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Hate to just bandwagon with everyone else, but that was a very good episode!

Guess it's just me but that was the absolute worst episode in the series. I actually groaned when they showed the burial ground. Just awful awful writing.

I understand the suspension of disbelief, but this whole season is just incredibly unbelievable and stupid for survivors a few years in. From the pied piper of zombies to Glen "dying" to this, it's like the writers aren't even trying.

"Hey guys lets spend a bunch of time and effort to build barricades instead of just reinforcing the quarry barricades!"

"Brilliant! Make sure to not use the bulldozer we'll reference later. That could never be used to back fill the quarry barricades."

"Your right. Earth behind a wall wasn't used for centuries to reinforce a wall. I know, lets put the supports on the outside of the wall, Because engineering."

Just an awful episode IMO. Thankfully the comics are still good.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
I mean the glaring holes in Eastman's character story. I can buy a doughy middle aged man being good at aikido. I can buy the pacifism. But the story? Rubbish.

No prisoner who escapes from jail, and slaughters a family, is going to be outside of solitary confinement for years, no matter how charming he is.

Then the timeline. He kills Creighton, feels bad, decides to turn himself in, only to find the apocalypse already in full swing. We already know that everyone is infected, so why didn't he see Creighton turn? Does starvation destroy the brain somehow?

He's only 30 miles (his words) from the Atlanta area and has had no large groups of walkers? With a goat bleating away all day?

And Eastman's death scene? Horrible horrible directing. Here's a guy who is apparently a zen master with a stick, a weapon with at least some range. Instead of attacking the single, lone zombie, or pulling Morgan back, he turns his back to it? WTF?

It's even worse than Glen missing the fire escape in the alley.

And lastly, how does a man stay that chubby on an all veg diet, with a garden with what, 10 plants total?

It seems like the writers think we are stupid, and you guys thought this was a good episode? At least Z Nation is fun.

I agree with nearly all of that. The notion that Eastman wouldnt use his stick to keep the zombie at distance was absurd.

I also hate Morgan's character more than I already did. I hope he bites it soon.

DutchWinsAll wrote:
It seems like the writers think we are stupid, and you guys thought this was a good episode? At least Z Nation is fun.

Yeah, there are things called "opinions" and like certain parts of the body, we all have them.

 ScootyPuffJunior wrote:

DutchWinsAll wrote:
It seems like the writers think we are stupid, and you guys thought this was a good episode? At least Z Nation is fun.

Yeah, there are things called "opinions" and like certain parts of the body, we all have them.

How are glaringly huge plot holes opinions? It's sloppy writing.

At first I was like, "Well, he's got some good points!" but then:

DutchWinsAll wrote:At least Z Nation is fun.

cincydooley wrote:The notion that Eastman wouldnt use his stick to keep the zombie at distance was absurd.

I'm with you on that one - made Eastman's death seem really contrived. They should have come up with something a bit more believable.

DutchWinsAll wrote:
How are glaringly huge plot holes opinions?

Enjoyment of something can be done even if there are faults in it. That is where the "opinion" part of this comes into play.

It's sloppy writing.

In your opinion.

 ScootyPuffJunior wrote:

DutchWinsAll wrote:
How are glaringly huge plot holes opinions?

Enjoyment of something can be done even if there are faults in it. That is where the "opinion" part of this comes into play.

It's sloppy writing.

In your opinion.

I get what you're saying, and maybe I worded it a bit harshly at first, but generally plot holes are considered bad writing.


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 Alpharius wrote:
At first I was like, "Well, he's got some good points!" but then:

DutchWinsAll wrote:At least Z Nation is fun.

cincydooley wrote:The notion that Eastman wouldnt use his stick to keep the zombie at distance was absurd.

I'm with you on that one - made Eastman's death seem really contrived. They should have come up with something a bit more believable.

If you like gakky B movies and such, it's great. If you try and take it as serious, like TWD, then it's horrible. At least they poke fun at their plot holes, and spoof cool gak like Mad Max and zombie George RR Martin.

I spent the episode wondering what stupid thing Eastman was going to do to get himself killed.

Deadly with a staff, and then....shoulder tackle???

Well, I generally do enjoy gakky B movies, so maybe that's why I've enjoyed this season so far.

I think the writters really love Morgan and think everyone else does too hence the indulgence of this episode............

it reminded me quite abit of the Angel episode https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Guise_Will_Be_Guise (except that had better writting) and for a moment I thought they were going to have a similar twist with the Akido guy being the murderer..............but no.

I didn't mind it but didn't enjoy it much either - its good that they are trying to make zombies seem a bit more of a threat but at this point they really shouldn't be except for the unexpected. The characters seem lurch from competancy to horrifically inept quite rapidly but then its tv so thats fairly normal............

Hoping Morgan gets called out on his stupidity that led directly to various people diying - but I doubt it.

Why do people love Morgan? I mean, I'm itching for him to get offed.

What about his character makes him compelling now, beyond "doesn't kill?" It's a trait that, for many, makes him "major liability."

People like Morgan, from what I can tell, because he's a link to the beginning and an excellent parallel for Rick. Additionally the episode "Clear" really was on of the best they'd done to that point (and still one of the best currently). The actor playing Morgan is excellent as well and has quite a bit of charisma on camera.

That said I'm ready for him to go. At this point he might be responsible for more deaths than the governor.

Also all of those "plot holes" mentioned earlier can have a fairly easy explanation. Overall the episode was solid and filled in story we probably needed to understand Morgan. But I'm really hoping he gets offed relatively quickly or Rick beats the ever living hell out of him.

Like I said earlier, my current guess is that Morgan will see a very memorable end that comics readers should be familiar with.

 gorgon wrote:
Like I said earlier, my current guess is that Morgan will see a very memorable end that comics readers should be familiar with.

I'm starting to think their saving that for the wolf guy.

This episode was really what the whole season is about though, it's about redemption. Tara was redeemed, nicolas was almost redeemed, morgan was redeemed, and this wolf could end up being redeemed. He might end up being the one who saves the day for the group. Or at least be used for that memorable end.

Yes. Nothing says "in line for redemption" quite like "I'm going to kill all of you including the children."

And yet Morgan was basically in that exact place -- killing any human or zombie he came across -- before he got himself together. At some point, the worm will turn in this show. It's plausible that wolf boy could be part of the start of that. He's right that redemption is one of the themes of the season so far.

Although I'm unsure that wolf boy will be the one to suffer the particular end I mentioned. I don't think his death would carry enough emotional significance, even if he's redeemed by Morgan.

Yep. Don't see it. Morgan isn't Eastman. Nor does he have a secluded area to rehabilitate someone for months.

 cincydooley wrote:
Yep. Don't see it. Morgan isn't Eastman. Nor does he have a secluded area to rehabilitate someone for months.

it wasn't months, it only took morgan 4 days and a whoopin to come around

sirlynchmob wrote:

 cincydooley wrote:
Yep. Don't see it. Morgan isn't Eastman. Nor does he have a secluded area to rehabilitate someone for months.

it wasn't months, it only took morgan 4 days and a whoopin to come around

If Carole sees "wolf boy" he is dead................and good riddance.

sirlynchmob wrote:

 cincydooley wrote:
Yep. Don't see it. Morgan isn't Eastman. Nor does he have a secluded area to rehabilitate someone for months.

it wasn't months, it only took morgan 4 days and a whoopin to come around

I read that it was longer than that.

If he was really only there for 4 days, learned aikido, and was rehabbed, then I hate this episode and the character even more than I did.

 cincydooley wrote:

sirlynchmob wrote:

 cincydooley wrote:
Yep. Don't see it. Morgan isn't Eastman. Nor does he have a secluded area to rehabilitate someone for months.

it wasn't months, it only took morgan 4 days and a whoopin to come around

I read that it was longer than that.

If he was really only there for 4 days, learned aikido, and was rehabbed, then I hate this episode and the character even more than I did.

he was only in the cage for 4 days, and when he emerged he fought it, then gave into it. after that he was done trying to kill cheese head.

 cincydooley wrote:

sirlynchmob wrote:

 cincydooley wrote:
Yep. Don't see it. Morgan isn't Eastman. Nor does he have a secluded area to rehabilitate someone for months.

it wasn't months, it only took morgan 4 days and a whoopin to come around

I read that it was longer than that.

If he was really only there for 4 days, learned aikido, and was rehabbed, then I hate this episode and the character even more than I did.

He was in the cell for four days...

Just remember that last scene where Morgan finds the Terminous Train Tracks. I'm sure that was AFTER the season when Rick's crew broke out of Terminus. That's ample time for Morgan to rehab and learn aikido. Isn't t that like 2+ worth TWD seasons at least?

Actually he spend a portion of the end of season 4 and all of season 5 heading to terminus and following Rick's group.

That leaves about a season and half of time between Clear and seeing him following the signs. And unlike other seasons there is a several month time jump between 3 and 4.

I saw it as him going crazy when he wakes up after Rick and Michonne leave in "Clear" and he burns his house down. Then he spends sometime out in the wild and then he's with Easterman for months. Granted I could be wrong but that's what it felt like.

I sincerely believe Glenn is not dead. He (with Maggie) and Daryl are the most loved characters in the show. More than Rick, Carl (who lots of people actively dislike), Morgan (also disliked by a bunch), Carol (who has gotten hella-badass)...yeah, I see Glenn more likely to survive than Rick, honestly. I truly think the show would go downhill quickly with him gone.

I don't think it would go downhill if Glenn is dead. It would remove the one "happy" storyline we still currently have on the show but I don't think the show would be hurt by it. I really do think he falls into the category of removable if for a good reason.

That said this could be a throwback to season 4. Then Glenn hunted for Maggie even though she had to be dead (the entire bus was). This time Maggie will hunt for him. It's also to remind us that Maggie is no slouch in this world either.

I still don't think Glenn is actually dead. I just don't think the show would do him the way it's been done. Also we've had the loved one/family member zombie arc so many times I hope we don't see that either.

The more I think about it the more I feel like this could also be a rediscovery for Rick. The last words Rick heard from Glen were the words he first heard from him when he was trapped in a mob of zombies in an position of certain doom. Now Glenn is in the same position. I don't feel like that was accidental either.

 Mr Morden wrote:

sirlynchmob wrote:

 cincydooley wrote:
Yep. Don't see it. Morgan isn't Eastman. Nor does he have a secluded area to rehabilitate someone for months.

it wasn't months, it only took morgan 4 days and a whoopin to come around

If Carole sees "wolf boy" he is dead................and good riddance.

And the time may come when they don't need Carol anymore, because killing isn't a civilized society's answer for everything.

Carol is still on my list of candidates to expire by season's end.


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 Hulksmash wrote:
I don't think it would go downhill if Glenn is dead. It would remove the one "happy" storyline we still currently have on the show but I don't think the show would be hurt by it. I really do think he falls into the category of removable if for a good reason.

That said this could be a throwback to season 4. Then Glenn hunted for Maggie even though she had to be dead (the entire bus was). This time Maggie will hunt for him. It's also to remind us that Maggie is no slouch in this world either.

Well, it'd be a great reason for Rick's crew to start exploring the greater area. With exploration comes discoveries...

 gorgon wrote:
And the time may come when they don't need Carol anymore, because killing isn't a civilized society's answer for everything.

Carol is still on my list of candidates to expire by season's end.

Considering the arcs still remaining in the comic, there is always a need for a killer.

Maybe but she is one of the few whose current survival makes sense.........plus I think she can self justify most of her actions and slip back into her homemaker persona plus Carol would never try and control the community - she will do whats required as and when to protect it and the people....

Rick is more likely to be the problem if the world gets better (and no sign of that) - depends alot on what happens to Carl and his daughter -bad things happen to them and we have another Governor.

I actually had a $5 bet with a friend that Rick wouldn't survive Lori's death. I figured Daryl would have become team leader. I had been predicting Glenn and Maggie surviving til the end. I still think Rick would bite it before Glenn.