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You don't roll on the mishap table for landing in dangerous terrain.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

Ozymandias wrote:Well they didn't fix RW bikes not being able to turboboost during scout like Marines but otherwise I'll take it!

They might have; the old DA FAQ prevented RW bikes from turboboosting in the scout phase. That FAQ is now gone.

Storm Shields, DA...

Dark Angel FAQ:
"Page 54 – Storm shield
Change to “A storm shield is a solid shield that has an energy field generator built into it. The energy field iscapable of deflecting almost any attack, even blows from lascannons and power weapons. A model with a storm shield has a 3+ invulnerable save. A model equipped with a storm shield can never claim the +1 Attack bonus for being"

So Dark Angels finally get the good newest version of the Storm Shields? Maybe we'll see some Dark Angels armies on game tables again soon.

I find one thing really wrong in these SM updates.

Q. Can you take a Drop Pod with a 10-man squad and then put a combat squad in it, deploying the other combat
squad on the table, or leave it in reserve but not in the Drop Pod? (p35)
A. No, because squads that are placed in reserve may not break down into combat squads.

The underlined portion is actually incorrect. Read the rules for Combat Squad. It specifically says that you CAN combat squad when disembarking from the drop pod. So how can GW say you can combat squad and you cannot? In the Dark Angels rules for Combat Squad it specifically states, "Any unit left in reserve cannot combat squad." I compared word for word the Combat Squad rule between Dark Angels and Space Marines. That sentence is not in the Space Marine rules. After this sentence is the exception for disembarking from Drop Pods. SM codex actually reads oddly missing this sentence. I've had it confuse people why there is an exception for drop pods, when there's nothing to exception to. In codex Space Marine there is no rule saying you cannot break down into combat squads in reserve.

Now, the the answer to the question is correct, but GW's reasoning is not. You cannot both DEPLOY a unit on the table and NOT DEPLOY a unit by keeping them in reserve. You either deploy and combat squad now, or stay in reserve and combat squad later. Except DAs.

Combat squadding from a drop pod is specifically allowed by the combat squad rule. Any other form of combat squadding in reserve is not.

Problem solved!

Corrode wrote:Combat squadding from a drop pod is specifically allowed by the combat squad rule. Any other form of combat squadding in reserve is not.

Problem solved!

That would require an errata on all SM codexes.

yakface wrote:GW have never, ever, ever seemed to make any effort to produce a new codex to fix 'issues' with the old one. Instead they seem to make new codexes based on what miniature line they want to work on, what miniature line revamp would work into the schedule, etc, etc, etc.

Are you forgetting Dark Eldar V2 codex? It's the only one I know of, but it could happen again...

wyomingfox wrote:

Ozymandias wrote:Well they didn't fix RW bikes not being able to turboboost during scout like Marines but otherwise I'll take it!

They might have; the old DA FAQ prevented RW bikes from turboboosting in the scout phase. That FAQ is now gone.

sorry, but the rule is in the codex. the faq ruling was there because the main rulebook faq said you CAN turbo boost in general while the DA codex said ravenwing can NOT. they still can't unfortunately...

Janthkin wrote:

Melissia wrote:

wyomingfox wrote:Shadow in the Warp is not listed in the codex as a "psychic power"

Neither are the powers used by that Doom fellow, but them being psychic in nature is the reason why GW says they don't work on transported individuals.

And you'd like to argue that a Psychic Hood isn't?

The Psychic Hood is technological in nature.

So yes.

I would argue that the Psychic Hood is not a psychic power which GW doesn't label as a psychic power in game. No, it is a piece of technology which makes it harder for psykers to use psychic powers within its range.

I'm not saying I approve. Just that this is actually internally consistent.

Melissia wrote:I would argue that the Psychic Hood is not a psychic power which GW doesn't label as a psychic power in game. No, it is a piece of technology which makes it harder for psykers to use psychic powers within its range.

I'm not saying I approve. Just that this is actually internally consistent.

But only psychers can activate them. . .techologically?

warboss wrote:

wyomingfox wrote:

Ozymandias wrote:Well they didn't fix RW bikes not being able to turboboost during scout like Marines but otherwise I'll take it!

They might have; the old DA FAQ prevented RW bikes from turboboosting in the scout phase. That FAQ is now gone.

sorry, but the rule is in the codex. the faq ruling was there because the main rulebook faq said you CAN turbo boost in general while the DA codex said ravenwing can NOT. they still can't unfortunately...

There's a reason for this. Deathwing Assault.

If they could turboboost you'd be getting 30" pinpoint deepstrikes of termies on turn one.

odmiller wrote:There's a reason for this. Deathwing Assault.

If they could turboboost you'd be getting 30" pinpoint deepstrikes of termies on turn one.

lol, ever try moving the full 24" while still staying more than 12" away from enemy models as the scout rules state? sure, you can move 30" but that realistically means you're going to an unoccupied corner or simply shifting in your own deployment zone. its not that overpowering in practice as it is in theory. i just don't like the fluff behind it. the *best* bikers in the imperium who SLEEP and EAT on their bikes can't do what a n00b ultramarine bike scout can do.

Hm, Deathwing seems like an incredibly strong army now, with the potential to take mass TH/SS with Cyclone missiles in the same squad. Not sure how I feel about that.

i don't know if this will confuse me more, or clear up questions i have about DE. but then, i've got no head for this meta-game stuff...

ryan3740 wrote:I find one thing really wrong in these SM updates.

Q. Can you take a Drop Pod with a 10-man squad and then put a combat squad in it, deploying the other combat
squad on the table, or leave it in reserve but not in the Drop Pod? (p35)
A. No, because squads that are placed in reserve may not break down into combat squads.

The underlined portion is actually incorrect. Read the rules for Combat Squad. It specifically says that you CAN combat squad when disembarking from the drop pod. So how can GW say you can combat squad and you cannot? In the Dark Angels rules for Combat Squad it specifically states, "Any unit left in reserve cannot combat squad." I compared word for word the Combat Squad rule between Dark Angels and Space Marines. That sentence is not in the Space Marine rules. After this sentence is the exception for disembarking from Drop Pods. SM codex actually reads oddly missing this sentence. I've had it confuse people why there is an exception for drop pods, when there's nothing to exception to. In codex Space Marine there is no rule saying you cannot break down into combat squads in reserve.

Now, the the answer to the question is correct, but GW's reasoning is not. You cannot both DEPLOY a unit on the table and NOT DEPLOY a unit by keeping them in reserve. You either deploy and combat squad now, or stay in reserve and combat squad later. Except DAs.

Corrode wrote:Combat squadding from a drop pod is specifically allowed by the combat squad rule. Any other form of combat squadding in reserve is not.

Problem solved!

Maybe I'm missing something (obviously I am). I hold a unit of 10 Blood Angel assault marines in reserve. I then roll a 5 on turn 2, bringing them in. They're still a unit of 10. Upon deployment (deep striking), I combat squad them.

What prevents this? Is it the combat squad rule? If so, does anyone have that wording? Combat squadding in reserve and combat squadding from reserve are two very different things.

oldone wrote:ok i take back what i said GW are such fan boys

Q. Is a model that has suffered an unsaved wound, but
hasnʼt been killed, from Arjac throwing his Foehammer
reduced to initiative 1 until the end of the next player turn?
(p51)
A. Yes.

yeah because everyone wants their IC model autosnuffed by JotWW....

Fetterkey wrote:Hm, Deathwing seems like an incredibly strong army now, with the potential to take mass TH/SS with Cyclone missiles in the same squad. Not sure how I feel about that.

while i'm glad that this updates them to 5e standards for the most part, this isn't as much of a power boost overall as it is just a simplification to avoid confusion. is the SS and cyclone missile launcher specifically a boost? absolutely, but they're no better than their vanilla marine counterparts.. The FNP apothecary? to be honest, i'd prefer the old apothecary rule as it allowed me one no roll required terminator saved every player turn. the best part was that it applied to a model within 6" so it didn't have to be from the same squad and worked against plasma weapons. I'd consider this one to be a lateral change in power but good in the sense that now all marine apothecaries grant FNP (it was sometimes painful to explain to other players that my medic was different from theirs). smoke launchers? i prefered the only-glancing hits-with smoke since it coudn't be screwed up by my roll and guaranteed that my vehicle coudn't be one-shot destroyed by anything short of a melta. what this does is make DA more standard and less confusing on the tabletop with a medium boost to deathwing specifically.

warboss wrote:

Fetterkey wrote:Hm, Deathwing seems like an incredibly strong army now, with the potential to take mass TH/SS with Cyclone missiles in the same squad. Not sure how I feel about that.

while i'm glad that this updates them to 5e standards for the most part, this isn't as much of a power boost overall as it is just a simplification to avoid confusion. is the SS and cyclone missile launcher specifically a boost? absolutely, but they're no better than their vanilla marine counterparts.. The FNP apothecary? to be honest, i'd prefer the old apothecary rule as it allowed me one no roll required terminator saved every player turn. the best part was that it applied to a model within 6" so it didn't have to be from the same squad and worked against plasma weapons. I'd consider this one to be a lateral change in power but good in the sense that now all marine apothecaries grant FNP (it was sometimes painful to explain to other players that my medic was different from theirs). smoke launchers? i prefered the only-glancing hits-with smoke since it coudn't be screwed up by my roll and guaranteed that my vehicle coudn't be one-shot destroyed by anything short of a melta. what this does is make DA more standard and less confusing on the tabletop with a medium boost to deathwing specifically.

It's a huge power boost. Vanilla marines can't take TH/SS terminators that also have strong long-range shooting options available, much less FNP.

puma713 wrote:

ryan3740 wrote:I find one thing really wrong in these SM updates.

Q. Can you take a Drop Pod with a 10-man squad and then put a combat squad in it, deploying the other combat
squad on the table, or leave it in reserve but not in the Drop Pod? (p35)
A. No, because squads that are placed in reserve may not break down into combat squads.

What prevents this? Is it the combat squad rule? If so, does anyone have that wording? Combat squadding in reserve and combat squadding from reserve are two very different things.

you have to read the exact wording. "SQUADS THAT ARE PLACED IN RESERVE MAY NOT..." in your example, did you ever place your squad in reserve? if so, you cannot break down into combat squads.

warboss wrote:

puma713 wrote:

ryan3740 wrote:I find one thing really wrong in these SM updates.

Q. Can you take a Drop Pod with a 10-man squad and then put a combat squad in it, deploying the other combat
squad on the table, or leave it in reserve but not in the Drop Pod? (p35)
A. No, because squads that are placed in reserve may not break down into combat squads.

What prevents this? Is it the combat squad rule? If so, does anyone have that wording? Combat squadding in reserve and combat squadding from reserve are two very different things.

you have to read the exact wording. "SQUADS THAT ARE PLACED IN RESERVE MAY NOT..." in your example, did you ever place your squad in reserve? if so, you cannot break down into combat squads.

I feel I can go over the whole internet explaining this.

This is not true.

The decision to combat squad and the decision to put a unit into reserves happens at the same time. Deployment.

So the decision to combat squad can happen before you decide to place one or both units in reserve, as there is no set order.

All the FAQ prevents you from doing is splitting a single unit into combat squads after you have placed it in reserve, clarifying to those confused about the ability to combat squad when a unit arrives from reserves. The Drop Pod exception still take precedent, of course.

Nothing has changed as far as combat squads go.

Fetterkey wrote:It's a huge power boost. Vanilla marines can't take TH/SS terminators that also have strong long-range shooting options available, much less FNP.

while i agree its a boost, it's not that big in actual practice. what you'll normally be shooting those 48" krak missles at (vehicles) will not be within range of your assault. i already experience that with my assault cannon and its rending ability.. half the time what is best to shoot is NOT what i can assault. it's a nice addition that admittedly adds an option but hardly a huge power boost. as FNP, blood angels can rock the FNP terminator squads (and 30 of them since its a range effect instead of within a squad). remember, you can only upgrade a single squad of 5 deathwing terminators to a command squad with an apothecary and that they already had an apothecary upgrade prior to the faq that was IMO almost as good.

Mahu wrote:

warboss wrote:

puma713 wrote:

ryan3740 wrote:*snip*

All the FAQ prevents you from doing is splitting a single unit into combat squads after you have placed it in reserve, clarifying to those confused about the ability to combat squad when a unit arrives from reserves. The Drop Pod exception still take precedent, of course.

Thank you, Mahu. This is exactly my point. It's a clarification of when a squad is broken into combat squads. It's not to say, "If you EVER put a squad into reserve, it cannot combat squad." But, "If you put a squad into reserve, it cannot combat squad while in reserve, but at its deployment."

At least, that's how I've read it.

I find one thing really wrong in these SM updates.

Q. Can you take a Drop Pod with a 10-man squad and then put a combat squad in it, deploying the other combat
squad on the table, or leave it in reserve but not in the Drop Pod? (p35)
A. No, because squads that are placed in reserve may not break down into combat squads.

The underlined portion is actually incorrect. Read the rules for Combat Squad. It specifically says that you CAN combat squad when disembarking from the drop pod. So how can GW say you can combat squad and you cannot? In the Dark Angels rules for Combat Squad it specifically states, "Any unit left in reserve cannot combat squad."

The QnA in question has been in the DA FAQ for the last two years or so. That's why it makes no sense, it was written for the DA codex, then all of a sudden copy and pasted into all the SM FAQs.

Mahu wrote:

warboss wrote:
you have to read the exact wording. "SQUADS THAT ARE PLACED IN RESERVE MAY NOT..." in your example, did you ever place your squad in reserve? if so, you cannot break down into combat squads.

I feel I can go over the whole internet explaining this.

This is not true.

The decision to combat squad and the decision to put a unit into reserves happens at the same time. Deployment.

So the decision to combat squad can happen before you decide to place one or both units in reserve, as there is no set order.

All the FAQ prevents you from doing is splitting a single unit into combat squads after you have placed it in reserve, clarifying to those confused about the ability to combat squad when a unit arrives from reserves. The Drop Pod exception still take precedent, of course.

Nothing has changed as far as combat squads go.

you're addign the distinction, not GW. the FAQ is saying squads in reserve cannot use combat squads while the drop pod has a specific exclusion to this general ruling under its own rules. the ruling makes no distinction between combat squading before deployement, during deployment, after deployment, coming in from reserve, on tuesdays, if your unit is painted aqua, etc... it simply says units placed in reserve can't combat squad. end of line. for better or worse, that's the ruling.

@Fetterkey

You'll see it in person probably in March if you make for the next single tournament at Misty Mountain

Of course this happens right after I ordered my guard foot army of doom....

Oh well...More Termies!!!!

DarknessEternal wrote:All good things.

Still no word on Djinn Blades though.

Actually the FAQ does address the issue:

Q. When a model has multiple special close combat weapons, do they only gain the effects of the one they choose to use in each round of combat or do they gain the effects of all of the special weapons they have?
A. They will only gain the effect of the weapon they choose to use. For example a Haemonoculus has a huskblade and an animus vitae. If he chooses to use his huskblade, he will not be able to attempt to gain a pain token from his animus vitae.

Personally I'm very pleased about the DE FAQ's especially in regards to the Void Mine ! Everything seems very sensible and while the issue of DE units w/ PfP causing the destruction of enemy units indirectly and gaining pain tokens from that is going to be discoursed extensively; I think common sense could prevail in those instances.

Apologies if this has come up already, but from how I'm reading it the DA still have a Land Raider that only carries five Terminators...?

I suppose it was a bit much to ask for TOTAL parity with the vanilla dex...

DA Vet squads are very appealing as you can equip each and every one of them with Storm Shields.

You can have a Ravenwing squad with FNP (if you have Sammael)

You can have a Deathwing squad with FNP (if you have Belial)

DW squads seem very reasonably priced now with the Cyclone Missile Launcher. They are Fearless, can mix equipment and have the DW assault which really makes them play differently than normal Terminators.

Belial seems much better now with the upgraded Storm Shield option.

I won't say DA will be an uber army, but I'm confident it can be reasonably competitive against a lot more armies.

RW still can't turboboost while Scouting, but I don't think this is all that big an issue (granted, they don't get the 3+ cover save in the scout move). But, being able to accurately drop the new and improved Deathwing could prove interesting.

I've been so excited about the DA, I've not even looked at the other FAQs

Standard Vanilla space marines are the only ones with the increased standard LR transport capacity. Or drop pod. It's part of their thing. DA's get bike/termi troops and mixed termi squads. That's their thing. Trust me, you've now closed in on parity with C:SM.

@Sarigar

I know, i was on the phone with a buddy this morning who wanted to talk about the DE FAQ but I couldn't click off the DA's

Anybody else notice that the bottom of Page 4 on the Vanilla Space Marines FAQ said Warhammer: Codex Vampire Counts!

Silly intern.

Maybe that's why it took so long to post them. They had lost 'em

Pyronick wrote:Anybody else notice that the bottom of Page 4 on the Vanilla Space Marines FAQ said Warhammer: Codex Vampire Counts!

Silly intern.

Damn, I was just about to post the same thing