which side of a magnet will be the north pole and which will be the south pole. The distinguishing feature of any magnetic material, however, is that it spontaneously breaks this symmetry and chooses one side to be the north pole. Another example is ordinary crystals. Although the laws of nature are invariant under rotating or shifting (translating) space, crystals spontaneously break these spatial symmetries because they look different when viewed from different angles and when shifted a little bit in space.

In their new study, the physicists specifically define what it would take to spontaneously break time-translation symmetry, and then use simulations to predict that this broken symmetry should occur in a large class of quantum systems called "Floquet-many-body-localized driven systems." The scientists explain that the key aspect of these systems is that they remain far from thermal equilibrium at all times, so the system never heats up.
The new definition of broken time-translation symmetry is similar to the definitions of other broken symmetries. Basically, when the size of a system (such as a crystal) grows, the time taken for a symmetry-breaking state to decay into a symmetry-respecting state increases, and in an infinite system the symmetry-respecting state can never be reached. As a result, symmetry for the entire system is broken.
"The significance of our work is two-fold: on one hand, it demonstrates that time-translation symmetry is not immune to being spontaneously broken," said coauthor Bela Bauer, a researcher at Microsoft Station Q. "On the other hand, it deepens our understanding that non-equilibrium systems can host many interesting states of matter that cannot exist in equilibrium systems."
According to the physicists, it should be possible to perform an experiment to observe time-translation symmetry breaking by using a large system of trapped atoms, trapped ions, or superconducting qubits to fabricate a time crystal, and then measure how these systems evolve over time. The scientists predict that the systems will exhibit the periodic, oscillating motion that is characteristic of time crystals and indicative of spontaneously broken time-translation symmetry.
"In collaboration with experimental research groups, we are exploring the possibility of realizing Floquet time crystals in systems of cold atomic gases," said coauthor Chetan Nayak at Microsoft Station Q and UCSB.




...glad we cleared that one up then eh !/


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I feel stupid today, and didnt understand any of that.

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Way to early for this...

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So tl;dr things may exist that do stuff by themselves which would be amazing but if they just kind of did stuff by themselves it would only be interesting?

   
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This is why I hate physics damnit. It's like concentrated migraine.

   
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Every time I read an article like this I'm more convinced that there's a segment of the scientific community sniggering madly while they just make crap up, waiting for somebody to finally call BS on their ever-more outlandish conjectures.

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"If a symmetry is broken explicitly, then the laws of nature do not have the symmetry anymore; spontaneous symmetry breaking means that the laws of nature have a symmetry, but nature chooses a state that doesn't."

So... nature makes choices? Does that mean it is sentient?

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Richard O'Brien had a whole maze full of time crystals in the 90's. That's all the proof I need.

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For the quantitatively challenged, where's the 'Bill Nye the Science Guy' explanation for this?
   
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 Orlanth wrote:
I feel stupid today, and didnt understand any of that.


To be fair I don't think that many physicists would really understand what's going on either, maybe just the base principles, because you'd need to be quite deep in the theory to understand what's going on.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
 SlaveToDorkness wrote:
Every time I read an article like this I'm more convinced that there's a segment of the scientific community sniggering madly while they just make crap up, waiting for somebody to finally call BS on their ever-more outlandish conjectures.


It's all a simulation at the moment, no direct data to prove it either way. Once in a blue moon these outlandish theories do find something and that moves science forward. A lot come to nothing, so it depends on what you mean by 'making crap up' because that is what scientists are paid to do!

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2016/09/10 21:33:21


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Okay what are time crystalsand if they existed what use there could be for them? First i heard of them

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So, from what I gather, time crystals are effectively perpetuum mobiles. In their lowest energy state, they still move. Thats it. But they cant actually move anything else, so you cant harness that motion for anything useful. So basically, theyre just a neat little idea without a lot of useful applications.
   
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tneva82 wrote:
Okay what are time crystalsand if they existed what use there could be for them? First i heard of them
I think it is just a fancy way of describing a quartz watch.
   
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 BigWaaagh wrote:
For the quantitatively challenged, where's the 'Bill Nye the Science Guy' explanation for this?
Imagine a perfectly symmetrical ball, balanced on top of an upturned salad bowl (also perfectly symmetrical). The system (ball and bowl) is in a perfect state of equilibrium (a bit like a ground state). It is also perfectly symmetrical (ball on top of bowl from every angle). But then, "spontaneously", the ball rolls off and ends up on the floor next to the bowl (to one side). Even though the ball is still symmetrical, and the bowl is still symmetrical, the resulting system is asymmetrical. This kind of spontaneous symmetry breaking happens in things like crystals and magnets, and causes them to be asymmetrical, even though the forces acting on them are symmetrical.

The time crystal is an analogous concept but in 4 dimensions, so instead of breaking three dimensional spacial symmetry, it breaks four dimensional "time-translation symmetry", meaning that it might "spontaneously" change while in its ground state, even though the forces acting on it don't change (stay symmetrical). Which is just another way of saying that its ground state changes over time (a bit like the ball spontaneously rolling back up on top of the bowl). From our point of view, it would be moving without energy, but also without violating the second law of thermodynamics (like a sneaky loophole in the laws of physics).

With that in mind, hopefully the rest of the article will fall into place.



This message was edited 4 times. Last update was at 2016/09/12 03:59:36


 
   
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I read it and it is crystal clear to me

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 Jehan-reznor wrote:
I read it and it is crystal clear to me
So...
Explain away

It just sounds as though someone saw a thing, thought it might do something odd, and someone else backed them up.
... without breaking the universe, to do something no-one will ever notice.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2016/09/12 13:46:03


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One man's "not provable either way" is another man's "bs". Lol

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Basically, very weird stuff happens at very low temperatures.

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I like this stuff in tv shows, because they wow me with lots of computer visuals that give me a feeling that I understand what they're talking about, when actually I have no real idea what they're talking about.

When I read it in text, either the OP or Smacks answer, there is nothing there to distract from the reality that I have no idea what they're talking about.

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My brain, it just froze while trying to think how any of this makes any sense to a normal human being.

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That's.... difficult for my brain to work its way around. I need much, much more coffee.
   
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So basicly some weird kind of molecular tesseracts???
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 Compel wrote:
Compel at 18: Advanced Higher Physics. "I like physics, physics is great, I want to study this at uni.

Compel at 19: End of first year of university. Duuuuhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh.... *Bit of drool falls onto the desk.*

Compel at 19.25: "I like biology, biology is great."


I had a similar experience with math. Was planning on being a math/comp sci double major. Got to the point in math where I think I could theoretically plot a safe course though hyperpspace (n-dimentional vector matrix calculus) but there was zero real world application, and my brain started to try to escape my skull to make the pain stop. So I scrubbed that plan.

   
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It reminds me of all the times some quantum or string theorist would describe some amazingly bizarre thing that could be happening right now, but that we couldn't observe because it didn't interact with our world of experience in any meaningful way. As a Pure Math major, I would just smile and say, "That's cute."

   
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 A Town Called Malus wrote:
Basically, very weird stuff happens at very low temperatures.


Yeah, I wouldn't say I understand any of that except "When gak gets really fething cold, gak gets really fething weird!"

*imagine my hands waving lamely as I say that*

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I found a time crystal once, but Ganon tried to take it away from me. I shoved the Master Sword up his ass as revenge.

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