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Made in gb
Fixture of Dakka







Slayer-Fan123 wrote:
The guns are the same cost because the platforms are entirely different costs. I'm not saying Crisis Suits are good, but it's obvious that, after you cut their price like that, the guns don't need to be cheaper.


I could agree with that position - if the IG didn't pay different prices for BS3+ for some weapons.

If pricing for some weapons is affected by BS - as well as having different prices for the bodies themselves - shouldn't that theoretically be true for all armies?

 oni wrote:
While I would like to see some this happen, I"m calling bullgak. I'll believe it when I see it in print.


That's my general position on rumours these days - if it isn't via WHC, or from an event, take them with an entire mine of salt

 Xenomancers wrote:
looks like love taps. That would be fine if they did 1 week updates. But we have to wait 6 more months for another CA.


6 months for a Big FAQ - 12 months for CA2019...

 rollawaythestone wrote:
Was there any word re: the timeline for when we'll see CA drop?


I think I saw someone mention 15/12 - but, as with everything, take that with a decent spoonful of salt

chaos45 wrote:
really hoping standard tactical marine profile dropped to 10-11 pts per model.


If you price a Tactical marine at 10 points, what the heck do you price a Storm Trooper at?

+++

As an aside, unrelated to any of the above quotes, I'm just glad there was that confirmation (from somewhere on Facebook) that CA2018 will feature a complete list of all points changes from their most recent source (be it Index or Codex), rather than putting you in the position of taking both CA books with you.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2018/11/16 22:43:08


2021-4 Plog - Here we go again... - my fifth attempt at a Dakka PLOG

My Pile of Potential - updates ongoing...

Gamgee on Tau Players wrote:we all kill cats and sell our own families to the devil and eat live puppies.


 Kanluwen wrote:
This is, emphatically, why I will continue suggesting nuking Guard and starting over again. It's a legacy army that needs to be rebooted with a new focal point.

Confirmation of why no-one should listen to Kanluwen when it comes to the IG - he doesn't want the IG, he want's Kan's New Model Army...

tneva82 wrote:
You aren't even trying ty pretend for honest arqument. Open bad faith trolling.
- No reason to keep this here, unless people want to use it for something... 
   
Made in us
Chaplain with Hate to Spare





Sioux Falls, SD

So far I am liking what I am seeing in terms of price reductions for some of the Space Marine units. Hopefully they reduce the prices of the non-Primaris units as well. But as of right now, I am down 15 pts through Intercessors alone. That almost makes me want to retire my Sternguard. Time will tell.

5250 pts
3850 pts
Deathwatch: 1500 pts
Imperial Knights: 375 pts
30K 2500 pts 
   
Made in us
Twisting Tzeentch Horror





So far this sounds at least promising.

Cultist to 5 points? I can see that, but only if IG are also 5 points. Cultists are objectively worse before applying any of the army buffs (Sv6+ v. Sv 5+, no access to good heavy weapons, and one less leadership) and quite frankly, I think other than alpha legion, the Guard Regimental abilities are better than any of the CSM Legion abilities for a 4 or 5 point model. I also don't think you should factor in stratagems etc because it is already hard enough to get points to be in an agreeable place, and saying "well this unit should be more because some other ability outside of the Units abilities and stats make it better" because by that logic anything that can have -1 to hit should be more expensive, and how do you price it when not using those abilities (currently all extra abilities are in fact free). Overall, though 8th edition really favors cheap numerous models, so both Cultists and Guardsmen will still be really good even at 5 points.

I am hoping that Rubrics go down a point or two (no specific mention so far) as other marine units have gotten drops it looks like. Terminators losing 3 points I don't think is enough to make them usable, probably should have been more like 6 points. I also hope SoT get maybe a 4 point drop as they are not 2 or 3 points better than a regular terminator.

Bel'kor down to 240 is good (he is currently 280) and would be a fair price if he had the stats of a normal Daemon prince, but he doesn't (one less ST and Sv4+ although 2 more attacks). As such I still think he is to expensive, especially since he ruins your god specific abilities if he is in a detachment and has no access to buff spells.

Curious to see if DPs went up in price.

Also, twin laser to 40? If the single lasor is at 20 that means a tri-las predator is 170, which is a steal.

At least this looks to be a bigger sweeping change than last year's CA and hopefully it will balance thing a bit better and make lists a bit more diverse.

   
Made in pl
Regular Dakkanaut




Yea...
I do not think that Scion and Tac should cost the same.
Tac has +1 BS, S, T, Sv. I honestly do not think that deepstrike and weapon with lower range and S which cannot be deepstriked into rapid fire range compensates for stat difference. Not mentioning useless stratagems

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2018/11/16 22:54:37


 
   
Made in gb
Combat Jumping Rasyat




East of England

I mean I get it, Cultists are a very good unit for their points. But ... what are CSMs supposed to take for troops? If the hike isn't accompanied by a cut for CSMs it'll be a bit harsh, considering how that codex is starting to lag behind now. I'd have preferred it if they'd just cut them off from votlw, which is what powers them up so crazily.

Happy to see cuts to termis, LRs, Intercessors, Repulsors. All great units that need some love. Suspect it won't be enough, but they're at least buffing the right units in the SM faction I guess.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
And I gotta say, these cuts are going to stack very well on DW armies. Could amount to a couple of 100 points in some lists...

This message was edited 3 times. Last update was at 2018/11/16 22:58:20


 
   
Made in us
Powerful Phoenix Lord





Dallas area, TX

 xeen wrote:

Also, twin laser to 40? If the single lasor is at 20 that means a tri-las predator is 170, which is a steal.
I don't think we'll see Lascannons down to 20ppm, and if we do, it would be weird for a Twin-Las to be 40ppm.
GW have realized that Twin-weapons are not equal in worth to 2 Single weapons of the same type, if only because you don't have the option to split your fire.
I could see Lascannons dropping from 25 to 22-23ppm, but not 20. But we'll see. Lascannons would certainly be reasonable at 20ppm
I've got my fingers crossed for Metlas & MMs to go down considerably

-

   
Made in us
Powerful Phoenix Lord





Yep, and lascannons are one of the few weapons which doesn't receive the twin-linked discount. It's always been a bit odd. I don't think some missile launchers do either (for the Eldar etc.).

I think a minor discount is reasonable on twin-linked weapons, much in the way you pay 20 for heavy bolters, and what, 17 for twin-linked heavy bolters? Seems about right to me. It's a good change which could be spread around a bit to various armies. I believe if I want to take twin-missile launchers for the Wave Serpent it's a full 50 points, etc.
   
Made in fi
Courageous Space Marine Captain






Repulsor going down 25 points and twin-las ten points makes las armed Repulsor 35 points cheaper. That's not insignificant. I hope Redemptor get's a point cut too, it is way overpriced.


   
Made in gb
Mekboy on Kustom Deth Kopta






 Elbows wrote:
Yep, and lascannons are one of the few weapons which doesn't receive the twin-linked discount. It's always been a bit odd. I don't think some missile launchers do either (for the Eldar etc.).

I think a minor discount is reasonable on twin-linked weapons, much in the way you pay 20 for heavy bolters, and what, 17 for twin-linked heavy bolters? Seems about right to me. It's a good change which could be spread around a bit to various armies. I believe if I want to take twin-missile launchers for the Wave Serpent it's a full 50 points, etc.


I don't believe that a singular Ork ranged weapon gets any discount for being twin linked.

Like not any. At all.
   
Made in ro
Fireknife Shas'el




Lisbon, Portugal

A bit bummed Knights and Custodes were barely changed, but the -1 to hit armies going away alone more than makes up for that and is worth this CA. Good thing I still have my Deathshroud

Love myself some marine points drop

AI & BFG: / BMG: Mr. Freeze, Deathstroke / Battletech: SR, OWA / HGB: Caprice / Malifaux: Arcanists, Guild, Outcasts / MCP: Mutants / SAGA: Ordensstaat / SW Legion & X-Wing: CIS / WWX: Union

 Unit1126PLL wrote:
"FW is unbalanced and going to ruin tournaments."
"Name one where it did that."
"IT JUST DOES OKAY!"

 Shadenuat wrote:
Voted Astra Militarum for a chance for them to get nerfed instead of my own army.
 
   
Made in us
Boosting Space Marine Biker





 Crimson wrote:
Repulsor going down 25 points and twin-las ten points makes las armed Repulsor 35 points cheaper. That's not insignificant. I hope Redemptor get's a point cut too, it is way overpriced.



It costs more an an armiger, the redemptor badly needs a point cut. The repulsor cut is spicy, especially if other stuff on it gets cuts too.
   
Made in us
Chaplain with Hate to Spare





Sioux Falls, SD

 Crimson wrote:
Repulsor going down 25 points and twin-las ten points makes las armed Repulsor 35 points cheaper. That's not insignificant. I hope Redemptor get's a point cut too, it is way overpriced.

that's definitely a good point. Mine's magnetized but I do think I would be more apt to run a Repulsor now. And I fully agree on the Redemption. It is making me want the Space Marine Supremacy Force now.

5250 pts
3850 pts
Deathwatch: 1500 pts
Imperial Knights: 375 pts
30K 2500 pts 
   
Made in gb
Longtime Dakkanaut




I think the Marine las cannon should be 20 points. The codex creep has been massive from when it was worth 25. The missile launcher should also be worth less - or really, the frag version buffed to 2d6/3d3 or something so its vaguely worth its points in some circumstances.

Not happy on the intercessors. I guess 17 vs 16 points (about as much as could be hoped for) isn't massive - but yeah, they are crap now, and I can't see why anyone would say they are okay if you save 5 points on an min squad. 16 was my limit for "try it and see" - they wouldn't be "good" until they hit 15 or even 14.

You can say "look at the other savings" - but if scouts continue to be the go to troop choice I don't see how that matters. Take your scouts and then take more of the non-troops stuff. If basic Marines have gone down to 12 they are still going to be bad.

Obviously if literally all infantry barring MEQ (i.e. including Scouts) were to get a points increase this might change things - but there is no obvious indication thats going to be the case.

As Xenomancers says this feels like tinkering around the edges. Some people might like that. "I bought my army at the start of 6th edition, and I'll be damned if I have to buy something new now we are in 8th" syndrome. Me - I'd like a more considerable meta change. Shining spears going up 3 points, terminators going down 3 points is not it.

If it turns out they have buffed Eldar Soup because Phil Kelly turned up in the studio that day I'll have mixed feelings.
   
Made in us
Decrepit Dakkanaut




Intercessors are amazing at 17 points, because it means I save a point on my Deathwatch squads.

CaptainStabby wrote:
If Tyberos falls and needs to catch himself it's because the ground needed killing.

 jy2 wrote:
BTW, I can't wait to run Double-D-thirsters! Man, just thinking about it gets me Khorney.

 vipoid wrote:
Indeed - what sort of bastard would want to use their codex?

 MarsNZ wrote:
ITT: SoB players upset that they're receiving the same condescending treatment that they've doled out in every CSM thread ever.
 
   
Made in fi
Courageous Space Marine Captain






Slayer-Fan123 wrote:
Intercessors are amazing at 17 points, because it means I save a point on my Deathwatch squads.

Deathwatch Intercessors don't need a point drop. They're way more than two points' worth better than the vanilla ones.

   
Made in us
Boosting Space Marine Biker





Intercessors only getting a 1 point reduction isn't the best, but combined with the repulsor price drop it makes them a bit more viable for stuff other than gunline/securing objectives in your deployment zone. Put ten in a repulsor, and scoot it from objective to objective. It's still expensive, and not getting special/heavy weapons still sucks, but it's an improvement.

I really want to see if powerfists/chainfists have been reduced. If they have been, terminators in general are gonna be fantastic for taking objectives.
   
Made in fi
Courageous Space Marine Captain






I hope they make other bolt rifle variants free too, then there might be at least some point in ever taking them.

   
Made in us
Boosting Space Marine Biker





 Crimson wrote:
I hope they make other bolt rifle variants free too, then there might be at least some point in ever taking them.


If they added a shot to the assault one it'd be worth the extra cost, maybe. Stalker version... not really sure the best way to fix that one.
   
Made in us
Chaplain with Hate to Spare





Sioux Falls, SD

 cole1114 wrote:
 Crimson wrote:
I hope they make other bolt rifle variants free too, then there might be at least some point in ever taking them.


If they added a shot to the assault one it'd be worth the extra cost, maybe. Stalker version... not really sure the best way to fix that one.
The Stalker Bolt Rifle should be Heavy 2 just the like Stalker Pattern Boltgun that Deathwatch get.

5250 pts
3850 pts
Deathwatch: 1500 pts
Imperial Knights: 375 pts
30K 2500 pts 
   
Made in us
Decrepit Dakkanaut




 Crimson wrote:
Slayer-Fan123 wrote:
Intercessors are amazing at 17 points, because it means I save a point on my Deathwatch squads.

Deathwatch Intercessors don't need a point drop. They're way more than two points' worth better than the vanilla ones.

Just because they're better than the Vanilla ones it doesn't mean they don't need a price drop. They're at minimum a 20 point model right now. That's a LOT.

CaptainStabby wrote:
If Tyberos falls and needs to catch himself it's because the ground needed killing.

 jy2 wrote:
BTW, I can't wait to run Double-D-thirsters! Man, just thinking about it gets me Khorney.

 vipoid wrote:
Indeed - what sort of bastard would want to use their codex?

 MarsNZ wrote:
ITT: SoB players upset that they're receiving the same condescending treatment that they've doled out in every CSM thread ever.
 
   
Made in us
War Walker Pilot with Withering Fire




These are interesting rumors, but I think a key thing here is that it sounds like they were listening to the players in that a lot of the things have been oft-requested. I might not agree with all of them, but the SM fanboys have been very...outspoken...about their desire for points drops and it sounds like they've been heard. Even the Tau crisis suits - probably the main complaint for that faction - are getting a little love. I'm a fan of small buffs/adjustments around the fringes, but with the caveat that they be done more frequently.

The Eldar points drop hint is also interesting, considering most of the units in that pic are already fairly decent. I'm (sarcastically) hoping those 300-400 points will just all come off the wraithknight so I can run both of mine again.
   
Made in au
Stalwart Tribune





I wonder if stygies VIII will get a tactic different to the one all the other -1 to hit armies are getting since they already get a army wide cover with canticles.

This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2018/11/17 00:54:11


 
   
Made in us
Paramount Plague Censer Bearer




Yokosuka, JP

As someone invested into the god hammer land raiders, tactical marines, and terminators, I'm really excited for the points drops! I always feel outclassed and like I'm fighting an uphill battle every game.


 
   
Made in ca
Automated Rubric Marine of Tzeentch





Nova Scotia

 kastelen wrote:
I wonder if stygies VIII will get a tactic different to the one all the other -1 to hit armies are getting since they already get a army wide cover with canticles.

I wonder if that will be a thing as well, although I have a feeling nothing will change (aka that canticle will effectively be useless for Stygies). On the other hand, I really hope Dragoons don't go up in points... I just bought 6!
   
Made in gb
Jealous that Horus is Warmaster





London, UK

ivangterrace wrote:
As someone invested into the god hammer land raiders, tactical marines, and terminators, I'm really excited for the points drops! I always feel outclassed and like I'm fighting an uphill battle every game.


^^ I hear you. I have a couple of armies, but my marine list has stayed Primaris free. I am on the point of pimping my chapter with the new hotness, but, simply, I can't face the idea of painting another 30 marines. I do want standard marine lists to be viable without Guilliman.
   
Made in au
Stalwart Tribune





 anticitizen013 wrote:
 kastelen wrote:
I wonder if stygies VIII will get a tactic different to the one all the other -1 to hit armies are getting since they already get a army wide cover with canticles.

I wonder if that will be a thing as well, although I have a feeling nothing will change (aka that canticle will effectively be useless for Stygies). On the other hand, I really hope Dragoons don't go up in points... I just bought 6!

You could always deep strike them with lucius in units of 3. Maybe if the tactic is different to the others it's that the bonus to cover is +2 instead of just +1?
   
Made in au
Fresh-Faced New User




Perth, Australia

 Vector Strike wrote:
A bit bummed Knights and Custodes were barely changed, but the -1 to hit armies going away alone more than makes up for that and is worth this CA. Good thing I still have my Deathshroud

Love myself some marine points drop


Knights and custodes aren't THAT bad. There's a reason why you never see mono armies of either.

The problem is soup, which GW seems very unwilling to fix.

Death Guard & Nurgle Daemons | Imperial Knights: House Terryn | Imperial Guard: Tanith 1st & Only 
   
Made in us
Stealthy Sanctus Slipping in His Blade





Betting all the -1s to hit become similar to the Jormangandr Hive Fleet, but probably better as they can still run and charge, maintaining their cover.

Here's to hoping that Swarmlord also sees a drop in points. He's good, but he's still expensive, and he's not as much of a force multiplier like Guilliman is. If anything, I'd really like to see Deathleaper un-'fixed' back to his Index version.

I dunno how I feel about people talking about 5ppm Termigants. I don't care for it, but I'm not sure it'd actually change much for Tyranids in Matched play. Guess it'd be alright if warriors went down in points....

PourSpelur wrote:
It's fully within the rules for me to look up your Facebook page, find out your dear Mother Gladys is single, take her on a lovely date, and tell you all the details of our hot, sweaty, animal sex during your psychic phase.
I mean, fifty bucks is on the line.
There's no rule that says I can't.
Hive Fleet Hercual - 6760pts
Hazaak Dynasty - 3400 pts
Seraphon - 4600pts
 
   
Made in gb
Storm Trooper with Maglight





Leicester

First up... maybe stupid, but lads that -1point on I ntercessors is a free power weapon on quite a melee capable sgt... try not to think of it as an insultingly small drop, and instead as free wargear boosting their versatility?


points drops for tactical marines? please god yes I've been painting them hand over fist due to my love of the aesthetic, but boy could they use a minor boost rn


GamerGuy
   
Made in gb
Battlefortress Driver with Krusha Wheel






 Galef wrote:
 xeen wrote:

Also, twin laser to 40? If the single lasor is at 20 that means a tri-las predator is 170, which is a steal.
I don't think we'll see Lascannons down to 20ppm, and if we do, it would be weird for a Twin-Las to be 40ppm.
GW have realized that Twin-weapons are not equal in worth to 2 Single weapons of the same type, if only because you don't have the option to split your fire.
I could see Lascannons dropping from 25 to 22-23ppm, but not 20. But we'll see. Lascannons would certainly be reasonable at 20ppm
I've got my fingers crossed for Metlas & MMs to go down considerably

-


Welocme to the ork codex.... where a rokkit on a BS5+ model is 12pts and twin rokkits are 24pts. We're lucky our kustom shooters are now only like 2pts or something considering they're also a twin version of a free upgrade.
   
 
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