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All Terminators Should go to 3W to improve them into viability, and should ignore 1 AP of incoming enemy attacks.
Then, finally, allow them to swing power fists and other -1 to hit weapons without penalties.

Simple Changes, keep price similar, and all the sudden they're really durable, and scarier in melee.

Custodes with 4-5 wound should cost 80-100ppm then. Not sure if you really want them this way.

Umm yes, please. I love my custsodes there should be less than twenty of them in a 2k game of just custodes.

Termies going up 3W would make me want to bring them in.

Give termies more options for weapons apart from powerfists, thunderhammers, chainfists, etc. Allow them to be far more flexible in a similar vein to 30k. (Cataprachts have a lot of option being able to take lightning claws over powerfists is a huge boon, but your terminators rarely if ever see combat, so something fast to hit would always be great to have)

At this point, unfortunately, MOAR wounds just isn't going to happen. It is widely regarded as the best fix for so, so many models. 2W standard troop Infantry should be a thing for more than just a fraction of Loyalist Marines (i.e Primaris)

The only models that should stay 1W are GEQ, Eldar, Lesser Daemons, Nid gribblies and Ork Boyz (I'm sure I'm missing some hear too).
IMO, Necrons are really the only examples that are "on the fence". Warriors probably should still be 1W, but Immortals and above could very well be 2W. This might also require a rewrite of RPs because now you get back twice the wounds.

8E is a great edition, but I truly feel the designers held on to too many old concepts, like 1W Marines. They really could have made a spectacular edition that FEELS like 40K on the tabletop.
But at this point this will only happen for 9E, which I doubt will be happening in the next few years as the "living ruleset" will keep the bulk of 8E going for a while

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Nothing in these threads ever happen. Doesnt stop conjecture

Nothing in these threads, like the idea to add a special rule for all Marines, so they can use their Boltguns better than non-Marines can use their Boltguns?

Marines with 2W 2A and AP-1 Boltguns?

It's not like rules come from here and make their way up into the game, but things posted here do happen (independantly) from time to time.

Bharring wrote:
Nothing in these threads, like the idea to add a special rule for all Marines, so they can use their Boltguns better than non-Marines can use their Boltguns?

Marines with 2W 2A and AP-1 Boltguns?

It's not like rules come from here and make their way up into the game, but things posted here do happen (independantly) from time to time.

I mean we already technically have that with primaris and the new rule for rapid fire for astartes only.

But i think we need a tactical option now not just a fire power one.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

Martel732 wrote:
Nothing in these threads ever happen. Doesnt stop conjecture

Its always fun to theory craft.

Hell most 40k is subsidized by fan theory and interpretation doesn't mean it isn't always wrong to think that way.

 Galef wrote:
8E is a great edition, but I truly feel the designers held on to too many old concepts, like 1W Marines. They really could have made a spectacular edition that FEELS like 40K on the tabletop.
But at this point this will only happen for 9E, which I doubt will be happening in the next few years as the "living ruleset" will keep the bulk of 8E going for a while

Agreed.

So, back to terminators and the present. The GSC preview showed a rule (a perfect ambush [3cp]) that allows them to essentially deepstrike then move d6" immediately. Also we got bolter drill.

If terminators got an inherent 3" movement after teleporting would that make mandatory power fists less unpalatable? Would that make heavy flamers worth taking? Combined with bolter drill that means you can shoot far off into the battleground and charge something else nearby. My feeling is that this combo resolves the lack of offense issue reasonably, while defensively they aren't so bad off except in price point.

At the CA2018 price and profile, would that be enough to give at least loyalist terminators a role?

As always I'm up for trading the 5++ for a stacking 6+++ too.

I'm sure people will come up with perfectly good reasons why Terminators cannot ambush enemies through Deep Strike and thus shouldn't be allowed to do so. After all, they're not as synonymous with "Deep Strike" as, say, Orks, who've been able to do it since...


When was the Ork codex released again? That long.

(Sarcasm in case anyone missed it)

 AlmightyWalrus wrote:
I'm sure people will come up with perfectly good reasons why Terminators cannot ambush enemies through Deep Strike and thus shouldn't be allowed to do so. After all, they're not as synonymous with "Deep Strike" as, say, Orks, who've been able to do it since...


When was the Ork codex released again? That long.

(Sarcasm in case anyone missed it)

Well the whole ork codex is now based around da jump/ Tellyporta one trick pony shenanigans.

I don't like that, albeit da jump is an old psychic power.

 AlmightyWalrus wrote:
I'm sure people will come up with perfectly good reasons why Terminators cannot ambush enemies through Deep Strike and thus shouldn't be allowed to do so. After all, they're not as synonymous with "Deep Strike" as, say, Orks, who've been able to do it since...


When was the Ork codex released again? That long.

(Sarcasm in case anyone missed it)

Is that an agreement that teleporting in could be less effort than climbing out of hiding? I think we can all agree that there will always be someone to complain about literally anything. Regardless of fluff, precedence has been set through feature creep and termies have needed to catch up one way or another for a while. The question is would easier charges make pop up punchy dudes fit a role?

As for the 3W suggestion, it looks like some decent points on historical scaling have been made. In terms of current mechanics the armor granting 1W and 1Sv seems a little underwhelming for something that costs 2pts more than a biker. It doesn't loose infantry status so that's nice but at 2+ it's less noticeable, and teleporting is not as nice as 14"movement. After all, termies at range aren't a priority target imo. I'd be ok with it.
In the future I expect that there would be a primaris incarnation which would be a better fit for 3W 2+Sv and will likely be less CC focused. In that regard I'm not hopeful that 3w on it's own will save the terminator models.

Leaving aside their weapons making them 1+ armour save and reducing incoming damage by 1 to a minimum of 1 would make them a lot tougher with rules that affect AP, give them more wounds etc. and the special rule is the one used already by several other units.