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Made in us
Sneaky Lictor






Hitokageresu wrote:How does the cult fare in friendly games?


Depends on what one defines as friendly games. Broadly speaking they should do well, though it is wise to keep in mind against less experienced opponents GSC can be overwhelming between their ability to drop threats right on top of the opposing army and the high damage potential the army has (generally if GSC can charge it, it will die).

gorgon wrote:
Even AM can easily min-max and get the ideal regiment rules they want for each of their detachments. In most cases you're looking at a single AM detachment for most GCult armies, and so a single set of regiment rules. So why the extra restrictions? There are already neutered AM units in the GCult list. Why slightly neuter any AM detachments also? Doesn't make much sense to me. *shrug*


We'll have to wait and see how it plays out, but if true I don't expect to see a Brood Brothers <regiment> until we get our codex, by which point AM might very well not be as attractive an ally for us as they are now. I also fully expect the AM units within the index will be brought in line with their Imperial equivalents, just a matter of how soon (still on the look out for the FAQ).

Also I am extremely curious to see how the Tyranid book turns out. Sharing the same faction keywords means some of the Stratagems may have some crossover potential.

 D6Damager wrote:
Mr.Pengwinn wrote:
Also apparently GSC placed 7th at the recent GT. I cant seem to find the list anywhere however. Anyone know where to look?


It was Magus spam plus AM detachment.


Any information on what units were taken alongside the Magi? While they could have simply loaded up on high command detachments, a Magnus really wants some pawns around to take hits on his behalf and act as denial batteries against opposing Smites.


Mr.Pengwinn wrote:
I was hoping for a more pure GSC list.


Here's one I've been tinkering with that took 5th place at a local tournament last month. It probably would have placed higher had I been able to finish my last game (opponent seized on me and we didn't get past turn 2/top of 3 before time was called...) but overall it performed well on the table.

Spoiler:

Genestealer Cult Battalion Detachment:
HQ: 1x Primus
HQ: 1x Magus

TROOPS: 10x Acolytes
- 4x Demolition Charges
TROOPS: 10x Acolytes
- 4x Demolition Charges
TROOPS: 5x Acolytes
- 2x Rock Saws
TROOPS: 5x Acolytes
- 2x Rock Saws

DT: 1x Goliath Truck
- Demolition Cache
DT: 1x Goliath Truck
- Demolition Cache

HEAVY: 1x Goliath Rockgrinder
HEAVY: 1x Goliath Rockgrinder
HEAVY: 1x Goliath Rockgrinder

Genestealer Cult Battalion Detachment:
HQ: 1x Magus
HQ: 1x Magus

TROOPS: 10x Neophytes
- Leader Bolt Pistol
- 2x Grenade Launchers
- 2x Mining Lasers
TROOPS: 10x Neophytes
- 2x Grenade Launchers
- 2x Mining Lasers
TROOPS: 10x Neophytes
- 2x Grenade Launchers
- 2x Mining Lasers

DT: 1x Goliath Truck
DT: 1x Goliath Truck
DT: 1x Goliath Truck

Total: 2000 points


I'm thinking I might swap some of the Mining Lasers for Seismic Cannons and the Rock Saws for Demolition Charges as further optimizations. The Mining Lasers did ok but were overshadowed by other weapons for anti-tank and I ended up needing more anti-infantry firepower than anything else. Seismic Cannons mesh nicely with the Grenade Launchers weapon profiles so they should allow the squads to double down on their main roles while retaining an element of flexibility. As for the Rock Saws, they never really got a chance to do much work, as they generally ended up taking hits on behalf of their boss or else were targeted in attempt to get to their boss once disembarked.

One thing I really likeis the flexibility of deployment the list offered. When I needed first turn I could condense all 19 drops down to 8 while retaining the option of deploying almost all of the infantry via ambush.

This message was edited 3 times. Last update was at 2017/10/23 03:58:57


 
   
Made in us
Fresh-Faced New User




 Strat_N8 wrote:



Mr.Pengwinn wrote:
I was hoping for a more pure GSC list.


Here's one I've been tinkering with that took 5th place at a local tournament last month. It probably would have placed higher had I been able to finish my last game (opponent seized on me and we didn't get past turn 2/top of 3 before time was called...) but overall it performed well on the table.

Spoiler:

Genestealer Cult Battalion Detachment:
HQ: 1x Primus
HQ: 1x Magus

TROOPS: 10x Acolytes
- 4x Demolition Charges
TROOPS: 10x Acolytes
- 4x Demolition Charges
TROOPS: 5x Acolytes
- 2x Rock Saws
TROOPS: 5x Acolytes
- 2x Rock Saws

DT: 1x Goliath Truck
- Demolition Cache
DT: 1x Goliath Truck
- Demolition Cache

HEAVY: 1x Goliath Rockgrinder
HEAVY: 1x Goliath Rockgrinder
HEAVY: 1x Goliath Rockgrinder

Genestealer Cult Battalion Detachment:
HQ: 1x Magus
HQ: 1x Magus

TROOPS: 10x Neophytes
- Leader Bolt Pistol
- 2x Grenade Launchers
- 2x Mining Lasers
TROOPS: 10x Neophytes
- 2x Grenade Launchers
- 2x Mining Lasers
TROOPS: 10x Neophytes
- 2x Grenade Launchers
- 2x Mining Lasers

DT: 1x Goliath Truck
DT: 1x Goliath Truck
DT: 1x Goliath Truck

Total: 2000 points


I'm thinking I might swap some of the Mining Lasers for Seismic Cannons and the Rock Saws for Demolition Charges as further optimizations. The Mining Lasers did ok but were overshadowed by other weapons for anti-tank and I ended up needing more anti-infantry firepower than anything else. Seismic Cannons mesh nicely with the Grenade Launchers weapon profiles so they should allow the squads to double down on their main roles while retaining an element of flexibility. As for the Rock Saws, they never really got a chance to do much work, as they generally ended up taking hits on behalf of their boss or else were targeted in attempt to get to their boss once disembarked.

One thing I really likeis the flexibility of deployment the list offered. When I needed first turn I could condense all 19 drops down to 8 while retaining the option of deploying almost all of the infantry via ambush.

So that looks neat, but I got a question. How many Acolytes can use the Cache of Demolition Charges? Is it just one per shooting phase? I'm fairly new but I could never seem to find an answer for this in the Index.
   
Made in us
Sneaky Lictor






Mr.Pengwinn wrote:

So that looks neat, but I got a question. How many Acolytes can use the Cache of Demolition Charges? Is it just one per shooting phase? I'm fairly new but I could never seem to find an answer for this in the Index.


Technically none as the Demolition Cache is a vehicle weapon system that activates when a unit is embarked (like the Lasgun Array on the Chimera) so the Goliath Truck/Rockgrinder that is equipped with the Demolition Cache makes the attack using the profile. The Acolytes themselves can throw as many Demolition Charges as they are equipped with.



   
Made in ca
Fresh-Faced New User




 Strat_N8 wrote:

Here's one I've been tinkering with that took 5th place at a local tournament last month. It probably would have placed higher had I been able to finish my last game (opponent seized on me and we didn't get past turn 2/top of 3 before time was called...) but overall it performed well on the table.

Spoiler:

Genestealer Cult Battalion Detachment:
HQ: 1x Primus
HQ: 1x Magus

TROOPS: 10x Acolytes
- 4x Demolition Charges
TROOPS: 10x Acolytes
- 4x Demolition Charges
TROOPS: 5x Acolytes
- 2x Rock Saws
TROOPS: 5x Acolytes
- 2x Rock Saws

DT: 1x Goliath Truck
- Demolition Cache
DT: 1x Goliath Truck
- Demolition Cache

HEAVY: 1x Goliath Rockgrinder
HEAVY: 1x Goliath Rockgrinder
HEAVY: 1x Goliath Rockgrinder

Genestealer Cult Battalion Detachment:
HQ: 1x Magus
HQ: 1x Magus

TROOPS: 10x Neophytes
- Leader Bolt Pistol
- 2x Grenade Launchers
- 2x Mining Lasers
TROOPS: 10x Neophytes
- 2x Grenade Launchers
- 2x Mining Lasers
TROOPS: 10x Neophytes
- 2x Grenade Launchers
- 2x Mining Lasers

DT: 1x Goliath Truck
DT: 1x Goliath Truck
DT: 1x Goliath Truck

Total: 2000 points


I'm thinking I might swap some of the Mining Lasers for Seismic Cannons and the Rock Saws for Demolition Charges as further optimizations. The Mining Lasers did ok but were overshadowed by other weapons for anti-tank and I ended up needing more anti-infantry firepower than anything else. Seismic Cannons mesh nicely with the Grenade Launchers weapon profiles so they should allow the squads to double down on their main roles while retaining an element of flexibility. As for the Rock Saws, they never really got a chance to do much work, as they generally ended up taking hits on behalf of their boss or else were targeted in attempt to get to their boss once disembarked.

One thing I really likeis the flexibility of deployment the list offered. When I needed first turn I could condense all 19 drops down to 8 while retaining the option of deploying almost all of the infantry via ambush.


I've been very curious to hear how this list did. Thanks for the update. From my perspective as a relatively new player it's great to see a list not using Genestealers, which seem like the obvious best choice, bar-none in the army. Note that I said 'seem like.' Your use of Acolytes has me thinking about how useful they are and how flexible given their decent melee stat line.

I'm really curious to hear more about the demolition charges both the Cache versions and the infantry version. How useful did they turn out? What was the randomness factor like for you? How about the getting into range issue, the weapons only being 6."

How long did it take you to collect and paint 8 Goliath models!? They are $ expensive!

How often are you planting your Neophytes and shooting to avoid the -1 to hit with the Heavy Weapons?

Can you go over how you move your vehicles and delpoy your guys? I'm not clear on the tactics when it comes to using vehicles to deliver charging units - what I think is called "Rhino Rush."

Thank-you for any time you spend answering these questions. I'm keen on the army, working on painting-up what I have and there is very little tactical information available for this army online.
   
Made in us
Sneaky Lictor






Caspian89 wrote:

I've been very curious to hear how this list did. Thanks for the update. From my perspective as a relatively new player it's great to see a list not using Genestealers, which seem like the obvious best choice, bar-none in the army. Note that I said 'seem like.' Your use of Acolytes has me thinking about how useful they are and how flexible given their decent melee stat line.


I tend to not use Genestealers as often as I probably should simply because mine are a mish-mash of newer models with my modern color scheme and older models with "still learning how to paint" schemes (put waaaaayyy too much shade on my first models, making their flesh more of a dark brown than the rusty orange the newer ones are). Still, Acolytes are better than a lot of people give them credit but they do not do mass rending attacks very well. They need to take advantage of their special weapon options to tailor them for a specific task, otherwise they won't be as efficient as they should be.


Caspian89 wrote:

I'm really curious to hear more about the demolition charges both the Cache versions and the infantry version. How useful did they turn out? What was the randomness factor like for you? How about the getting into range issue, the weapons only being 6."


The Demolition Charges did well for the most part, save for the second game against a foot-based Astra Militarium list where they didn't have any particularly juicy targets to go after (just Celestine, but she gets back up so...). The randomness is a potential issue but I rolled mostly average for the number of shots during the tournament and if nothing else there is always a command point reroll available for at least one shot. I didn't have much problem with range with the squads mounted in a Goliath, as it gives them an extra 12'' of movement (for an 18'' threat range) and allows all of the charges to be thrown from the same point on the hull.

I'm not sure what I think about the Demolition Cache upgrade, as in the first game the Goliaths were shot out from under the squads before they were in range themselves while in the other games the squads themselves generally blew up whatever they targeted which left the truck without anything to use the charges against. I still need to try them on the Rockgrinders though, as they should pair nicely with the Clearance Incinerators.

Caspian89 wrote:

How long did it take you to collect and paint 8 Goliath models!? They are $ expensive!


I already had two Rockgrinders and three Trucks from 7th edition as formation fodder so I only needed two more trucks and a single Rockgrinder. Painting actually went surprisingly fast, I think I had the three new acquisitions done in the week leading up to the tournament with the Rockgrinder itself being painted the night before. Our shop also has a punch-card program that grants $25 off when a full card is turned in, so that helped ease some of the burden.

Reminds me, I probably should update that painting thread I made regarding the army...

Caspian89 wrote:

How often are you planting your Neophytes and shooting to avoid the -1 to hit with the Heavy Weapons?


Depends on how they deployed. If they Ambush they generally just stay put in whatever cover they set up in while in the Goliaths they generally remain stationary once they reach an optimal firing location (generally 24'' out) but will move if needed. I've generally found the bulk of the work is done by the autogunners and grenade launchers using their frag profile while the Mining Lasers are mostly for targets of opportunity. As mentioned prior, I'm tempted to swap a squad or two over to Seismic Cannons to double down on anti-infantry firepower since they provided the bulk of my infantry removal alongside the mass heavy stubbers and clearance incinerators.

Caspian89 wrote:

Can you go over how you move your vehicles and delpoy your guys? I'm not clear on the tactics when it comes to using vehicles to deliver charging units - what I think is called "Rhino Rush."


There isn't really that much thought to it. Each vehicle gives the squad inside 9'' from its hull to be placed (3'' disembark + 6'' movement) and if this is sufficient to put them at about 8-9'' away from the foe I'll consider disembarking them to set them up for a charge. The main thing to keep in mind is to leave a route for the transport itself to charge as it makes an excellent overwatch sponge for its cargo (and in the case of the Rockgrinder is deadly in its own right) and gives survivors an escape option once the foe is dead or fled.

Caspian89 wrote:

Thank-you for any time you spend answering these questions. I'm keen on the army, working on painting-up what I have and there is very little tactical information available for this army online.


Happy to be of help! I think the dearth of tactical information is partially a side effect of the 7th edition meta list for the army not transitioning to the new edition well at all coupled with their being a relatively new army coming into 8th edition.
   
Made in pl
Regular Dakkanaut






I am about to get me some 6 boxes of neophytes for my army. I think I will get an uneven split between shotguns and autoguns (2 squads with shotguns and 4 with autoguns). How do you think I should outfit them? Keep them bare to keep the cost low or get some special weapons? Which ones are considered the best option?
   
Made in us
Sneaky Lictor






 Kandela wrote:
I am about to get me some 6 boxes of neophytes for my army. I think I will get an uneven split between shotguns and autoguns (2 squads with shotguns and 4 with autoguns). How do you think I should outfit them? Keep them bare to keep the cost low or get some special weapons? Which ones are considered the best option?


I'd probably build 2x flamers for each Shotgun squad and 2x Grenade Launchers for each autogun squad as the weapons pair well with the main weapons while remaining fairly inexpensive relative to the firepower boost they provide. The heavy mining weapons are all useful in their own way, just a matter of what you need. Mining Lasers are good against multi-wound infantry and can plink wounds off vehicles while the Heavy Stubber and Seismic Cannon offers more anti-infantry firepower. Of those two, I personally like the Seismic Cannon slightly more than the Heavy Stubber since it can't be gotten elsewhere and its range band matches with the other weapons in the squad, but both are viable and the Heavy Stubber is half the cost so it is easier to spam.

Regardless of options, make sure you always take two of whatever you choose. One of the biggest advantages Neophytes have over Guardsmen (besides built-in ambush) is that they can double up on special and heavy weapons while the Guard only get 1 of each.

   
Made in gb
Regular Dakkanaut




I tried a Magus smite battery (5x magus in a supreme command) in my tyranid list in a friendly the other day and my god it felt cheesy. Was fun though, they tore holes in his army, would recommend.
   
Made in pl
Regular Dakkanaut






 Strat_N8 wrote:
 Kandela wrote:
I am about to get me some 6 boxes of neophytes for my army. I think I will get an uneven split between shotguns and autoguns (2 squads with shotguns and 4 with autoguns). How do you think I should outfit them? Keep them bare to keep the cost low or get some special weapons? Which ones are considered the best option?


I'd probably build 2x flamers for each Shotgun squad and 2x Grenade Launchers for each autogun squad as the weapons pair well with the main weapons while remaining fairly inexpensive relative to the firepower boost they provide. The heavy mining weapons are all useful in their own way, just a matter of what you need. Mining Lasers are good against multi-wound infantry and can plink wounds off vehicles while the Heavy Stubber and Seismic Cannon offers more anti-infantry firepower. Of those two, I personally like the Seismic Cannon slightly more than the Heavy Stubber since it can't be gotten elsewhere and its range band matches with the other weapons in the squad, but both are viable and the Heavy Stubber is half the cost so it is easier to spam.

Regardless of options, make sure you always take two of whatever you choose. One of the biggest advantages Neophytes have over Guardsmen (besides built-in ambush) is that they can double up on special and heavy weapons while the Guard only get 1 of each.



Thanks, I always overlooked Seismic Cannon as it was very expensive. Nice to know it's good option. I'm a big fan of grenade launchers myself - grenade launchers with mortar is a great combination in my opinion, good to know that they are recommended.


EDIT:
Could somebody review my list?
Spoiler:

++ Supreme Command (CP +1) (Genestealer_Cults) [365 Pts] ++

+ HQ +

Magus

Magus

Magus

Magus

Magus

+ 'Faction +

Genestealer Cults

++ Battalion (CP +3) (Genestealer_Cults) [1635 Pts] ++

+ Troops +

Acolyte Hybrids: 5x Acolyte Hybrid, 2x Heavy Rock Saw

Acolyte Hybrids: 5x Acolyte Hybrid, 2x Heavy Rock Saw

Neophyte Hybrids: 2x Grenade Launcher, Mortar, 10x Neophyte Hybrid - Autoguns

Neophyte Hybrids: 2x Grenade Launcher, Mortar, 10x Neophyte Hybrid - Autoguns

Neophyte Hybrids: 2x Grenade Launcher, Mortar, 10x Neophyte Hybrid - Autoguns

Neophyte Hybrids: 10x Neophyte Hybrid - Shotguns

+ HQ +

Acolyte Iconward

Magus

+ Fast Attack +

Cult Armored Sentinels: 2x Cult Armored Sentinel, 2x Lascannon

Cult Armored Sentinels: 2x Cult Armored Sentinel, 2x Lascannon

Cult Scout Sentinels: 2x Cult Scout Sentinel, 2x Heavy Flamer

+ Heavy Support +

Cult Leman Russ: Battle Cannon, Heavy Bolter

Cult Leman Russ: Battle Cannon, Heavy Bolter

+ Dedicated Transport +

Cult Chimera: Heavy Flamer, Heavy Flamer

Cult Chimera: Heavy Bolter, Heavy Bolter

Cult Chimera: Heavy Bolter, Heavy Bolter

Cult Chimera: Heavy Bolter, Heavy Bolter

+ 'Faction +

Genestealer Cults

++ Total: [2000 Pts] ++

Created with BattleScribe (https://battlescribe.net)

I know it looks a bit cheesy but I hope to win some games with them (and since I view my cult as Tzeentchian cult it's very fluffy!).
Woops! Bad BattleScribe - no points now!

This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2017/10/20 17:09:08


 
   
Made in us
Sneaky Lictor






 Kandela wrote:


EDIT:
Could somebody review my list?
Spoiler:

++ Supreme Command (CP +1) (Genestealer_Cults) [365 Pts] ++

+ HQ +

Magus

Magus

Magus

Magus

Magus

+ 'Faction +

Genestealer Cults

++ Battalion (CP +3) (Genestealer_Cults) [1635 Pts] ++

+ Troops +

Acolyte Hybrids: 5x Acolyte Hybrid, 2x Heavy Rock Saw

Acolyte Hybrids: 5x Acolyte Hybrid, 2x Heavy Rock Saw

Neophyte Hybrids: 2x Grenade Launcher, Mortar, 10x Neophyte Hybrid - Autoguns

Neophyte Hybrids: 2x Grenade Launcher, Mortar, 10x Neophyte Hybrid - Autoguns

Neophyte Hybrids: 2x Grenade Launcher, Mortar, 10x Neophyte Hybrid - Autoguns

Neophyte Hybrids: 10x Neophyte Hybrid - Shotguns

+ HQ +

Acolyte Iconward

Magus

+ Fast Attack +

Cult Armored Sentinels: 2x Cult Armored Sentinel, 2x Lascannon

Cult Armored Sentinels: 2x Cult Armored Sentinel, 2x Lascannon

Cult Scout Sentinels: 2x Cult Scout Sentinel, 2x Heavy Flamer

+ Heavy Support +

Cult Leman Russ: Battle Cannon, Heavy Bolter

Cult Leman Russ: Battle Cannon, Heavy Bolter

+ Dedicated Transport +

Cult Chimera: Heavy Flamer, Heavy Flamer

Cult Chimera: Heavy Bolter, Heavy Bolter

Cult Chimera: Heavy Bolter, Heavy Bolter

Cult Chimera: Heavy Bolter, Heavy Bolter

+ 'Faction +

Genestealer Cults

++ Total: [2000 Pts] ++

Created with BattleScribe (https://battlescribe.net)

I know it looks a bit cheesy but I hope to win some games with them (and since I view my cult as Tzeentchian cult it's very fluffy!).


The main vulnerability I see with the list is the melee presence is a bit lacking with just 10 Acolytes and an Iconward (I suppose the Magi too, but they would rather hang back and Smite). Smaller Acolyte squads in my experience tend to operate like missiles that hit the foe and then are expended unless there are other things around that warrant more attention ('stealers, Rockgrinders, etc.). Admittedly it may not be too big an issue since your list as a whole has a lot of firepower to throw at the foe, but worth keeping in mind. One nice thing about the list is that you have lots of ambush slots available due to the mechanized elements, so it might be worth trying a few games ambushing with most of the Neophytes and Magi while the Chimera rumble forward and use the transports to relocate them as needed. Also if you want to squeeze a little more cheese out of the list, take the Leman Russes and Sentinels from the battalion and form an Astra Militarium Outrider detachment with one or both of the Russes as tank commanders for the mandatory HQ choice and an upgrade to BS: 3+.

Regardless, looking forward to hearing how it works for you.
   
Made in us
Longtime Dakkanaut






C4790M wrote:
I tried a Magus smite battery (5x magus in a supreme command) in my tyranid list in a friendly the other day and my god it felt cheesy. Was fun though, they tore holes in his army, would recommend.


How did you play it? Did you use Cult Ambush at all or just walk them? In a Nids army i'm thinking of walking them if no snipers.

15k+ 10k+ 5k :Harlequin: 3k

Reading/Writing LD, be kind!

https://maddpaint.blogspot.com 
   
Made in pl
Regular Dakkanaut







The main vulnerability I see with the list is the melee presence is a bit lacking with just 10 Acolytes and an Iconward (I suppose the Magi too, but they would rather hang back and Smite). Smaller Acolyte squads in my experience tend to operate like missiles that hit the foe and then are expended unless there are other things around that warrant more attention ('stealers, Rockgrinders, etc.). Admittedly it may not be too big an issue since your list as a whole has a lot of firepower to throw at the foe, but worth keeping in mind. One nice thing about the list is that you have lots of ambush slots available due to the mechanized elements, so it might be worth trying a few games ambushing with most of the Neophytes and Magi while the Chimera rumble forward and use the transports to relocate them as needed. Also if you want to squeeze a little more cheese out of the list, take the Leman Russes and Sentinels from the battalion and form an Astra Militarium Outrider detachment with one or both of the Russes as tank commanders for the mandatory HQ choice and an upgrade to BS: 3+.

Regardless, looking forward to hearing how it works for you.


This. Is. Brilliant. Thank you. I will definitely use that little cheese gem.
   
Made in gb
Regular Dakkanaut




 Amishprn86 wrote:
C4790M wrote:
I tried a Magus smite battery (5x magus in a supreme command) in my tyranid list in a friendly the other day and my god it felt cheesy. Was fun though, they tore holes in his army, would recommend.


How did you play it? Did you use Cult Ambush at all or just walk them? In a Nids army i'm thinking of walking them if no snipers.


I did ambush them, but I’m not sure if it was the right call. I basically popped them all up close to eachother behind the enemy force (went second vs eldar). I’d almost definately footslog them in a future list though, wrap em all snug in a malanthrope/termagant sushi roll
   
Made in us
Longtime Dakkanaut






C4790M wrote:
 Amishprn86 wrote:
C4790M wrote:
I tried a Magus smite battery (5x magus in a supreme command) in my tyranid list in a friendly the other day and my god it felt cheesy. Was fun though, they tore holes in his army, would recommend.


How did you play it? Did you use Cult Ambush at all or just walk them? In a Nids army i'm thinking of walking them if no snipers.


I did ambush them, but I’m not sure if it was the right call. I basically popped them all up close to eachother behind the enemy force (went second vs eldar). I’d almost definately footslog them in a future list though, wrap em all snug in a malanthrope/termagant sushi roll


Yeah having 5 characters mixed in should be really hard to kill them.

15k+ 10k+ 5k :Harlequin: 3k

Reading/Writing LD, be kind!

https://maddpaint.blogspot.com 
   
Made in pl
Regular Dakkanaut






 Strat_N8 wrote:

The main vulnerability I see with the list is the melee presence is a bit lacking with just 10 Acolytes and an Iconward (I suppose the Magi too, but they would rather hang back and Smite). Smaller Acolyte squads in my experience tend to operate like missiles that hit the foe and then are expended unless there are other things around that warrant more attention ('stealers, Rockgrinders, etc.). Admittedly it may not be too big an issue since your list as a whole has a lot of firepower to throw at the foe, but worth keeping in mind. One nice thing about the list is that you have lots of ambush slots available due to the mechanized elements, so it might be worth trying a few games ambushing with most of the Neophytes and Magi while the Chimera rumble forward and use the transports to relocate them as needed. Also if you want to squeeze a little more cheese out of the list, take the Leman Russes and Sentinels from the battalion and form an Astra Militarium Outrider detachment with one or both of the Russes as tank commanders for the mandatory HQ choice and an upgrade to BS: 3+.

Regardless, looking forward to hearing how it works for you.


Well I played some test (with heavy proxing - I was AdMech player before) games (2) with my friend and my brother - one against heavy melee Dark Eldars and one against Genestealer Cult.
Have to say I wasn't expecting anything out of my list but was both pleasantly surprised and worried by your excellent deduction skills:
- Against both armies I lacked melee numbers
- Acolytes break face and die the next turn due to heavy fire
- Ambush rocks, I don't know why I was worried to use it - just had to re-roll 1s and 2s for it to be useful
- Smite battery works wonderful! I just carted their ass in chimera and dropped where they could do some damage
- Shotguns are... mediocre. They look cool but have short threat range and not that good in cc as Acolytes.
- Chimeras with double Heavy Bolter rock. In both games they managed to wipe some infantry, kill a fragile carrier (Venom I believe) and cart around some Magi.
- Leman Russes were OK.
- Had a problem with Rockgrinders and enemy Leman Russes - too little heavy firepower.

Due to these things I decided that I should change my list just slighly
Spoiler:

++ Supreme Command (CP +1) (Genestealer_Cults) ++

+ HQ +

Magus

Magus

Magus

Magus

Magus

++ Battalion (CP +3) (Genestealer_Cults) ++

+ Troops +

Acolyte Hybrids: 5x Acolyte Hybrid, 2x Heavy Rock Saw

Acolyte Hybrids: 5x Acolyte Hybrid, 2x Heavy Rock Saw

Acolyte Hybrids: 5x Acolyte Hybrid, 2x Heavy Rock Saw

Neophyte Hybrids: 2x Grenade Launcher, 10x Neophyte Hybrid, 2x Seismic Cannon

Neophyte Hybrids: 2x Grenade Launcher, 10x Neophyte Hybrid, 2x Seismic Cannon

Neophyte Hybrids: 2x Grenade Launcher, 10x Neophyte Hybrid, 2x Seismic Cannon

+ HQ +

Acolyte Iconward

Acolyte Iconward

+ Fast Attack +

Cult Armored Sentinels: 2x Cult Armored Sentinel, 2x Lascannon

Cult Armored Sentinels: 2x Cult Armored Sentinel, 2x Lascannon

Cult Armored Sentinels: Cult Armored Sentinel, Hunter Killer Missile, Lascannon

+ Heavy Support +

Cult Leman Russ: Battle Cannon, Heavy Bolter
. . Two Heavy Bolters: 2x Heavy Bolter

Cult Leman Russ: Battle Cannon, Heavy Bolter
. . Two Heavy Bolters: 2x Heavy Bolter

+ Dedicated Transport +

Cult Chimera: Heavy Bolter, Heavy Bolter

Cult Chimera: Heavy Bolter, Heavy Bolter

Cult Chimera: Heavy Bolter, Heavy Bolter

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Made in us
Fresh-Faced New User




for smite spam.

are primarus psykers better than a magus now?
   
Made in us
Sneaky Lictor






FAQ dropped and the main post has been updated accordingly.

- Brood Brothers are now a <Regiment> and locks out the regiments from the Astra Militarium Codex though it is implied they will get their own trait when the GSC codex itself drops. (guess I was wrong earlier )
- Cult Leman Russ now has the same Grinding Advance as the Astra Militarium one.
- Armored Sentinels are now T6 like the Astra Militarium ones.

The Astra Militarium received quite a few changes as well, with the most major being Commissars now kill a model to reroll failed moral tests instead of limiting moral casualties to 1.

Kandela wrote:
- Had a problem with Rockgrinders and enemy Leman Russes - too little heavy firepower.


If you are still in the proxy stage, try running some of your Acolytes with Demolition Charges. From my experience they are great for cracking high value targets like Russes and the like when used en-mass. If they don't blow the target up in one go it generally will be damaged enough something else can finish it off. Each Acolyte box also comes with 2 sets while only having 1 of the other mining weapon options, so they are slightly easier to amass as well. Might from Beyond is also very helpful for any of the other Acolyte weapons going after T8 models, as it allows them to wound on 3's instead of 4's.

If nothing else, Aberrants and their S10 hammers have no problem wrecking armored targets and they play rather well with mechanized lists. With your Chimeras you can fit a medium-sized Acolyte Squad and Aberrant squad in one transport.

sureblade wrote:for smite spam.

are primarus psykers better than a magus now?


Not sure. They are cheaper per model and have a bit of innate insurance against catastrophic perils but their secondary power selection isn't as good and they loose out on Cult Ambush, Unquestioning Loyalty, and Spiritual Leader abilities. Taking them en-mass also means sacrificing your Astra Militarium detachment allowance for a High Command, which may or may not be worth it depending on what else you may want to borrow.

Thematically I like the idea of using them in conjunction with Magi though. It would stand to reason captive psykers would be released when the Cult begins its uprising to add to the carnage and confusion.

This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2017/10/23 05:32:33


 
   
Made in ca
Fresh-Faced New User




 Strat_N8 wrote:
FAQ dropped and the main post has been updated accordingly.


Well I must say I am disappointed but not surprised by the FAQ. One thing to note is that the Cult Leman Russ DID NOT drop 10 points like the AM version did - just a little salt in the wound.

   
Made in us
Sneaky Lictor






To be fair, the Forge World versions didn't see a cost reduction either. I'm not too bothered by it, as we gained the new version of Grinding Advance which boosts the firepower of each tank significantly and makes taking 1-2 tanks more appealing (any more than that would probably be better as a Brood Brother spearhead).

Also while Brood Brothers replaces the Regiment Keyword, by the look of things we can still use the unaligned relics and warlord traits. The Daggers of Tu'Sahk in particular look like they would work nice with us as they allow a character and infantry unit to "ambush" from a table edge in a similar manner to results 1 and 2 on our ambush table. All manner of possibilities there, be it a blob of infantry or some Bullgryns.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2017/10/23 14:42:10


 
   
Made in ca
Fresh-Faced New User




 Strat_N8 wrote:
To be fair, the Forge World versions didn't see a cost reduction either. I'm not too bothered by it, as we gained the new version of Grinding Advance which boosts the firepower of each tank significantly and makes taking 1-2 tanks more appealing (any more than that would probably be better as a Brood Brother spearhead).


Can we also access non-regiment specific Stratagems?
   
Made in us
Snord





Florida

Caspian89 wrote:
 Strat_N8 wrote:
FAQ dropped and the main post has been updated accordingly.


Well I must say I am disappointed but not surprised by the FAQ. One thing to note is that the Cult Leman Russ DID NOT drop 10 points like the AM version did - just a little salt in the wound.



Me too. Valhallan Banehammer was fun while it lasted.

I play:
40K: Daemons, Genestealer Cults
AoS: Blades of Khorne
Warmachine: Convergence of Cyriss
Infinity: Haqqislam, Combined Army
Malifaux: Gremlins,Neverborn
Wrath of Kings: Shael Han
Dark Age: Brood, Kukulkani
Guild Ball: Morticians, Brewers 
   
Made in us
Sneaky Lictor






Caspian89 wrote:Can we also access non-regiment specific Stratagems?


Yes as far as I can tell. The FAQ only specifically restricts Brood Brothers from using <Regiment> specific items, orders, and characters.
   
Made in us
Dominating Dominatrix






Southeastern PA, USA

Well, I fully expect that the eventual Brood Brothers regiment rule will give something really 'useful' like WS 3+.

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Made in ca
Fresh-Faced New User




If indeed we can use AM Stratagems then how about using 'Crush Them!' with a Sentinel Power Lifter - found in the Forgeworld Imperial Armour book. The Sentinel in particular (which gets a scout move!) can move 9", Advance and still charge (with the stratagem), hitting on 2+'s, 3Attacks, Strength 10, -2AP, D3 Damage each. It doesn't degrade like other vehicles either and can take on another role using "Go Recon!" at other stages in the game to move quick or grab objectives. I think I will prefer this version of the Scout Sentinel over a Heavy Flamer version. Sadly I don't see any powerlifter kits on the FW website at this time.
EDIT: Sadly "Go Recon!" clearly states that it only targets Scout Sentinels and that's it.
EDIT 2: Also noticed that Power Lifters are Heavy Support and not Fast Attack...odd.
EDIT 3: Forgeworld has confirmed that they no longer produce Sentinel Power Lifters, nor do they plan too. If I'm that keen on them I would make them out of Kastelian Robots as the base with Meganobz bits for arms.

Surely we will get a similar Stratagem to "Crush them!" that we can utilize with our Rockgrinders. Maybe it will be called "Grind them!" or maybe "Mincemeat!"

And I will be taking Kurov's Aquilla every time.

Seperate topic: Has anyone tried running Biovores in their lists? They seems pretty great and very tactically flexible. Adding to the mortal wound spam OR messing up opponent movement and reserve placement. They are also cheap.

This message was edited 6 times. Last update was at 2017/10/24 18:20:43


 
   
Made in pl
Regular Dakkanaut






Wanted to share results of another proxy game against my friend playing Genestealer Cult:

List I used:
Spoiler:


++ Battalion (CP +3) (Genestealer_Cults) ++

+ Troops +

Acolyte Hybrids: 5x Acolyte Hybrid, 2x Heavy Rock Saw

Acolyte Hybrids: 5x Acolyte Hybrid, 2x Heavy Rock Saw

Acolyte Hybrids: 5x Acolyte Hybrid, 2x Heavy Rock Saw

Neophyte Hybrids: 2x Grenade Launcher, 10x Neophyte Hybrid

Neophyte Hybrids: 2x Grenade Launcher, 10x Neophyte Hybrid

Neophyte Hybrids: 2x Grenade Launcher, 10x Neophyte Hybrid

+ Elites +

Abberants: 4x Abberant, 4x Power Hammer

+ HQ +

Acolyte Iconward

Acolyte Iconward

+ Fast Attack +

Cult Armored Sentinels: 2x Cult Armored Sentinel, 2x Lascannon

Cult Armored Sentinels: 2x Cult Armored Sentinel, 2x Lascannon

+ Heavy Support +

Cult Leman Russ: Battle Cannon, Heavy Bolter
. Two Heavy Bolters: 2x Heavy Bolter

Cult Leman Russ: Battle Cannon, Heavy Bolter
. Two Heavy Bolters: 2x Heavy Bolter

+ Dedicated Transport +

Cult Chimera: Heavy Bolter, Heavy Bolter

Cult Chimera: Heavy Bolter, Heavy Bolter

Cult Chimera: Heavy Bolter, Heavy Bolter

++ Supreme Command (CP +1) (Genestealer_Cults) ++

+ HQ +

Magus

Magus

Magus

Magus

Magus



Results - minor victory for me (2 points more than my friend)

Notes:
- Smite battery great again! They squashed squad of enemy genestealers in one turn (10 Genestealers).
- Aberrants are decent answer against enemy heavies - they kill whatever they need to kill and then stand there threateningly ensuring overreaction from enemy.
- Leman Russ with Grinding Assault is premium heavy hitter. They can kill whatever they want - kind of swiss army knife of vehicles.
- I think I like my Neophytes squad with only grenade launchers as it warrants them staying cheap and mobile.
- Acolytes with Rock Saws are indeed like a missile - unless you park an Iconward behind them, then they turn a little more tricky to kill.
- Don't know what to say about Sentinels - they are OK at dealing with enemy heavies I guess. Nothing major though.

That leads me to creation of my future shopping list:
6 boxes of Neophytes (6 Grenades, 6 Seismic Cannons, 30 Autoguns, 10 Shotguns)
6 boxes of Acolytes (2 converted Acolyte Iconwards, 4 converted Aberrants, 6 Rock Saws, 6 Demolition charges, 9 normal Acolytes)
2 Leman Russes
3 Cgimeras
4 Sentinels
5 Magi (how on earth will I manage that?!? Guess I will convert some form Eldar Farseers...)

Some of the boxes I already have. This is actually super fun to plan your future force.
   
Made in us
Longtime Dakkanaut






I would use this for Magus Spam
https://www.games-workshop.com/en-US/Collegiate-Arcane-Mystic-Battle-Wizards

Also how did you deploy and play your Magus?

15k+ 10k+ 5k :Harlequin: 3k

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Made in pl
Regular Dakkanaut






 Amishprn86 wrote:
I would use this for Magus Spam
https://www.games-workshop.com/en-US/Collegiate-Arcane-Mystic-Battle-Wizards

Also how did you deploy and play your Magus?


I started with them inside Chimeras (2 can fit with my Neophytes Squad inside a Chimera). They mostly stayed behind a Neophyte meatshields in squads of 2 with my Warlord being alone (he was a big target, had to have one squad and Iconward to stay on the board and stay relevant). Squads of 2 generic Magi went with Neophytes and started to encircle foes, that's where lack of heavy weapons came handy - they were on the constant move for that sweet 18" Smite. Genestealers went after my Warlord so I had to back away a bunch, generic Magi and their squads were respectively on the left and the right of the board. Sadly I positioned my Iconward too close to Neophytes as Genestealers run rampart on them, costed me an important piece. Then every Magi casted smite on Genestealers as they killed 10 man squad of Neophytes and Iconward like they didn't even existed. 4 smite went off, one rolled 10 on their cast and got 5 mortal wounds after that getting 5 wounds on 3 smites was quite easy.

They managed to kill one squad of 10 Genestealers alone and support my Neophytes with killing some other infantry, 2 Magi casted Smite on a damaged Leman Russ and managed to kill it, they tore chunks out of Acolyte squads (I sadly lost 3 Magi when they appeared so only 2 left standing when the game ended). Surprisingly they are quite good in cc with 3+ and 3 attacks, one of my lost Magus managed to took down 2 Acolytes before death.
   
Made in ca
Fresh-Faced New User




Thank-you for your battle reports. They are helpful to me as I work on painting the models I have and deciding what units get to be 'coloured in' next.

I have to watch my hobby budget very closely so here is what I have done to reduce the costs as much as I can think of:

What I have done is to use Facebook to connect to 40k USED model swaps/sale groups. If you pay through PayPal AND make sure you indicate it's for a good or service, NOT to a friend or family you have 100% coverage if you don't get your models. So 0 risk, other than the risk of getting models that are put together poorly. Sometimes you can get 'used' models that haven't even been taken off the sprue. I have been able to pick up three of the GSC side of the Deathwatch: Overkill for a very good price. Each set gives you: 1 Patriarch, 1 Primus, 1 Magus, 2 Familiars, 16 Neophytes (w/2x Grenade Launcer, 2x Mining Laser), 12 Acolytes (no special weapons), 2 Genestealers and 4 Abberhants. This is massive value and getting them used is even better.

The Acolyte box comes with only 5 models BUT if you just buy 1 set of extra legs (and a base) from a bits store you can make a 6th Acolyte from the box as there is an extra torso and plenty of extra heads and arms. (one of the models will have to have the RockDrill back-pack stuck on unless you want them to have a blank space on their back. I carved up some of the generic 12 Acolytes that came from Deathwatch: Overkill sets and glued on the demolition charges and Iconward pieces to make the box go even further. I also purchased Rocksaws individually from a bitz store and then used my Acolyte box to make them. SO...from 1 box of Acolytes and a bitz purchase I get 6 Heavy Rock Saw models. NOTE: That the torsos are asymmetrical. Some are meant for the Rocksaws/Drills and some are meant for the Rockcutters. I just ignored that and did all Rock Saws. You'll never notice once they are painted and on the table.

Buying a 2nd Deathwatch:Overkill set will provide you with the rest of the Neophytes you need as well as the last 4 Abberhants and another Magus. When you make your bits order for the Rocksaws make sure you also buy 2 extra Grenade Launchers to outfit a couple of generic Neophytes (this may require some knife work to cut away the arms sculpted to the torsos) from the Overkill set. Voila! You now have 6x Grenade Launcher models, and 22x generic Neophytes (+4x Mining Laser models). That leaves you 2 generic Neophyte Models short for the 24 your list from above needs. If you're purchasing Chimeras I'd buy the one that comes with the extra squad of Guardsmen and the GSC upgrade sprue - that'll give you your extra dudes plus a grenade launcer/flamer/pistol/chainsword.

You can then sell off any extra models to help make back any money you may want.

So your pruchase list for the above becomes:
2x Used Overkilleathwatch sets
1 Box of Acolytes
5x Heavy Rocksaws, 2x Grenade Launcher (I used AM versions for ease of conversion), 1x Acyolte Legs, 1x 32mm base from a bits store
1x Armoured Claw box-set (Chimera + 10 guardsmen)

   
Made in pl
Regular Dakkanaut






Caspian89 wrote:
Thank-you for your battle reports. They are helpful to me as I work on painting the models I have and deciding what units get to be 'coloured in' next.

I have to watch my hobby budget very closely so here is what I have done to reduce the costs as much as I can think of:

What I have done is to use Facebook to connect to 40k USED model swaps/sale groups. If you pay through PayPal AND make sure you indicate it's for a good or service, NOT to a friend or family you have 100% coverage if you don't get your models. So 0 risk, other than the risk of getting models that are put together poorly. Sometimes you can get 'used' models that haven't even been taken off the sprue. I have been able to pick up three of the GSC side of the Deathwatch: Overkill for a very good price. Each set gives you: 1 Patriarch, 1 Primus, 1 Magus, 2 Familiars, 16 Neophytes (w/2x Grenade Launcer, 2x Mining Laser), 12 Acolytes (no special weapons), 2 Genestealers and 4 Abberhants. This is massive value and getting them used is even better.

The Acolyte box comes with only 5 models BUT if you just buy 1 set of extra legs (and a base) from a bits store you can make a 6th Acolyte from the box as there is an extra torso and plenty of extra heads and arms. (one of the models will have to have the RockDrill back-pack stuck on unless you want them to have a blank space on their back. I carved up some of the generic 12 Acolytes that came from Deathwatch: Overkill sets and glued on the demolition charges and Iconward pieces to make the box go even further. I also purchased Rocksaws individually from a bitz store and then used my Acolyte box to make them. SO...from 1 box of Acolytes and a bitz purchase I get 6 Heavy Rock Saw models. NOTE: That the torsos are asymmetrical. Some are meant for the Rocksaws/Drills and some are meant for the Rockcutters. I just ignored that and did all Rock Saws. You'll never notice once they are painted and on the table.

Buying a 2nd Deathwatch:Overkill set will provide you with the rest of the Neophytes you need as well as the last 4 Abberhants and another Magus. When you make your bits order for the Rocksaws make sure you also buy 2 extra Grenade Launchers to outfit a couple of generic Neophytes (this may require some knife work to cut away the arms sculpted to the torsos) from the Overkill set. Voila! You now have 6x Grenade Launcher models, and 22x generic Neophytes (+4x Mining Laser models). That leaves you 2 generic Neophyte Models short for the 24 your list from above needs. If you're purchasing Chimeras I'd buy the one that comes with the extra squad of Guardsmen and the GSC upgrade sprue - that'll give you your extra dudes plus a grenade launcer/flamer/pistol/chainsword.

You can then sell off any extra models to help make back any money you may want.

So your pruchase list for the above becomes:
2x Used Overkilleathwatch sets
1 Box of Acolytes
5x Heavy Rocksaws, 2x Grenade Launcher (I used AM versions for ease of conversion), 1x Acyolte Legs, 1x 32mm base from a bits store
1x Armoured Claw box-set (Chimera + 10 guardsmen)



Nice thinking! Sadly where I come from getting bits is very expensive or not available at all (some bitzshops even refused to send it to Poland... for some reason) I will buy me some Deathwatch Overkill though I already have 4 boxes of Neophytes coming to me as we speak. Maybe the game itself is fun to play, who knows?
I intend to get my Magi by converting some of these:
https://www.games-workshop.com/en-US/Eldar-Farseer
and using this one as my Warlord (so he's more visible on the board):
https://www.games-workshop.com/en-US/Eldrad-Ulthran-2017

Don't chimeras squads with guardsmen come with mortars? I could use some of these for extra flexibility.
   
Made in no
Powerful Ushbati





Bergen

Hi.

So I was thinking of adding some cultists to my turanid army.

I have acces to: 2 magus, 1 primus, 1 patriarch, a group of genstealer and 1 chimera. Any thoughts on what I should take?

I am a dyslectic, so bear with me.

Dyslectics in a text based environment? Dakka is aware of you and sympathises with any troubles you have: http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/505863.page

Kronos biovore box fresh sporemines. Denying psykick powers since 2017.

 
   
 
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