Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you: No adverts like this in the forums anymore. Times and dates in your local timezone. Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance. Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely. Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net. If you are already a member then feel free to login now.

Hello all,

I've been away from 40k for a bit (basically 3rd/4th, though I did play 6th briefly). 8th has piqued my interest. So...what armies are viable with low model counts? Frankly I don't have the space to store nor the inclination to paint large numbers of models. I'm not averse to mechanized forces that don't have too many models. Though I also don't want to drop $1k on an army in one go either. I should note that for the most part, bog standard marines hold 0 interest for me, including the basic deathwing and variants.

Some thoughts I've had so far:

-Grey Knights
-Nobz heavy speed freeks
-Wait for Primaris deathwing equivalent
-Nids warrior heavy with shooty MCs
-Harlies (not Ynnari)
-Iyanden
-Necrons without warrior hordes

So, what do folks see as being effective along these lines? Not limited to the above, because I'm sure I'm missing tons of possible options.

EDIT: Note, this is for matched play. I've got 0 interest in the other game types. Also I don't give a crap about fluff. Aesthetics do matter a bit, but I can be swayed there.

I think primaris only army will do good, won't go wrong painting starter half while waiting for new kits. Buy extra hellblasters and inceptors maybe?
Than there's custodes, I personally like them, and will combine them with some assassin's and some imperial hq for support. It's viable, but not really TAC.

3 Baneblades is 3 models and can easily push 1800-1850 after upgrades.

GK aren't having a good time; if you run them you will probably want to focus on Terminators/Dreadknights, the power-armoured units are still paying way too much for tricks they can't use (psychic powers that don't help, melee weapons when they're stuck with one attack...).

Iyanden could be fun; Wraithguard are still too slow and too short-ranged to run without transports, but Wraithlords have gotten cheaper to the point that they can serve as reasonably cost-effective substitute War Walkers with swords.

Damn man if you don't care for the fluff at all and aesthetics are also not that important what the hell do you play this game for?

yea, custodies still seem great on paper. and can have their units just slotted into imperium armies. barring some kind of command buff from say a space marine captain i see no reason to take a normal contemptor dred over a custodies one. as for normal custodies 6" moving 3 wound 2+ armor, 3 attacks, hitting on 2's str 5 T5, and they just are a blender to other infantry while still a threat to armor

even then the custodies banner buffs all imperial units within 6 to reroll morale which is huge for units without atsknf

How about Imperial Knights? They are still strong.

 Unit1126PLL wrote:
3 Baneblades is 3 models and can easily push 1800-1850 after upgrades.

I can beat that.

3 Stompas. can easily get close to 3000 points

Jokes aside. If you want "low count tiny models", which is usually what people ask for in these things, here are some suggestions:

Any Vanguard Detachment army (i.e: one led by a HQ and consists mostly of Elite choices). Elite models tend to be more quality over quantity so in general they will have a lower model count. This basically holds true no matter which army you play. These also include "Deathwing" style terminator armies but even stuff like massed Sternguards can be low count and still viable.

Tau Battlesuits or Biker armies. These have extremely low model counts due to bikes costing far more individually. Unlike other "expensive model" count armies, Bikes tend to be more survivable and have more utility point for point. Same goes for battlesuits.

Monstrous Armies: Either All Dreadnought armies (doable with BAs and SWs I think), Nidzilla or just spamming stuff like Riptides, Wraithlords, Talos and the like. These usually have extreme survivability and can dish out a lot of damage, at the expense of being rather slow.

I've played around with a couple of the detachments looking for something unique. I've got no idea how these lists will fair, but here's what I've come up with.

Dark Eldar Outrider Detachment

Succubus on Venom

6 Reavers
6 Reavers
6 Reavers
6 Reavers
15 Hellions
15 Hellions

Ravager
Ravager

1,961 points

Ultramarine Spearhead Detachment

Sergeant Chronus

Predator
Predator
Predator
Predator
Predator
Predator

3 Land Speeders
3 Land Speeders

1,930 points.

 wuestenfux wrote:
How about Imperial Knights? They are still strong.

problem there seems to be objectives contested by number of models, so a wraithknight is outscored by 2 gretchin

 G00fySmiley wrote:

 wuestenfux wrote:
How about Imperial Knights? They are still strong.

problem there seems to be objectives contested by number of models, so a wraithknight is outscored by 2 gretchin

Should of killed them all

yeah anything you run you better make sure they can wipe out an entire horde otherwise you will lose to model advantage.

Combi-Plasma Sternguard pump out a TON of shots in rapid fire range, it's gross. If you can get there, these guys will bring the heat.

Thanks for the feedback so far, almost everyone.

 TheLumberJack wrote:
Damn man if you don't care for the fluff at all and aesthetics are also not that important what the hell do you play this game for?

So, I've been playing miniature wargames since 2e 40k/5e fantasy. I stopped playing sometime after 4th 40k, mostly because the game(s) became unplayably bad for me. Just an absolute waste of time. I did move on to other games. My enjoyment of all tabletop miniature gaming derives from communal experience and problem-solving/strategic engagement. That's why I can bounce around armies and factions, and across systems. It's the playing of the game that matters to me. Not really horrifically badly written fluff (GW, Privateer, it doesn't matter), model design of varying quality, or judgemental gamers.

TL,DR;


EDIT: Meant to say custodes are interesting. Not a thing way back when, so I'll have to explore this further. Mayhap I'll combine with some Mechanicus? Nidzilla and biker lists are also interesting (Nobz or Eldar). Crisis spam I used to play, never was that interesting to me. Sternguard, though I see the power, are of no interest to me. Basic marines bore me, and even BA/SW hold no interest really for me anymore.

 G00fySmiley wrote:

 wuestenfux wrote:
How about Imperial Knights? They are still strong.

problem there seems to be objectives contested by number of models, so a wraithknight is outscored by 2 gretchin

Big fail.
So elite armies may have a hard time in the new ed.

 wuestenfux wrote:

 G00fySmiley wrote:

 wuestenfux wrote:
How about Imperial Knights? They are still strong.

problem there seems to be objectives contested by number of models, so a wraithknight is outscored by 2 gretchin

Big fail.
So elite armies may have a hard time in the new ed.

Niche spam lists should have trouble in some aspect. seems to work out just fine

Baneblades are fine in Objectives because even with enemy models in B2B if it is directly centered over the objective, then 0 enemy models are within 3" because they are so huge.

 Unit1126PLL wrote:
Baneblades are fine in Objectives because even with enemy models in B2B if it is directly centered over the objective, then 0 enemy models are within 3" because they are so huge.

You even allowed to move over the objective? honest question.

The named HQ's and Scarab Occult Terminators carry the brunt of the burden for Thousand Sons so you might be interested in that. Certainly not a troop spam army.

Dunno if they count as "bog standard marines" to you, I feel basically the same way about the Ass Tarts but the KSons aesthetic is pretty rad.

 Desubot wrote:

 Unit1126PLL wrote:
Baneblades are fine in Objectives because even with enemy models in B2B if it is directly centered over the objective, then 0 enemy models are within 3" because they are so huge.

You even allowed to move over the objective? honest question.

Are you discussing the holy right of the MIGHTY BANEBLADE to drive whenever the Emperor's Will command it?!

I think Warrior Nids is going to be huge. I'm already building mine.

 Xenomancers wrote:
I think Warrior Nids is going to be huge. I'm already building mine.

This is why I threw this in the list above. I'm kinda thinking warriors + nidzilla is mighty mighty strong and versatile.

Though, looking through the possibilities custodes + mechanicus seems like it has some possibility too.

Less sure on the bike-focused lists as I'm going through.

@archnomad: Ksons aesthetic is great, but the army never plays well enough. And even when they're good, they always get screwed. See every edition of warhammer ever.

 Desubot wrote:

 Unit1126PLL wrote:
Baneblades are fine in Objectives because even with enemy models in B2B if it is directly centered over the objective, then 0 enemy models are within 3" because they are so huge.

You even allowed to move over the objective? honest question.

Technically yes...I don't recommend that you permit this, but there's no strict wording in the rulebook that'd prevent it, so...

bored1 wrote:

 Xenomancers wrote:
I think Warrior Nids is going to be huge. I'm already building mine.

This is why I threw this in the list above. I'm kinda thinking warriors + nidzilla is mighty mighty strong and versatile.

Though, looking through the possibilities custodes + mechanicus seems like it has some possibility too.

Less sure on the bike-focused lists as I'm going through.

@archnomad: Ksons aesthetic is great, but the army never plays well enough. And even when they're good, they always get screwed. See every edition of warhammer ever.

Same with greyknights - they look to be really strong in CC - but Im sure they will just get wiped out to quick for that to matter. Psychic powers are just a little too gak in this edition to make a psychic army.

My Warriors I plan to deck out. (WTF tyranids have the best spells?)

Fleshhooks, Toxin sacs, Deathspitters, and rending talons and maybe adrenal glands. If you Onslaught a big unit - they can advance shoot and charge...I think it's going to be brutal.

 Xenomancers wrote:
...Same with greyknights - they look to be really strong in CC - but Im sure they will just get wiped out to quick for that to matter. Psychic powers are just a little too gak in this edition to make a psychic army...

One Attack per model has me really worried about trying to get GK in melee. Especially with no bonus Attacks for charging. I know the Paladin Ancient is around now with the flag as a bubble, and I know 3+ armour has gotten a lot better, but I've spent too much time watching single attacks whiff to trust that a unit of GK is going to do anything more than flail ineffectually in melee. Especially after they hiked the price on Purifiers and took away their extra attack.

 AnomanderRake wrote:

 Xenomancers wrote:
...Same with greyknights - they look to be really strong in CC - but Im sure they will just get wiped out to quick for that to matter. Psychic powers are just a little too gak in this edition to make a psychic army...

One Attack per model has me really worried about trying to get GK in melee. Especially with no bonus Attacks for charging. I know the Paladin Ancient is around now with the flag as a bubble, and I know 3+ armour has gotten a lot better, but I've spent too much time watching single attacks whiff to trust that a unit of GK is going to do anything more than flail ineffectually in melee. Especially after they hiked the price on Purifiers and took away their extra attack.

Purifiers don't even get 2 attacks anymore?

I sure hope Paladins still get at least 2!

wuestenfux wrote:

 G00fySmiley wrote:

 wuestenfux wrote:
How about Imperial Knights? They are still strong.

problem there seems to be objectives contested by number of models, so a wraithknight is outscored by 2 gretchin

Big fail.
So elite armies may have a hard time in the new ed.

in objective matches yes. though elite strong unit sstill have a place I doubt you will see as many death star focused armies which if i recall one of the dev interviews correctly was part of their intent.

Desubot wrote:

 Unit1126PLL wrote:
Baneblades are fine in Objectives because even with enemy models in B2B if it is directly centered over the objective, then 0 enemy models are within 3" because they are so huge.

You even allowed to move over the objective? honest question.

per rulebook i don't thing there is anything, house rules and tournament rules may vary. in our local tournament you specifically even in 7th cannot be on top of an objective, you can however bubble wrap it

 Desubot wrote:

 Unit1126PLL wrote:
Baneblades are fine in Objectives because even with enemy models in B2B if it is directly centered over the objective, then 0 enemy models are within 3" because they are so huge.

You even allowed to move over the objective? honest question.

In one of the first GW live play games, they specifically addressed this and said yes.

 daedalus-templarius wrote:

 AnomanderRake wrote:

 Xenomancers wrote:
...Same with greyknights - they look to be really strong in CC - but Im sure they will just get wiped out to quick for that to matter. Psychic powers are just a little too gak in this edition to make a psychic army...

One Attack per model has me really worried about trying to get GK in melee. Especially with no bonus Attacks for charging. I know the Paladin Ancient is around now with the flag as a bubble, and I know 3+ armour has gotten a lot better, but I've spent too much time watching single attacks whiff to trust that a unit of GK is going to do anything more than flail ineffectually in melee. Especially after they hiked the price on Purifiers and took away their extra attack.

Purifiers don't even get 2 attacks anymore?

I sure hope Paladins still get at least 2!

Terminators are 2 and Paladins 3, but PAGK aren't going to make a resurgence this edition unless their detachment benefits are really good.

 G00fySmiley wrote:

Desubot wrote:

 Unit1126PLL wrote:
Baneblades are fine in Objectives because even with enemy models in B2B if it is directly centered over the objective, then 0 enemy models are within 3" because they are so huge.

You even allowed to move over the objective? honest question.

per rulebook i don't thing there is anything, house rules and tournament rules may vary. in our local tournament you specifically even in 7th cannot be on top of an objective, you can however bubble wrap it

If the Objective Marker is more than just a flat circle, it may be hard to park on top of it.

Like, I am planning on making some custom Objective Markers in the future (since I kept telling myself I would over the years). Now that I have a lot of bits and nothing much else to do with them, I am getting some ideas for cool Markers, but it would keep any model from sitting on them.

 Unit1126PLL wrote:
Baneblades are fine in Objectives because even with enemy models in B2B if it is directly centered over the objective, then 0 enemy models are within 3" because they are so huge.

All my local objective markers are all a 4-8" tall and very decorative. You would be stabbed by one of the model makers if you tried to balance something on top of it.