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So to be frank, I noticed in the "magnus is OP" thread, a few people keep referencing pink horrors being way worse. I've never played against them, but my curiosity has been peaked. So what the deal with pink horrors? Like, explain it barney style please ha.

Pink Horrors now split into two Blue Horrors (Pink Horrors with S2 T2) when they die, on a one-to-two basis. And Blue Horrors split into one two-wound Brimstone Horror (S1, T1).

Which means a single 9 point Pink Horror has effectively 4 wounds (1 for the Pink, 2 for the Blue, 1 for the Brimstone (since it gets doubled out by almost everything. But against Dark Eldar, it's two wounds matter!)) and has to be killed in three separate phases to actually see it dead.

And which seems to have no restriction on placing models if quotes pasted are true. Somebody shot bunch of pink horrors? You can kongoline blue horrors toward your opponents deployment zone! Blue horror unit must be put within 6". Not FULLY within so as long as one blue horror is within 6" of pink horrors that split into blue horrors you are fair game.

Shooting at pink horrors could be seriously bad idea in many situations...

tneva82 wrote:
And which seems to have no restriction on placing models if quotes pasted are true. Somebody shot bunch of pink horrors? You can kongoline blue horrors toward your opponents deployment zone! Blue horror unit must be put within 6". Not FULLY within so as long as one blue horror is within 6" of pink horrors that split into blue horrors you are fair game.

Shooting at pink horrors could be seriously bad idea in many situations...

That's one of those RAW things that no sane opponent (or TO) would let you do.

 JNAProductions wrote:

That's one of those RAW things that no sane opponent (or TO) would let you do.

Well, they kinda allowed it to necron scarabs, didn't they?

 koooaei wrote:

 JNAProductions wrote:

That's one of those RAW things that no sane opponent (or TO) would let you do.

Well, they kinda allowed it to necron scarabs, didn't they?

Eh it's different. The Scarab spawn rule is just place a scarab in coherency of a unit but if you have multiple Spyders you spawn a scarab one at a time so would be an already officially part of the unit when you go to attach another one and thus you can place in coherency to it.

For Split though you add all the models at the same time

Pink horrors received what amounts to, in the worst case for the daemon player, a 3x increase in durability for no extra points. They were already surprisingly tough (5+ or better invulnerable, really 1s, ignore morale but can go to ground).

But that's in the worst case.

Daemon players know that there is really very little difference between 1 horror and 10 horrors. They both do the job of providing warp charges and holding objectives. And so GW has given pink horrors now the ability to spawn little units of blur horrors. Which are identical to pink horrors in terms of generating warp charges and holding objectives.

So that happens is that if you shoot some pink horrors and don't wipe them out, they actually get BETTER at their job: there are now two units on objectives, generating twice the warp charge.

And the more times you try to damage them, the better they get. If you take 3 turns to wipe out 10 horrors cowering in ruins, they're now generating 3 warp charge instead of 1. And now each of those units does the same thing again!

The timing when the new units are placed matters a lot too, because it prevents you from engaging effectively with the spawned unit. It also allows the daemon player to protect the bigger unit by creating blocks that prevent assaults.

You can now summon on a unit of 10 pink horrors that is at least 50 wounds to get through, needs to be killed in 3 separate phases, and if it doesn't die completely on one phase you're screwed because you just made it stronger.

Horrors are now a magnificent tar pit, as they can just keep throwing models in to the fray. You also can't totally avoid it, as they have a few ways of deliberately hurting themselves...

Horrors just became a unit you want to avoid engaging at all costs.

In terms of lore, they suits perfectly now.
not just because they split like on classic description and lore of them... now they really allow awake the desesperation and "horror" of face a demon true horde xDD

The better one can do is ignote the pink horrors. Especially if there are an herald with the new relic (4 blues per pink dead).

Also think that the portal to try summon pinks horrors each turn will be interesting now

I'd not mind if they had their squad numbers shrinked and points increased. That'd be a cool mechanic if they were like 20 ppm and started at, say, 5-strong squads up to 9 strong squads. 2 WC for 9.

Thankfully at the very least they have a weakness.
It doesn't overcome the fact that they are now crazy efficient scorers and a nightmare of a unit to face.

This so called weakness: Daemonic Instability. Models removed as a result of it don't cause new models to spawn, so you need to get in combat with them ASAP with a decent assault unit and bash them about and get them to lose combat. If they fail the Instability test by enough to be destroyed entirely, no Blue Horrors/Brimstone Horrors are split off.


At least they lost specific access to Malefic, so they're no "Summon Bloodthirster, spawn Blue Horror unit" shenanigans.

Don't forget the most important thing, it means you now have to buy an extra 2 boxes of Horrors for every squad you buy and paint them blue!

On top of the extras you have to buy if you're summoning as well.

I can see Tzeentch-heavy daemon players turning up to tournaments with wheelbarrows full of horrors

Whether or not they lost malefic remains to be seen. The current horrors don't have it on their profile either, and GWs FAW says that all daemon psykers know it even if not on their profile.

The instability weakness is a bit unclear. It very easily be interpreted that only a roll of 12 generates 0 horrors.

That is correct only a roll of 12. If you are scared, you should be. I laugh at the fact people wanna cry about this rule and try and make it less awesome. Deal with it. Most of these players are probably eldar or loyalist

indeed, heretics followers of false Gods! xD


Enemies of the Dark Gods, beware!

It's saddening that the most frightening thing to come out of the warp isn't the chaos gods, mutants, heretics, or daemon prince primarchs, but PINK FLIPPIN' HORRORS.

The quality of the rule writing coming out of GW these days is mind blowing.

I'm sure they're laughing all the way to the bank as players buy three boxes of horrors for every one unit they want to field.

As a Tau player. It is the first unit I've seen where the opposing player is screaming, 'SHOOT THEM! Mua ha ha ha.'

And as a Tau player, can I ask another question?

Do summoned or spawned(calved?) psychic units have powers, or just warp dice?

Depends if they are psychics or not. If they are psychics....minimum they have daemonology because FAQs unless they have an specific rule saying that can not generate any power

AFAIK the lesser horrors are brotherhood of sorceress with change powers.

So, it's something?

Mostly a psychic generator than am actual threat.

 BoomWolf wrote:
AFAIK the lesser horrors are brotherhood of sorceress with change powers.

So, it's something?

Mostly a psychic generator than am actual threat.

Ultimate scoring vs shooty armies. If you shoot them, they only multiply making it even harder to remove them + adding extra psy dice. And i'm still not sure about inability to cogno-line.

 koooaei wrote:

 BoomWolf wrote:
AFAIK the lesser horrors are brotherhood of sorceress with change powers.

So, it's something?

Mostly a psychic generator than am actual threat.

Ultimate scoring vs shooty armies. If you shoot them, they only multiply making it even harder to remove them + adding extra psy dice. And i'm still not sure about inability to cogno-line.

Well the congo line remains to be seen for tournament organizers. As written it's pretty clearly allowed. Is pretty nuts so maybe GW with their improved FAQ service will fix it or tournament organizers might fix as a last hope.

You actually cannot "congo-line" them as each MODEL must be added within 6" of the Pink horror unit they split from. This is different than Scarabs that can be added to a unit that is within range. The spyder producing them on needs to be in range to add Scarabs, but with Split, the models must be added within 6"
You also MUST place new models in an existing unit if there is one within that range. You only create a new unit if one is not in 6". So it should be rare than 1 unit splits into 3+ new ones.

I don't think we have seen the actual screen shot of Pink Horrors yet, so they very well may be more than 9ppm, but I doubt they would be more than 10 or 11ppm.
We do know that Blues are 5ppm and Brimstones are 3ppm.
Blues and Brimstones are Brotherhood Psykers (so WC 1) and Blues are WC2 if 11+ models

The issue right now is that GW does not sell Blues & Brimstones separately. And you need a bunch, so piece-mealing them together from the Silver Tower set will be a pain
Even though Blues are smaller than Pinks, most will just get Pinks and paint them blue. The Brimstone horrors are another matter.
I suspect most Tourneys to rule that if you do not have models to accurately represent them, you won't be able to use the rule

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Nelson Mechanized wrote:
So to be frank, I noticed in the "magnus is OP" thread, a few people keep referencing pink horrors being way worse. I've never played against them, but my curiosity has been peaked. So what the deal with pink horrors? Like, explain it barney style please ha.

Piqued, not peaked.

My crew tends to hold people to WYSIWYG. There are existing Blue Horror and Brimstone Horror models. If you want to make use of your Split ability, I expect you to have the appropriate models. Pink Horror and Blue Horror models look basically the same, so we'd allow using the same models. The Brimstone Horrors look totally different, so we'd expect you to have Brimstone Horror models. Currently, that means spending 150 USD to pick up a Silver Tower box for 4x Brimstone Horrors. That's 150 USD per Pink Horror you want to split. Not even remotely manageable.

I plan on converting Brimstone Horrors. 2 Dryad heads per base floating on greenstuff flames and painted as flames themselves should suffice. Especially since my Pink (and now repainted Blue) Horrors are converted using Lizardmen Skink bodies with Dryad heads & arms. I made them before the current plastic kit was available.

I like the rule and am excited to use it, but it don't plan on spamming Pinks. I used to run 2x 11, but now I'll rarely do more than 16 total just due to the massive amount of models it requires.

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It's a very fluffy rule, but feels very unbalanced considering the points. Time will tell, but Pink Horrors probably just became the best objective holders in the game. Literally takes 3 full phases to kill one unit assuming you can wipe the entire unit each phase. Realistically, it'll probably take an entire game's worth of shooting to kill a large unit.

 Kriswall wrote:
Literally takes 3 full phases to kill one unit assuming you can wipe the entire unit each phase. Realistically, it'll probably take an entire game's worth of shooting to kill a large unit.

I would make the argument that it you can kill the entire unit in 1 phase, the Blue horrors are split "immediately" and don't what until the end of the phase. Making it possible to take out every model in the same phase if you have an insane amount of firepower to do it,

Or you charge the Pinks, kill all but a few models and make them fail an Instability test, which specifically prevents splitting if it removes the unit. If you wipe them in CC, they still split, but if Instability wipes them out, no splitting.

I also keep seeing people mention that you can only get blues from the WQ: ST game, but don't forget you get three in the chariot box; which can be split for 1 exalted flamer, 3 blues, one herald on disc and two screamers. That's a pretty hefty haul in one $40 box. Considering 3 screamers is $30, a herald on disc in finecast is $40, and there is no other way for exalted Flamers. Go wild. That box will likely never be used for chariots again.

 Galef wrote:

 Kriswall wrote:
Literally takes 3 full phases to kill one unit assuming you can wipe the entire unit each phase. Realistically, it'll probably take an entire game's worth of shooting to kill a large unit.

I would make the argument that it you can kill the entire unit in 1 phase, the Blue horrors are split "immediately" and don't what until the end of the phase. Making it possible to take out every model in the same phase if you have an insane amount of firepower to do it,

Or you charge the Pinks, kill all but a few models and make them fail an Instability test, which specifically prevents splitting if it removes the unit. If you wipe them in CC, they still split, but if Instability wipes them out, no splitting.

It's my understanding that the only time you place the Blues "immediately" is if the entire unit is removed as a casualty (other than instability). Otherwise, the Blues are set up at the end of the phase. The best way to eliminate Horrors, to me, is either to sweep them in melee (and I'm not 100% sure that won't just result in an immediate set-up) or, as you mentioned, forcing an Instability check.

The issue with both the Chariot and WQ: ST is that neither gives you a significant amount of Blue Horrors.
Sure the Chariot is a good buy and 4 boxes would get you 8 Screamers, 4 Ex Flamers and 4 Disc Heralds, but you'd only get 12 Blues, which is not enough to split 1 box of Pinks.
I really doubt even a dedicated Tzeentch Player would get more than 4-5 Chariot boxes.

GW absolutely needs to make a box with 10 Blues & 10 Brimstones. It will sell like hot cakes


Edit: @ EnTyme: you are right that Blues split "immediately" only if the entire unit it removed. Which is why killing them all in combat is a bad idea. You want some survivors to take the Instability test.
And btw, Daemons can never be swept in combat, that is what Instability replaces, although I think you just meant killing them all.
Also remember that "a rule that removes the entire unit" can simply be doing enough wounds that the unit is removed. After all the BRB is called "Warhammer 40,000: THE RULES"
I think everyone keeps confusing that line for a "special" rule that removes the unit. No such wording exists

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Wouldn't another weakness to these guys be any weapon or psychic spell or whatever that removes from tabletop or from play instead of outright wounding?