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Do we have a source for the points for the Abominant? I have the power level from the build book, but don't see points anywhere.

The last page of the rules booklet in tooth and claw has points for everything in the box.

Yeah it's around 80pts I think - seems like a reasonable price for what you get. Can't help but compare him to the options the BA smash captain gets though with invulns and mega mobility...

Thanks. Are chimeras or Goliaths worth it to transport aberrants or genestealera?

I’ve been thinking about getting a Ferratonic Furnace terrain kit to run as a Bastion/Plasma Obliterator for my cult. Anyone tried running fortifications? It seems like having a big tough building to stick your squishies in while everything else deepstrikes would work well. Plus the 17” move genestealers could get piling out of one is a serious threat bubble. I just dunno if it’s worth the 200 point pricetag.

If they could hold more than 1 unit it would be pretty good actually.

mightymconeshot wrote:
Thanks. Are chimeras or Goliaths worth it to transport aberrants or genestealera?

IMHO, yes. They are a bit expensive in points but can be useful. Ambush with primus/stratagem is a better way to deliver assaulty units, but you can only do that once per turn. Transports are more reliable than an unmodified random ambush.

They benefit greatly from target saturation. If your army's only vehicles are two transports, it is likely that they will be shot to pieces before they get to deliver.

The chimera is probably the best transport for assault units. I like to use it with double heavy flamer for the auto hits.

Has anyone tried mass acolytes? I benched my GSC when 8th dropped but started modelling on them again recently in preparation for the new book arriving.

I currently have 80 Acolytes including 4 drills 2 snips and 8 saws, 3 banners.

I also have 80 Neophytes, soon to be 100. IDK seems to me that drowning the table in fearless chaf with hidden weapons could be decent

I also have 12 Abareants, soon to be 17 and 34 pruestrains, 10 metamorphs (was 30 ut turned 20 into normal acolytes since there is no way to fix these guys in 8th, they have a core rules issue).

3 of each character except for singles of the abominant and iconward. 2 of each transport truck, grinder and chimera. 3 sentinals.

I went a bit crazy end of 7th lol. I am betting acolytes drop to 8 ppm, same with metamorphs obviously before any gear. I am hesitant to use guard or nids, I play a 8k worth catachan army and my brother has even more nids. I'd really like to run a pure cult even though I know it isn't that good right now. I have a feeling they are going to be amazing again soon. Point drops are all they really need, they seem to run out of gas now which is because they have a problem with acolytes costing way too much, but being the heavy lifters as troops.

Anyway, sorry that rambled a bit, been painting for a few too many hours straight these last two days lol.

 Red Corsair wrote:
Has anyone tried mass acolytes?

Not with that many acolytes, but I have tried a few times with only infantry models in the army. And I found it quite frustrating. It feels like I lack control over the game since I have no reliable ranged anti-vehicle, and once the ambushes are done the army is pretty slow. I didn't quite manage to swamp my opponents, so they got to choose their combats quite a lot.

Mind you, it was very fun and thematic to play the gibbering hordes! And there is a certain pleasure in seeing a frustrated opponent shoot their anti-tank weapons at acolytes. So I definitely think you should set up a list and play a few games to try it out for yourself.

What do you think your army list would look like?

 Strat_N8 wrote:


Flyer usage dropped off in our area after the early edition FAQ that made it so they cannot score or count for tabling, so I haven't had much experience fighting them in 8th edition unfortunately. The last time I fought multiple fliers (two Stormtalons) I was able to bring them down with weight of autocannon fire and a few well placed Smites, but they are rather light targets and don't have the -2 penalty.

Could you perhaps provide the Eldar list? Might be easier to find a weakness if we know what else there is.

Hey Stat_N8, I somehow missed your request to provide the Eldar list my friend plays when I originally read your reply. Thanks again for your advice, as well as for all your work maintaining this thread.

The Eldar list I have been getting crushed by (as in, tabled by turn 3 repeatedly) looks something like this:



In essence, the Wraithblades stand in front and screen off the shooting units while the jetbikes screen off the flanks. Wraithblades with shields are T6, 3 wounds, 3+ save, 4++, so they are ridiculous hard to chew through with most of our units. I have crashed 20 genestealers into them and only taken out 3. They usually walk forward and either take a key objective and say 'come at me bro,' or just hang with the rest of the army until I commit my melee units, then they counter-charge and wreck my most valuable unit. With Quicken cast on them by the spiritseer, they can actually cover quite a bit of ground. The jetbikes actually do a good job of screening off ambushes because they take up a lot of space and are fairly cheap. With Biel Tan tactics, basically the whole army has reroll 1s to hit for free. He usually holds the guardian bomb in the webway and the swooping hawks in reserve until I commit my ambushes, then drops them in and uses them to delete the ambushers. The Wave Serpents are a pain, too, since they can shrug off damage from things like autocannons pretty easily.

I can't touch the flyers, either, but they can definitely touch me, so I usually end up losing two transports on the first turn and then whatever vehicles I have left on the second turn. Until I started adding Nids, I couldn't even take one of them down, on average. The Hemlock is a particular problem because it can continue doing bad things to you with its psychic abilities/Ld debuffs even after its ideal targets have been taken down.

A typical game sees me killing the jetbikes and a few other troop units before getting tabled fairly quickly. I'm not sure there is a really good answer to this list - it is pretty unorthodox, but it is built in a way that it can really smash GSC. Biel Tan is typically not considered the best craftworld, but it is brutal against our hybrids when used in a list that makes use of massed shuriken weapons.

Mellon wrote:

 Red Corsair wrote:
Has anyone tried mass acolytes?

Not with that many acolytes, but I have tried a few times with only infantry models in the army. And I found it quite frustrating. It feels like I lack control over the game since I have no reliable ranged anti-vehicle, and once the ambushes are done the army is pretty slow. I didn't quite manage to swamp my opponents, so they got to choose their combats quite a lot.

Mind you, it was very fun and thematic to play the gibbering hordes! And there is a certain pleasure in seeing a frustrated opponent shoot their anti-tank weapons at acolytes. So I definitely think you should set up a list and play a few games to try it out for yourself.

What do you think your army list would look like?

IDK, every time I start making lists I get half way through and realize I am paying WAY too much for acolytes compared to how many more bodies I can get from Neophytes. I feel like the best horde from the index would be 250 neophytes made fearless by patriarchs with familars to eat sniper missiles from knights, but then I feel like I am just playing whack a mole only I am the damned mole! Ha ha ha! I probably have 2 months worth of painting to get through all these duders any way, so I guess I should just grit my teeth get through it and enjoy the price cuts when the new book finally drops.

I re read through the index points just a minute ago and at one point I scared my wife I let out such an audible laugh, I mean I had forgotten the power maul in the index is 13 points! Hand flamer...8 points!!! which is so trolltastic when you look at the fully fledged flammer which is literally better in every way and 7 points...7... points... The power hammer is essentially a thunder hammer, actually, it literally IS a thunder hammer 24 points! Power pick 16 points. This book is going to give point cuts that will blow the mind, I mean, the hand flamer in the blood angel book is 1 point for example, thats a 7 point drop. If acolytes go down to 8 ppm and hand flamers to 1pt I will definitely have to try a big clump of them all with flamers.

I guess I was desperate for someone to convince me of anything that would work that I am not seeing, but I guess that would just look like using allies that are far better which I already said I wasn't super interested in.

Oh one last one, eradicator nova anon 46pts! I am dying here.

Mellon wrote:

 Red Corsair wrote:
Has anyone tried mass acolytes?

Not with that many acolytes, but I have tried a few times with only infantry models in the army. And I found it quite frustrating. It feels like I lack control over the game since I have no reliable ranged anti-vehicle, and once the ambushes are done the army is pretty slow. I didn't quite manage to swamp my opponents, so they got to choose their combats quite a lot.

Mind you, it was very fun and thematic to play the gibbering hordes! And there is a certain pleasure in seeing a frustrated opponent shoot their anti-tank weapons at acolytes. So I definitely think you should set up a list and play a few games to try it out for yourself.

What do you think your army list would look like?

yeah and I find them too expensive for what they do to be used as a horde, especially compared to neophytes who have much better shooting and the same save for less then half the cost. I find acolytes work best as a single solid strike against the enemies trump card unit. Ambush a squad of 10-12 via primus and strategem with the appropriate heavy weapons near a vital enemy unit and maul it in a single round.

 Badablack wrote:
I’ve been thinking about getting a Ferratonic Furnace terrain kit to run as a Bastion/Plasma Obliterator for my cult. Anyone tried running fortifications? It seems like having a big tough building to stick your squishies in while everything else deepstrikes would work well. Plus the 17” move genestealers could get piling out of one is a serious threat bubble. I just dunno if it’s worth the 200 point pricetag.

From a modeling perspective that is a very clever idea actually. I hadn't thought about it but the Furance is around the same size, so a few spare Heavy Bolters from the weapon teams and it would make a serviceable "industrial bastion"

I have not used fortifications with my GSC yet but they should be serviceable. GSC likes having things to hide stuff out of line of sight and I think all of the buildings have fairly high transport capacity. Need to be weary about Knights though...

Red Corsair wrote:Has anyone tried mass acolytes? I benched my GSC when 8th dropped but started modelling on them again recently in preparation for the new book arriving.

I've considered it, but it is a bit like doing mass Devastator marines. They currently aren't very cost efficient used as cannon fodder but do hit very hard, so they are better used as a "bomb" to send after key models.

The closest I've gotten to mass Acolytes is in my mechanized lists, where there is usually a 1-1 ratio of Acolytes to Neophytes. Acolyte demolition squads work very well with Goliath Trucks and said trucks with Acolytes are perfectly happy zipping up alongside Rockgrinders for threat saturation. Once the squad's demolition charges have been spent they can jump out and start picking on infantry on objectives.

Red Corsair wrote:
I also have 80 Neophytes, soon to be 100. IDK seems to me that drowning the table in fearless chaf with hidden weapons could be decent

I don't know. Overwhelming firepower isn't really the army's strong point and attrition is really something GSC doesn't want to get in to if it can help it (see quote from Kill Team). Blocks of Neophytes to act as the "anvil" might work, but I wouldn't focus on spamming them to the exclusion of everything else as they don't have the same offensive potential that the melee squads bring.

Red Corsair wrote: 10 metamorphs (was 30 ut turned 20 into normal acolytes since there is no way to fix these guys in 8th, they have a core rules issue).

They work fairly well in Kill Team actually. They get a rather powerful tactic (read "stratagem") that adds +1 to wound rolls and are at about half the cost they are in standard 40k.

I think the main "fix" they need is a cost adjustment to bring them in line as the "cheap" mass attack melee option. I'd also probably give their Metamorph weapons AP-1 since they had the same AP as rending claws in 7th edition, but that would be a bonus.

Red Corsair wrote:
I guess I was desperate for someone to convince me of anything that would work that I am not seeing, but I guess that would just look like using allies that are far better which I already said I wasn't super interested in.

The main benefit of allies (besides their having codexes and our not having one yet) is that they basically enable 7th-edition style foot lists by providing the "anvil" required by matched play reserve rules. If you play pure GSC you need to divide your list between the "something" that starts on the table and the ambushing elements. I've generally found vehicles work best as the on-table force, since they can't ambush anyway and in the case of transport vehicles bring mobility to supplement the army after ambushes have dropped. Return to shadows helps a little bit, but pure foot runs into the issue of mobility unless you have allies acting as the anvil (since they are either very fast in the case of Tyranids or don't care about moving in the case of AM).


Based on what you mentioned having, try a list with a core of 2-squads of Goliath mounted Neophytes, 2 squads of Chimera mounted Acolytes, and 2 squad of Rockgrinder mounted Aberrants, then fill out with ambushers and characters. This entire vehicle group provides 12 "ambush slots" and any of the contents can elect to ambush if they need to.

Asmodas wrote:
Hey Stat_N8, I somehow missed your request to provide the Eldar list my friend plays when I originally read your reply. Thanks again for your advice, as well as for all your work maintaining this thread.

Thank you for the kind words, and no worries.

That is a very unconventional Eldar list... I'll ask my brother to give it a closer inspection (The craftworlders were his first army) but my initial impression is that they might have tailored a bit since they are putting such focus on low-to-mid strength, high rate of fire shooting (which GSC hates) at the expense of dedicated anti-tank for fighting Knights and the like. First thing that pops into my mind is to bring some Cult Russes, since they only have the fliers and Dark Reapers for dedicated anti-tank and of those only the Hemlock will be able to wound them on a 3+ (everything else should be S8). The Exterminator Autocannon is probably going to be the best gun for this particular match-up since it brings a very high rate of fire (8 S7 shots) which should help compensate for the accuracy penalties on the planes and the -1 damage ability on the Wave Serpents.

Also the newly buffed Aberrants should be an even match for the Wraith Blades if you pop Might from Beyond on them. That would be 6 swings per Power Pick model and 3 for each Hammer model.

I finally finished the Power Lifter pieces for my Sentinel models. I magnetized some Killa Kan arms and painted them suitably to match the other mining weapons. I think it does the job well and the bits are not expensive. Now to field these little ankle biters.

Caspian89 wrote:
I finally finished the Power Lifter pieces for my Sentinel models. I magnetized some Killa Kan arms and painted them suitably to match the other mining weapons. I think it does the job well and the bits are not expensive. Now to field these little ankle biters.

That was really pretty! Good job. I might steal that idea.

I've been tempted, but with the model no longer prduced for quite some time by FW it won't be long before they drop the rules entirely. Those still work as sentinels with the chainsaw if and when it happens though, and they do look good.

Your army is an inspiration! I really like the pallet you chose.

 Red Corsair wrote:
I've been tempted, but with the model no longer prduced for quite some time by FW it won't be long before they drop the rules entirely. Those still work as sentinels with the chainsaw if and when it happens though, and they do look good.

Your army is an inspiration! I really like the pallet you chose.

Thanks for your kind words.

The beauty of magnetizing my sentinels is that if the rules change I can't get too fussed about it. I just stop attaching the cutty bits and attach the shooty bits instead.

Yea I agree, I have the magnets but I am often too impatient to mess with them, so it is my own stupidity lol. I wish the standard chainsaw was better at least but it is funny getting buffs from nearby characters. Thats the other issue I have with the power lifters (which is my own problem) is I can't take them from a GSC detachment.

Man I am so ready for some points drops, the army is still very strong it just runs out of gas too early.

Mellon wrote:

mightymconeshot wrote:
Thanks. Are chimeras or Goliaths worth it to transport aberrants or genestealera?

IMHO, yes. They are a bit expensive in points but can be useful. Ambush with primus/stratagem is a better way to deliver assaulty units, but you can only do that once per turn. Transports are more reliable than an unmodified random ambush.

They benefit greatly from target saturation. If your army's only vehicles are two transports, it is likely that they will be shot to pieces before they get to deliver.

The chimera is probably the best transport for assault units. I like to use it with double heavy flamer for the auto hits.

Using just the primus is still pretty good odds, so taking a primus for each ambushing squad lets you drop several in a turn with most getting a good roll.

Personally I'm painting up several carnifex and a hive tyrant to be my on board anvil for the GSC ambush hammer.

Danny slag wrote:

Mellon wrote:

mightymconeshot wrote:
Thanks. Are chimeras or Goliaths worth it to transport aberrants or genestealera?

IMHO, yes. They are a bit expensive in points but can be useful. Ambush with primus/stratagem is a better way to deliver assaulty units, but you can only do that once per turn. Transports are more reliable than an unmodified random ambush.

They benefit greatly from target saturation. If your army's only vehicles are two transports, it is likely that they will be shot to pieces before they get to deliver.

The chimera is probably the best transport for assault units. I like to use it with double heavy flamer for the auto hits.

Using just the primus is still pretty good odds, so taking a primus for each ambushing squad lets you drop several in a turn with most getting a good roll.

Personally I'm painting up several carnifex and a hive tyrant to be my on board anvil for the GSC ambush hammer.

A Jormangondr gun line can do serious work. Add in GSC ambushers, and you've got an army. Though I'd use Neurothrope for the HQ's they are more survivable as characters, and still have cool Hive Mind Powerz!

I'm wondering how people are resolving their ambushing when wanting more than one HQ with a squad?

I have my Hammerant squad and I'd like to run that with the Abominant for his aura and his role which overlaps the Hammerants. Trouble is that I want the Primus too for the +1 to hit and the accurate ambush. So how do you propose I do it?

I can use the Primus + strategem for the Hammerant squad. Then for the lone Abominant use a single dice Cult Ambush roll backed by a regular 1CP point re-roll. Probably have the Abominant come in with Neophytes for some bubble wrap.

OR

Better to use the strategem for 2 dice on the Abominant attached to squad, re-roll if required. Then have the Primus come in alone (or with Neophytes) with a single dice Cult Ambush and 'natural' re-roll?

Same problem with a Genestealer Squad. Would like the accuracy of the Primus but I want the buffs/psychic of the Patriarch.

I have great success in just sticking my Abominant + Aberrants in a Rockgrinder and driving them up the field as fast as I can. My Primus ambushes with my big Acolyte squad. And since both the Aberrants and the Acolytes just want to smash the meanest units my opponent has they are often nearby each other by turn 2 or 3, thus the Aberrants are near the Primus for the +1 to-hit.

I also run 2x5 Acolytes w/ 2x2 Demo Charges in a Double HF Chimera with a Magus. They too drive around the field and are fast enough so that I can deliver the Magus to where I need him.

 Causalis wrote:
I have great success in just sticking my Abominant + Aberrants in a Rockgrinder and driving them up the field as fast as I can. My Primus ambushes with my big Acolyte squad. And since both the Aberrants and the Acolytes just want to smash the meanest units my opponent has they are often nearby each other by turn 2 or 3, thus the Aberrants are near the Primus for the +1 to-hit.

I also run 2x5 Acolytes w/ 2x2 Demo Charges in a Double HF Chimera with a Magus. They too drive around the field and are fast enough so that I can deliver the Magus to where I need him.

Do you find that 5 Abberants are enough to get the job done? Are you running them for hammers or picks?

Also, how do you find the Demo Charges work out? Having them pop out of a Chimera is awesome.

Played a 3 round RTT saturday and learned alot. My list was

2 primus
patriarch
Magus
abomanant

10 aberrants (4 hammer 6 pick)
10 acolytes (4saws)
20 purestrains
3 scout sentinels HF each seperate unit
5x10 neophyes with 1 grenade launcher (one unit had 2)
chimera
1750

Soooooo, mixed results. Played against Tau sept T'au game 1 which was rough. I had 1st turn and ambushed my abbs and purestains rolling a 6 on each, both had a primus with them. This was a mistake, I smelled blood like a shark and went for it. I failed to mind control his riptide 3 turns in a row which sucked since that was gona be my answer to drones. He essentially had a battalion and brigade with 5 man firewariors units all overlaping with fireblades, dark strider, etheral support. I lost 17 purestrains charging in not knowing what dark strider did (I was aware but forgot) his rolls were way above average. I never expected to win this one, but in hind sight I could have. Sould have ambushed the neos mostly instead, played squirrely, I was actually winning most of the game since he was stuck in one place (ITC) but it fell apart.

Game two I played admech with cawl, a pair of dakka bots and a pair of armigers. Not the best army and he wasn't the best p;layer either but we had a blast. Highlights were abberants killing an armiger then killing cawl lmao, had three hammers left on cawl near abomanant, rolled to hit and scored 5 6's and a 5 for 11 hits, needless to say he took 18 wounds and we recycled his body like soda cans. This game was bittersweet because my opponent was paying for his armigers from forge bane so was under points by 120 lol. I told him to redeploy his onegar but he declined, he figured I was overpaying by about that much a least and had no stratagems etc which was cool. It's also probably why the game was so fun. Oh, btw the purestrains came in killed some scrub rangers then died horribly. Again.

Game three I played blood angels and cadians (of course) This game was also hilarious. All day I wanted to mind control something cool, didn't care if I was tabled so long as I pulled off some fun tricks and all day so far I failed to cast a fething WC 6 power or the LD test even with a CP reroll. That changed here, he had a storm raven with hurricane bolters and I took it over every turn lol. I could tell he was getting a bit salty as it was mulching more of his stuff them mine. This game I decided to stagger my ambushers, purestrinas came in 1st again, murdered a 5 man tac squad, 10 man infantry and plinked some wounds on mephiston. Eventually they all died and meph survived somehow (couldn't roll rends for crap and his saved FNP's were red hot) after all you need to fish for 5's on him... he bailed out smash meph with captain smash, I then charged in my aberrants killed smash but stupid meph was on 1 wound in the end when time was called.

Lessons learned, 20 man prestrains and 10 man abberant units are too good. Sounds strange but it's true. They pop in, murder either cheap dispossable crap, or if your lucky a misplaced vanguard type unit, then they die. At 300 points it will never be worth the trade IMO. Consider 20 neophyte with the relic banner and might from beyond + primus will pretty much murder anything anyway, if they don't they have the bodies to wrap and trap. You don't want to finish your targets you want to cripple a couple then stay locked. Neos are so much better at this, you can be happy with pretty much any result as well besides a 3. Even then they can shoot at least. 2o neos with a unit standard is 120, arm with shot guns, on a 5 or 6 your going to assault but first you can shoot 40 S4 shots, then with the suggested support your attacking with another 41 s5 attacks htting on 3's rerolling 1's.

I love the abomanant but I am having the same issues it sounds like others are having, you want him to come in with the aberrants, so if they ambush your never reliable unless you tie the abs to a primus and daisy chain back to the abomanant. Honestly I think the answer is puting him in a chimera with them. You don't want your abs to ambush turn 1 due to the aformentioned screens, you also don't want to wait and risk poor rolls turn 2. Obvious answer seems to be a chimera.

That said, the abomanant hits harder then abs by a mile and he is 4X as resilient. As I said, abs and stealers overkill things as it stands, the abomant just makes the abs turn crushed units into red mist, not worth it usually. Again, have to say, best use is tie an abomanant to neophytes, with unquestioning loyalty hes not going anywhere and he will kill anything big. Mine hit an armiger game two, I min'd my damage rolls 1, 2 and 3 and still stripped 9 wounds, it did nothing back (5's to hit, becomes 2 damage and you ignore it on a 5+ then pass wounds off to scrubs THEN he heals) My idea for my next list is first wave going all in on neophytes, 3 abomanants mixed in and a patriarch (thought about going 3 patriarchs 3 abomanants) A patriarch does the work of an elite unit only he can't be targeted as well.

Anyway, soprry abut the messy post, needed a break from airbrushing and wanted to spill my beans on the RTT. Hit me back with discussion and we can craft some ideas.

Those are great thoughts and I have to say they make a lot of sense. Thanks for that!

 Red Corsair wrote:
Played a 3 round RTT saturday and learned alot. My list was
Lessons learned, 20 man prestrains and 10 man abberant units are too good. Sounds strange but it's true. They pop in, murder either cheap dispossable crap, or if your lucky a misplaced vanguard type unit, then they die. At 300 points it will never be worth the trade IMO. Consider 20 neophyte with the relic banner and might from beyond + primus will pretty much murder anything anyway, if they don't they have the bodies to wrap and trap. You don't want to finish your targets you want to cripple a couple then stay locked. Neos are so much better at this, you can be happy with pretty much any result as well besides a 3. Even then they can shoot at least. 2o neos with a unit standard is 120, arm with shot guns, on a 5 or 6 your going to assault but first you can shoot 40 S4 shots, then with the suggested support your attacking with another 41 s5 attacks htting on 3's rerolling 1's.

I love the abomanant but I am having the same issues it sounds like others are having, you want him to come in with the aberrants, so if they ambush your never reliable unless you tie the abs to a primus and daisy chain back to the abomanant. Honestly I think the answer is puting him in a chimera with them. You don't want your abs to ambush turn 1 due to the aformentioned screens, you also don't want to wait and risk poor rolls turn 2. Obvious answer seems to be a chimera.

That said, the abomanant hits harder then abs by a mile and he is 4X as resilient. As I said, abs and stealers overkill things as it stands, the abomant just makes the abs turn crushed units into red mist, not worth it usually. Again, have to say, best use is tie an abomanant to neophytes, with unquestioning loyalty hes not going anywhere and he will kill anything big. Mine hit an armiger game two, I min'd my damage rolls 1, 2 and 3 and still stripped 9 wounds, it did nothing back (5's to hit, becomes 2 damage and you ignore it on a 5+ then pass wounds off to scrubs THEN he heals) My idea for my next list is first wave going all in on neophytes, 3 abomanants mixed in and a patriarch (thought about going 3 patriarchs 3 abomanants) A patriarch does the work of an elite unit only he can't be targeted as well.

I agree with you about the 'wrap and trap' ability of Neophytes. I was able to take out one of those Primarus hover tanks and it's valuable crew by ramming it with 2 Rockgrinders and thair Rock-Saw Acolyte Crew. I had wrapped the back end of the tank with a squad of ambushed Neophytes and that was the end of almost 50% of my opponents army, no casualties!

I think it's a very clever idea to hide an Abominant inside big Neophyte squads. The Patriarch adds the extra oompf with the Fearless factor.

Bringing in 20 Neophytes with any of the HQs is a good deal. All the HQs really add something great to the basic Neophyte, depending on the battlefield need.

Yea the more I play the more I realize neophytes should really be the guys ambushing turn 1. There is no result they cannot work with. They are also dirt cheap and have the volume to keep your characters hidden and working.

I expect this to change a bit when acolytes get a cost adjustment though, right now they are just way too pricey. The durability of a guardsmen at 3x the cost lol.

 Red Corsair wrote:
Yea the more I play the more I realize neophytes should really be the guys ambushing turn 1. There is no result they cannot work with. They are also dirt cheap and have the volume to keep your characters hidden and working.

I expect this to change a bit when acolytes get a cost adjustment though, right now they are just way too pricey. The durability of a guardsmen at 3x the cost lol.

Acolytes are plain overpriced as of now...they are worth 6-7 points per model

KurtAngle2 wrote:

 Red Corsair wrote:
Yea the more I play the more I realize neophytes should really be the guys ambushing turn 1. There is no result they cannot work with. They are also dirt cheap and have the volume to keep your characters hidden and working.

I expect this to change a bit when acolytes get a cost adjustment though, right now they are just way too pricey. The durability of a guardsmen at 3x the cost lol.

Acolytes are plain overpriced as of now...they are worth 6-7 points per model

I'd say more like 8 ppm. I think dropping them to 6 would be too cheap. You got to remember, we are not just going to get cost adjustments, we are also going to gain more free rules essentially when we gain traits and stratagems. Either way we both can agree they are way to pricey currently, which is only made worse by the cost of their upgrades as well. I look forward to running rock drills seriously.

Do you find that 5 Abberants are enough to get the job done? Are you running them for hammers or picks?

Absolutely. As you can guess from Red Corsair's post, 10 Abberants just obliterate anything they touch and then just stand in the open. I run my five guys 2x Picks, 2x Hammers + Hypermorph w/ Improv Weapon. Together with the Abominant they can still crack open pretty much any tank and they will mulch through most units that don't have an invuln. Honestly, the Abominant is a bit too cheap. Any other character would have -1 to-hit with that enormous hammer (unless it is a special relic) and only be S4/T4.

I also find Purestrains not really worth it. First of all the models are pretty ugly and I haven't encoutered a unit yet where I wish I had Purestrains instead of Acolytes.