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As the title says, we have new Starters for 10th edition. https://www.warhammer-community.com/2023/07/03/warhammer-40000-starter-sets-get-cracking-with-the-new-edition/

Most balanced introductory set ever.

"So i'll move my gaunts"
"i'll overwatch"
"GG"

not checked 10th but I assume if you start outside flamer range and roll well enough to reach them there won't be overwatch?

and for bonus points, using models not painted using the paints in the box

the two larger boxes look ok though

the smaller one, depending on price, seems reasonable to chuck at relatives kids to annoy them with paint over the new dining table and carpet

leopard wrote:
not checked 10th but I assume if you start outside flamer range and roll well enough to reach them there won't be overwatch?

and for bonus points, using models not painted using the paints in the box

the two larger boxes look ok though

the smaller one, depending on price, seems reasonable to chuck at relatives kids to annoy them with paint over the new dining table and carpet

you overwatch at the start or end of a movement from a normal move/advance/charge.

Flamers have 12" range, max charge distance is 12"

 VladimirHerzog wrote:

leopard wrote:
not checked 10th but I assume if you start outside flamer range and roll well enough to reach them there won't be overwatch?

and for bonus points, using models not painted using the paints in the box

the two larger boxes look ok though

the smaller one, depending on price, seems reasonable to chuck at relatives kids to annoy them with paint over the new dining table and carpet

you overwatch at the start or end of a movement from a normal move/advance/charge.

Flamers have 12" range, max charge distance is 12"

Flamers have a 12" range

I'd ask if whoever wrote that rule had played the game but I suspect at this point the answer is obvious

didn't they used to be 8" range?

and didn't overwatch used to happen before the charging unit moved again specifically to avoid this...

glances at HH Tactical Support Squad armed with flamers... hmmmm

I suppose they change the rules for overwatch or ignore it altogether. It's just an introduction to the game and the hobby, what are you going to do with only 1 unit on each side after all? You could have a fun game with these miniatures, but only if you included rules to play a skirmish game and I doubt they will.

The Ultimate Starter set has something that I've never seen before, the barbgaunts come in a single big sprue with the neurogants, but they are divided neatly in two halves. The union is even different from any other sprue I've seen before. They can cut it in half, put the barbgaunt half in the Ultimate starter and put the neurogant in its own box to be sold on its own. It's reasonable, but new for GW.

This reveal also explains why the space marine looks so anemic in the corebook. I hope the ultimate starter cost just a bit more than a single combat patrol like the late command edition, but it’s always a good time for a price raise.

Apparently the core rules are not included in the Starter Set as per the Warhammer 40,000 Facebook page. The image is in error.

That's annoying, as the Ultimate Starter is obviously a much bigger investment if you're after that A5 book...

 The Phazer wrote:
Apparently the core rules are not included in the Starter Set as per the Warhammer 40,000 Facebook page. The image is in error.

That's annoying, as the Ultimate Starter is obviously a much bigger investment if you're after that A5 book...

Probably why it's done that way. It keeps the Starters from being as appealing to those who make $$$$ from box-splitting.

Glad to see terminators on them, ebay going to have plenty at lower prices. Puzzled not having Neurogants in these sets...

Definitely want one of those Core Rules booklets. Not sure I Ultimate Starter want it, but with the release of these I assume a lot of loose sprues and components will get cheaper on ebay.

Ultimate Starter looks great tbh. Just played a Combat Patrol game with those two forces and it was incredibly hectic and down to the wire.

edit: also surprisingly on pretty much the exact same terrain setup lol

leopard wrote:


Flamers have a 12" range

I'd ask if whoever wrote that rule had played the game but I suspect at this point the answer is obvious

didn't they used to be 8" range?

At 8" they were useless for anything but Overwatch. Anything under 10" range made them useless for Deep Striking units. Makes me wonder if you play this game, honestly.

leopard wrote:

 VladimirHerzog wrote:

leopard wrote:
not checked 10th but I assume if you start outside flamer range and roll well enough to reach them there won't be overwatch?

and for bonus points, using models not painted using the paints in the box

the two larger boxes look ok though

the smaller one, depending on price, seems reasonable to chuck at relatives kids to annoy them with paint over the new dining table and carpet

you overwatch at the start or end of a movement from a normal move/advance/charge.

Flamers have 12" range, max charge distance is 12"

Flamers have a 12" range

I'd ask if whoever wrote that rule had played the game but I suspect at this point the answer is obvious

didn't they used to be 8" range?

and didn't overwatch used to happen before the charging unit moved again specifically to avoid this...

glances at HH Tactical Support Squad armed with flamers... hmmmm

Flamers were completely useless when they were 8" range and still weren't good at 12". It's only 10th's overwatch that makes them dangerous.

 VladimirHerzog wrote:
Most balanced introductory set ever.

"So i'll move my gaunts"
"i'll overwatch"
"GG"

They do say that box has cut-down rules, so preumably no OW.

 The Phazer wrote:
Apparently the core rules are not included in the Starter Set as per the Warhammer 40,000 Facebook page. The image is in error.

Palm -> Face

leopard wrote:

Flamers have a 12" range

I'd ask if whoever wrote that rule had played the game but I suspect at this point the answer is obvious

didn't they used to be 8" range?

and didn't overwatch used to happen before the charging unit moved again specifically to avoid this...

glances at HH Tactical Support Squad armed with flamers... hmmmm

all of these things made flamer units irrelevant in the game and barely able to accomplish the role they are now supposed to fill (RIP templates)

 Shakalooloo wrote:

 VladimirHerzog wrote:
Most balanced introductory set ever.

"So i'll move my gaunts"
"i'll overwatch"
"GG"

They do say that box has cut-down rules, so preumably no OW.

One unit per side isn't going to be good for playing an actual game one way or another. It's just doesn't match how the game is constructed. Still, this is more egregious than it has to be. I couldn't be bothered to get much into the 10th ed rules, but the little starter set strikes me as being just as easy to break down without overwatch. Gaunts move first, get to shoot an inflict a casualty or two, then the Marines retaliate and it smells of roast Termagant. It's a fundamental loadout problem. You'd get more of a game out of five Tacticals with one flamer. Still bad for the Tyranids, but not as bad by far as a whole unit of Burninators. That's just silly territory.

It's probably best to take the included paints as a hint and treat the box as a means of determining whether someone finds assembling and painting miniatures appealing, with just enough rules to push models around and find out if that appeals, too.

 Lord Damocles wrote:

 The Phazer wrote:
Apparently the core rules are not included in the Starter Set as per the Warhammer 40,000 Facebook page. The image is in error.

Palm -> Face

I notice that the biggest one also includes more models on top of terrain than the middle one, unlike 9th ed. It seems like GW wants to incentivize buying the biggest starter box. At a guess just adding terrain didn't achieve that to GW's satisfaction last edition.

The Ultimate Starter Set is everything I hoped it would be. As someone who is only interested in Combat Patrol for 40k, it gets me both the Leviathan Combat Patrols (and skipped on Leviathan because I don't want to have more unpainted minis with no plans for than I already do), terrain that matches terrain I already have from KT: Moroch, and the core rules and Combat Patrol rules in printed form. Hopefully the price is around the same as the last Command Edition, because this will be an autobuy for me if that's the case.

I’m guessing $60, $110 and $200 USD. Can’t stay at 9th price point but can’t jack them too high

I was hoping for some new terrain in the ultimate set, something tyranid themed. Oh well, perhaps the next killteam season will have something that isn't just Imperium / ruins, even if it is just a re-release of the old death world stuff.

 Platuan4th wrote:

leopard wrote:


Flamers have a 12" range

I'd ask if whoever wrote that rule had played the game but I suspect at this point the answer is obvious

didn't they used to be 8" range?

At 8" they were useless for anything but Overwatch. Anything under 10" range made them useless for Deep Striking units. Makes me wonder if you play this game, honestly.

IIRC the idea behind the 8" range thing was to specifically stop a unit with flamers deep striking and firing, without the ability of the enemy to do anything about it and with zero risk to the striking unit as a result.

you dropped out of flamer range, could charge, with the risk of failure, but equally safe from flamer overwatch, by taking the risk of failure.

found flamers in 8th (didn't play much 9th) quite useful, specifically for pushing enemies to charge from a longer range with more chance of failure, and also for units which were being aggressive themselves in advancing

seemed to work reasonably well, no "I win" button for either side, can get close and get hot, or stay at range and take the risk of failure.

8" flamer range is an almost exact conversion of the flame template that was in use prior to 8th ed. GW may have chosen the 9" deep strike restriction at least in part due to that, but the way the designers didn't change most stats going into 8th ed even though they created a different ruleset with different interactions suggests that a flamer's range was 8" because it had always* been 8".

Notably prior to 8th ed you could deep strike inside flamer range just fine if you were so inclined.



* going back to 3rd ed. 2nd ed had more template diversity. Also Apocalypse got its on humongous ones that bled into 40k proper in 6th or 7th ed.

still remember the 1" templates there used to be

and the 'hilarity' of shots being able to scatter behind the firer in IIRC 5th edition

back with the smaller starter, it looks like previous ones and if it is the rules used are reasonably different - IIRC one of the AoS ones had models acting individually for example and came with a few scenarios aimed specifically at really small model count games

stuff like "stop the enemy crossing the board", or trying to kill one or two models in a set time, it looked a bit laughable at first but actually it played quite well

I got a pair of the 8th edition ones for a friends kids and they really enjoyed them

I thought it would break the game when Rubrics got 12" warp flamers with their easy access to teleport spells, but I didnt hear much about it afterwards.

Ofcourse, now they need to sell their new flamer marines, so the flamer rules need to look sharp for a couple of months.

 privateer4hire wrote:
I’m guessing $60, $110 and $200 USD. Can’t stay at 9th price point but can’t jack them too high

That makes sense and I would say those prices are pretty reasonable.

They look like pretty good starter sets, I reckon.

 Slinky wrote:
They look like pretty good starter sets, I reckon.

except the first I agree, and the first would be if not for the paint inflating the value - have a separate starter paint set, the actual models though works just fine

Dollars to donuts, the introductory set is not just intended for sale but also for them to be able to comp to things like the School Leagues and the like.

The Introductory set looks like it is designed for mass retail at stores that have higher-end board games, such as Target and Barnes & Noble.

I would be surprised if it did not appear in those places, tbh

 Fayric wrote:
Ofcourse, now they need to sell their new flamer marines, so the flamer rules need to look sharp for a couple of months.

You really think you did something here but flamers were 12" range in 9th too.