Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you: No adverts like this in the forums anymore. Times and dates in your local timezone. Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance. Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely. Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net. If you are already a member then feel free to login now.

 Blacksails wrote:
You caught me!

Though to be fair, ImAGeek insults someone every time he (?) posts.

With a username like that, he's just insulting himself every time!

I'm assuming Geek is male, correct if wrong

And yep, I'm male. And yep, people do seem to get insulted when I post...

 Torga_DW wrote:

 SlaveToDorkness wrote:
I wish I had a video of how hard they laughed at that.

GW is a plane in a nose dive. You have a parachute under your seat. You can jump and leave it all behind or sit quietly and hope they pull it out. What you don't have the option of doing is taking the stick and saving it. Get out if you don't like it, I did, or put your hands up and try and say WEEEE! Like you mean it.

Pretty much this. Although you missed the 3rd option: do both. Get out, then put your hands up and say WEEE!!! as the plane dives ever deeper, and truly enjoy it.

Oh, that's what I'm doing, by reading all the wailing and gnashing of teeth about the latest thing from GW. Now it's off to play Infinity!

 ImAGeek wrote:

 Blacksails wrote:
You caught me!

Though to be fair, ImAGeek insults someone every time he (?) posts.

With a username like that, he's just insulting himself every time!

I'm assuming Geek is male, correct if wrong

And yep, I'm male. And yep, people do seem to get insulted when I post...

God man, that's so insulting!

I will sign a petition if you like?

Lets all go to Nottingham and throw stuff at GW. Maybe then they will get the message.

Immersturm wrote:
Lets all go to Nottingham and throw stuff at GW. Maybe then they will get the message.

Throw scatterbikes

Wouldnt that help GW. You already bought their stuff and if you throw your army at them, the secondery market gets smaller. If enough people did that, more people would have to buy their armies directly from GW. Seems likea win/win situation for GW.

GW simply isn't worth all this effort
The game has become too broken and unfun for many. They're trying so hard to salvage a game they once enjoyed but the fact is that 40k will never be what they want. Like trying to fit a square peg in a round hole. Its time to move on guys. There are other games out there that are better and actually engage the players.

I didn't say it was a perfect plan

 MWHistorian wrote:
GW simply isn't worth all this effort
The game has become too broken and unfun for many. They're trying so hard to salvage a game they once enjoyed but the fact is that 40k will never be what they want. Like trying to fit a square peg in a round hole. Its time to move on guys. There are other games out there that are better and actually engage the players.

That's one lousy attitude.


The game can be easily fixed, if fact, so easily that most things can be FAQed/errataed into their proper place.

Everything that is "broken" is the direct result of a handful of balance issues. beyond that the new formations-type armies are actually a step upwards, as they reduce spamability. from there to getting things done right, its a short path.

After all, all issues nowdays are unit-spesific. a buff here, a nerf there-all within the proper places and the proper amount-and the game will be rock solid.

 BoomWolf wrote:

 MWHistorian wrote:
GW simply isn't worth all this effort
The game has become too broken and unfun for many. They're trying so hard to salvage a game they once enjoyed but the fact is that 40k will never be what they want. Like trying to fit a square peg in a round hole. Its time to move on guys. There are other games out there that are better and actually engage the players.

That's one lousy attitude.


The game can be easily fixed, if fact, so easily that most things can be FAQed/errataed into their proper place.

Everything that is "broken" is the direct result of a handful of balance issues. beyond that the new formations-type armies are actually a step upwards, as they reduce spamability. from there to getting things done right, its a short path.

After all, all issues nowdays are unit-spesific. a buff here, a nerf there-all within the proper places and the proper amount-and the game will be rock solid.

Yeah, except GW don't actually do any of that.

 gmaleron wrote:
I really think people are overreacting, from what I've heard is that they only have a 4+ armor save so they are not invincible and 270pts. Is a pretty expensive cost to pay.

3+ armour still, and its more so the multiple small units of them will be interesting, 135pts for 5 bikes and 20 s6 shots isn't bad at all.

Although, I'm very used to seeing this reaction to new releases (which may very well be warranted in this case from what I'm hearing of the new Eldar rules), it is unlikely that GW is actually too concerned. Nothing is overpowered, since you can just take them as allies and enjoy your own taste of the flavor of the month. Making unbalanced units that could find their way into the armies of those who don't only play Eldar may be the goal. Of course, none of us truly know the thought process of the designers but this is something that occurred to me.

 ImAGeek wrote:

 Blacksails wrote:

 gmaleron wrote:
Agreed, stop freaking out until the book comes out and instead start thinking of ways to adapt and counter bikes.

We all need to adapt harder!

In seriousness, there's an 18 page discussion where we haven't been able to come up with a reliable counter to the Jetbikes, especially considering the rest of their army can still counter your counters...

And we still have people saying it's fine and we just need to adapt

Helldrakes. They annihilate these bikes.

GW do listen...

Look at the Tyranids.

I suspect there may be a cunning plan here...

 Icelord wrote:

 ImAGeek wrote:

 Blacksails wrote:

 gmaleron wrote:
Agreed, stop freaking out until the book comes out and instead start thinking of ways to adapt and counter bikes.

We all need to adapt harder!

In seriousness, there's an 18 page discussion where we haven't been able to come up with a reliable counter to the Jetbikes, especially considering the rest of their army can still counter your counters...

And we still have people saying it's fine and we just need to adapt

Helldrakes. They annihilate these bikes.

Because every army has Heldrakes right?

In 7th they can have all the drakes in the world!

How are Eldar on the brink of extinction again? With this kind of hardware they ought to be lining up to have their photo taken on the Golden Throne.

Sadly, I don't think complaints will be listened to. Write a letter by all means (that way at least you've done something), but if they cared to test the rules something like this probably wouldn't have got past the playtesting stage in the first place.

 BoomWolf wrote:

 MWHistorian wrote:
GW simply isn't worth all this effort
The game has become too broken and unfun for many. They're trying so hard to salvage a game they once enjoyed but the fact is that 40k will never be what they want. Like trying to fit a square peg in a round hole. Its time to move on guys. There are other games out there that are better and actually engage the players.

That's one lousy attitude.


The game can be easily fixed, if fact, so easily that most things can be FAQed/errataed into their proper place.

Everything that is "broken" is the direct result of a handful of balance issues. beyond that the new formations-type armies are actually a step upwards, as they reduce spamability. from there to getting things done right, its a short path.

After all, all issues nowdays are unit-spesific. a buff here, a nerf there-all within the proper places and the proper amount-and the game will be rock solid.

That may be true, but my point is that GW wont make those changes. You wishing that they would won't change the kind of company they are. And in the meantime while you wait for the unlikely, go try the numerous other games because they're actually really fun.

 BoomWolf wrote:

 MWHistorian wrote:
GW simply isn't worth all this effort
The game has become too broken and unfun for many. They're trying so hard to salvage a game they once enjoyed but the fact is that 40k will never be what they want. Like trying to fit a square peg in a round hole. Its time to move on guys. There are other games out there that are better and actually engage the players.

That's one lousy attitude.


The game can be easily fixed, if fact, so easily that most things can be FAQed/errataed into their proper place.

Everything that is "broken" is the direct result of a handful of balance issues. beyond that the new formations-type armies are actually a step upwards, as they reduce spamability. from there to getting things done right, its a short path.

After all, all issues nowdays are unit-spesific. a buff here, a nerf there-all within the proper places and the proper amount-and the game will be rock solid.

It's the pragmatic look, the correct attitude.

The rules themselves allow spammability in multiple CADs alone, let one unbound.

The rules, as a game, are a failure. Narratives are for RPGs. Not opponent based strategy games. It requires a complete paradigm shift in the writing staff and a new way to play. Given the glut of units that requires balance, they'd be better making a lower point, two list format with scenarios that favor tactical play (meaning games are scoring based, not turn limited).

Games Workshop is unable to do this with their current business model. Codecis are inefficient, mess with army composition in each release, and are costly for the player. It's better to do what every other game does and slowly release books with splashes for each faction versus rewriting entire books every time. By doing the latter, we are getting these higher retail cost, lower value books losing features (artwork, useful appendices, recycled fluff) that just play "which unit is good/sucks" roulette.

Could this all change? Yes. But we have no evidence contrary. Avoiding the sunk cost fallacy and bailing out for anyone frustrated is the smart thing to do. Spending extra time to fix the already most expensive game on the market is asinine. You're actively admitting to buying an inferior product for the highest market cost when you do so.

This is just a continuation of a systemic problem where "balance" appears to be not addressed in a methodical way or is prone to interference.

Appropriate points to capability ratio would be nice, never mind what "buffs" the unit would be exposed to expand capability even further.

I think it has not been made clear in GW's mind that anything they could write would do anything to discourage sales.

Unless they are hit in the pocketbook with a clear message, they will blissfully carry-on: it is all about pumping out dividends to pay themselves.
Until the gravy train in that regard dries-up they will do whatever they feel like.

Petitions, rage-quits, eloquently written letters will all pretty much fall on deaf ears.

With the mechanicus stuff released, it may be hard for some to ban all purchases of GW product based on Eldar setting the even higher watermark for cheese.

No not interested in supporting your rant to GW. Not now or after any play time either. I just got my codex today haven't even had a game and people want units banned?

We accuse GW of making decisions with no play testing ? and now this demand?

Play another game its less hassle for you because nothing else will change. If its not Eldar this month it will be something else by the end of the year

 MWHistorian wrote:
GW simply isn't worth all this effort
The game has become too broken and unfun for many. They're trying so hard to salvage a game they once enjoyed but the fact is that 40k will never be what they want. Like trying to fit a square peg in a round hole. Its time to move on guys. There are other games out there that are better and actually engage the players.

With the right quantity of Lube, it works, thats what GW is thinking anyway...


Automatically Appended Next Post:

Drunken Angel wrote:
No not interested in supporting your rant to GW. Not now or after any play time either. I just got my codex today haven't even had a game and people want units banned?

We accuse GW of making decisions with no play testing ? and now this demand?

Play another game its less hassle for you because nothing else will change. If its not Eldar this month it will be something else by the end of the year

No, its Eldar now, and it will be the last, because just like in 6th they will see their mistake, and tone down any codex that comes after in an flimsy attempte to "balance things back in", but there will still be an Eldar book, that should'nt be.

Also its highly dissapointing that the codex is named Craftworlds and that it doesn't contain any Craftworlds rules..., apparantly only SM chapters gets specific rules for each of their Company...

 Slayer le boucher wrote:

Also its highly dissapointing that the codex is named Craftworlds and that it doesn't contain any Craftworlds rules..., apparantly only SM chapters gets specific rules for each of their Company...

Almost every army should have some form of Chapter Tactics

Orks - Klans
IG - Doctrines
CSM - Chaos Chapter Tactics
Eldar - Craftworlds
Dark Eldar - Cabals
Tau - Castes
Necrons - Dynasty
Nids - Hive Fleets
SoB - Order of _____

I thought tau castes work together as one anywayz.

The craftworld rules are formations rather than 1 time use buffs you forget to use half the time anyway. I play SM and eldar and I like the eldar way of doing it better. This codex has me considering selling my marine army to get more eldar.

 koooaei wrote:
I thought tau castes work together as one anywayz.

Yeah, septs would be better.

This is how you KNOW for a fact that this Codex is completely broken. MARTEL AND I AGREE!!!!!!!

Jesus that statement has never been uttered in this forum EVER! Their is no balance to this new codex and realistically there is very little hope you can now beat Eldar if they bring even a remotely competitive list, unless your opponent is a moron and charges his jetbikes into a squad of assault marines/Boyz

 Ghazkuul wrote:
This is how you KNOW for a fact that this Codex is completely broken. MARTEL AND I AGREE!!!!!!!

Jesus that statement has never been uttered in this forum EVER! Their is no balance to this new codex and realistically there is very little hope you can now beat Eldar if they bring even a remotely competitive list, unless your opponent is a moron and charges his jetbikes into a squad of assault marines/Boyz

Do we disagree often?

LOL I would say so. Regardless Im just happy theirs only 1 Eldar player in my local area and has agreed already to limit his entire army to the previous codex because this one is so broken.