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Could also be the most troll tastic thing ever. Hear me out, don't like the guy you are playing? Bring a green tide with enough pyskers to get DA Jump. Take your time with terrain and deployment. Start with all your non green tide models in reserve. Right after all the tables are in a game, start your pys phase and use da jump to mishap your squad, praying for the worst.

"Well, guess I lost man."

Naturally, I wouldn't play anyone I felt a need to do this to, but the thought did cross my mind"

the +1 attack power could be brutal

So guys; I have a campaign coming (1500), the only limitations is no relics, no named chars and your warlord cannot be changed during any of the games. However he does advance/get injured depending on performance.

Looking at the advancement tables and injuries tables;
Injuries; caused by dying on battlefield.
Fear
fearless
5+ invun / +1 to invun
-1LD
-1T
cannot seize
-2I
-2 BS
gets hot all weapons
dead (replace WL)

advancement; (advances at end of game on 5+, with +1 to roll for kill char in challenge, StWL, KillMC or vehicle)
+1LD
+1I
+1BS
+1WS
+1A
+1T

So initially before I had seen those tables I had been planning on using a SAG Bigmek. But it seems to me that most advancements would be worthless for him and hard to achieve. Now im thinking a Bikerboss is clearly the most useful. He can kill chars, vehicles, MC's. The advancements all are worthwhile for a bike, even +1 BS.

thoughts?

Big Mek on a bike with a SAG and Killsaw. Best of both worlds. Better at killing vehicles because of armorbane and str2d6 ap2 large blast will kill the poop out of a few warlords not to mention if he rolls 66.

haha that is true, plus a SAG is such fun. I'll give him a nice big blob of bikers with a painboy and just shoot stuff to pieces. I think generally i'll avoid going for slay the warlord with him unless its against something squishy. But generally I know that most players are going to be bringing something a bit tougher. One dude is running a wraithlord as his WL, as a spiritseer is a little squishy.

Also each game has a table modifier; D6
-1BS and -2Movement
All terrain is difficult terrain
Normal
-1 reserves
each charge roll D6, 1 or 2 = half charge range.
No scout or infiltrate

So having looked at that I think bikes are going to be extremely useful, as well as anything in vehicles. Footslogging is dangerous as 3/6 are either making movement harder or reducing charge range.

Im thinking then;
SAG bike
Bike blob with painboy
Trukk boyz
lootas

But I can change the army comp game to game anyway, so i'll see how it pans out

So since the ITC ruling of double detachments, I've been thinking of making a WarbossStar that includes Zhadsnark, 2-3 Warbosses on Bikes, one with Boss pole and lucky Stikk, all with PK and a Painboy on a Bike. Maybe a Big Mek and KFF if you need it to be a bit more survivable.

Essentially, you've got 15-20 S10 ap2 attacks, some at I4 for challenges, much like TWC, except you're not doubled out by Strength 10 weapons like TWC are. You also have semi-fleet through 'Ere we go so it's likely you can get into combat. I guess you could have a unit of Warbikers attached to it too for ablative wounds and Scouting with Zhadsnark. Thoughts?

Anything star with a buttload of PKs is going to do work if it gets into action, and with warbikes I think it'll work. We had a nobstar last game I played, which included Ghazzy, and it did some work, taking out three dreadnauts and a pack of space wolves. The hardest thing we had to do was get to the enemy, so the bikes will solve that problem.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Sorry for the double post, but I need some advice. I've been playing around with a list I want to make (2000 point-ish) and it's nearly there- it just needs to trim a bit of fat. It's based around a mass of infantry with a few vehicles for screens and some heavy artillery.


The plan is for one of the battlewagons to charge in front of the Greentide to give them something to hide behind. The weirdboy will be using sanctic powers, which could potentially bolster the painboy's +5 FNP into a +4 FNP, along with gate of infinity being a chance for hilarity. He's also there for psyker defense, as a lot of powers could effect the unit as a whole. Meanwhile, the stormboyz and bikers will be distracting anything that could hit the greentide from the sides. The lootas and mek guns would be taking out any vehicles or what have you in the meantime. The nobs are your generic melee formation, and the 12 shootas in a trukk are there to get to whatever they can get their grubby mits on, much like the grots.

However, this list has some glaring flaws. I don't have any relics, and my only HQs are in the greentide, and I would like at least a warboss with my nobs. Plus, the battlewagons are hardly decked out, and I want more anti-vehicle choices on them.

Hmm, if your plan is for the BW to act as a screen, personally I would take trukks or buggies. you could take 3 trukks for the cost of a BW and not only would you have enough to completely block LoS, but it requires 3 targets. The side armour of a BW is 12, and will still be blown to pieces given the chance, all that extra cost that provides you with front AV14 is being wasted. Heck you could even get 2-3 BigT's or Gunwags for that cost and they are AV 11 and AV12 respectively on their sides.

Secondly, if your putting your Nob into a BW with an 'ard case they can't charge after disembarking. So will likely get shot to pieces on the turn they do so.

At the moment I can't see why your list wouldn't work, might not be ultra competitive, but seems like a good fun list. Although if I was trying to trim to squeeze in a warboss (on bike most likely), then first i'd drop the Nobs. they are an expensive unit for the survivability. For anti-vehicle, i'd probably run some 5 man tankbusta's in trukks, dropping both battlewagons and the Nobs.

I agree with possibly dropping the nobs, but I'd rather keep at least one BW because trukks are just so fragile. Another issue with dropping the nobs is I have nowhere to put another war boss, though I could just go with some other HQ instead.

You have 6 warbikers, an excellent crew for a bikerboss A DLS bikerboss no less, re-rollable coversave, great for a flanking unit.

you also have Mek gunz;
But why is there also a lobba and a kannon in there? The lobba and kannon add up to the cost of 1 KMK, personally i'd swap them for 1 KMK, the lobba doesn't provide anything, nor the kannon.

I think if I ran a greentide it would have a purely Stormboy support I mean you could field like 3x30 stormboyz for 900 points Hello a 100 strong FNP blob, with 90 fast moving tarpits! use the stormboyz to tarpit any annoying units while the greentide moves up!

I mostly wanted variety in the mek guns, but then again, I have enough anti infantry. The issue with that many stormboyz, though, is that I lose my anti-MEQ/vehicle options.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
The biker boss, though, is a great idea. I'll definitely do that.

Who needs anti MEQ/vehicle when he can't move them out of his own DZ!

I just ordered like 10 jump packs and some rokkits. Gona make as many stormboyz as I can and see how they hold up. 9pts for a 12" move, 2D6 run into cover (because if you are taking a terrain check from using the 2D6 run you may as well end the move in terrain.). Turn 2; Waaagh! Move 6", run 2D6 and then use the jump pack for re-rollable charge range and HoW!

i just feel a need for high str/ap weapons for larger targets. They're also long range, like my lootas, to weaken any threats before my boyz get there.

I have found the 36" restrictive in circumstances. PLaying against shooty lists has generally seen them hold back further than 36" knowing that I as an ork player WILL be coming forward

Against a greentide, they are going to stay well away, throwing occasional speed bumps to slow you down/pull you away in another direction. Plus if you start your tide on your DZ line then likely you will not be able to take the most advantageous spot for your KMK's. However in saying that I see a lot of greentides with Artillery, so it clearly works

I run the gun trucks from IA 8 [from the actual book, not the update] for cheap barrage cover. You can mount a big lobba (48" str. 6 ap. 4 large blast barrage) and only pay circa 60 pnts. The ap isn't the greatest, but the high strength of the gun, range, and mobility of mount pays dividends. Plus, they are super easy to convert, since all you need is an Ork Trukk and a nasty looking gun. You can also mount the flakk gun on it for anti-air, but I prefer to put that on the big trakk for a bit more protection.

Omg I've been converted to using KMK. Last night I had a single CAD 1850 list with 2 units of 5 KMK's and one unit of 5 Lobbas. In one round of shooting one unit of KMK was able to wreck one and explode 2 IG Hydras, in cover! It was unreal.

Later 4 out of 5 Lobbas got a 'hit', out of view of course. 28 wounds on a veteran unit.

Over all they performed much better than I expected and the other new Mek Gunz. The AP helped a little with damage results. Since I was playing against IG the opp. had nothing better than a 4+ save. Oh, and the BS3 helped reduce scatter that much more than the BS2, it was noticeable.

so i have a question. has anyone ever used da lucky stick on a bigmek with shock attack gun? i am curious how the rules work for this. does dls allow reroll on the scatter (just like ammo runts would), and if so what rerolls would be counted as failures? if a reroll on a scatter weapon isn't counted as a failure then does this grant a bigmek with sag unlimited rerolls on the "to hit"?

would this be a good use of dls, could it maximize the effectiveness of the sag.

benefits
-after rolling a low strength you can reroll the scatter to possibly change your target.
-if by chance you get sucked into combat you could use dls to better survive combat untill more units can "rescue the big mek"
-if the bigmek is upgraded with bike and killsaw he can use dls to be as good if not better than a warboss in combat.

downsides
-its not on a warboss (while yes warbosses have proven to be ideal for dls, would it be as effective on a bigmek with sag).

Can't reroll anything more than once unless stated otherwise.

What Koooaei said,

The DLS in regards to the SAG will simply act like an ammo runt, allowing a re-roll on scatter. It will also allow you re-rolls to wound.

It would certainly help with if you got teleported into combat, but tbh I don't bother putting a KS/PK on my SAG meks. If they get teleported then generally its safe to assume they are going to die in short order. So I like to save the points and use it elsewhere. I think the cost of a KS and a DLS at 55 points for something situational like combat is a bit of a waste. I mean if you can scrape together another 30 points you could potentially field a second SAG; which would probably do more work.

You'd still avoid getting removed as a casualty from failing re-rolls, though, right? Since scatter never "fails"?

Then if "scatter never fails" then you can't re-roll it with the DLS? As the DLS is "failed" rolls?

Dont have my dex at hand so cannot confirm

Solar Shock wrote:
Then if "scatter never fails" then you can't re-roll it with the DLS? As the DLS is "failed" rolls?

Dont have my dex at hand so cannot confirm

It does say "the bearer can choose to re-roll any failed To Hit or To Wound rolls or saving throws that they make". =/

Scatter does fail a "to-hit" roll if an arrow is rolled.
So then you reroll the whole thing, the scatter die and the 2d6

 Icculus wrote:
Scatter does fail a "to-hit" roll if an arrow is rolled.
So then you reroll the whole thing, the scatter die and the 2d6

Well put That explains it nicely.

In my next game I am running some looted wagons, as i'm playing what seems a MEQ heavy campaign, i think the killkannons are going to help. I know its a low AV platform with only AV11 front and side. Does anyone have any experience running them? I have yet to try.

 Icculus wrote:
Scatter does fail a "to-hit" roll if an arrow is rolled.
So then you reroll the whole thing, the scatter die and the 2d6

While that makes sense... I can't find any rule in the book that says a scatter roll "fails" if it rolls an arrow. It says if you can re-roll to-hit, and you choose to use that for the scatter roll, you must reroll everything (scatter die and the 2d6). But I can't find any mention of "failing" the roll (except maybe if the scatter distance/direction takes it off the board, which is described as being a "complete miss" and being "discarded").

WAAAAAGGGHHHH!!!!!

Now that I have your attention lets get to it.

So I am brand new to the hobby and have in fact only played 1 game so far. I have a growing ork army and right now am comfortable learning the game playing my Green tide army with supporting elements from other ork vehicles and side boy units.

~~

Anyways my question is what do you guys think of having Chaos Space Marine allies for your Ork army? I see they are the only army Orks can ally with without suffering some pretty nasty penalties. I like the CSM from a lore perspective and would love to start collecting some of them on the side as allies for my orks and perhaps one day build them into an army of their own.

Are there any notable synergies between the orks and CSM? Would getting CSM to add to my Ork army be worth it for additional options and flare or do the Ork units just have all their own areas covered?

 Tibs Ironblood wrote:
WAAAAAGGGHHHH!!!!!

Now that I have your attention lets get to it.

So I am brand new to the hobby and have in fact only played 1 game so far. I have a growing ork army and right now am comfortable learning the game playing my Green tide army with supporting elements from other ork vehicles and side boy units.

~~

Anyways my question is what do you guys think of having Chaos Space Marine allies for your Ork army? I see they are the only army Orks can ally with without suffering some pretty nasty penalties. I like the CSM from a lore perspective and would love to start collecting some of them on the side as allies for my orks and perhaps one day build them into an army of their own.

Are there any notable synergies between the orks and CSM? Would getting CSM to add to my Ork army be worth it for additional options and flare or do the Ork units just have all their own areas covered?

Well, CSM psykers are better than weirdboys, so a ML3 Sorcerrr on a Bike can come handy. A unit of Havocks with lascanons might also be worthwile.

 Tibs Ironblood wrote:
WAAAAAGGGHHHH!!!!!

Now that I have your attention lets get to it.

So I am brand new to the hobby and have in fact only played 1 game so far. I have a growing ork army and right now am comfortable learning the game playing my Green tide army with supporting elements from other ork vehicles and side boy units.

~~

Anyways my question is what do you guys think of having Chaos Space Marine allies for your Ork army? I see they are the only army Orks can ally with without suffering some pretty nasty penalties. I like the CSM from a lore perspective and would love to start collecting some of them on the side as allies for my orks and perhaps one day build them into an army of their own.

Are there any notable synergies between the orks and CSM? Would getting CSM to add to my Ork army be worth it for additional options and flare or do the Ork units just have all their own areas covered?

IMBO along with the better Pyschers who can summon demons without penalty as mentioned above, I think the best thing CSM can offer is a unit of Obliterators. DSing Terminators that have a variety of heavy weapons in an opponent's backfield is exactly what the Orks are missing. Much more efficient than anything in the Ork Codex.

Let's not forget Helldrakes with Ap3 Ignore Cover and Fearless units.

Chaos marine sorcerers can't summon daemons any better than weirdboys. A sorcerer with a specific uograde can, but that isn't the same thing. If you want daemons in an ork list weirdboys are just fine as summoners...or ally in some daemons. The only thing a sorcerer has on a weirdboy is a bike, and heralds have jet bikes...

I don't personally see chaos marines adding much to an ork list. A daemon prince and helldrake is about all I'd want, but I wouldn't want to waste points on chaos troops to get them.

I do like adding in daemons though. Four heralds and a unit of horrors isn't that much and opens up a ton of options if you have the daemon models to summon in.

FraustTheSnowman wrote:
Chaos marine sorcerers can't summon daemons any better than weirdboys. A sorcerer with a specific uograde can, but that isn't the same thing. If you want daemons in an ork list weirdboys are just fine as summoners...or ally in some daemons. The only thing a sorcerer has on a weirdboy is a bike, and heralds have jet bikes...

I don't personally see chaos marines adding much to an ork list. A daemon prince and helldrake is about all I'd want, but I wouldn't want to waste points on chaos troops to get them.

I do like adding in daemons though. Four heralds and a unit of horrors isn't that much and opens up a ton of options if you have the daemon models to summon in.

Or paint a bunch of your Sluggas and Shootas red and you can summon count-as Chaos/Demon Orks!!!