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Except Luther is not a space marine. He's a half and half. Like Kor Phaeron, he has no geneseed of his own.

 welshhoppo wrote:
Except Luther is not a space marine. He's a half and half. Like Kor Phaeron, he has no geneseed of his own.

Which I mentioned. What's the point of repeating part of my comment to me as if that was a rebuttal?

Are we talking 100% biological Space Marines, or people who fought and served as Space Marines? If it's the former, he doesn't qualify. If it's the latter, then he's as much a Space Marine as any other.

Just because someone served as a space marine, it doesn't make them so. A full Astartes needs to have a gene seed and all the special organs. Luther doesn't have that. In some ways. It can make them better than marines.

 Orblivion wrote:
Anval Thawn. Currently a Grey Knight, but is a perpetual and has been around for a long, long time.

Not really. He's only about 300 as far as I could gather. Not close to Dante, Logan, or Cassius.

 Grey Templar wrote:

 Orblivion wrote:
Anval Thawn. Currently a Grey Knight, but is a perpetual and has been around for a long, long time.

Not really. He's only about 300 as far as I could gather. Not close to Dante, Logan, or Cassius.

300 years since he became a space marine yeah, but he is far older.

He was a little kid when the GKs picked him off the Black Ships. Like all Marine initiates have to be, pre/mid puberty. As he was a pretty powerful psyker, he knew they were coming for him.

I don't know, it seems weird that the Eldar would have already known about him if his death on Malan'tai was the first time his abilities as a perpetual were ever used. He hadn't even resurrected yet and they already referred to him as the last perpetual. I suspect he has been hanging around for a long time and finally decided to join the Grey Knights, maybe his body remained childlike the whole time.

Lot of Logan Grimnar being tossed around. While his age isn't exact, it is specifically stated that Ulrik the Slayer is older than Grimnar, and the oldest non dreadnought space wolf.

Hierophant wrote:

 welshhoppo wrote:
Except Luther is not a space marine. He's a half and half. Like Kor Phaeron, he has no geneseed of his own.

Which I mentioned. What's the point of repeating part of my comment to me as if that was a rebuttal?

Are we talking 100% biological Space Marines, or people who fought and served as Space Marines? If it's the former, he doesn't qualify. If it's the latter, then he's as much a Space Marine as any other.

Even if we regard Luther as a Space Marine, then those Dark Angels who served in the Unification Wars were already Space Marine veterans by the time Luther was born.

 Iron_Captain wrote:
Even if we regard Luther as a Space Marine, then those Dark Angels who served in the Unification Wars were already Space Marine veterans by the time Luther was born.

Many of the Fallen were originally from Terra, so if any of them fought as part of the First Legion in the Unification Wars, then they might have a pretty good claim to being the oldest space marines.

An example of this would be Merir Astellan. The Lexicanum says:


Surely that gives him a reasonable claim for being the oldest space marine we know of?

And oh, I should probably mention he has a reputation for twisting the truth... but still, Terran Astartes from the First Legion... that in itself should make him and other First Legion Terrans pretty old.

 Salted Diamond wrote:

Spetulhu wrote:
Dreadnoughts are in their own category due to the way they're stored in stasis between deployments. Hell, Dante is old but he's not even the oldest Blood Angel if Dreads count - some Librarian Dreadnoughts are said to have been present for the Battle of Terra during the Horus Heresy.

Source? (Non-sarcasm, really want to know)

Stromark massacre audiodrama.

You do know Legion number does not equate to 'the order in which they were created', do you not? Other than the Dark Angels, which were supposed to be the prototype, there is reason to believe that all the remaining legions were created more or less simultaneously... much as their Primarchs were all created simultaneously.

Just sayin'.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
It's worth mentioning that, in addition to specifying 'full, genetic Space Marines' you need to create a time context.

Do we mean continuously serving? That could eliminate Fallen, who were scattered across space/time, and Dreadnoughts who spend time in stasis and could be considered to have 'gaps'. It could also eliminate most Chaos Marines for whom time passes oddly in the Eye of Terror.

All of which sort of rigs the deck in favor of Loyalists. I believe Dante has been repeatedly cited by GW as the oldest living Space Marine, but there may well be deceased Space Marines who were older.

Or Dreadnoughts, if GW is counting those.

Out of curiosity, why does age make a difference? Is there a prize? I feel old as Methuzelah, does that count?

Joking....

Warboss Gorhack wrote:
You do know Legion number does not equate to 'the order in which they were created', do you not? Other than the Dark Angels, which were supposed to be the prototype, there is reason to believe that all the remaining legions were created more or less simultaneously... much as their Primarchs were all created simultaneously.

I don't know the order in which the legions were created, but the Index Astartes explicitly states that the Dark Angels were the first Space Marine Legion created by the Emperor (it's also on the Lexicanum: http://wh40k.lexicanum.com/wiki/Dark_Angels#History).

Warboss Gorhack wrote:
Out of curiosity, why does age make a difference? Is there a prize? I feel old as Methuzelah, does that count?

No prize but since there's a thread about the oldest space marine, might as well mention Terran members of the legion that's stated to be the oldest.

Is there any person in the current administration of the Imperium, in any type of important leadership role, that was kicking around during the horus heresy, or spoke with the emperor?

 triplegrim wrote:
Is there any person in the current administration of the Imperium, in any type of important leadership role, that was kicking around during the horus heresy, or spoke with the emperor?

Probably some of the Custodes. Beyond that, I doubt it.

It's most likely the dark angel from pandorax, 10k years old, present during the heresy, one of the founding grey knights, no warp hocus pocus involved, and fully able to fight, unlike the salamander who died upon being found.

Any space marine that has lived in the warp does not count. As time flows differently, sometimes faster some times slower. SO it is impossible to tell. Out right, the oldest marine is Bjorn.


logan grimnar is around 900?

and ulrik is older so he is atleast 1000-1100?

Triszin, if we rule out any SM that has lived in the warp, that rules out every SM, since they have all lived part of their lives in the Warp during transit from campaign to campaign.

To answer the question we need to know one simple thing.

Are we talking subjective age or difference between current year and year of birth?

Triszin wrote:
Any space marine that has lived in the warp does not count. As time flows differently, sometimes faster some times slower. SO it is impossible to tell. Out right, the oldest marine is Bjorn.


logan grimnar is around 900?

and ulrik is older so he is atleast 1000-1100?

Grimnar is 700, Ulrik is assumed to be about 900.

Grimnar has been great wolf for 700, so must be a fair bit older than that

 statu wrote:
Grimnar has been great wolf for 700, so must be a fair bit older than that

According to Champions of Fenris he was recruited in 313.M41, and became Great Wolf in 440.M41.

Yeah I've always assumed that Grimnar was around 700. The oldest Space Marine I feel is Bjorn

 War Kitten wrote:
Yeah I've always assumed that Grimnar was around 700. The oldest Space Marine I feel is Bjorn

No he isn't, he was young when the heresy kicked off, Epimetheus is the oldest non chaos space marine, as bjorn is a dreadnought, not a space marine, a machine with an astartes pilot, even a normal human can survive in a dreadnought for a extremely long time, as shown in Inquisition war.