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so this are the new Psychic Phase rules.

https://www.warhammer-community.com/2017/04/28/new-warhammer-40000-psychic-phase/

Mortal wounds are a thing now in 40k.

Mortal Wounds are a new mechanic too – these cannot be saved by any means and punch straight through thick armour and even invulnerable saves! Ouch.

And the Psychic Phase works a bit like magic in WHF i like that.

What do you think about the new rules?

I'm excited for this. I like that they kept mastery levels rather than everyone just gets 1 spell per turn (typically) like AOS. Everything is just so so good-looking and I'm so hyped.

Yeah this looks great and essentially how it works in AoS. Much simpler and more fun

Mortal goes through Invul... Stormshields and terminators better be freakin cheap

Seems interesting, just have to see the powers and how units like Magnus work with powerful psychic powers. I do like the idea of each psyker being able to do something

Ooohh I wonder if 7th "rend" will be the new 8th "mortal wound"? I hope it is since it seems like there will be a lot more T7+ models with 3+ or better saves and a bucket loads of wounds.

 Brutallica wrote:
Mortal goes through Invul... Stormshields and terminators better be freakin cheap

depends on how common mortal wounds are.

Beyond that I like this better than the 7th edition rules because it means bringing one psyker is viable. I also like the seeming elimination of BRB powers I like different armies having different powers, it also makes powers easier to balance. The new system also could make extremely powerful abilities far more unreliable as a means of balance. If something like invisibility still exists but casts on say an 11+ it wouldn't be nearly as bad.

I don't think a lot of things will be inflicting mortal wounds; I like that this gets through armour and invuls because it's attacking your brain. However, we'll have to see how psychic defence works; having a few psykers in your army just to help defend against other psykers will probably be a big deal.

Looking forward to seeing how Force Weapons work.

 Brutallica wrote:
Mortal goes through Invul... Stormshields and terminators better be freakin cheap

I would say it depends on the proliferation of these weapons, if it is the new instant death and only a few weapons have it then it might mean some multiwound models survive like D3 mortal wound, gets 2 wounds average. sure it kills a terminator but a chapter master survives it rather than just removed as a casualty to instant death

Pretty likely any old D-weapons will now inflict mortal wounds

Tiberius501 wrote:Yeah this looks great and essentially how it works in AoS. Much simpler and more fun

Jacksmiles wrote:I'm excited for this. I like that they kept mastery levels rather than everyone just gets 1 spell per turn (typically) like AOS. Everything is just so so good-looking and I'm so hyped.

Yep me too *so Hyped*. Can't wait to see the Necron psychic lore I hope Necrons get some sort of psychic defense because Smite looks really deadly if all psychicers can cast it.

Mortal wounds!
Psychic powers that you can't aim

Yet to be seen
- how to deny

Every faction will have its own psychic lore with a range of thematic powers.
Tau
Necrons
DEldar

With that updated Galaxy map, and the increased warp rifts will we see these 3 races somehow become anti psykers or psychically charged?

Not liking this, means pyker heavy armies are gonna be good, also the way the word it, it does not sound like there are pyker schools anymore, you get these spells. I really hope they let us choose a school to draw out of, I really liked fulmination, or maybe I felt like using librarius.

Another change I'm not liking.

That said, props on the casting value system, much easier to deal with.

I'm really interested to see what Force does now. Maybe mortal wound on a wound roll of 6? GK will be scary with all the Force weapons

Jacksmiles wrote:
I'm excited for this. I like that they kept mastery levels rather than everyone just gets 1 spell per turn (typically) like AOS. Everything is just so so good-looking and I'm so hyped.

They never stated they were keeping Mastery levels in the article. They only mentioned them as a being a previous mechanic of the game. So I'm betting that the generic Librarians and psykers will be limited to casting and blocking a single power per turn. Casting/blocking more than one power will probably be limited to special characters and/or units like the Eldar Farseer and Tigurius.

Just as long as powerful spells are costed correctly. I like knowing the spells ahead of time and being able to cast them all.

The psychic mechanics are fine with me. Mortal Wounds can be worrisome as they can suffer from some of the issues D weapons did, but at least with the Smite power portrayed it looked somewhat finicky to properly deploy as it targets the nearest enemy unit, not necessarily the one of your choice, so will often require work to pull off right.

Each time you pick a psyker, you can cast as many spells as their datasheet states (which would previously be the same as their Mastery Level) and there’s a simpler, two-dice mechanic for casting, you just need to beat the warp charge value.
The more potent the power, the harder it will be to cast.

To me, if this is means that each Psyker datasheet will have the spells they know listed on the sheet?

If the psyker only casts the spells on their data sheet, I think that you're going to see different psyker profiles, at different price points that only cast certain subsets of powers.
examples -

Fire Psyker - 120pts - knows
- Fire Sheild
- Flame Breath
- Molten Beam
+ Smite (they all know smite now)

Combat Psyker - 180pts - knows
- Iron Arm
- Warp Speed
- Endurance
+ Smite

I like this. It lends itself to the hobby aspect - people can model psykers appropriately and give them appropriate paint jobs

Also means you don't sit and roll for random powers

Takes some of the cheese out of psychic phase as you'll have to pay for a certain psyker that has access to a special godly power.

Yep, knowing them ahead of time will certainly be way less of a headache than having to roll random powers. I always hated random power generation in 7th edition. You could either buy one psyker and generally be next to useless, or you just go hog wild and buy all the ALL the psykers and just go fishing for powers like Invisibility. (Looking at you, Libby Conclave and Daemon armies)


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Also, since every faction knows the Smite power, what happened to the Force power? I wonder if Force weapons just have their special Instant Death power wrapped up in the weapon stats itself? Maybe Force weapons do mortal wounds on a wound roll or to hit roll of 6+ now?

 Vaktathi wrote:
The psychic mechanics are fine with me. Mortal Wounds can be worrisome as they can suffer from some of the issues D weapons did, but at least with the Smite power portrayed it looked somewhat finicky to properly deploy as it targets the nearest enemy unit, not necessarily the one of your choice, so will often require work to pull off right.

And you could couter Smite by butting a ceap unit closer to the psyker.

 bomtek80 wrote:

Jacksmiles wrote:
I'm excited for this. I like that they kept mastery levels rather than everyone just gets 1 spell per turn (typically) like AOS. Everything is just so so good-looking and I'm so hyped.

They never stated they were keeping Mastery levels in the article. They only mentioned them as a being a previous mechanic of the game. So I'm betting that the generic Librarians and psykers will be limited to casting and blocking a single power per turn. Casting/blocking more than one power will probably be limited to special characters and/or units like the Eldar Farseer and Tigurius.

In the new system, the Psychic phase has been re-worked from the ground up.
Each time you pick a psyker, you can cast as many spells as their datasheet states (which would previously be the same as their Mastery Level) and there’s a simpler, two-dice mechanic for casting, you just need to beat the warp charge value. The more potent the power, the harder it will be to cast.

If your Librarian is a Lvl 2 in 7th then he will know 2 powers and can attempt 2 powers in 8th. From the sound of it, each faction will have its own set of powers to pull from and hopefully there will be some common/universal powers like we have now.

As for Mortal Wounds. In AoS Mortal Wounds are mostly regulated to Magic and some special attacks. It's not a super common ability outside of Magic but all factions do have some kind of access to it on non-wizards. On top of that there are rules that let you discount Mortal Wounds, usually on a 6, and usually double as an extra save against normal saves.

I feel like Instant Death is gonna be changed into Mortal wounds now

 commander dante wrote:
I feel like Instant Death is gonna be changed into Mortal wounds now

Yeah, which would also make Force weapons boss.

BomBomHotdog wrote:

 bomtek80 wrote:

Jacksmiles wrote:
I'm excited for this. I like that they kept mastery levels rather than everyone just gets 1 spell per turn (typically) like AOS. Everything is just so so good-looking and I'm so hyped.

They never stated they were keeping Mastery levels in the article. They only mentioned them as a being a previous mechanic of the game. So I'm betting that the generic Librarians and psykers will be limited to casting and blocking a single power per turn. Casting/blocking more than one power will probably be limited to special characters and/or units like the Eldar Farseer and Tigurius.

In the new system, the Psychic phase has been re-worked from the ground up.
Each time you pick a psyker, you can cast as many spells as their datasheet states (which would previously be the same as their Mastery Level) and there’s a simpler, two-dice mechanic for casting, you just need to beat the warp charge value. The more potent the power, the harder it will be to cast.

If your Librarian is a Lvl 2 in 7th then he will know 2 powers and can attempt 2 powers in 8th. From the sound of it, each faction will have its own set of powers to pull from and hopefully there will be some common/universal powers like we have now.

As for Mortal Wounds. In AoS Mortal Wounds are mostly regulated to Magic and some special attacks. It's not a super common ability outside of Magic but all factions do have some kind of access to it on non-wizards. On top of that there are rules that let you discount Mortal Wounds, usually on a 6, and usually double as an extra save against normal saves.

Yes but the article doesn't really state that Mastery levels are still present in the new system. Only that they may cast as many spells as their data sheet allows.

In AoS most magic users can only cast/unbind one spell per hero phase. Even the more powerful special characters are limited to two spells per phase. So I suspect that only the really powerful casters like Magnus and Fateweaver and the like will be able to cast 3 or more spells per phase.

 bomtek80 wrote:

Jacksmiles wrote:
I'm excited for this. I like that they kept mastery levels rather than everyone just gets 1 spell per turn (typically) like AOS. Everything is just so so good-looking and I'm so hyped.

They never stated they were keeping Mastery levels in the article. They only mentioned them as a being a previous mechanic of the game. So I'm betting that the generic Librarians and psykers will be limited to casting and blocking a single power per turn. Casting/blocking more than one power will probably be limited to special characters and/or units like the Eldar Farseer and Tigurius.

"You can cast as many spells as their datasheet states (which would previously be the same as their Mastery Level)."

Close enough? Dunno why you need to play semantics with it. It's possible everything generic will be the equilavent of current ML1, but "the same as their [current] mastery level" read to me like this won't be the case, and I hope that's true.

You can say they haven't said Mastery Level is in, and that's true - but they're implying that datasheets will state how many spells a model can cast, and there's no reason yet to believe that number is typically 1. I'm hoping they'll keep the current "buy more mastery levels" system.

Hello Psycher Biker Gangs runnin up on your warlord!

The Psychic Hogs?

The Sons of Smite?

Audustum wrote:

 commander dante wrote:
I feel like Instant Death is gonna be changed into Mortal wounds now

Yeah, which would also make Force weapons boss.

It would also then make sense for GK to be using their force weapons.
They are supposed to be anti-daemon and yet have been armed with a weapon that in no way helps them fight daemons...(In current 40K)

Audustum wrote:

 commander dante wrote:
I feel like Instant Death is gonna be changed into Mortal wounds now

Yeah, which would also make Force weapons boss.

well, that assumes that Instant Death stays (has that been confirmed? I would be surprised if it did now that we have multiwound weapons back again) and that Force continues to use it as its mechanic. We'll see how that pans out.

Jacksmiles wrote:

 bomtek80 wrote:

Jacksmiles wrote:
I'm excited for this. I like that they kept mastery levels rather than everyone just gets 1 spell per turn (typically) like AOS. Everything is just so so good-looking and I'm so hyped.

They never stated they were keeping Mastery levels in the article. They only mentioned them as a being a previous mechanic of the game. So I'm betting that the generic Librarians and psykers will be limited to casting and blocking a single power per turn. Casting/blocking more than one power will probably be limited to special characters and/or units like the Eldar Farseer and Tigurius.

"You can cast as many spells as their datasheet states (which would previously be the same as their Mastery Level)."

Close enough? Dunno why you need to play semantics with it. It's possible everything generic will be the equilavent of current ML1, but "the same as their [current] mastery level" read to me like this won't be the case, and I hope that's true.

You can say they haven't said Mastery Level is in, and that's true - but they're implying that datasheets will state how many spells a model can cast, and there's no reason yet to believe that number is typically 1. I'm hoping they'll keep the current "buy more mastery levels" system.

Actually I'm hoping for that as well. Just being slightly too pessimistic I guess.

"Hope is the first step on the road to disappointment"

 Vaktathi wrote:

Audustum wrote:

 commander dante wrote:
I feel like Instant Death is gonna be changed into Mortal wounds now

Yeah, which would also make Force weapons boss.

well, that assumes that Instant Death stays (has that been confirmed? I would be surprised if it did now that we have multiwound weapons back again) and that Force continues to use it as its mechanic. We'll see how that pans out.

Actually, my post was predicated on the assumption that Instant Death would be replaced by Mortal Wounds. That would be a major buff in my eyes to current Force weapons.