Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you: No adverts like this in the forums anymore. Times and dates in your local timezone. Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance. Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely. Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net. If you are already a member then feel free to login now.

Hey guys so for christmass since I just got the new house in november I decided I will throw all my money into the kids. Well Christmas is gone so I built 4 cabinets for some clients and now my wife said go for it and I am thinking of ordering 3 baneblade tanks. "sorry thats all that I ever known them as.

So here is the question my friend has 2 reaver titans a few warhounds and the others are no better. We use atleast 1 super heavy a game, since we play usually at each others house the games usually take a week or 2 to finish. But I am beating around the bush here, the real question is with so many super heavies what tank output would be the best? The stormblade looks pretty cool so I think thats one of them. Any other suggestions?

Or would it be better to go tyranid and try to swarm them? Both armies have lots of love from the bottom of my heart.

None of the above. Putting big expensive targets on the table against titans is a great way to lose the game. They out-gun you by a huge margin at the same point investment (450 for a Shadowsword, 750 for a Warhound with four times the firepower) and your big single-model targets maximize the effectiveness of those multi-shot D-weapons. You beat titans by either bringing your own titans, killing them with a dedicated turn-1 alpha strike (mass melta/grav pods, etc), or spamming so much MSU that they can't possibly kill it all before the game ends.

As much as I like the Tyranid aesthetic, I can't see them standing a chance against titans - they can barely stand against most armies as is :(.

Shadowsword by the fluff was designed as a titan killer with the Volcano Cannon, but that's about as far as my Baneblade knowledge goes, sorry.

If you really want a tank rather than your own titan then the best bet is the Mechanicums Ordinatus Ulator, is tough enough to survive multiple D shots turn 1 and its sonic cannon is pretty filthy.

 Stormonu wrote:
As much as I like the Tyranid aesthetic, I can't see them standing a chance against titans - they can barely stand against most armies as is :(.

They could, just, like, evolve an acid that eats through Titan armor.

Then work it into, like, every biomorph they expect to go up against Titans. Even the little ones, like Rippers.

Then just melt the Titan to death. It can't stop ALL of them.

 Pouncey wrote:

 Stormonu wrote:
As much as I like the Tyranid aesthetic, I can't see them standing a chance against titans - they can barely stand against most armies as is :(.

They could, just, like, evolve an acid that eats through Titan armor.

Then work it into, like, every biomorph they expect to go up against Titans. Even the little ones, like Rippers.

Then just melt the Titan to death. It can't stop ALL of them.

Think they meant ruleswise.

I'm a big fan of the superheavy tanks and while what people here say is totally true in effectiveness rankings,

they do fine in that nitch below apoc games where you can take a LOW but before everyone starts with big titans.

I find if my list has enough anti-armor, I take a stormlord to use as something to mow down infantry, be a bunker, and also wreck bikes/light transports. open topped is fun!

If I need just more firepower, I perfer a Hellhammer. that ignore cover has helped me so so much. The regular baneblade cannon is too much range for a standard table.
The volcano cannon on the shadowblade seems cool with D but again, just doesn't have volume of fire. It can make for an OK bullet magnet though. People have an unnatural fear of D but it's not as scary as it seems

Point for point it would probably be more efficient to haywire a titan to death, looking at you Skitarii.

Although my math is pretty lacklustre so may be wrong.

OgreChubbs 712787 9108457 wrote: nullthe real question is with so many super heavies what tank output would be the best?

Why not build them all? The Baneblade kit can be magnetized to build all variants in the box if you're not afraid of some work. Several tutorials about it out there. :-)

My personal favourite is the Stormlord; it's a phenomenally shenanigansy thing to do, but if you're playing with lots of superheavies anyway you can park Severin Loth behind it, make it invisible, and use it as a semi-mobile bunker for mass quantities of heavy weapons.

Also in less shenanigansy games it's less overarmed than most superheavies, and depending on your interpretation of 'doesn't have the open-topped rule but is treated as open-topped for purposes of embarking and disembarking' (paraphrased) it can be a funny general-purpose vehicle for wandering around the board carrying most of an army and engaging in over-the-top drive-by shootings.

For the same cost as a banebalde variant, you could have an allied SM detatchment with a divination librarian, min scouts and a 9 man sternguard squad all with combi meltas and a drop pod. That'll work 9 times out of 10 instead of the 1/18 times you take a shadowsword, go first, don't scatter off wildly and roll a 6 for damage. Librarius conclave and 1st co detatchment can up your game even further while also being pretty great against against every other target you care to name, but at that point, you're not really playing guard anymore.

As to which variant I'd build, the Shadowsword certainly looks the business aesthetically, but mechanically, the Hellhammer's 36" range, 7" str10 AP2 ignores cover blast will definately ruin most things day and the follow up demolisher shell probably won't be gratefully recieved either. There's a very short list of things that aren't phased by str10 AP2 ignores cover and the list narrows significantly further with some monster hunting lascannon teams nearby or some vendettas flying around.

I'm on 3 baneblade variants and a reaver (also a marauder but it's not worth including), and have this to say:

Titans beat everything, and the bigger titan you have, the more beating you get to do. They are also an absolute joy to build and paint.

The baneblade variants slot into a 'high risk removal system', not an army destroyer. If you play them that way, and with the understanding that they will *generally* be underwhelming at the apocalypse level, you won't be disappointed.

The alpha strike problem is real and serious. The best way i've fond to mitigate it is Master of the fleet + comms relay and put in reserve. it occasionally allows it do actually do more damage than it would with the full 5 turns of shooting by thunderblitzing a deepstruck unit in your deployment zone, then getting its main cannon/s off.

I've found that their value is in providing the biggest and strongest ignores cover attacks IG and possibly the imperium can take, in the form of the Stormsword and Hellhammer. The shadow sword, bizarrely, is more useful for its sponsons.

If you honestly want to kill the Reaver then bring all three Shadowswords because you will need them. And do not deploy them together - leave at least 18" between each of them (preferably 25") to avoid a chain reaction if one of them is knocked out. Make sure they are deployed in cover and exploit the rules in the IA book to allow you to take Camo Gear on each of them (seriously, that +1 cover save could be all the difference). Finally, before you open fire with them use your other units armed with anything of S7 or above to bring its void shields down, up to and including the sponson mounted Lascannons on your Shadowswords themselves. THEN open fire with the Volcano Cannons. Assuming you go first you should be able to get an average of 9 HP off the Reaver with the Volcano cannons alone, or if you score a '6' (1/4 chance) your hit will most likely bring it down.

Alternatively, I personally prefer the Stormsword with its 36" S10 AP1 10" pieplate ignores cover goodness as it makes my Marine playing opponent cry foul.

When a Baneblade is the largest thing on the table it can do a lot of damage (and be a massive fire magnet).

When there are bigger things than a Baneblade on the Table (such as Titans), then it does not preform as well as the giants above it. It lacks the sheer firepower of a Titan, and armor.

The Baneblade lives in the weird middle zone between "apocalypse" and "normal" (for lack of a term).

For example, a Shadowsword can shoot a single D attack, but a Reaver can shoot like what? 8? or something with all turbolasers? A Baneblade with extra sponsons can throw a lot of "little" shots but large templates is about 2 (the main gun and the demolisher) and that's it. A Warhound can throw up more than that easy. A Reaver? well... its like double the templates if not more if built right.

If anything, I would personally consider a baneblade as support to a Titan, but while it can kill a titan (with luck), but it cannot contend with one in a one on one engagement.

A Reaver with both the Gatling Blasters and a Turbolaser Carapace mount can throw twelve S8 AP3 pieplates and two SD AP1 pieplates out to around 96".

 Engine of War wrote:

If anything, I would personally consider a baneblade as support to a Titan, but while it can kill a titan (with luck), but it cannot contend with one in a one on one engagement.

This.

BB and variants should be shooting at threats to the titan that the titan would over kill.