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I think we can safely assume the BGG crowd will not be included in any plans Mercs has for testing this game.

 CptJake wrote:
I think we can safely assume the BGG crowd will not be included in any plans Mercs has for testing this game.

It's the most popular board-game site, Merc's product was number 1 on their leaderboards for over a week straight from all the talk about it and it has a pretty good rating there.

I'm sure Recon will be the same.

 Karaoke Ninja wrote:

 CptJake wrote:
I think we can safely assume the BGG crowd will not be included in any plans Mercs has for testing this game.

It's the most popular board-game site, Merc's product was number 1 on their leaderboards for over a week straight from all the talk about it and it has a pretty good rating there.

I'm sure Recon will be the same.

http://boardgamegeek.com/article/15410934#15410934

I don't think Mercs currently feels BGG is worth their effort.

Mercs' loss. Well, their loss, and everyone who ends up kickstarting or buying the game, since a small local beta won't iron out all of the bugs, and they're clearly not up to that task themselves.

I don't intend to invest in the full game, but I could see joining this campaign for a couple of the add-ons. They'll need to clarify shipping policies for add-on only pledges before I put in anything, though.

An FAQ and Your First Game booklet will be shipped with Wave 2.

Your harshest criticisms come from your most ardent supporters, and all that. I think BGG *really* likes this game, but is disappointed that the rulebook is so difficult to learn from.

 CptJake wrote:

 Karaoke Ninja wrote:

 CptJake wrote:
I think we can safely assume the BGG crowd will not be included in any plans Mercs has for testing this game.

It's the most popular board-game site, Merc's product was number 1 on their leaderboards for over a week straight from all the talk about it and it has a pretty good rating there.

I'm sure Recon will be the same.

http://boardgamegeek.com/article/15410934#15410934

I don't think Mercs currently feels BGG is worth their effort.

Whatever link that was; it has been taken down ?????


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 Salacious Greed wrote:

 Azazelx wrote:
So does anyone know if the "rules fixes" for Myth will be a published errata, a reprinted rulebook or what? Really, ti sounds like they got burnt the same way that Sedition Wars did - only using internal esting of the rules because they thought they were hot gak, and then it turned out that all those apparently annoying entitled bastards on BGG actually will break your rules and point out all of the obvious faults in your rules that you're too close/blind to see.

They should be releasing their full beta rules for this game to as well so the BGG crew can tear them apart - so they don't end up like the "totally awesome" Myth...

Az,

No idea. I heard it stated that all the ROW shipments would have a corrected rulebook in it. But no idea if they are sending all the US backers a new one. They posted that there would be a couple or three of "How to play" and "getting started" type pdfs released here soon I believe.

They have decided to make sure they aren't "too" close to the rules this time with Recon. They advertised on a fan FB page that is local to Indianapolis for people to come down and playtest Recon. So one guy posted that he went down, and they spent 3 hours reading the rules and playing one game. They said it went smoothly for the rules. But he didn't comment on if he liked it as a game. Just that they had no rules questions playing a very basic run through.

I find it very humorous that they believe they are going to get people who don't know anything about the Mercs TT game by advertising for playtesters on a Mercs TT fansite. They need to go to a mall and have soccer moms see if they can figure out how to play the game. If not, they need to hit the drawing board again.

They have said that those two things will ship with ROW and wave 2 domestic shipments. They have also said that they are reorganizing the RB,.... But it sounds like a full reprint will not be in the box until they do another run of the game (I'm not sure about that, but I can't find anywhere where they have said that they will print that and include it,.... I'd imagine that it's not cheap to do)

From last night:

As to myth: i need to sign off on FAQ and your first game text and we'll share it for feedback. Should be tomorrow, unless it needs more work. Then we work on reorganizing the rules and expanding/clarifying at Boston.

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Videos for then Conflict dice game are up. I have not had a chance to look at them yet, ......

ced1106 wrote:
An FAQ and Your First Game booklet will be shipped with Wave 2.

Your harshest criticisms come from your most ardent supporters, and all that. I think BGG *really* likes this game, but is disappointed that the rulebook is so difficult to learn from.

http://boardgamegeek.com/thread/1152150/do-yourself-a-favor-and-skip-this-disaster-of-myth/page/1

 Karaoke Ninja wrote:

ced1106 wrote:
An FAQ and Your First Game booklet will be shipped with Wave 2.

Your harshest criticisms come from your most ardent supporters, and all that. I think BGG *really* likes this game, but is disappointed that the rulebook is so difficult to learn from.

http://boardgamegeek.com/thread/1152150/do-yourself-a-favor-and-skip-this-disaster-of-myth/page/1

Wow. And Ow!

So I guess I've got myself a gak ton of figures to join my Bones for Pathfinder, eh? And dungeon tiles. At least until they rewrite the rules coherently...

That review was extremely one sided,....... Strange really.

I can be real,... And say that the rule book for MYTH was a failure,... And that it needs the fixes and rewrites that have been discussed.

But this guy,.... Who claims to be a game designer, but has no games listed as credited,... Just looks like someone on a mission of some sort.

I've played the game,... It's not perfect by any stretch,.. But I played it without a FAQ, and have had lots and lots of fun!!!!, it's not broken in the way that this guys is trying to sell to you.

 yamato wrote:
That review was extremely one sided,....... Strange really.

I've played the game,... It's not perfect by any stretch,.. But I played it without a FAQ, and have had lots and lots of fun!!!!, it's not broken in the way that this guys is trying to sell to you.

Huh? I bloody love the game but playing it without the FAQ??

You wouldn't even be playing it at all without all the hard-work put into the official FAQ and intro.

Some very recent updates about the rule book work and their lack of BGG activity this past week:

....... we are working on it and endeavor to get the rulebook(s) to the quality that everyone can play.
There are 4 people who work at MegaCon Games: one is an artist and one is a sculptor. That means two people, the same two who wrote the rule book in the first place are working on the solutions. Because we thought we needed outside assets to help, we enlisted the help of others. Creating solutions for everyone takes time.
We actually approved the official FAQ 1.0 today and a "Your First Quest" document today as well. They are both being laid out. When they are done, we'll post them on the Myth KS, our website, and BGG.
We don't look for anyone's blind devotion, and we aren't hiding from BGG. Simply put, we have been working on the solutions and had a major convention for us last week and a major convention this week. It takes time to prep for these types of things. The more time we spent on BGG the less time we could actually create the documents that can solve the problems.

We plan on reorganizing the rules and creating an summarized game round document as well. All told a lot of work to get done. If we went to BGG over the last week, we could only tell them what we had already told them. How much better to produce the documents, put it in everyone's hands, and let them evaluate it so we can make it better.
That is what we have been doing.

Oh, and the Myth videos...the first two are in post production now. We are using Justin (the same genius who is helping with all the videos here) and I suspect that the videos of gameplay will be brilliant. You'll see the game, while tracking things on all the boards.

They are clearly slammed,.... And I'm sure they wish they we able to totally focus on one thing right now,.... (Yeah, yeah,.... Come on out the "I told you so" crowd),.... Let's see what they come up with,...

If you read the posts that I put here from one of the Recon beta testers, then you can see that they are taking a much different approach with the genesis of the Recon rule book,.... So it looks like they have taken some steps based on what they have learned,.... We can all be the judge on the results of what they put out with regard to the revised rule books and documents for Myth as well as videos and such.


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 Karaoke Ninja wrote:

 yamato wrote:
That review was extremely one sided,....... Strange really.

I've played the game,... It's not perfect by any stretch,.. But I played it without a FAQ, and have had lots and lots of fun!!!!, it's not broken in the way that this guys is trying to sell to you.

Huh? I bloody love the game but playing it without the FAQ??

You wouldn't even be playing it at all without all the hard-work put into the official FAQ and intro.

I don't discount the work that was put in by those folks,... But as I had been playing prior to the first shipments going out,.... I know that I was not using the FAQ,... It did not even exist.

I got an advance copy to demo at a convention,.... Had zero dialog with the creators other than them letting me know that they were shipping it to me (meaning, no one showed me how to play or answered any questions),....

I learned the game and played demo sessions with my kid,.... And did full Act sessions at the con for full teams of five,... So I know that it can be done, because I did it.

I'm not defending the state of the book at all,... Just that the game as a whole is not like what that guy on BGG described. It's hard to take someone's opinion on something seriously when they deal in such hyperbole without any middle road feeling of anything in the box,..... Very black and white.

 yamato wrote:


I don't discount the work that was put in by those folks,... But as I had been playing prior to the first shipments going out,.... I know that I was not using the FAQ,... It did not even exist.

I got an advance copy to demo at a convention,.... Had zero dialog with the creators other than them letting me know that they were shipping it to me (meaning, no one showed me how to play or answered any questions),....

I learned the game and played demo sessions with my kid,.... And did full Act sessions at the con for full teams of five,... So I know that it can be done, because I did it.

I'm not defending the state of the book at all,... Just that the game as a whole is not like what that guy on BGG described. It's hard to take someone's opinion on something seriously when they deal in such hyperbole without any middle road feeling of anything in the box,..... Very black and white.

That's pretty cool! I'm jealous of your luck.

What parts about his opinion are hyperbolic?

 yamato wrote:

They are clearly slammed,.... And I'm sure they wish they we able to totally focus on one thing right now,.... (Yeah, yeah,.... Come on out the "I told you so" crowd),.... Let's see what they come up with,...

Well, really - why the feth not throw an "I told you so" in here? Because we fething did tell them so, but in another example of their arrogance/blindness to their own flaws (no external playtesting or proofreading by grown-ups), they decided to power on anyway, and launch MERCS while shipping MYTH. Still, if all this negative fallout hurts MERCS then so much the better, as it sounds like Megacon could well do with having their egos taken down a few notches. Having some humility and the need for proper editing and playtesting beaten into their heads while their company is relatively young could only be a positive for them long-term, after all.

So yeah, I rose to your flamebait. Good show.

Well,... I knew it was coming anyway

 Karaoke Ninja wrote:

That's pretty cool! I'm jealous of your luck.

It's not luck. They don't randomly send complete copies of the game out to people based on nothing. They send them to reviews and those who they believe that they will get positive press, etc from. Yamato demoed the game at cons, so there's the quid pro quo. The guy at BGG sounds like, you know, someone who bought the base game and expected it to work correctly right out of the box without the need for research and hunting down FAQs and all manner of other bs. Imagine that! A board game that works right out of the box!

What parts about his opinion are hyperbolic?

Really, pretty much the whole thing,... What wasn't?

Quick Overview: Wade into a dungeon of incoherent rules and trapped cards and try to emerge with any clue of how the heck to play the game.

He admits that he couldn't play the game,... And if so,... Ok,... But then how can you actually write a review of several thousand words?

The parts that he did explain were so wrong and full of indications that he did not actually take any effort whatsoever,.....

Example,.... Found shield on one card,... Could not determine what it meant, thought, maybe there are other cards with "shield",... Looked but couldn't find any,.... There are several cards in the soldier deck with the shield key word,.... So what did he actually do????? Or maybe he's just adding stuff to make it all seem worse than it actually is???

 yamato wrote:

What parts about his opinion are hyperbolic?

Really, pretty much the whole thing,... What wasn't?

You made the assertion, not I, good sir. Usually burden of proof would come from you.

 yamato wrote:

He admits that he couldn't play the game,... And if so,... Ok,... But then how can you actually write a review of several thousand words?

The parts that he did explain were so wrong and full of indications that he did not actually take any effort whatsoever,.....

Example,.... Found shield on one card,... Could not determine what it meant, thought, maybe there are other cards with "shield",... Looked but couldn't find any,....

There are several cards in the soldier deck with the shield key word,.... So what did he actually do????? Or maybe he's just adding stuff to make it all seem worse than it actually is???

None of those cards explain what the Shield keyword does, they're just more examples of it being poorly placed.

I actually had an identical experience to his review, it was completely impossible to finish the game.

But unlike him I was able to utilize the online resources and make the third play-through much better.

...
Actually even with the FAQ I'm still a little confused because some places says May use the shield and some of the FAQ's say must use a shield.

New topic:
How the heck do I use cards with shield? I've been playing it as must but it can really limit the soldier.

Do you have the latest version of the card reference document? It tells you about all the cards,....

Basically, you have to have a shield item equipped in your secondary slot in order to use any of the cards with "shield" on them.

http://megacongames.com/download/hero-deck-reference/

Example:

So, there's a plan for a complete reprint of the book then?

So, having played the game a couple times, with fairly minimal FAQ reference, I found the first game painfully difficult to play, but found that, except for a couple points, the second play through went off without many issues.

There are some serious and occasionally embarrassing flaws in Myth, but the BGG crowd seems to be overrreacting for the sake of it...

After getting a few more games in, I hope to write a review.

I wonder if we'll have the opportunity to buy a copy of the fixed rulebook, Sedition Wars style?

 Azazelx wrote:
I wonder if we'll have the opportunity to buy a copy of the fixed rulebook, Sedition Wars style?

I heard they were going to include it with wave 2 shipments.

Of course, I may have heard wrong.

OK, briefly, as I am tired still...

I saw the miniatures in person, and they very much look as pictured - they didn't look worse, or better, in person.

Some of them look very appropriate for SF, and some look a bit too cartoony and MYTH-like for my tastes.

The whole issue with the MYTH rulebook and being too close to their product and with their attitude about...many things in this KS doesn't help.

What also doesn't help is the fact that there are other KS campaigns going on right now that are competing for these dollars, and they don't have really any issues associated with them, other than costs!

So, in summary, there wasn't anything at Adepticon that would make me run screaming from the project, but then there also wasn't anything there that would make me want to pledge again, or stay in if I was.

That sounds bad actually.

But but but butt they promised me a 3D view of the figs would show me they are fantastic.

Also not seeing a noticeable bump from them being at Adepticon. Guess we'll see how Pax East goes for them.

Looks like they're now EU-friendly for shipping according to the latest update yesterday. They're up to $383k now so it is increasing, just slowly.

What makes me wonder is that they claimed as such from the start.

All the pledge levels had a little note about needing to include extra $ for shipping outside the US. But I see the FAQ at the bottom did say EU shipping would be from a distributor in Germany. Not much of a news update, then.

In my ideal world they would put an intermediate stretch goal in between not-tango-n-cash at 385 and the expansion at 400. One of the previous updates said they had some additional stuff they could use to power through funding gaps and I would say now's the time to start using them. If they're good, that is. More pop culture knockoffs aren't going to suddenly cause people to pledge if they've been sitting on the fence so far.