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Mattlov wrote:If you stop bitching about it, stop acting outraged about so-called injustices, it will go away, at least in America to a large degree. There will always be the haters in the world, you cannot make everyone believe one thing, no matter how factual that information is. Suck it up, move along, and don't support stereotypes about your race. Problem solved, eventually.

No it won't.

I am also a realist to know this will never happen.

No you aren't.

Mattlov wrote:I haven't read the whole thread, but here is my opinion. Let me first point out that while I have occasionally racist thoughts, those are always directed at individuals and never a stereotype. I am also ASTOUNDINGLY Caucasian.


Racism still exists because the "oppressed" want it to. Organizations like the NAACP, events here in Indy like Black Expo PROMOTE racism. Media stereotypes sure as hell don't help for other people such as Middle Eastern folk or any other race. By constantly pointing out their differences and "fighting" for equality or a fair shake, they simply drive a larger wedge between races for hatred to exist.

If you stop bitching about it, stop acting outraged about so-called injustices, it will go away, at least in America to a large degree. There will always be the haters in the world, you cannot make everyone believe one thing, no matter how factual that information is. Suck it up, move along, and don't support stereotypes about your race. Problem solved, eventually.

I am also a realist to know this will never happen.

There is an irony in this statement. That irony is that the statement is incorrect and kind of mindless and then the last sentence claims that the poster is a realist.

Am I racist if I think everyone that is NOT me is inferior?

Fateweaver wrote:Am I racist if I think everyone that is NOT me is inferior?

No, it just implies that you don't know what the word means.

Modern news and entertainment is cannabalistic, and racism sells very, very, very well.

Yeah, but WHY is this the case? Why is it racism? Why isn't it "anti-Americanism" or "blasphemy" that sell?

You keep saying that it sells, and I agree. You keep saying that people want to protect their bottom line, and I agree. But WHY is racism the issue that sends heads rolling? Why isn't it any of a million other issues?

There is no powerful collaboration of individuals whose priority is to enforce the ever shifting morass known as "political correctness

I agree, and I didn't mean to imply that there was. This is not an organized thing with a board of directors. There's a few recurring characters, guys like Jesse Jackson and Al Sharpton, but it's not like they're actually in charge of anything.

That said, it's still a "thing." Just because nobody is managing it, nobody is organizing it, that doesn't mean that it's not a clearly understood and constantly used club.

As I pointed out above, other issues don't sell. WHY don't they sell? Why DOES racism sell? Did we all just wake up one day with a raging hatred for racism?

I think you need to recalculate exactly what people need to do or at the very least adjust your perception of what it is that they are doing.

I don't expect you to agree with my standards for free speech, I'm simply telling you what they are. It may be that I'm overly concerned, and there's no threat. I don't see it that way, and while I'm right about 27% more often than you are, I'm still not always right.

You also lead into another angle with your comments... Political Correctness sells nicely because it's victim mentality, which is critical to Western morality. We don't like to just pick an enemy and kick the crap out of them. That enemy has to wrong us first, give us the moral highground, and then we come charging down to smite them. People just LOVE to troll the news looking for racism to point at and feel like a Crusader for Good. It works especially nice for them when they have nothing whatsoever to do with the actual situation.

So, you're out and about, dropping racial slurs, but because you're so dashingly beautiful, everyone just lets it go, lest they lose even a second of time they might otherwise have spent basking in your glow. In less snarky terms, people know who you are and let it go, because they don't think you really "mean it."

Poltical correctness is all about taking the moral highground in a battle you're not even in. When people actually have to take a stand, they're remarkably cowardly. Yet another reason I think they should shut their idiot faces.

Should radical clerics that espouse jihad within america be silenced?

No, I don't think so...

That said, there are laws. They've been used against the KKK in the past to hold the organization responsible for the deeds of members who have been "provoked" into action. So, given that that's precedent, and we're a precedent based legal system, then yes, they should be silenced.

But given that I think that's BS, and that being told to do anything does not require you to do that thing, then personally I don't think they should be silenced. They should be watched (within the bounds of the law) and any crimes they intend to commit should be prevented if possible, but simple speech should be protected.

That irony is that the statement is incorrect and kind of mindless and then the last sentence claims that the poster is a realist.

See, that's just moral highground haterism. Don't play the PC game.

The fact is, Jesse Jackson and Al Sharpton are race-profiteers. They're immoral scumbags who are milking their own race. They're not even REMOTELY from the same spirit as a guy like MLK. They're also not "black people." "Black people" just want to have happy, successful, safe lives, they don't want to keep revisiting this BS and keep hearing about who's a racist today, and how whitey hates them.

I firmly believe that black people think whites hate them more than whites actually hate them. By orders of magnitude. And any white that matters, i.e. somebody with a company, that's hiring, probably hates them even less than that. That fear is a barrier to their advancement, it discourages them from believing in their own potential, and yet it's something that people like Jackson and Sharpton constantly assure them is a real, terrible thing.

I also believe that there comes a point in a dispute when it can't be discussed anymore, and the next step is to let it pass. At some point, we're going to have to stop picking at the scabs of racism. Some people think that time is now, some don't. But the fact is, if racism does eventually fade into irrelevancy, then that step will have to be taken.

It's a shame that Jackson and Sharpton are the self-appointed "leaders" of the black community. They couldn't be more poisonous to their own communities.

Yeah, but WHY is this the case? Why is it racism? Why isn't it "anti-Americanism" or "blasphemy" that sell?

They do! They're great headlines, especially anti americanism, however your example (imus) didn't do that. He did the racism thing.

You keep saying that it sells, and I agree. You keep saying that people want to protect their bottom line, and I agree. But WHY is racism the issue that sends heads rolling? Why isn't it any of a million other issues?

There are. Religious intolerance and sexism get you the boot just as quickly in a job setting, as does sexual harassment and drug use. Espousing violence against particular groups often does the same. Lets see.. Remarking about your own contributors or advertisers does it. Leaking any sort of unspecified secret will do it. Breaking contractural obligations will do it.

Honestly, racisms just a target, it's far less common as a reason to remove someone from a job as sexism, sexual harassment, or breaking NDA agreements/insulting your own employer.

I agree, and I didn't mean to imply that there was. This is not an organized thing with a board of directors. There's a few recurring characters, guys like Jesse Jackson and Al Sharpton, but it's not like they're actually in charge of anything.

Rush and Hannity call people racist daily and constantly try to highlight the anti white conspiracies of the left, you should probably go a little less political with where you're laying blame here.

That said, it's still a "thing." Just because nobody is managing it, nobody is organizing it, that doesn't mean that it's not a clearly understood and constantly used club.

As I pointed out above, other issues don't sell. WHY don't they sell? Why DOES racism sell? Did we all just wake up one day with a raging hatred for racism?

The hell are you talking about? Obamas socialism and Rushes drug habit got vastly more play than any racial controversy in the media (even the underlying "Is x racist!" talk gets outdone by "Is X socialist!". Racism isn't a special club, it's just a form of taboo and in popular media it can bring in viewers almost as well as natural disasters or the threat of terrorism mostly because it's juicy and people enjoy controversy. I heard more news coverage of that damn balloon kid than I ever did of Imus.

But given that I think that's BS, and that being told to do anything does not require you to do that thing, then personally I don't think they should be silenced. They should be watched (within the bounds of the law) and any crimes they intend to commit should be prevented if possible, but simple speech should be protected.

I agree, but thats not how the world works.

I also believe that there comes a point in a dispute when it can't be discussed anymore, and the next step is to let it pass. At some point, we're going to have to keep picking at the scabs of racism. Some people think that time is now, some don't. But the fact is, if racism does eventually fade into irrelevancy, then that step will have to be taken.

We're not even remotely close to that yet.

It's a shame that Jackson and Sharpton are the self-appointed "leaders" of the black community. They couldn't be more poisonous to their own communities.

If you think Jesse Jackson or Al Sharpton are leaders of the black community then you don't understand the black community very well. They are no more representative of it then glenn beck is of conservatism. You also seem to be mischaracterizing their body of work quite strongly which implies to me that you haven't done much research into their histories.

I have basically lost track of what Phryxis is arguing for at this point.

It may be something along the lines of 'ignore racism', but I am not entirely sure. Much of what he has said reminds me of talk radio, and cable TV... which to put it kindly, is full of absolute nonsense.

If anything, what we need are ways of getting around all of this crap, so that the problems at the center of this discussion can be addressed in a real way. Instead, we are left with conversation that boils down to, "NO U!", most of the time.

Do more research Phryxis, some of your points simply don't fit with reality.

'Moral highground haterism'. Sidetrack much?

Phryxis wrote:
So I fully agree that the mechanism here is "cut the guy loose, I don't want to lose money on him" as you guys are saying. But why exactly do people think they're going to lose money if there's not a powerful force being turned against him?

I don't think that anyone is saying that political correctness isn't a powerful force. It certainly is, just like any other social taboo. What I think is being disputed, or at least I am disputing, is that political correctness is somehow unique in human history, or the result of some outside force. A lot of people genuinely hate racism, and will often tend to find it in places where it doesn't exist. To some extent this is the result of politicians playing on the trope, but it also wasn't that long ago when racism was a serious issue in the US. Fifty years simply isn't that much time where cultural memory is concerned.

Phryxis wrote:
Right, and in Saddam's Iraq, people were free to speak their mind. The consequence was that they'd be killed.

It's always a sliding scale. All I'm saying is that people need to err on the side of free speech more often than they do, even in the relatively permissive state we're in now.

Saddam's Iraq isn't really comparable. It isn't as if the federal government is actively working to quash racist speech by killing off people who use it. Sure, we've got anti-discrimination laws, but in general that legislation requires more than simple racist speech. Granted, I should have said 'social consequences' instead of 'consequences' in general.

Still, I sort of agree with you in that I believe that the state should always err on the side of free speech. I also agree that society should, as a rule, be more open to the possibility that a certain set of words were chosen in error, or the intended meaning was not clearly conveyed. However, I don't think the issue of social pressure is so significant as to be considered offensive, or oppressive. Cases like Imus' don't strike me as terribly common, and his own record of dodging controversy seems to speak to that.

Phryxis wrote:
But if something is "not right" does that mean we should act to prevent it? Should we act to silence "not right" speech?

Isn't that what social conventions are based on?

They're great headlines, especially anti americanism

Meh... Sure, sometimes it gets headlines, but not like racism. Take a guy like Ward Churchill. Dude said stuff so flagrantly, insanely anti-American... And then, after it turned out he ALSO was a plagiarist, and generally awful at his job, he got fired.

It just doesn't strike me as being on the same scale. Let's say we're watching the View. Let's just imagine.

Now imagine that Rosie O'Donnell suggests that 911 was a coverup, and a conspiracy, which, to be clear, would sugest that the American government would cover up the reason that 3000 American citizens died. That would qualify, in my mind, as "anti-American." Also, slowed.

Now imagine that Whoopi Goldberg would come out and suggest that Mel Gibson wasn't a racist. That's not even her saying something racist, that's just her declining to demonize somebody else for being a racist.

I don't have a backlash-o-meter, but it seems to me that much ado has been made about Whoopi, while, outside of right wing circles, nobody gave much notice to Rosie.

I'd also point out that what Rosie said is, based on my calculations, 36,348 times more insane than what Whoopi said.

Rush and Hannity call people racist daily and constantly try to highlight the anti white conspiracies of the left

First off, I never said Rush and Hannity are better than Sharpton and Jackson. They certainly earn more, they certainly say stuff I prefer ideologically, and they do a lot less to harm their own race, but at the end of the day, they're also political profiteers. I just find them more tolerable.

And, that said, they don't claim there are anti-white conspiracies going on. I think they tend to view black people in the same way I do... As a community of people, no better or worse than any other people, but with the misfortune of being caught in the middle of a political pissing contest.

They're more likely to point out things like that King Samir Shabazz lunatic, who says it's a good idea to kill white babies. This is pretty good fodder for the headlines, and yet its relegated to the right wingers. If it's all about racism getting air time, how come this doesn't?

I heard more news coverage of that damn balloon kid than I ever did of Imus.

Heh, local news...

We're not even remotely close to that yet.

Not even REMOTELY? I'm not sure how you're seeing it that way. I honestly can say I haven't met somebody that was truly racist, in person... I dunno, ever? Maybe one or two people I witnessed in passing?

That's not to say there aren't other factors at play, institutional, etc. But really? Are there enough true RACISTS around anymore to even bother thinking about them?

Racism is just not interesting to me. It's a stupid, boring, discredited way of thinking, it's no longer even worth wasting time with. I'm not sure what else society can do at this point to be any less racist. There will always be baseline levels of idiot, and they're to be ignored and quietly marginalized without making a big, self-congratulatory noise about.

If you think Jesse Jackson or Al Sharpton are leaders of the black community then you don't understand the black community very well.

I guess calling them self-appointed and putting "leaders" in quotes was too subtle, huh?

They're "leaders" insofar as they're who "the establishment" goes to when it wants somebody to say the Tea Party movement is racist, or to generally make some sort of race-baiting idiot comment. They're not actual leaders, they're profiteers.

'Moral highground haterism'. Sidetrack much?

You just posted about 100 words, all of which added up to "nuh-uh, you're dumb."

Please stop being a waste.

From what I have read, regardless of how long your posts have been, you're generally saying that racism is not a problem, free speech is very important, and the black community is full of paranoid schizos that worship ideologies spouted by people you consider to be 'poisonous'.

Your perspective on this subject appears to be very limited, although I do not doubt your intelligence overall because of it.

I accused you of side-tracking, because you were sidetracking. Get over it.

Phryxis wrote:Not even REMOTELY? I'm not sure how you're seeing it that way. I honestly can say I haven't met somebody that was truly racist, in person... I dunno, ever? Maybe one or two people I witnessed in passing?

How many people do you know who have come from a poor black community? Talk with them for an hour or two about the prejudices they face on a daily basis.

That's not to say there aren't other factors at play, institutional, etc. But really? Are there enough true RACISTS around anymore to even bother thinking about them?

I dunno. Does someone have to be overtly racist and covered in swastikas to have an effect through their authority? I won't suggest that there is a conspiracy afoot, just that a layer of ignorance does, and will likely continue to exist on a scale large enough, that it directly effects the lifestyles that a person of color can build for themselves.

There doesn't have to be Nazis for people to take offense, and pointing at such blatant racism does not counter the fact that subtle racism is still more than strong enough to hold our country back from achieving what we could with much, much less of it. I don't fool myself into thinking that we can create a utopia, just that we need to do a much better job than we are currently.

Racism is just not interesting to me. It's a stupid, boring, discredited way of thinking, it's no longer even worth wasting time with. I'm not sure what else society can do at this point to be any less racist. There will always be baseline levels of idiot, and they're to be ignored and quietly marginalized without making a big, self-congratulatory noise about.

Again, pointing at the obvious problems does not wash away the things that you do not take notice of, or ignore.

you're generally saying that racism is not a problem, free speech is very important, and the black community is full of paranoid schizos that worship ideologies spouted by people you consider to be 'poisonous'.

I'm not saying racism isn't a problem. I'm saying it's just an incredibly minor problem, relative to more concrete things, like fixing the school system, repairing the black family, growing the pool of positive leadership in the black community. The problem isn't people keeping black people down. The problem is a lack of people pulling black people up.

Yes, I think free speech is very important.

I don't think the black community is literally mentally insane, but I do think that they're given such a negative, bleak view of things, that they can't help but be worn down, demoralized, etc. I don't want to be mischaracterized as calling them insane. They're as vulnerable to programming as any community. We're all programmed. They just have to suffer with especially negative, demoralizing programming. White kids go to school and hear, "you can be anything you want to be!" Black kids get told "whitey will never let you succeed." Even if it were true, it's not helpful to say it.

How many people do you know who have come from a poor black community?

Not many since I moved to Colorado. More when I lived in CT, but then again, it was very (very) segregated.

I know people have stories about being mistreated. Unfortunately, these are only anecdotes. That's not to say that black people aren't mistreated... I just don't know where this shadow community of racists is coming from.

There's simply no question that "racist" has near universal acceptance as a bad word in America. Few words are so universally negative, and so strongly negative. Given this level of buy in, where are all these racists hiding?

I'd like to respect the life experiences of black folks, but I also have to respect my own. I simply don't see the population of busy racists that would need to exist to make it all work.

I also find the whole "you don't know what it's like to be black" thing to be a bit ridiculous. It's true, I don't. And black people don't know what it's like to be white. Everyone has to guess at everyone else's experience. Is being black harder than I imagine? Could be. Is being white harder than black folks imagine? Could be. I don't know the answer, but I also don't think anybody can every really know. We just have a mess of very complicated statistics that may or may not lead to truth.

just that a layer of ignorance does, and will likely continue to exist on a scale large enough, that it directly effects the lifestyles that a person of color can build for themselves.

How is this manifesting itself? As I said above, I'm not aware of any racism that I see in my daily life, with only one exception...

8A companies. I work as a contractor to the Federal Government. When they hired the contracting company, they gave preferential treatment to any companies with minorities, women, or veterans in ownership. As a result, the "head guy" of the whole operation is black. There's an Indian fellow (as if they need any help in IT), and some women also. No veterans I'm aware of... Regardless, the point is that the ONLY personal experience I can really draw on here is one in which minorities were given preferential treatment.

I could also point to Affirmative Action.

For a while I attended a private high school They had a policy of bringing in a few "inner city" kids per year, either free or reduced tuition from local communities.

There are very real, very obvious forces of "positive racism" at work that FAVOR minorities. It would seem to me that your argument is that there is so much racism that it offsets all of this, and still manages to be a net detriment to minorities. While history does seem to bear your assertion out to some degree, the whole "they're just being kept down" mentality has been repeated for thatsame history, and it hasn't fixed much along the way. I simply don't think it's the right approach to the problem.

Most people are racist in some way. It's how they act on it that matters though. You can't blame people for disliking others, just hope they don't act like bastards about it.

Racism exists because people like to throw insults at each other, and they find reasons to do so. Sure, we'll tone it down, but we'll find something else, like gun control, or religion. Or, we pull it out as an excuse to not learn/do something, or because we need a scapegoat.

Point being? We're a confrontational lot, and as long as we don't take it out of bounds (Which we tend to do, a lot) we'll be semi-ok...

yeah it exists, but it'll never go away, racism is a part of life, just ignore it and carry on as normal

Phryxis wrote:I'm not saying racism isn't a problem. I'm saying it's just an incredibly minor problem, relative to more concrete things, like fixing the school system, repairing the black family, growing the pool of positive leadership in the black community. The problem isn't people keeping black people down. The problem is a lack of people pulling black people up.

I can agree entirely with you here, and in a way I see what point you were trying to make.

I consider racism made manifest through a lack of support for black communities. You can say what you will about that, but looking around Oakland in the poor areas that are known to be black communities, then comparing it to the areas that are known to be white communities generally... it makes me sick. Really.

I know where the money is being spent, and it sure as hell isn't going into providing support for areas that have had the same exact problems for generations. You can choose to not call that racism, I happen to disagree. Whether you are offended by the term simply doesn't matter to me, I could give a damn about the KKK when so many problems have lasted for such a god damned long time.

Yes, I think free speech is very important.

I don't think the black community is literally mentally insane, but I do think that they're given such a negative, bleak view of things, that they can't help but be worn down, demoralized, etc. I don't want to be mischaracterized as calling them insane. They're as vulnerable to programming as any community. We're all programmed. They just have to suffer with especially negative, demoralizing programming. White kids go to school and hear, "you can be anything you want to be!" Black kids get told "whitey will never let you succeed." Even if it were true, it's not helpful to say it.

Black kids go to school after walking through a neighborhood where they could be shot in the face. I am glad I have had friends that managed to make it out of those types of situations, because most just don't. Anger. No one cares, and no one tries, it is a wonder that anyone can keep their head on after living in such bad situations.

Here is an interesting article showing just how divided the leaders of the black community can be.

http://www.nytimes.com/2010/07/20/us/20pot.html?_r=1&ref=politics

Black kids live in neighborhoods where all the cops think they are drug dealers, and they learn to fear authorities because of the way they are treated by them. You can call that whatever you want, I happen to call it racism. While there can be good cops, the worst areas tend to bring out the worst in any person, and that is reflected in how they treat the people they are trying to protect. I think that individual cops are not usually racist in a way that you could associate with lynching and what have you, but the methods they use to fight crime often boil down to destroying lives, and predetermining guilt, at least as far as their authority will let them.

http://www.prisonpolicy.org/graphs/raceinc.html

Not many since I moved to Colorado. More when I lived in CT, but then again, it was very (very) segregated.

I know people have stories about being mistreated. Unfortunately, these are only anecdotes. That's not to say that black people aren't mistreated... I just don't know where this shadow community of racists is coming from.

You are casting this in a very strange light IMO. Like I said, you can call it what you want, but the statistics are there, and the conclusions are relatively simple to come by.

There's simply no question that "racist" has near universal acceptance as a bad word in America. Few words are so universally negative, and so strongly negative. Given this level of buy in, where are all these racists hiding?

How racist are we? How much of a presence does racism actually have? More to the point, how much is needed to destroy entire communities, swastikas or not. I don't want to cast the same light I feel you are, from my side, but there is enough prejudice for lives to be destroyed in huge numbers. Society does not need a white hood to practice it's prejudice.

I'd like to respect the life experiences of black folks, but I also have to respect my own. I simply don't see the population of busy racists that would need to exist to make it all work.

This is a strange narrative, and I am not entirely sure I even follow what you mean when you use it.

I also find the whole "you don't know what it's like to be black" thing to be a bit ridiculous. It's true, I don't. And black people don't know what it's like to be white. Everyone has to guess at everyone else's experience. Is being black harder than I imagine? Could be. Is being white harder than black folks imagine? Could be. I don't know the answer, but I also don't think anybody can every really know. We just have a mess of very complicated statistics that may or may not lead to truth.

Sure, we can most definitely know, and it doesn't have to be a matter of people intentionally being racist, more the point that society can be destroying lives simply for the fact that some are born in a specific demographic. If you consider all of the literature and study behind this subject to be 'a mess', then I am not entirely sure why you care at all. What statistics are valid?

How is this manifesting itself? As I said above, I'm not aware of any racism that I see in my daily life, with only one exception...

8A companies. I work as a contractor to the Federal Government. When they hired the contracting company, they gave preferential treatment to any companies with minorities, women, or veterans in ownership. As a result, the "head guy" of the whole operation is black. There's an Indian fellow (as if they need any help in IT), and some women also. No veterans I'm aware of... Regardless, the point is that the ONLY personal experience I can really draw on here is one in which minorities were given preferential treatment.

I could also point to Affirmative Action.

Affirmative action is a generally stupid idea, as it doesn't really address the problems.

For a while I attended a private high school They had a policy of bringing in a few "inner city" kids per year, either free or reduced tuition from local communities.

There are very real, very obvious forces of "positive racism" at work that FAVOR minorities. It would seem to me that your argument is that there is so much racism that it offsets all of this, and still manages to be a net detriment to minorities. While history does seem to bear your assertion out to some degree, the whole "they're just being kept down" mentality has been repeated for thatsame history, and it hasn't fixed much along the way. I simply don't think it's the right approach to the problem.

Is this going down the path of 'reverse racism'? I won't even get into that nonsense, and I still agree that affirmative action is a generally stupid idea.

While I agree that shoving kids into schools and jobs where they won't benefit is dumb. I feel good for the people that have been able to succeed because of programs like that, but it is not a great solution. Not receiving support and being stuck in a situation where your options are to either become a drug dealer (or criminal in general), or work harder than can be expected of a normal person, is basically tantamount to 'kicking them while they are down'.

Keeping them down isn't so much the problem (depending on your point of view, and the extremes of which you are willing), as it is not providing sensible support, as a means to repair broken communities that could provide a great deal for our society at large once supported. Denying that help, is not keeping a person down, so much as it is laughing in their face for being down in the first place. I believe that the lack of intervention is no less than a sign of ambivalence at best, subtle racism in the middle, and dare I say, even culturally accepted overt racism at it's worst.

Johnny didn't make it to school because his brother was shot while walking back from the store. The person that shot him was just a kid himself, but one that was ignored like trash, and in turn acted like trash. It isn't a monolithic issue, just one that needs to be studied closely to understand it.

Anyway, I really don't care what you call it as long as you can accept the fact that there are parts of any society that are downtrodden and ignored. Providing support for those communities is an amazing thing when it is done... unfortunately, that usually isn't what happens.

I agree that in some way, playing word games can often be part of a solution, but not playing them can also be a larger part of that solution.

There are two kinds of people I hate in this world:
People who judge others based on their ethnicity, and the Dutch.

I'm not saying racism isn't a problem. I'm saying it's just an incredibly minor problem, relative to more concrete things, like fixing the school system, repairing the black family, growing the pool of positive leadership in the black community. The problem isn't people keeping black people down. The problem is a lack of people pulling black people up.

Go to China, Korea, Japan, northern africa, the mideast, Australia, russia, India or half of europe. Racism definitely still exists. You should qualify your statements nationally you seem to imply that it's a diminished problem globally.

Wrexasaur wrote:

Mattlov wrote:If you stop bitching about it, stop acting outraged about so-called injustices, it will go away, at least in America to a large degree. There will always be the haters in the world, you cannot make everyone believe one thing, no matter how factual that information is. Suck it up, move along, and don't support stereotypes about your race. Problem solved, eventually.

No it won't.

I am also a realist to know this will never happen.

No you aren't.

Really? Will constantly making it a "front-burner" issue, constantly forcing everyone to think about it help either? No, it just polarizes each side of the argument, which makes fixing the problem even more difficult, if not impossible. Hence, my realism that racism wil never go away.

Besides the fact that I do not consider coverage of racial tensions to be a front burner issue, it is quite one-sided when it is.

The problem isn't that it gets some coverage (and certainly not that it gets too much, unless you are ignoring all of the other stories that take place in a given day), it's that it is covered in ways that add to the tension, all the while not really providing a great deal of serious journalism.

Perhaps the Mehserle story shouldn't have received any coverage at all in terms of your opinion, but that aside, it was a locally covered issue for the most part. You can find a great deal of local news covering the subject, but not so much in terms of national news. Brief mention of a subject does not suggest in-depth coverage of what you consider to be a front burner issue. Like Shuma said earlier, Balloon boy recieved more coverage than pretty much any other issue at the time, and I consider that a very sad fact.

National coverage usually involves riots, not individual incidents. I know there is information summarizing the subjects that are covered nationally, but I am having a hard time finding it. If I do find that information, I will go ahead and drop the info in this thread.

Apologies if I misinterpreted your meaning, Mattlov, but the assumption that racial tension exists because one group of people talk about it... is ridiculous at best. Perhaps I did misinterpret your meaning, but I do not feel that what you are suggesting is true at all. If you just don't believe there are any problems left to solve, and that all the blame rests on the shoulders of those that are outspoken on subjects that you have a different perspective on, then there really isn't a great deal left to discuss.

In short, I feel that the idea that racism still exists because a handful of people that speak from a position of anger (and in a limited set of case cases, delusion) gain a modicum of national coverage, is completely preposterous. It is an alternate reality that the narrative is based in, relying on placing blame where none may be present. You may feel the opposite is true, but I have little information that actually reinforces your opinion.

Racism as an overt belief is more or less behind us. The number of people who believe races are somehow distinct from each other is vanishingly small.

On the other hand, privilege is still with us and the inability of people to examine their own privilege and recognise other people don’t have those natural advantages because of their skin colour is a huge problem. Mattlov’s post, and well, the underlying assumption of this thead demonstrate this very well.