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2017/08/10 23:15:06
Subject: Eldar in 8th - Blood runs, anger rises, death wakes, war calls!
No idea when any of the Eldar codices will be yet. I have seen a leaked release schedule for the rest of the year and our Codex is not on it. Assuming the leak is geniune (and that is not guaranteed) we will have to wait until 2018.
No indication yet of whether we will be bundled or not. My hunch is that they will be separate and that Ynnari will remain as just an Index list since it only has 3 models of its own.
I stand between the darkness and the light. Between the candle and the star.
2017/08/11 09:09:09
Subject: Eldar in 8th - Blood runs, anger rises, death wakes, war calls!
admironheart wrote: well I put my striking scorpions away for this edition and am using all my howling banshees in every game. My opponent hates that his charge units gets interrupted during the fight phase. Between my Autarch and twin Banshee units. I get to deal some damage on my opponents during their turn and they turn everything on the Banshees.
A nice distraction for 2 units of 80 points each.
I'm curious as to what is happening here. You know that charging units and always strike first units cancel each other out right? And if the Banshees are getting charged then your opponent is the active player which means they get to go first (aka dead Banshees).
I also don't understand how small units of Banshees are actually making it to combat, 5 Banshees charging something like a Tactical Squad (in some mysterious universe where people actually use those) lose over half the squad from Overwatch + melee. I have also yet to see a combat last more than 1 round in this edition, either one side dies in the combat or the unit that got charged backs out of combat so that every other unit in the army is able to support it.
2017/08/11 09:27:41
Subject: Eldar in 8th - Blood runs, anger rises, death wakes, war calls!
I haven't tried Banshees yet but my impression is they would need a large squad and Doom to make damage stick. Adding Jain Zarr to counter Overwatch is a possibility but an expensive one.
By the time you have stacked that all up, you would probably be better off with a squad of Wraithblades. More wounds, S6/7, T5 and a 3+ save
I stand between the darkness and the light. Between the candle and the star.
2017/08/11 10:52:17
Subject: Eldar in 8th - Blood runs, anger rises, death wakes, war calls!
I have used Banshees twice so far. Both times it was a unit of 10. I was pleasantly surprised, on both occasions they wiped out their intended target. 1st was a unit of Doomed Thousand sons that had about 6-7 left when the Banshees charged, second was a unit of 10 Tesla Immortals. I think they used SfD to attack twice to finish off the Teslas, who were also doomed. Both times they got shot off the board immediately afterwards.
They are by no means amazing but they do actually work now, which is a nice change.
Wraithblades with swords are flat out better, which is a problem a lot of aspects have now.
2017/08/11 10:57:50
Subject: Eldar in 8th - Blood runs, anger rises, death wakes, war calls!
Moosatronic Warrior wrote: Wraithblades with swords are flat out better, which is a problem a lot of aspects have now.
Totally agree with this. Aspects are meant to be a precision tool to accomplish a specific task. A few are still doing this well (Fire Dragons for armoured targets for examples), but the majority are straight up outclassed by other units.
Hawks should be ultra mobile, anti-hoard and precision strikes
Scorpions should be durable, elite-killers
Banshees should be a whirlwind of power sword death
Fire dragons the bain of armour
Dark Reapers, a versatile ranged threat an opponent cannot afford to ignore
Warp Spider ... ... poor, poor Warp Spiders :(
And so on
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2017/08/11 10:58:13
2017/08/11 14:34:21
Subject: Eldar in 8th - Blood runs, anger rises, death wakes, war calls!
Karhedron wrote: My hunch is that they will be separate and that Ynnari will remain as just an Index list since it only has 3 models of its own.
That would be awful. "Just because you chose to buy those awesome models to be the center of a force which should be expected to be the future of Eldar (according to Gathering Storm) you are trapped into using the piss poor stop gap Index list the whole edition. Kthanxbye"
2017/08/11 14:42:55
Subject: Eldar in 8th - Blood runs, anger rises, death wakes, war calls!
That is just speculation on my part. I just cannot see them rolling all 3 Eldar factions into a single codex, especially when they will want to add Stratagems and possibly even sub-factions to represent things like Swordwinds, Wraithhosts etc.
Ynnari are not a standalone faction. They are 3 characters that represent a fluffy way of bolting the existing factions together. Maybe I am wrong and GW will surprise us but I can't quite see how else they could do it.
I stand between the darkness and the light. Between the candle and the star.
2017/08/11 15:38:39
Subject: Re:Eldar in 8th - Blood runs, anger rises, death wakes, war calls!
I think that is very unlikely. From everything we've seen lately in how GW has been releasing books and armies in both 40k and Sigmar the better bet is 4 books for Aeldari.
We'll get a Craftworlds book with "chapter tactics" for the big craftworlds, and a Dark Eldar book with the same for the cults/covens/kabals. Think of Ynnari more like blood angels or dark angels. They'll have less variety as SfD will be their "craftworld tactic" but I'd expect 2-4 Ynnari only kits/units and then the ability to grab from the other books. Harlequins are more like genestealer cults, a stand alone that can be used with the rest or solo.
As to release date, who knows, but it would be break from trend to not have Eldar in the first wave (of 10) with a new edition.
2017/08/11 18:13:48
Subject: Eldar in 8th - Blood runs, anger rises, death wakes, war calls!
1. List the Ynnari characters and strategems in both the Dark Eldar and Craftworlds books.
2. Make a very small book for Ynnari, one that requires the other codexes, or a very big one with units an Ynnari faction can take from the other two books.
3. Ynnari and Harlequins share a codex.
Lover of all things Eldar, branching out into Daemons.
I'd like to see 3 Aeldari books:
-Craftworlds
-Drukhari
-Harlequins & Ynnari
Neither Harlies nor Ynnari have enough units on their own to merit a stand-alone codex. But they both work very heavily alongside CWE & DE, so putting them together makes sense. It would also be about as much content as either the CWE or DE Codices
Galef wrote: I'd like to see 3 Aeldari books:
-Craftworlds
-Drukhari
-Harlequins & Ynnari
Neither Harlies nor Ynnari have enough units on their own to merit a stand-alone codex. But they both work very heavily alongside CWE & DE, so putting them together makes sense. It would also be about as much content as either the CWE or DE Codices
-
I'll second that. Ynnari + Harlies would be just enough material to make the book worth printing.
Icing on the cake would be giving us new Harlequin and Ynnari units. A Cegorach Avatar and a Death Cult aspect.
Lover of all things Eldar, branching out into Daemons.
admironheart wrote: well I put my striking scorpions away for this edition and am using all my howling banshees in every game. My opponent hates that his charge units gets interrupted during the fight phase. Between my Autarch and twin Banshee units. I get to deal some damage on my opponents during their turn and they turn everything on the Banshees.
A nice distraction for 2 units of 80 points each.
I'm curious as to what is happening here. You know that charging units and always strike first units cancel each other out right? And if the Banshees are getting charged then your opponent is the active player which means they get to go first (aka dead Banshees).
I also don't understand how small units of Banshees are actually making it to combat, 5 Banshees charging something like a Tactical Squad (in some mysterious universe where people actually use those) lose over half the squad from Overwatch + melee. I have also yet to see a combat last more than 1 round in this edition, either one side dies in the combat or the unit that got charged backs out of combat so that every other unit in the army is able to support it.
Well my opponents have been Tyranids or black Templars and they want to stay in hth.
My Wave Serpents drop off my assault units. Fire Dragons, Avengers and Wraithguard back them up. Normally I have Autarch with Banshee mask and warlocks in there too....perhaps a Farseer.
So after I attack and the consolidation and such...it is the opponents turn. They stay in hth. A unit like a captain or a hive tyrant attacks. Perhaps the Farseer is a target. Then one unit of Banshees attack, Then the Crusaders or the Tyrant Guard attack and then the Other unit of Banshees or the Autarch attack, followed up with their supporting units, etc..
The thing is the Banshees are a prick that gets their attention. They always die. But when the dust clears the Fire Dragons and Wraithguard make sure nothing is left on my next turn.
koooaei wrote: We are rolling so many dice to have less time to realise that there is not much else to the game other than rolling so many dice.
2017/08/12 10:42:41
Subject: Eldar in 8th - Blood runs, anger rises, death wakes, war calls!
Galef wrote: I'd like to see 3 Aeldari books:
-Craftworlds
-Drukhari
-Harlequins & Ynnari
Neither Harlies nor Ynnari have enough units on their own to merit a stand-alone codex. But they both work very heavily alongside CWE & DE, so putting them together makes sense. It would also be about as much content as either the CWE or DE Codices
-
I'll second that. Ynnari + Harlies would be just enough material to make the book worth printing.
Icing on the cake would be giving us new Harlequin and Ynnari units. A Cegorach Avatar and a Death Cult aspect.
That sounds nice! Both likely and with a little luck, also satisfying. We need new units, even if only two ir three.
2017/08/12 14:00:31
Subject: Eldar in 8th - Blood runs, anger rises, death wakes, war calls!
I also don't understand how small units of Banshees are actually making it to combat, 5 Banshees charging something like a Tactical Squad (in some mysterious universe where people actually use those) lose over half the squad from Overwatch + melee. I have also yet to see a combat last more than 1 round in this edition, either one side dies in the combat or the unit that got charged backs out of combat so that every other unit in the army is able to support it.
If you have Jain Zar, then overwatch isn't an issue.
But even without Jain Zar, as mentioned elsewhere, in this thread, you charge the wave serpent in *first.* The serpent eats the overwatch, then the banshees follow.
Then I think the assumption here is that most of these armies are Ynnari, so when the opponent backs out of combat, you use a soulburst to charge the banshees back in during the opponent's turn. Non-flying enemies aren't usually falling back more than about 6", and with the banshee 3" charge bonus, it's hard to botch the charge.
"The complete or partial destruction of the enemy must be regarded as the sole object of all engagements.... Direct annihilation of the enemy's forces must always be the dominant consideration." Karl von Clausewitz
2017/08/13 02:09:52
Subject: Re:Eldar in 8th - Blood runs, anger rises, death wakes, war calls!
Too lazy to translate reports, but important points are 1) list like that excels at killing elites 2) it's poor against hordes, but team tournament means it's possible to avoid these pairings - and it's not like Eldar have reliable way to deal with hordes anyway.
The games were: German Ynnari with reapers/dragons (win), Turkey Tau (Commanders + 80 drones) (win), Poland Ravenwing planes (win), Denmark Azrail/Devastators/Razorbacks (win, wipe out turn 3), Sweden Scions+Ratlings (win), France Blood Angels 4 Storm Ravens (also win).
Aside from shocking effect of just banshees existing in the tournament list, as enemy brain gets turned into goo from elvish maidens screaming, it also proves eldar superiority in the air over many enemies.
This message was edited 3 times. Last update was at 2017/08/13 02:40:26
2017/08/13 18:13:09
Subject: Eldar in 8th - Blood runs, anger rises, death wakes, war calls!
By the way, can I ask how you guys equip your Autarchs?
I'm curious as to how you use them.
Also, would there be any value in giving one a Reaper Launcher?
blood reaper wrote: I will respect human rights and trans people but I will never under any circumstances use the phrase 'folks' or 'ya'll'. I would rather be killed by firing squad.
the_scotsman wrote: Yeah, when i read the small novel that is the Death Guard unit options and think about resolving the attacks from a melee-oriented min size death guard squad, the thing that springs to mind is "Accessible!"
Argive wrote: GW seems to have a crystal ball and just pulls hairbrained ideas out of their backside for the most part.
You're not. If you're worried about your opponent using 'fake' rules, you're having fun the wrong way. This hobby isn't about rules. It's about buying Citadel miniatures.
Please report to your nearest GW store for attitude readjustment. Take your wallet.
2017/08/13 18:17:47
Subject: Eldar in 8th - Blood runs, anger rises, death wakes, war calls!
Also, would there be any value in giving one a Reaper Launcher?
Definitely, if you are looking for someone to buff your backfield units like Reapers, Support batteries etc, the Reaper launcher is a good choice as it allows him to add some significant firepower. How many HQs can take a missile launcher? Even if he moves, he is still as good as a Reaper.
If you have him up front I would rather choose a fusion gun but Reaper Launcher is still pretty sold.
I stand between the darkness and the light. Between the candle and the star.
2017/08/13 18:20:22
Subject: Eldar in 8th - Blood runs, anger rises, death wakes, war calls!
Also, would there be any value in giving one a Reaper Launcher?
Definitely, if you are looking for someone to buff your backfield units like Reapers, Support batteries etc, the Reaper launcher is a good choice as it allows him to add some significant firepower. How many HQs can take a missile launcher? Even if he moves, he is still as good as a Reaper.
If you have him up front I would rather choose a fusion gun but Reaper Launcher is still pretty sold.
To be honest, I was considering taking him in an otherwise pure-DE list (he's the closest I can get to a winged Archon). I was going to convert one out of a Scourge and run him with a unit of them as a sort of Scourge-Lord.
Unfortunately, Scourges have 18" range Blasters, which don't really mesh well with most of the Autarch's weapons.
blood reaper wrote: I will respect human rights and trans people but I will never under any circumstances use the phrase 'folks' or 'ya'll'. I would rather be killed by firing squad.
the_scotsman wrote: Yeah, when i read the small novel that is the Death Guard unit options and think about resolving the attacks from a melee-oriented min size death guard squad, the thing that springs to mind is "Accessible!"
Argive wrote: GW seems to have a crystal ball and just pulls hairbrained ideas out of their backside for the most part.
You're not. If you're worried about your opponent using 'fake' rules, you're having fun the wrong way. This hobby isn't about rules. It's about buying Citadel miniatures.
Please report to your nearest GW store for attitude readjustment. Take your wallet.
2017/08/13 18:32:46
Subject: Eldar in 8th - Blood runs, anger rises, death wakes, war calls!
Karhedron wrote: I think running him with DE would be a bit of a waste as he only buffs <Craftworld> units.
Yeah but the Archon's own buff is worthless, so I'm hardly losing out in that regard.
blood reaper wrote: I will respect human rights and trans people but I will never under any circumstances use the phrase 'folks' or 'ya'll'. I would rather be killed by firing squad.
the_scotsman wrote: Yeah, when i read the small novel that is the Death Guard unit options and think about resolving the attacks from a melee-oriented min size death guard squad, the thing that springs to mind is "Accessible!"
Argive wrote: GW seems to have a crystal ball and just pulls hairbrained ideas out of their backside for the most part.
You're not. If you're worried about your opponent using 'fake' rules, you're having fun the wrong way. This hobby isn't about rules. It's about buying Citadel miniatures.
Please report to your nearest GW store for attitude readjustment. Take your wallet.
2017/08/14 05:53:43
Subject: Eldar in 8th - Blood runs, anger rises, death wakes, war calls!
Karhedron wrote: I think running him with DE would be a bit of a waste as he only buffs <Craftworld> units.
Yeah but the Archon's own buff is worthless, so I'm hardly losing out in that regard.
Rerolling 1's to hit is not worthless. You need some basic math lessons.
"'players must agree how they are going to select their armies, and if any restrictions apply to the number and type of models they can use."
This is an actual rule in the actual rulebook. Quit whining about how you can imagine someone's army touching you in a bad place and play by the actual rules.
Freelance Ontologist
When people ask, "What's the point in understanding everything?" they've just disqualified themselves from using questions and should disappear in a puff of paradox. But they don't understand and just continue existing, which are also their only two strategies for life.
2017/08/14 07:57:36
Subject: Eldar in 8th - Blood runs, anger rises, death wakes, war calls!
Karhedron wrote: I think running him with DE would be a bit of a waste as he only buffs <Craftworld> units.
Yeah but the Archon's own buff is worthless, so I'm hardly losing out in that regard.
Rerolling 1's to hit is not worthless. You need some basic math lessons.
The Archon doesn't let you reroll 1s. You need to learn to read.
blood reaper wrote: I will respect human rights and trans people but I will never under any circumstances use the phrase 'folks' or 'ya'll'. I would rather be killed by firing squad.
the_scotsman wrote: Yeah, when i read the small novel that is the Death Guard unit options and think about resolving the attacks from a melee-oriented min size death guard squad, the thing that springs to mind is "Accessible!"
Argive wrote: GW seems to have a crystal ball and just pulls hairbrained ideas out of their backside for the most part.
You're not. If you're worried about your opponent using 'fake' rules, you're having fun the wrong way. This hobby isn't about rules. It's about buying Citadel miniatures.
Please report to your nearest GW store for attitude readjustment. Take your wallet.
2017/08/14 21:40:13
Subject: Re:Eldar in 8th - Blood runs, anger rises, death wakes, war calls!
I have the option to trade for some eldar and am wondering if it seems worth it. I have started going back to find out what is good and bad since I have not played with or against them in 8th. Some insight would speed things up.
Here are the models, from what I have read scorpions, wraightknights, rangers and windriders are bad. Is the rest workable into a decent list or should I skip? I have a bunch of extra orks that I could trade so not costing me anything but I am not sure on waiting to gamble on the codex improving bad stuff.
Farseer
Farseer on jetbike
Eldrad Ulthran
3 Warlocks
22 Guardians
2 Heavy Weapon platforms
10 Rangers
13 Windrider Guardians
11 Fire Dragons
10 Striking Scorpions
5 Shining Spears
2 Warwalkers
6 Dark Reapers
Wraithknight
2 Wave Serpents
2017/08/14 22:04:01
Subject: Eldar in 8th - Blood runs, anger rises, death wakes, war calls!
I think those are solid models. The only bad thing in that list are scorpions sadly (which are still my favorite aspects fluffwise and lovely models) and the WK (overcosted). Anything else can be made to work. A bargain considering retail prices of the characters...
2017/08/14 23:16:07
Subject: Eldar in 8th - Blood runs, anger rises, death wakes, war calls!
Who is saying Striking Scorpions are bad? Deploy them into cover and they have 2+ save and can provide a distraction, min squad with Biting Blade is 105pts requires a good amount of fire to remove or risk being charged by them next turn, charging from cover they get 2+ save too
~500pts Asuryani painted new colour scheme
~7500pts Asuryani assembled some with old colour scheme
2017/08/14 23:44:32
Subject: Eldar in 8th - Blood runs, anger rises, death wakes, war calls!
Start winning some games with them. Describe those games. Convince people with your data.
"'players must agree how they are going to select their armies, and if any restrictions apply to the number and type of models they can use."
This is an actual rule in the actual rulebook. Quit whining about how you can imagine someone's army touching you in a bad place and play by the actual rules.
Freelance Ontologist
When people ask, "What's the point in understanding everything?" they've just disqualified themselves from using questions and should disappear in a puff of paradox. But they don't understand and just continue existing, which are also their only two strategies for life.
2017/08/15 01:20:37
Subject: Eldar in 8th - Blood runs, anger rises, death wakes, war calls!
I was thinking 3 Storm Guardian Squads for objectives, 3 Spiritseers for cheap HQ and 14 Warwalkers with AML for anti-vehicle/horde options.
Maybe drop a spiritseer and add farseer... We'll see.
No madam, 40,000 is the year that this game is set in. Not how much it costs. Though you may have a point. - GW Fulchester The Gatling Guns have flamethrowers on them because this is 40k - DOW III
2017/08/15 21:11:38
Subject: Eldar in 8th - Blood runs, anger rises, death wakes, war calls!
At 2500 points, you're going to be facing things that remove several War Walkers every turn.
"'players must agree how they are going to select their armies, and if any restrictions apply to the number and type of models they can use."
This is an actual rule in the actual rulebook. Quit whining about how you can imagine someone's army touching you in a bad place and play by the actual rules.
Freelance Ontologist
When people ask, "What's the point in understanding everything?" they've just disqualified themselves from using questions and should disappear in a puff of paradox. But they don't understand and just continue existing, which are also their only two strategies for life.
2017/08/15 22:22:40
Subject: Eldar in 8th - Blood runs, anger rises, death wakes, war calls!
blood reaper wrote: I will respect human rights and trans people but I will never under any circumstances use the phrase 'folks' or 'ya'll'. I would rather be killed by firing squad.
the_scotsman wrote: Yeah, when i read the small novel that is the Death Guard unit options and think about resolving the attacks from a melee-oriented min size death guard squad, the thing that springs to mind is "Accessible!"
Argive wrote: GW seems to have a crystal ball and just pulls hairbrained ideas out of their backside for the most part.
You're not. If you're worried about your opponent using 'fake' rules, you're having fun the wrong way. This hobby isn't about rules. It's about buying Citadel miniatures.
Please report to your nearest GW store for attitude readjustment. Take your wallet.
~500pts Asuryani painted new colour scheme
No madam, 40,000 is the year that this game is set in. Not how much it costs. Though you may have a point. - GW Fulchester 
The Gatling Guns have flamethrowers on them because this is 40k