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Do we have evidence this will happen for sure?

In short?

No.

Cypher will kill abbadon, but that's about it.

Cypher will kill 350 pages in a spin off novel and shoot a few sergeants, no-name mooks, maybe a Chaos Warlord. Abbadon and the Emperor will remain as is.

 Jackal wrote:
Cypher will kill abbadon, but that's about it.

you think Cypher will be the one to kill Abaddon and not Roboute?

Typical GW. Make people wait a decade for a new Abaddon model, release it in a kit that makes you buy 2 other models, then kill him in the accompanying book.

I have read the rumors and have little doubt this is what they are planning to do. Maybe they can make it less painless by keeping him as the tiniest Chaos Warlord in the range, so we won't want the model on the table.

Roboute will be more concerned with structuring the defences and planning than to directly launch into battle.
First and foremost he is a strategist.

If I had to lay money on it I'd say cypher without a shadow of a doubt.

 Jackal wrote:
Roboute will be more concerned with structuring the defences and planning to directly launch into battle.
First and foremost he is a strategist.

If I had to lay money on it I'd say cypher without a shadow of a doubt.

do you think GW has long term plans with Roboute

or will this event be a one in done type thing like Vulkan in Beast Arises?

I see roboute running things from a military standpoint afterwards.
But once the plot reaches a conclusion time will freeze again with the fluff.

 Jackal wrote:
I see roboute running things from a military standpoint afterwards.
But once the plot reaches a conclusion time will freeze again with the fluff.

true


I still think Cypher's main goal, and have always said, his main goal was to destroy the corpse of the Emperor so he can be released from the golden throne and reborn

the whole star child thing

LightKing wrote:

 Jackal wrote:
Roboute will be more concerned with structuring the defences and planning to directly launch into battle.
First and foremost he is a strategist.

If I had to lay money on it I'd say cypher without a shadow of a doubt.

do you think GW has long term plans with Roboute

or will this event be a one in done type thing like Vulkan in Beast Arises?

My bet will be that when all is done in regards to the 13th BC and Robute has given the HLoT a sharp rap on the knuckles, then he'll set off into the Eye of Terror/Webway/Galaxy at large to find Russ, Corax, Vulkan, Khan, Lion and (possibly) Dorn. Hence, he is 'alive' when they need him, but otherwise pre-occupied in the background - just like the other Loyalist Primarchs.

Either that, or he'll play an active role, but as a lone Primarch with little technical knowledge (Compared to Vulkan, Manus or Perturabo), the technological state of the Imperium will still be degrading (Including the Golden Throne) and his administrative skills can't alter that too much. Similarly, he can't be everywhere at once to turn the tide of every war the Imperium is involved in. TLDR, they'll find some way to tone his galaxy-changing revival down. Of course, he may end up dead in a Game of Thrones style twist...

LightKing wrote:

 Jackal wrote:
I see roboute running things from a military standpoint afterwards.
But once the plot reaches a conclusion time will freeze again with the fluff.

true


I still think Cypher's main goal, and have always said, his main goal was to destroy the corpse of the Emperor so he can be released from the golden throne and reborn

the whole star child thing

When was the last time the Star Child theory was mentioned in the lore?

LightKing wrote:

 Jackal wrote:
I see roboute running things from a military standpoint afterwards.
But once the plot reaches a conclusion time will freeze again with the fluff.

true


I still think Cypher's main goal, and have always said, his main goal was to destroy the corpse of the Emperor so he can be released from the golden throne and reborn

the whole star child thing

One problem with that idea. It assumes Emperor himself is unaware that he would be reborn. After all golden throne was set up to support him by his orders. He WANTED the golden throne in place so he would presumably be pretty pissed off at the idea of being released from it.

Well albeit unless they write it so that 10k years in the throne was neccessary before release. Maybe that.

I also think it will be the main reason.

It's just a theory but what if Cypher knows that Emperor is perpetual and that killing him will bring upon his Resurrection few days later.

Guilliman possibly knows this because of Vulkan as he was together with him for a while after the Heresy ended. So he may assist Cypher with this, fully knowing that death of his dad will also mean his rebirth.

The main question here, in my opinion, is how muhc OP will the Emperor be when he returns? Unlike his 30k version ( which is already OP as hell ) he is now worshiped by untold billions and had thousand of psyker souls sacrificed to him, every day, ever since he was put to the Throne. Because we know how he was created ( fusing of souls of said sacrificed psykers ) the logical conclusion here is that these souls also fused with his own. So....... OP much?

All in all we won't know this for sure until GW decides to reveal that part to us. WHat I know for certain is that they indeed have been building to this event ever since 6'th edition was released with every other codex fluff since then.

re the long term plans, given GW has released a Gulliman mini, I suspect he won't just be a "one and done" situation. the third book in gathering storm is titled "Rise of the primarch" this choice to me suggests Gulliman may in fact rise to a powerful position once he returns. it also suggests that given that name, he may be the only loyalist primarch returning. (which BTW I HOPE isn't the case. the Lion at the very least not returning would be an injustice to dark angels)

For all we know the HLOT and some mechanicum know Big Easy is a perpetual. The Throne has probably been killing him over and over since his interment on it.

Those millions of psykers being burnt out everyday could be helping keep Emps chained to his chair.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

BrianDavion wrote:
re the long term plans, given GW has released a Gulliman mini, I suspect he won't just be a "one and done" situation. the third book in gathering storm is titled "Rise of the primarch" this choice to me suggests Gulliman may in fact rise to a powerful position once he returns. it also suggests that given that name, he may be the only loyalist primarch returning. (which BTW I HOPE isn't the case. the Lion at the very least not returning would be an injustice to dark angels)

I think Gulliman would have a lot of doubters within the Imperium at large. Especially those in power.

 Captain Azrael wrote:


Guilliman possibly knows this because of Vulkan as he was together with him for a while after the Heresy ended. So he may assist Cypher with this, fully knowing that death of his dad will also mean his rebirth.

If this were true, why didn't Gulliman and Vulkan just kill the Emperor right after Horus crippled him?

The thing is, we don't even know GW's current stance about the Emperor, him being the results of all the shamans reincarnating themselves into him. For me, it has been in the process of retcon for quite a long time, beginning with the Perpetual concept and followed by the revelations of Vengeful Spirit/Battle of Molech : How I see it, the Emperor was one of several Perpetuals (that kinda acted as a group), already a powerful psyker made even more powerful thanks to having a loooong time to develop his abilities, then acquired a god-like power by traveling to Molech and gaining said strength from the Chaos Gods then refusing to honor his part of the deal, starting their rivalry.

 Mr. Burning wrote:
For all we know the HLOT and some mechanicum know Big Easy is a perpetual. The Throne has probably been killing him over and over since his interment on it.

Those millions of psykers being burnt out everyday could be helping keep Emps chained to his chair.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

BrianDavion wrote:
re the long term plans, given GW has released a Gulliman mini, I suspect he won't just be a "one and done" situation. the third book in gathering storm is titled "Rise of the primarch" this choice to me suggests Gulliman may in fact rise to a powerful position once he returns. it also suggests that given that name, he may be the only loyalist primarch returning. (which BTW I HOPE isn't the case. the Lion at the very least not returning would be an injustice to dark angels)

I think Gulliman would have a lot of doubters within the Imperium at large. Especially those in power.

course he'll have doubters and resisters, you don't rise to a high position in an insisution like the Imperium without making a lot of enemies. the question isn't "will he be opposed?" but "what form will that oppisition take?" given his status simply dennouncing Gulliman as a heretic seems unlikely, my guess is the high lords will attempt to use the man as a figure head, putting him at the front lines as much as they can, and keeping him far away from the levers of power