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FM Ninja 048 wrote:yes it does, if GW don't defend their IP then theyt could lose it, resutling in no more 40k/fantasy.

It could, but in this case it really doesn't mean this.

Grimtuff wrote:I forgot about this game, now this muddies the waters a bit does it not?

Depends on what the licensing agreement says.

AlexHolker wrote:There's a thought: could THQ/Relic sue, on the grounds that it is their (exclusive?) licence to make 40k computer games that is being infringed upon?

Maybe they and GW would like to sue EA but neither want to be the one to front up the money to do it. Both probably have a case but perhaps they would rather the other party pay for it...

Saldiven wrote:So what?

If you don't like EA, don't buy their games.

Speak with your wallet.

The problem with EA is that it's a plague. It won't just sit there and ruin its own franchises, it will buy out franchises and studios you like. Neither Command and Conquer nor Mass Effect were EA games when the franchises started, but now look at what's been done to them.

AlexHolker wrote:

Saldiven wrote:So what?

If you don't like EA, don't buy their games.

Speak with your wallet.

The problem with EA is that it's a plague. It won't just sit there and ruin its own franchises, it will buy out franchises and studios you like. Neither Command and Conquer nor Mass Effect were EA games when the franchises started, but now look at what's been done to them.

To that extent, I can't think of a single EA game that was originally an EA game. Even the early games that come to mind were just twisted mockeries of what used to be Origin.

Okay, just looked. Bard's Tale, which was pretty classic.

AlexHolker wrote:

Saldiven wrote:So what?

If you don't like EA, don't buy their games.

Speak with your wallet.

The problem with EA is that it's a plague. It won't just sit there and ruin its own franchises, it will buy out franchises and studios you like. Neither Command and Conquer nor Mass Effect were EA games when the franchises started, but now look at what's been done to them.

Oh, God! The humanity! How can life go on?

Seriously. If you don't like what they're doing, don't buy their stuff. Starting petitions like the one in the OP is a largely meaningless exercise in time wasting, especially since it is likely based in misapprehension of the actual situation. It might make someone feel better; make them feel like they're "doing something." Unfortunately, that "something" is far less effective than just not buying their stuff.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

Hellfury wrote:Its the same thing as saying "If GW do not continue to steal everyones ideas and claim them as their own orginal ideas and sue anyone who disagrees, then we will lose 40K and WHFB" and if that is the case, then good riddance to bad rubbish.

Pure genius.

I wonder what would happen if GW stole the CnC Orca fighter... (Valkayrie?) or if GW stole almost every term from Dune (Lasgun, Navigator, Emperor, Harkon(ian)*Warhawks, ect.) Wasn't heavily inspired by the Lord of the Rings, (Orks, Elves, ect.), Star Wars, Star Trekk, ect. The Matrix... seriously Matt Ward, how could you be so creatively bankrupt to rob the matrix for the Grey Knights?! you already had the penitent engine! (You get the point).

Anyway,

My assumption would be that our 40k would not exist... and obviously if CnC cannot think beyond its already inginous designs of tanks from the earlier years, its clear that EA's Adeptus Mechanicus is a failing think tank that is quickly drying up to seek copies of GW's ingenuity. I seriously hope that GW borrows more from the CnC series, it would do them good if they don't get sued for it, they after all would deserve the extra STC's.

DemetriDominov wrote:I wonder what would happen if GW stole the CnC Orca fighter... (Valkayrie?) or if GW stole almost every term from Dune (Lasgun, Navigator, Emperor, Harkon(ian)*Warhawks, ect.) Wasn't heavily inspired by the Lord of the Rings, (Orks, Elves, ect.), Star Wars, Star Trekk, ect. The Matrix... seriously Matt Ward, how could you be so creatively bankrupt to rob the matrix for the Grey Knights?! you already had the penitent engine! (You get the point).

Sir, I hate to tell you this, but your ignorance is showing again. For one thing, common words like "Navigator", "Emperor" and so on? Impossible to make a case for IP infringement. There's an endless variety of media that uses them. Did you know, for example, that the last Galactic Emperor, mentioned the Hitch-Hiker's Guide to the Galaxy series, was encased in a stasis field at the point of his death and the galaxy is ruled in his stead by a succession of bureaucrats? Sound familiar yet?

Also, this is an Orca: http://www.gamer.ru/system/attached_images/images/000/464/670/original/Orca1.1.png?1323701175
This is a Valkyrie: http://3.bp.blogspot.com/_VbB1uRVgs8g/SY4Y01cHs6I/AAAAAAAACWI/AaKAZ0daX_M/s1600/IG%2BValkyrie%2Bcopy.jpg

Are you honestly going to sit there, sir, and tell me one is a carbon copy of the other? Inspired, maybe, who knows. But inspiration is not infringement. Inspiration is the lifeblood of culture and society, and the efforts to cast it in a bad light are misguided.

Consider the Valkyrie. What are its creative ancestors? Immediately, when we look at the side doors complete with door gunners, one is reminded of transport helicopters the likes of which you might see in any Vietnam war film. The two man cockpit is inspired by a very similar construction of the iconic Apache helicopter gunship. A quick Google search reveals a lot of different designs for aircraft-mounted rocket pods, some of which are not entirely dissimilar from the ones GW designed for their model. The list goes on and on, but I trust I have already made my case: the creative pedigree of GW's models is more complex than just claiming they've been lifted outright.

Now, with the Navigators you've hit closer to your mark, which is what happens when you use a flamethrower, I suppose. I'm not saying 80s Games Workshop didn't play it fast and loose with their inspiration and often with satirical intent, but frankly, that was the 1980s for you. Going back and criticizing them now about it is a bit too late, and it's doubtful their actions would be actionable in court, either. Just because the Adeptus Arbites are thematically very close to Judge Dredd doesn't mean there's a case to be made for IP infringement.

Maybe GW don't really mind because EA have their fantasy license and it might be a bit awkward Alienating the largest Videogame company in the world.

I know THQ handle 40k, but things can change.

In saying that I hope things don't change because THQ are fantastic and EA are just a disgusting business.

biccat is correct.

1. Trademarks are different to copyright. Trademarks need to be defended, copyright doesn't. This is a possible case of copyright not trademarks.

2. The putative licence for 40K vehicles in a game might have applied to vehicles in a 40K game, not 40K vehicles anywhere. Also it might not have descended to EA.

Agamemnon2 wrote:
Sir, I hate to tell you this, but your ignorance is showing again. For one thing, common words like "Navigator", "Emperor" and so on? Impossible to make a case for IP infringement. There's an endless variety of media that uses them. Did you know, for example, that the last Galactic Emperor, mentioned the Hitch-Hiker's Guide to the Galaxy series, was encased in a stasis field at the point of his death and the galaxy is ruled in his stead by a succession of bureaucrats? Sound familiar yet?

This is basically the beginnings of the arugement of Blizzard's inspiration for Starcraft and Warcraft, same material - rearranged and repainted. You sir, need to take a closer look at my argument, it's congruent with yours, saying that our beloved GW would not exist had it not drawn heavy inspiration from other genres. If you had read Dune, you would have seen that the terms I mentioned aren't just common words portrayed strikingly similar to how they are in the 40k lore, they are literally the same in some cases. Or that Caidan's look like Starship Troopers with shoulder pads and skirts, Storm Troopers are Storm Troopers, Horus personifies Lucifer, and Necrons are Terminators, the list goes on literally endlessly.

So again, clearly EA crossed the line by photo-shopping GW's workshop's material without paying any homage or royalties to it. I think Medium of Death's argument is especially valid since GW once had a vested interest with the gaming giant and lack the funds to properly defend against such a legal giant. It would be interesting indeed to see if the same held true going in the opposite direction. The Tau already have battlesuit and tank mounted Ion Cannons after all.

Finland huh..... I was wondering why you were so cordial with me verg....

The sight of GW being unable to attack EA in the courts because of the size difference gives me a frisson of schadenfreude.

Nvm...

If this brings us an updated version of FINAL LIBERATION - great!

Alpharius wrote:If this brings us an updated version of FINAL LIBERATION - great!

Yeah, maybe this time we'll actually get the armies that are shown in the game.

"The artwork was internal EA concept art that was unintentionally released publicly," an EA rep told Gamespot.
"No Warhammer 40,000 tanks have ever made an appearance in Command and Conquer: Tiberium Alliances, and never will."

http://www.escapistmagazine.com/news/view/116787-EA-Explains-Warhammer-40K-Tanks-in-C-C-Concept-Art

Cyrax wrote:

"The artwork was internal EA concept art that was unintentionally released publicly," an EA rep told Gamespot.
"No Warhammer 40,000 tanks have ever made an appearance in Command and Conquer: Tiberium Alliances, and never will."

http://www.escapistmagazine.com/news/view/116787-EA-Explains-Warhammer-40K-Tanks-in-C-C-Concept-Art

Huh...GW has a strong relationship with EA.

I guess its true what they say - Birds of a feather flock together.

CthuluIsSpy wrote:Huh...GW has a strong relationship with EA.

I guess its true what they say - Birds of a feather flock together.

You mean like this?

Cyrax wrote:

CthuluIsSpy wrote:Huh...GW has a strong relationship with EA.

I guess its true what they say - Birds of a feather flock together.

You mean like this?

Spoiler:

Yep, that sounds about right xD

CthuluIsSpy wrote:Yeah, maybe this time we'll actually get the armies that are shown in the game.

I'm sorry, I never got to play Final Liberation - could you elaborate, please?

daedalus wrote: To that extent, I can't think of a single EA game that was originally an EA game. Even the early games that come to mind were just twisted mockeries of what used to be Origin.

Okay, just looked. Bard's Tale, which was pretty classic.

Wing Commander..... I MISS MY WING COMMANDER! Damn you EA Damn you to hell! *runs away crying*

Dysartes wrote:

CthuluIsSpy wrote:Yeah, maybe this time we'll actually get the armies that are shown in the game.

I'm sorry, I never got to play Final Liberation - could you elaborate, please?

In the race selection menu, you have a choice of IG, Orks, SM, Tyranids and Eldar.
However, they never finished Tyranids and Eldar before release, so you can't actually play them.
They are just in the encyclopedia of available races and units...even though they do not have any units made for them, nor are they available.

Now this really annoys me; an unfinished game that they expect you pay for pisses me off. I don't mind them being present in an expansion pack, but I do mind being taunted by their incompetence to release a whole game.

There's also technical issues. Videos don't work on modern systems, and you are lucking to get sound. This is a problem that I found with all the old Warhammer computer games; they don't age well compared to other games that were released in the same decade.

To be fair, the listings for Chaos, Tyranids and Eldar weren't in the race selection screen, they were in the encyclopaedia. You couldn't start a skirmish game and then select any of those five only to find that two of them have armies and the rest didn't. Their inclusion was just information for people who were interested. Everyone assumed that there would be expansions... but there weren't any.

EA wrote:"The artwork was internal EA concept art that was unintentionally released publicly," an EA rep told Gamespot.
"No Warhammer 40,000 tanks have ever made an appearance in Command and Conquer: Tiberium Alliances, and never will."
http://www.escapistmagazine.com/news/view/116787-EA-Explains-Warhammer-40K-Tanks-in-C-C-Concept-Art

Then what about the Baneblade appearing in this screenshot?

There are others too, but that's all I could find a moment's notice.

EA and GW worked together to produce Space Hulk years ago so they've had some association for a while.

DemetriDominov wrote:
This is basically the beginnings of the arugement of Blizzard's inspiration for Starcraft and Warcraft, same material - rearranged and repainted. You sir, need to take a closer look at my argument, it's congruent with yours, saying that our beloved GW would not exist had it not drawn heavy inspiration from other genres. If you had read Dune, you would have seen that the terms I mentioned aren't just common words portrayed strikingly similar to how they are in the 40k lore, they are literally the same in some cases. Or that Caidan's look like Starship Troopers with shoulder pads and skirts, Storm Troopers are Storm Troopers, Horus personifies Lucifer, and Necrons are Terminators, the list goes on literally endlessly.

This comes back to 'there is nothing new under the sun'. Cadians look like any generic sci-fi trooper (or most modern troopers, and a variety of IG units look like historical soldiers). Necrons are probably one of the more original things GW has created (undead egyptian ROBOTS IN SPACE). Storm Troopers are special ops forces and inspiration is obviously drawn from *real life* Stoßtruppen. Take any single idea and you will find a hundred examples of it being done before. The argument that GW would not exist without drawing on outside influences is moot - neither would anything else, including Dune or StarWars.
GW has taken each of those ideas (ideas are not protectable under copyright law) and created their own interpretation of it (which is protectable).

Trasvi, Necrons might be getting to being original now, with the Egyptian influence, but they started off as Terminators/Cybermen.

The first necron lord model (2nd ed, apparently) would like a word with you

When did they drop the 'I'll be back!' rule?

Howard A Treesong wrote:When did they drop the 'I'll be back!' rule?

5th ed codex.
"We'll be back" was replaced with "Reanimation Protocols".

Something about stones and glass houses and all that.

http://www.games-workshop.com/MEDIA_CustomProductCatalog/m2130407a_99120207017_Vargheists01_445x319.jpg

http://www.games-workshop.com/MEDIA_CustomProductCatalog/m2130402a_99120207017_CryptHorror01_445x319.jpg

http://www.ladymoiraine.com/forum/gallery/8/medium_3_15_05_11_2_20_11_8900313.jpeg

My appologies for the bad screenshot, but anyone who has played the Witcher can testify to the similarites between the two (or three depending on how you count it)