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 mitch_rifle wrote:
Lord they are horrific, i dont understand how they havent managed to be able to get some decent plastic, other than the KOW stuff they released years ago. How do fireforge, gripping beast, the perrys and warlord can do it, and reasonably priced as well.

Whilst i understand it may be a risk for them to borrow some money and invest in some good sculptors and plastics, im afraid it's just never going to get out there. I want some awesome plastic alternatives for scifi but i dont think were gonna get them for some time

Are you talking about the space zombies? Are we looking at the same models?


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NTRabbit wrote:
Renedra had a massive queue of people waiting to get things produced because they're so good everyone wanted to use them, including all of Fireforge, Gripping Beast and the Perrys; Mantic couldn't wait, so went to China. At least that's how I recall it.

No, the massive queue is a fiction. It's just the prices. Renedra is expensive. They are the former GW plastics team.


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 Riquende wrote:
Mantic aren't the only people to investigate other options than Renedra - Warlord's Auxilia sprue is noticeably different to their earlier Roman sprues, with much softer detail and a different, more glossy finish to the plastic. That was a few years ago now, whether their newer kits are using Renedra again I don't know.

Dunno if Victrix ever used Renedra, but I bought a box of one of their new Greek kits the other day and it doesn't have 'Renedra' stamped anywhere on the sprue (which Warlord's Romans do).

Victrix definitely doesn't use Renedra and neither does Warlord (they haven't used Renedra for a long time).

Victrix (and PSC?) use SK Engineering.

Speaking of plastics companies, what happened to PSC? They seem to have lost interest in producing anything new. You seemed to have a more direct line to someone there IIRC, scarlet: would you know anything about that?

^ I have no idea and no direct line!

Also, I am now a member of the Mantic rules committee for Deadzone and KoW, so I should be making some good contributions there. KoW is mostly in a good state so I'd probably just act as a more passive playtester there, but Deadzone seriously needs some work!

Congratulations! well deserved.

Ah, sorry then. I might have mistaken your ever-present enthusiasm for a direct line
Congrats on the rules committee thing!

 scarletsquig wrote:
^ I have no idea and no direct line!

Also, I am now a member of the Mantic rules committee for Deadzone and KoW, so I should be making some good contributions there. KoW is mostly in a good state so I'd probably just act as a more passive playtester there, but Deadzone seriously needs some work!

Well that could have been embarrassing, I thought you were someone else, but by process of elimination you can only be one person [/escapesfootinmouth]

 scarletsquig wrote:
^ I have no idea and no direct line!

Also, I am now a member of the Mantic rules committee for Deadzone and KoW, so I should be making some good contributions there. KoW is mostly in a good state so I'd probably just act as a more passive playtester there, but Deadzone seriously needs some work!

So where do I send this request for the 'Anyone called Michael has an extra dice for each roll' rule go to? It's written on a $50 note.

The man surely has integrity, better make it a 100.

 scarletsquig wrote:
^ I have no idea and no direct line!

Also, I am now a member of the Mantic rules committee for Deadzone and KoW, so I should be making some good contributions there. KoW is mostly in a good state so I'd probably just act as a more passive playtester there, but Deadzone seriously needs some work!

Congratulations!

Without being silly at all, KoW needs more scenarios, and the siege rules need work. It could use some proper campaign rules as well.

Damn Mantic emailing re. DBX saying "are you *sure* you don't want to add a nerd shirt to your burgeoning collection?" The sting from the initial payment has worn off so $150 later...

 scarletsquig wrote:
^ I have no idea and no direct line!

Also, I am now a member of the Mantic rules committee for Deadzone and KoW, so I should be making some good contributions there. KoW is mostly in a good state so I'd probably just act as a more passive playtester there, but Deadzone seriously needs some work!

Ah great, can you get them to look into the imbalance between shooting and mele please as currently mele is far more potent then shooting, thanks!

I'd like to finally see the Deadzone movement videos.

Yeah... look at the excellent Infinity learn to play videos, then replicate them

 scarletsquig wrote:
^ I have no idea and no direct line!

Also, I am now a member of the Mantic rules committee for Deadzone and KoW, so I should be making some good contributions there. KoW is mostly in a good state so I'd probably just act as a more passive playtester there, but Deadzone seriously needs some work!

SS can I send you the small list of a few of my proposed rules errata/clarifications/additions for KoW? This is coming from, uh, perhaps a hundred games of KoW played in the last 2 years.

Just got an email, backers of deadzone should have the PDF for contagion and the new faction and Merc decks.


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No digital AI deck though... has anyone gotten the hard copy yet?

 scarletsquig wrote:
Deadzone seriously needs some work!

Congratulations on being selected. I'm sure you'll do a lot of good for the games.

As far as Deadzone goes, I just hope you can help take the Rebs down a notch. Jake made a great start of watering them down, but they're still overpowered. ;p

 Vermonter wrote:

 scarletsquig wrote:
Deadzone seriously needs some work!

Congratulations on being selected. I'm sure you'll do a lot of good for the games.

As far as Deadzone goes, I just hope you can help take the Rebs down a notch. Jake made a great start of watering them down, but they're still overpowered. ;p

Ye gods, man! That sarcasm is so thick it threatens to bury us all like the people of Pompeii...someone bring me a plasma torch to cut this!

In other news, congrats on the selection there SS. As enthusiastic as you are for Mantic I don't think you'll hesitate to call them out on the carpet when something isn't working. Also, if you could get me a Draconian race for KoW, that'd be extra-super keen. I kid...unless you can actually do it, then I'm not.

As far as the PSC tangent, if you're talking about Plastic Soldier Company (and I think you are, but if not, ignore this) then you're looking for Big P on these forums. I don't think he's a formal PSC employee, but he's got in-roads there (via his work with Battlegroup/Warwick Kinrade if memory serves). PSC did just release a Panzer III kit and are going back to add track options so they're still out there and releasing new stuff. In fact, I have a load of tiny tanks from them waiting for me to stop being a slacker...

Nope, this was another company. did a KS, quite a few people here joined in - and the quality was decent. designs weren't the most inspired ever IMO, but the tooling was as sharp as I'd expect decent plastics to be (==renedra level quality, IMO - slightly more briittle).

Well, it definitely looks like the Forge Fathers saw a few changes, so that's good. Brokkr got a bit cheaper (but lost Knockback), Forgeguard a bit more expensive (but now have AP2 weapons as standard and gained Knockback in lieu of It Burns). Lists can range in size from 4-7 units depending on what you go for. Bringing the Brokkr Chief down by two points from beta points moves it from being questionable choice compared to the Huscarl to actually being a solid choice (though it loses the heat hammer). But saving three points compared to the Huscarl makes it an actual savings (especially with cheaper Brokkr).

Looking over their missions it looks like all of their Scour objectives have gone to 2VP up from 1VP (except Look Under Every Rock which stays at 3VP). So the X/Y/Z Marks the Spot missions can now be completed with only four units (which is good since a list with a single Forge Guard at 70 points is only 5 members strong, though a Brokkr horde can get up to 7 with a bit of room for specialists). So at the very least, their problem missions became much more doable. Of course, some of their less problematic missions also got a bit easier, Dig In now has the survive objective at 2VP so can now be won as early as turn 2 instead of turn 4 (though losing Knockback on all the Brokkr made them much less adept at capture missions). Their only real problematic missions were the Marks the Spot ones (though Look Under Every Rock and Stake a Claim will be challenging due to the small size, and the latter due to a lack of ubiquitous Knockback). So at the very least, I think the majority of their missions are doable which is an improvement over beta. They were never in as bad a way as the Rebs, but for a faction that lacks the speed of the Enforcers, they would have a hard time doing some of those original missions with their low numbers.

That said, I think the changes to the Forge Guard are quite interesting. With AP2 and Weight of Fire, they currently have a basic weapon that seems entirely capable of actually wounding models on a Blaze Away action (even Enforcers!). And since it isn't limited only to Blaze Away actions it can get a double helping of murder. It looks like even the basic Forge Guard is a support piece for the point cost (1 higher than in beta). And the FG are now the sole source of Knockback for the list, which makes them kind of important for capture and control, though being slow it will be hard to get them in position quickly without burning a lot of cards (though Move isn't super common in the deck). But at least they're incredibly hard to kill. Not sure if this is enough to make a single suit common at the 70 point level, but the move to being a bit more punchy certainly means they will be making the most of their ranged weapons if they are included.

I'll still have to give them a play, but I think I'm a fan of the changes from beta.

Thanks for the break down, I hadn't looked them over too much before but it sounds like changes for the better.


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So the AI stuff exists, just haven't seen cards to make it work yet.

They changed the merc-mission from ''million credit heist'' to black ops, line up the 8 free mercs from the kickstarter, take turns picking them, one side is on O the other D. Kind of neat.

The horde rule for zombies is exactly what I was hoping it would be, a cumulative fight bonus per horde enemy in the cube, as opposed to a flat +1. It also adds AP1 per 'friendly' uncaring model so even enforcers are gonna get pulled down by enough zombies!




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Hard to comment on AI portion of the rules until I have cards in hand... but the solo zombie campaign sounds like a great deal of fun!

The zombies are... I dunno vicious sounding. Anything you do, the zombies get to move. It reminds me of playing a roguelike game in a dungeon and you start panicking move inefficiently as everything crowds in on you to your ultimate demise.

Move? Zombies with LoS get to move. Shoot? Zombies within 3 cubes regardless of LoS get to move. Anything else? Zombie Spawn locations stockpile dice increasing the likelyhood of additional zombies arriving.

No limit to zombie actions per turn or round, at the end of each turn (even in solo you track turns) they roll on a chart to see if they move again anyway.

They sound pretty dangerous as an add-in to normal play, and the solo campaign sounds brutal, seems like any diliberate or otherwise slow to fire weapon is going to get shot sparingly, or left behind to die as a rear-guard. I mean... win conditions for the solo campaign are getting a SINGLE model to the evacuation site, where you can consider your score to be the points value of your survivors.

Gotta set up a table and give this a try ASAP

Tabletop roguelike? Count me in! In the last year or two I've picked up a dozen roguelikes/roguelites on PC, I love the playstyle ; )

Did the asterians change much from the test rules?

When/where will the zombie rules be for non-backers?

Probably pretty soon on the zombie rules. Miniature market already has the physical book of Incursion and that leaves only Contagion left to be released. They may wait a bit, but I doubt for long. Their zombie kit should probably be polished enough to come out soon too.

I didn't look too closely at the asterians during their beta. The force as a whole looks pretty neat though.

 Bolognesus wrote:
Speaking of plastics companies, what happened to PSC? They seem to have lost interest in producing anything new. You seemed to have a more direct line to someone there IIRC, scarlet: would you know anything about that?

They're on holiday but have the following on the development cycle:

1/72nd German SdKfz 251/Ausf C Halftrack
15mm German stowage and accessories
15mm KV 1/2/S/85
15mm German panzergrenadiers
15mm Stuart M3
1/72nd Stuart M3
15mm Late War British Heavy Weapons
15mm SU76
15mm Russian 122mm howitzer
15mm Pak 40 with Raupenschlepper Ost
15mm Universal Carriers
15mm 250 Halftrack
1/72nd 250 Halftrack
1/72nd Universal Carrier Conversion Kit
15mm 6 pdr with Lloyd carrier tow
1/72nd 17 pdr with M5 Halftrack tow
15mm 88mm and tractor

Mantic has updated Mission Control with photos of the new items being sent out - they're not the best quality, but at least should tell you exactly what will be in each bag, and in what quantities!

http://www.manticgames.com/kickstarter/mission-control/deadzone-shipping.html

This includes photos of the 'limited edition resins' for the Plague 1st Gen & Rebs commander - I admit that they just look like reposes:

Scenery Expansion Sprues - nice half sized pillars

Excellent - Asterian Black Talons come unattached from their scenery. Now multiples of them won't look silly on the field.

This assembly guide is a big step forward for Mantic.

Wow. Very cool.

Forge Father Booster pics currently link to Asterian Booster pics instead.