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I was under the impression that tank hunters didn't work on Monoliths.

Wonderful! Can you give a reference or a solid argument? The 2004 FAQ says the ability doesn't, but it's not in the latest FAQ (inexcusably). Did they alter it in later editions of the codex??


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In any event...responding to original topic:

while I did both diagrams and math for your tactica, I see it as excellent in 2/3 of missions, but weak in dawn of war. I Also see it weak in facing a mech army ("my other car is a leman Russ"...in a 9-tank IG list) altho the corner deployment is still strong.

In facing the mech army, the Mono needs to be screened by warriors >12" before it. They can provide the nuisance factor v skimmers and such to hold them at bay with the threat of 32-64 Gauss shots (in my case). Behind them - and getting a cover save - should be the destroyers. Behind them should be the Mono shielding the C'Tan (if any) or Pariahs. The Scarabs and Wraiths can jetbikr out to enfold vulnerable units, as the phalanx ponderously moves towards a central objective. Note that in 50% of games the Crons must advance as the odd (winning) objective favors the opponent.

I welcome your thoughts as I see the Crons as presently struggling.

Kinda off topic but when is the new cron dex coming out?

If you put your Warriors in front of the Monoliths, you are highly likely to get them assaulted and then run down by anything with some decent CC potential.

As for Tank hunters vs. Living Metal, it was specified in the 4th ED faq but not in the 5th. Living Metal doesn't specifically forbid it, but it also hasn't changed in wording since the 4th ed FAQ that disallowed it. Why it was removed from the 5th ed FAQ isn't known.

Because GW couldn't make up their minds.

Codex rumored for later this year.
Since it was written in the 4th FAQ I'd be tempted to use it.
Yes, but the eldar mech I faced is mainly shooty and so mobile I can't prevent their assaulting on their terms anyway. Massed gauss fire seems to worry him, but he could take out the lith my crons need for support. At 235 it's tempting to field a second instead of five destroyers.

Did the numbers and here's my anti-mech list, esp'y vs Tau snd Eldar, skimmer mech forces. They will always have a cheap gadget that gives cover saves to skimmers, thus cutting down 50% of your hits. Massed firepower and good luck is all you can use. Since you lose 12" range if you move you want your infantry screen far forward so they can shoot without moving.

Deployment is 30+ Warriors in 3units (to grab objectives) in a 30" line with the Lord+Orb covering all three. Moving behind this line but always within 6" of Orb are 3 Hvy Destroyers in two units. Their 4+ cover save will protect them when fired upon by long range skimmer weapons. Deployed with Destroyers are your Scarabs or Wraiths, ready to charge out 18" and engage enemy melée troops.

16" behind and within 18" of all three units is the monolith. Any 36" weapons fired by skimmers at Mono will bring them within 24" if the Warriors. Hiding behind the Mono would be your C'Tan.

Your goal is to use the Destroyers and occasionally the Mono and CTan to ordnance skimmers with the help of some Gauss glances. Note that a successful glance requires 20 Gauss shots on average! Obviously Immortals would help this firing line.

With corner deployment you're looking at about 25-30" frontage of Warriors deployed in the corner, with the end of the line about 20-23" from the corner.


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This line advances towards objectives until they've secured a couple, using the CTan to assault a center contested one, perhaps with Wraiths and Flayed Ones.

Note that you could toss the CTan and add 5-6 Destroyers. While this commits you to solely using Firepower, some would say that's enough. I personally disagree and would Field a destroyer Lord plus 2 Hvy or 3 regular Destroyers with 10 Flayed Ones as a counter assault force.

Consider Scarabs and Spyders with your Warriors? They're pretty dangerous against Eldar melee units. Flayed Ones won't accomplish much.

Aman wrote:Wonderful! Can you give a reference or a solid argument? The 2004 FAQ says the ability doesn't, but it's not in the latest FAQ (inexcusably). Did they alter it in later editions of the codex??

Yes, as Mondo mentioned in your thread in YMDC. The current wording on Living Metal makes clear that you only ever get 1d6 + weapon strength. The only exception to that is Ordnance, which still only adds one die but gets to roll two and take the higher one of them. Fire Dragons can only ever kill a monolith on a Glancing 6. No need to be so aggressive with folks when you already know that you're using an outdated copy of the codex. Yes, GW should have added the wording changes to an Errata section of the Necron FAQ, but the fact that they didn't isn't the fault of anyone here.

Even if TH worked, only the FD exarchs have it, so you're saying that either two exarchs both rolled 6s to penetrate, or your opponent cheated and played the whole squad as having TH.

Also not clear on what you said about Holofields. The standard Eldar transport (Wave Serpent) can't take them. The HS tank, the Falcon, can (and makes a decent choice to carry squads of up to 6 Fire Dragons), but it costs ~185+pts and takes away slots he could be using for Fire Prisms, which would give him S9 or S10 (combined fire) shots.

The Grog wrote:As for the Monolith and LOS, I believe the flying base stick that ships with the model is maybe an inch tall. More than low enough to block anything.

It doesn't actually come with one at all. In 4th edition all Skimmers had to be mounted on flying stands and didn't block LOS. In 5th they're mounted on whatever they come with (which is nothing, for Monoliths), and block LOS however they actually do. So Monoliths are walls blocking a lot of LOS.

Yeah, nothing short of S9 or S10 can pen a mono, the eldar player probably didn't know that TH didn't matter, although only the exarchs should get it, so sounds like be cheated there.

Was he the friendly casual kinda guy or the "Victories for the victory god!" kinda guy: he seems like the "must win" kind of guy

They usually pick on Tau and crons, as they are considered easy pray, although they may beat up on the new SM player every nowand then. Most of this players play either mech guard or mechdar.

Best countermeasure - don't play against them.


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Sry bout grmr, 2 slpy 2 cair...

It was a casual game. Since I haven't played much lately I warned him in advance that I'd forget my own special rules and we sort of muddled thru. In the end we both forgot phase out and lots if other little things.

Actually, another player - experienced - mentioned that about Exarchs only having the ability sothe guy checked his book bc he wasn't certain and read the passage aloud, and they confer the ability onto their squad.

I'm just looking for info that GW is supposed to provide as the authors of a large complex game system. You're mistakenly reading aggression into the equation. The game systems are so large that boards like this are necessary to get thru a game at all. Getting a straight and reasonable answer on 2-3 rules that determined the game result has taken time and effort. Personally, I like my game results to revolve around skill and a little luck, not about knowing - or not knowing - the rules.


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The Grog wrote:Consider Scarabs and Spyders with your Warriors? They're pretty dangerous against Eldar melee units. Flayed Ones won't accomplish much.

yes. I forgot to mention spyders.
Actually i think FO are pretty good. On the charge they get 30 WS4 S4 I4 attacks, plus the 3+ Save and WBB. They and the melée Lord were the heroes in my last two games. At 180 points, plus a melée Lord they're only 380, slightly more than Nightbringer. But they've 23-33 attacks, contribute 11 figs against Phase Out, and are underestimated. Whil Nb is nasty, he scares people so much they shoot him down. Of course that Itself can also contribute to victory...

Aman wrote:Actually, another player - experienced - mentioned that about Exarchs only having the ability sothe guy checked his book bc he wasn't certain and read the passage aloud, and they confer the ability onto their squad.

Thanks for the correction; just double-checked my codex and you're right. I must have forgotten since it's so long since I used it. Usually it's overkill for normal vehicles, and it's useless against the Monolith, so I can't remember the last time I saw anyone take it.

Aman wrote:It was a casual game. Since I haven't played much lately I warned him in advance that I'd forget my own special rules and we sort of muddled thru. In the end we both forgot phase out and lots if other little things.

Aman wrote:I'm just looking for info that GW is supposed to provide as the authors of a large complex game system. You're mistakenly reading aggression into the equation. The game systems are so large that boards like this are necessary to get thru a game at all. Getting a straight and reasonable answer on 2-3 rules that determined the game result has taken time and effort. Personally, I like my game results to revolve around skill and a little luck, not about knowing - or not knowing - the rules.

Well, I think there's a bit of a disconnect here. Any complex game requires some practice and understanding to get a representative result. When folks are still in the "learning & making mistakes on the rules" stage, they usually wait a bit before condemning the game or dismissing tactics described by experienced players.

Mannahnin wrote:
It doesn't actually come with one at all. In 4th edition all Skimmers had to be mounted on flying stands and didn't block LOS. In 5th they're mounted on whatever they come with (which is nothing, for Monoliths), and block LOS however they actually do. So Monoliths are walls blocking a lot of LOS.

Hmm, I'd swear mine did. But I bought mine when the codex released, too, so that was entire editions ago.

Flayed Ones are going to have trouble beating anything that dares to call itself a melee unit. Talking about Eldar in specific, Banshees are likely to just charge the FOs and win flatly. Scarabs and Spyders may still loose too, but at least they won't be run down, and I think they have a better chance of winning.

My FO meleed his banshees for 3-4 rounds at partial strength. In the end they were wiped out but took all but a couple with them which the Lord finished off.


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Mannaheim, I said I'm returning and rusty. I've been playing 40k since 3rd edition, about 1998, and played Necrons with the original box set. And I've been playing/designing wargames for 29 years, and have a game design company with two published games. After 10-15 years of GW, my patience with them is thinner than Elrond's list of allies. Considering the state of this codex, it's fair to say they are sloppy at best. Why should I or anyone have to exert this much effort to get questions answered that should be right on the front page of a complete FAQ? Plus if you've the 1st ed codex (both mine snd the flgs) you need the previous FAQ
too?? Get the FAQ outta here GW! . Bunch of numnuts but I like the figs. Overall, I appreciate Privateer Press more and more...

I hear you. Since the DE finally got their update, Necrons are the most outdated book, and the FAQ missing errata (which errata go back to when they were doing "stealth reprints") is just terrible.

I hadn't looked at the Necron FAQ for a while and am horrified at what seems to have gone missing.

I have opened two Monolith boxes this year and neither have come with a flying base. Just throwing that out there.

Not surprised. Mine did, but I bought mine within a month of the original codex release. Long before TLOS and the basing problems & restrictions that came with it.

Fwiw, no flying base in my mono fromseversl years ago.

So how about warrior spamming? Not a viable option? Even with using disruption field scarabs for anti tank?

I would advise against it.

Warriors are just too weak in CC. Without Monoliths to hide behind you'd be phased out in pretty short order.

.

Hey, glad you liked it buddy! Thanks for reading!

Heading over to your thread right now!