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yakface wrote:Consistent except for every other anti-psychic thing in the game besides Shadow in the Warp affecting psykers in vehicles?

Yeah, that's consistent!

True, I had forgot about that angle...well it still only makes me want to slap a baby instead of punch one

wyomingfox wrote:Shadows in the Warp is no more a psychic power than runic weapons or psychic hoods are. The only thing consistant was that the ruling gave mech lists another edge.

Fine, psychic effect or whatever you want to call it. At least I can still carve open the tin can to get to the psyker. I can't do anything about the IC ruling.

Anyway you get the point and this is OT for the updated stuff...

BrassScorpion wrote:

Crap, no more Drop Podding into terrain. My marines might explode

Huh? I didn't see anything like that. There's a line about missing the table and a bunch of other Drop Pod stuff that has nothing to do with that at all, but I didn't see anything about terrain in the Space Marine FAQ 1.1 or the main rule book FAQ.

Q: Does a unit being transported by a vehicle that has
arrived by Deep Stike that turn also count as having
arrived by Deep Strike? (p95)
A: Yes.

Q: If models disembark from a transport into dangerous
terrain, do they take a dangerous terrain test? Unlike Pilein
or Consolidation moves, disembarking does not
specifically states that it doesn't trigger dangerous terrain
tests. (p67)
A: Dangerous terrain says you test for every model that
has 'entered, left or moved through' the terrain. As there is
no exception in the text, disembarking models do have to
test. However, if they disembark at the beginning of their
move and then move after the disembarkation, only one
test is needed, not two.

Thanks, I did my keyword search on the term, "Drop Pod" rather than "vehicle" or "deep strike" so I didn't see that.

yakface wrote:
Ummm, no. You still have to be able to identify that a unit actually destroyed another unit. For example, a unit falling back off the table is not being destroyed by any unit, they count as casualties due to a rule unrelated to any unit.

That's just it - this FAQ is a bit of a slippery slope. You can say that a unit within 6" "caused" the destruction of the unit by not allowing a regroup. If the unit would have been normally allowed to regroup, but couldn't and was destroyed, what was the cause of the destruction? Running off the table. Yes, but what caused them to run off the table? Not being able to regroup. What caused them not to be able to regroup? A unit within 6".

A unit was destroyed by an exploding vehicle. The DE unit didn't destroy the enemy unit, a vehicle did. Yes, but the vehicle's destruction is what caused the unit to be destroyed and what caused the vehicle to be destroyed was the DE unit.

They are similar causal leaps.

Yakface wrote:

Rugrud wrote:

Q: Can you take a Drop Pod with a 10-man squad and
then put a combat squad in it, deploying the other combat
squad on the table, or leave it in reserve but not in the
Drop Pod? (p69)
A: No, because squads that are placed in reserve may not
break down into combat squads.

Does that prevent say Blood angels to split their assault squads into 5 man squads and DS? I fint it hard to believe...

This Q&A was already there in the DA FAQ, so i wonder if this is a real change or an error of copy/paste - consitency thing...

That seems to be the case!

? What is the case? Why can't a BA player deploy the unit via deepstrike, thereby splitting into combat squads at deployment?

wyomingfox wrote:

BrassScorpion wrote:

Crap, no more Drop Podding into terrain. My marines might explode

Huh? I didn't see anything like that. There's a line about missing the table and a bunch of other Drop Pod stuff that has nothing to do with that at all, but I didn't see anything about terrain in the Space Marine FAQ 1.1 or the main rule book FAQ.

Q: Does a unit being transported by a vehicle that has
arrived by Deep Stike that turn also count as having
arrived by Deep Strike? (p95)
A: Yes.

Q: If models disembark from a transport into dangerous
terrain, do they take a dangerous terrain test? Unlike Pilein
or Consolidation moves, disembarking does not
specifically states that it doesn't trigger dangerous terrain
tests. (p67)
A: Dangerous terrain says you test for every model that
has 'entered, left or moved through' the terrain. As there is
no exception in the text, disembarking models do have to
test. However, if they disembark at the beginning of their
move and then move after

On the plus side...if I drop a spore pod with warriors into difficult terrain, they won't have to take a dangerous terrain test since it's not a "vehicle" Not that I'd normally play it that way, but it's handy ammo for playing against a RAW junkie


Automatically Appended Next Post:

puma713 wrote:What is the case? Why can't a BA player deploy the unit via deepstrike, thereby splitting into combat squads at deployment?

Q: Can you take a Drop Pod with a 10-man squad and
then put a combat squad in it, deploying the other combat
squad on the table, or leave it in reserve but not in the
Drop Pod? (p32)
A: No, because squads that are placed in reserve may not
break down into combat squads.[/quote]

puma713 wrote:? What is the case? Why can't a BA player deploy the unit via deepstrike, thereby splitting into combat squads at deployment?

What are you talking about? You can't combat squad a unit held in reserve, which a unit that was Deep Striking would have to be. The only provision for combat squadding on Deep Strike is if you do so by Drop Pod; there's no other rule that allows you to combat squad on arrival.

Corrode wrote:

puma713 wrote:? What is the case? Why can't a BA player deploy the unit via deepstrike, thereby splitting into combat squads at deployment?

What are you talking about? You can't combat squad a unit held in reserve, which a unit that was Deep Striking would have to be. The only provision for combat squadding on Deep Strike is if you do so by Drop Pod; there's no other rule that allows you to combat squad on arrival.

Ah, that was what I was missing. I don't have any codices on me, since I'm at work. I thought there was a provision that states that "upon deployment", you may combat squad. Because if there wasn't you wouldn't be able to ever combat squad.

Which raises the debate about deep strike deployment versus deep strike movement.

puma713 wrote:
That's just it - this FAQ is a bit of a slippery slope. You can say that a unit within 6" "caused" the destruction of the unit by not allowing a regroup. If the unit would have been normally allowed to regroup, but couldn't and was destroyed, what was the cause of the destruction? Running off the table. Yes, but what caused them to run off the table? Not being able to regroup. What caused them not to be able to regroup? A unit within 6".

A unit was destroyed by an exploding vehicle. The DE unit didn't destroy the enemy unit, a vehicle did. Yes, but the vehicle's destruction is what caused the unit to be destroyed and what caused the vehicle to be destroyed was the DE unit.

They are similar causal leaps.

I agree that this particular FAQ answer leaves lots of unanswered situations, but to draw the conclusions you have means that every unit is responsible for destroying every unit in the game, because every unit has some sort of indirect effect on every other unit in the game.

In the specific case covered in the FAQ, a direct link can be drawn back to the unit doing the destroying. They destroyed the vehicle which caused the explosion which destroyed the enemy unit.

In the case of a unit being removed due to falling back to a table edge, no enemy unit was directly responsible for triggering that special rule...You could try to argue that the enemy unit that caused them to fall back could be responsible, but the act of falling back is not what destroyed the unit...they could have potentially regrouped for example.

So yeah, while this answer certainly leaves a lot of questions up to be answered by the players (or a fan FAQ), there obviously has to be a line drawn somewhere or else you just have every single unit being responsible for the destruction of every unit.

Ah, that was what I was missing. I don't have any codices on me, since I'm at work. I thought there was a provision that states that "upon deployment", you may combat squad. Because if there wasn't you wouldn't be able to ever combat squad.

Which raises the debate about deep strike deployment versus deep strike movement.

Yeah, that is what their rule says in the codex (well, it says 'when the unit is deployed', which is different then 'during deployment'), so that's why this FAQ ruling is a big change.


And Deep Striking is both deployment and movement, as is a unit that arrives normally from Reserves.

Q: When a Damaged – Weapon Destroyed result is rolled
and a weapon is destroyed are any built-in, combi or coaxial
weapons attached to it also destroyed? (p61)
A: Yes.

This seems like a new nerf to Razorbacks with las/plas on them.

Now if they get a weapon destroyed, both weapons are gone.

gannam wrote:Q: When a Damaged – Weapon Destroyed result is rolled
and a weapon is destroyed are any built-in, combi or coaxial
weapons attached to it also destroyed? (p61)
A: Yes.

This seems like a new nerf to Razorbacks with las/plas on them.

Now if they get a weapon destroyed, both weapons are gone.

Q: If a Razorback armed with a lascannon and twin-linked
plasma gun suffers a weapon destroyed result, does it
destroy both weapons or just one? (p35)
A: Only one weapon – either the lascannon or the twinlinked
plasma gun.

The plasma guns are not built-in, coaxial, or combi.

Maelstrom808 wrote:On the plus side...if I drop a spore pod with warriors into difficult terrain, they won't have to take a dangerous terrain test since it's not a "vehicle" Not that I'd normally play it that way, but it's handy ammo for playing against a RAW junkie

As a tyranid player, I think I should also apply this rule to Spore Pods even though the FAQ doesn't expressly mention thier scenario (not a vehicle). The mechanics would seam to be similar. Then again there is the Shadow in the Warp FAQ and I know SM players wouldn't apply that FAQ to their hoods when up against enemy psychers in a transport .

wyomingfox wrote:

Maelstrom808 wrote:On the plus side...if I drop a spore pod with warriors into difficult terrain, they won't have to take a dangerous terrain test since it's not a "vehicle" Not that I'd normally play it that way, but it's handy ammo for playing against a RAW junkie

As a tyranid player, I think I should also apply this rule to Spore Pods even though the FAQ doesn't expressly mention thier scenario (not a vehicle). The mechanics would seam to be similar. Then again there is the Shadow in the Warp FAQ and I know SM players wouldn't apply that FAQ to their hoods when up against enemy psychers in a transport .

We know spore pods aren't similar - Tyranid ICs won't climb in them.

Holy Crap! Time to start adding some TH/SS models to my Deathwing army. 3+ Invul save with Feel no Pain as Troops!? Yes please!

All good things.

Still no word on Djinn Blades though.

Well they didn't fix RW bikes not being able to turboboost during scout like Marines but otherwise I'll take it!

yakface wrote:Consistent except for every other anti-psychic thing in the game besides Shadow in the Warp affecting psykers in vehicles?

How many other anti-psychic psyker powers are there?

Crevab wrote:Crap, no more Drop Podding into terrain. My marines might explode

Where do you see this???? I can't find any text that says differently.....

Melissia wrote:

yakface wrote:Consistent except for every other anti-psychic thing in the game besides Shadow in the Warp affecting psykers in vehicles?

How many other anti-psychic psyker powers are there?

Shadow in the Warp is not listed in the codex as a "psychic power"


Automatically Appended Next Post:

General Hobbs wrote:

Crevab wrote:Crap, no more Drop Podding into terrain. My marines might explode

Where do you see this???? I can't find any text that says differently.....

Q: Does a unit being transported by a vehicle that has
arrived by Deep Stike that turn also count as having
arrived by Deep Strike? (p95)
A: Yes.

Servitors not taking up an Elites slot is pretty nice for people running a MOTF dread-heavy army.

Ozymandias wrote:Holy Crap! Time to start adding some TH/SS models to my Deathwing army. 3+ Invul save with Feel no Pain as Troops!? Yes please!

How are you getting FNP on troops? Regular squads and DW squads can have apothecaries?????

Death Wing Terminators can have an Apothecary in one squad and a banner too. Check out my conversions for those in the Gallery.

Woot! Vindication!

Duke Sliscus deploys like any other IC if the player's army contains no Kabalite Warriors or Trueborn.

wyomingfox wrote:Shadow in the Warp is not listed in the codex as a "psychic power"

Neither are the powers used by that Doom fellow, but them being psychic in nature is the reason why GW says they don't work on transported individuals.

BrassScorpion wrote:Death Wing Terminators can have an Apothecary in one squad and a banner too. Check out my conversions for those in the Gallery.

nice conversions. the other caveat to the rule is that belial *must* be taken to upgrade one of the Deathwing squads to a command squad.

REJOICE MY BROTHERS!

Praise to the Emperor, Beloved by All!

All the changes to BT are awesome (sure, some stuff got weaker, but overall these changes are great).

TO THE CRUSADES!

EDIT: No more +1A for the Servo-Harness Plasma Pistol, too bad. But now we can repair from inside a vehicle.

Melissia wrote:

wyomingfox wrote:Shadow in the Warp is not listed in the codex as a "psychic power"

Neither are the powers used by that Doom fellow, but them being psychic in nature is the reason why GW says they don't work on transported individuals.

And you'd like to argue that a Psychic Hood isn't?

The Shadows ruling is inconsistent with every other piece of anti-psyker gear in the game.

gannam wrote:Q: When a Damaged – Weapon Destroyed result is rolled
and a weapon is destroyed are any built-in, combi or coaxial
weapons attached to it also destroyed? (p61)
A: Yes.

This seems like a new nerf to Razorbacks with las/plas on them.

Now if they get a weapon destroyed, both weapons are gone.

So you mean my furiso with blood talons and a built in multi-melta cant have a floating ghost multi-melta when the blood talon is removed


Automatically Appended Next Post:

Q: What is meant when the term ʻturnʼ is used? (p9)
A: Whenever the word turn is used it means player turn.
Otherwise it will clearly state game turn. In a complete
game turn both players get a player turn. Hence one game
turn will comprise two player turns.

There's a definition for "turn"! i wonder if they have the same thing for "phase"

wyomingfox wrote:

Melissia wrote:

yakface wrote:Consistent except for every other anti-psychic thing in the game besides Shadow in the Warp affecting psykers in vehicles?

How many other anti-psychic psyker powers are there?

Shadow in the Warp is not listed in the codex as a "psychic power"


Automatically Appended Next Post:

General Hobbs wrote:

Crevab wrote:Crap, no more Drop Podding into terrain. My marines might explode

Where do you see this???? I can't find any text that says differently.....

Q: Does a unit being transported by a vehicle that has
arrived by Deep Stike that turn also count as having
arrived by Deep Strike? (p95)
A: Yes.

Created an interesting hilarious siation.

Drop lands fine, marines get out in terrain. because they are also deepstriking, they suffer deep strike mishap, and you roll go back into reserve.

Now they are in reserve without their drop pod, lol.
Do they walk onto the board now?

And what is the luff explanation? Did they leap back into their orbital battle barge?

The definition for turn was already in the rulebook. It's only in the FAQ because half the players in the game were completely ignorant of it.

e: Landing in terrain doesn't make you mishap, landing in impassable terrain, friendly models or 1" of enemy models does. Pods can't do any of those things, so you're safe. You might take a few DT tests though.

I'm sad. They didn't dig out the "anti-suck"
wand and wave it at the Tau for me. I am disappoint.