[Kings of War] Mantic Fantasy News & Rumors

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**DarkBlack**

Gimgamgoo wrote:
Will all the cards be sold in a separate pack? Or do we have to get all the figure packs just to get the rules?

No card packs.
There are lists to play with in the rulebook.
If you want more than that out you have to put more in.

**H0neyBe4r**

Gimgamgoo wrote:
Will all the cards be sold in a separate pack? Or do we have to get all the figure packs just to get the rules?

Neither, unless you want the rules as soon as possible. The rules for all models of the four "properly" released warbands (abyssals, basileans, nightstalkers and northern alliance) are already up on easy army, so my guess would be that the rules for all of the dwarf warband models will be accesible for free sometime in march 2019.

**Gimgamgoo**

H0neyBe4r wrote:
Gimgamgoo wrote:
Will all the cards be sold in a separate pack? Or do we have to get all the figure packs just to get the rules?

Neither, unless you want the rules as soon as possible. The rules for all models of the four "properly" released warbands (abyssals, basileans, nightstalkers and northern alliance) are already up on easy army, so my guess would be that the rules for all of the dwarf warband models will be accesible for free sometime in march 2019.

I have those 4 sets of cards from the KS. However, I'm one of those strange players that likes to own all the rules for the games I play - but not always every single figure.

I spent $300+ on the Vanguard kickstarter. I'm happy to buy rules addons or buy card packs, but I don't always want to buy loads more figures - especially if I bought them already.
I don't expect FREE. I'll happily buy rules books, pdfs or cards.

**DaveC**

Needlefangs

**StygianBeach**

Ah Needlefangs, so scary. I always try to target them first.

**DaveC**

Ronnie’s here with an update about everything that’s going on in the world of Vanguard…

Well, it’s very safe to say that Vanguard was one of our most successful game launches ever. Since the Kickstarter shipped and the game hit stores in October, we’ve seen plenty of faction photographs, battle reports and painting tutorials pop up online – which is great. Plus, popular YouTube channels like BlackJackLegacy, Weight of Fire and Guerrilla Miniature Gaming with Ash Barker have all jumped on board the Vanguard hype train – and there is a host of events already scheduled in and filling up fast.

In fact, the game has been so popular that we’re just about sold out of the first print run of the rulebook – so if you want to get one before January (when the 2nd printing arrives), you’ll need to grab one quick!

However, all this is only just the beginning of the Vanguard journey. Over the coming weeks and months we’ve got plenty of awesome Vanguard coverage and releases planned to keep the games fresh and ever evolving.

WHAT’S HAPPENING NEXT?

Dwarf Faction Launch – these are some of the most amazing Dwarf minis we’ve ever produced as you can see below. Those people who were sensible enough to grab some during the Kickstarter have been drooling over them since they received them. Watch out for the faction going up for pre-order later this week, ahead of their official launch in January

Mercenaries – later this week you’ll be able to add the heroic Firebrand to your warband, or the powerful goblin wizard, Kuzlo, complete with his hungry mount, Madfall

Uncharted Empires starter warband lists – some of you insist on playing with miniatures that went OOP in 1973. Well everyone is welcome at house Mantic, so as part of our 12 Days of Christmas, we’ll be unleashing a free PDF download for the remaining factions from the Kings of War supplement, Uncharted Empires. Time to literally blow the dust off those minis

**StygianBeach**

Interesting, I was just planning on running some Beastmen as Northern alliance but if Mantic are going to release lists for the Herd then I can wait.

**DaveC**

the rest of that post as it got cut for some reason

RMy Warband, My Story Wave 2 – these personal stories/tactics articles from Mantic staff were a popular addition to the launch, so we’re carrying them on as people swap and change factions. Rob started yesterday with his Trident Realm blog, which you can read here. Also, we’d love to see your factions and warbands coming together, so if you’d like to write your own, please just send it along to support@manticgames.com with some pictures and you’ll be WORLD FAMOUS on the Mantic blog and FB pages!

EASYARMY UPDATE

http://vanguard.easyarmy.com/

However, one of the big pieces of news today is that EasyArmy has now been updated with all the unit stats for the currently available warbands. That includes:

Forces of the Abyss – basic list, warband starter cards and booster cards
Nightstalkers – basic list, warband starter cards and booster cards
Basileans – basic list, warband starter cards and booster cards
Northern Alliance – basic list, warband starter cards and booster cards
Dwarfs – basic list (plus extras) – and the new ones will be added after their full release too
Elves – basic list (plus extras)
Forces of Nature – basic list (plus extras)
Ogres – basic list (plus extras)
The Trident Realm – basic list (plus extras)
Abyssal Dwarfs – basic list (plus extras)
Empire of Dust – basic list (plus extras)
Goblins – basic list (plus extras)
Orcs – basic list (plus extras)
Undead – basic list (plus extras)

WHY ARE WE USING EASYARMY?

In the core rulebook – and the PDF download – you receive starter warband lists for each faction. In fact, in the rulebook there are 121 units spread across the different factions (and we’ve recently added extra units to the downloadable PDF). This gives all the factions a fair and even starting point when you first collect and play the game.

Then, to keep the game growing and developing, when we launch a faction at retail (such as the Forces of the Abyss, Nightstalkers, Basileans and Northern Alliance) it allows us to go to each new range and add some incredible new miniatures – which will often be entirely new unit choices (such as the awesome Palace Guard – Ogres in Plate Mail – yes please!!!), or hero style figures – which make great models for your KoW army too. These not only give us new models for you to gaze longingly at, but also the chance to try new options to add to KoW armies.

And aside from making cool new models, this is an opportunity to ensure the game remains balanced and fun for players, as the additional Warband entries help change up the meta or address any weaknesses – and each army gets its own focus and each entry can be carefully considered – impossible if you try and do it for 20 entries for 15 + armies all at once! For example, if it becomes clear that Trident Realm needs a cheaper grunt option (as Rob keeps moaning about to Matt Gilbert… but then again, he is a cheating scoundrel), then during the retail launch we can add something to the list to mix things up a bit.

This all keeps Vanguard fresh as everyone gets new factions – both models and rules – to either dive into or play against.

IT’S ALL PART OF THE PLAN…

In the retail release these new units come in the form of warband cards. These cards are handy references that can be placed on the table during play – or you can make a note of the stats on the warband roster sheet (available to download here). Warband cards are planned at the moment as a faction gets a full retail release. So, the Dwarfs will be next in 2019, followed by the goblins and so on.

Of course, we’re aware that many Kings of War players and Mantic fans in general may have some miniatures that are represented by the cards. You may even have some miniatures that AREN’T made by Mantic *faints in horror*. And that’s exactly why we’re officially working with Gregg over at EasyArmy to ensure that new units are consistently added to EasyArmy too. This way you can browse new units online to see what the competition may have up their sleeve, or plan your latest foe-crushing list. Once you’ve finished your list, you can save it as a PDF and it’ll look like the below (almost identical to the warband cards) – and we have already added 2 new units/heroes to all the original factions. These will be scooped up at some point into a book, alongside lots more new scenarios and a few other surprises

Automatically Appended Next Post:
and part 3

In fact this is very similar to how we keep KoW fresh with the Clash of Kings book – currently the 2019 available at all good gaming stores and online at www.manticgames.com <end plug>

By working with EasyArmy as an official partner, it means that the rules and unit stats will continue to be available to browse online or download as a warband stat sheet, and we will be constantly updating and developing the game – in a format available to ALL for free!!

So, if you can somehow resist not buying those wonderful new miniatures (such willpower – they really are some of our best-ever fantasy minis) you can still access all the up to date information online any time and completely free. And, as mentioned, by continuing to have full faction releases every couple of months, it ensures we will keep Vanguard fresh throughout 2019 and for many years to come. In summary then:

Hardback rulebook – full rules, 12 scenarios, full equipment lists, campaign rules, full spell lists and intro warband lists
Downloadable PDF – intro rules, warband lists
Retail faction launches – incredible new miniatures and new units via warband cards
EasyArmy – complete warband lists (including those introduced in the faction sets), available to browse whenever you want, then print off or save warband lists at your leisure
Enjoy your gaming and hopefully see you at a Vanguard event soon.

**DarkBlack**

Well now, that should stop the complaining.
Should...

**Sarouan**

Sure, it was all part of the plan. That's why they waited so much before finally announcing that.

Anyway, only the ones not having constant access to internet will be the ones fethed indeed. But they are not to be taken into account, so all praise Mantic, because Mantic can never make mistakes - that's only GW's field. Am I right here ?

**Illumini**

Nice customer friendly attitude. I like that they want to compete for my money with improved miniatures and good games instead of going for excluding options.

Sarouan, are you seriously blaiming Mantic for bad internet access? You just look ridiculous trying to stir up something after mantic has just delivered a very customer friendly statement.

Note that I am no Mantic fanboy, I think lots of their minis are terrible.

**Sarouan**

Illumini wrote:
Nice customer friendly attitude. I like that they want to compete for my money with improved miniatures and good games instead of going for excluding options.

Sarouan, are you seriously blaiming Mantic for bad internet access? You just look ridiculous trying to stir up something after mantic has just delivered a very customer friendly statement.

Note that I am no Mantic fanboy, I think lots of their minis are terrible.

Of course not, I'm not blaming them. You can never blame Mantic for what they are doing, because they always are friendly towards their customers, they're the good guys.

Sure, if they wrote it all in the book day one, they would nothing to fix with easyarmy, but that's preposterousl. Now they fixed something they cause themselves because of their first choices, so yes thanks to Mantic for that gift ! Obviously, it's the fault of customers if they don't want/can't use easyarmy, instead of a book they have bought with their money to support Mantic on, said, a Kickstarter, when it wasn't known at that time Mantic would have done that in the end. After all, there is nothing to complain about, right ?

**OrlandotheTechnicoloured**

DaveC wrote:
the rest of that post as it got cut for some reason

probably an emoji or other unrecognised character in the text

I've found dakka seems to delete it an everything after it in a cut/paste quote unless you manually delete it before posting

**AegisGrimm**

Uncharted Empires starter warband lists – some of you insist on playing with miniatures that went OOP in 1973. Well everyone is welcome at house Mantic, so as part of our 12 Days of Christmas, we’ll be unleashing a free PDF download for the remaining factions from the Kings of War supplement, Uncharted Empires. Time to literally blow the dust off those minis

Kinda snarky considering what some of their official minatures look like.

**DaveC**

OrlandotheTechnicoloured wrote:
DaveC wrote:
the rest of that post as it got cut for some reason

probably an emoji or other unrecognised character in the text

I've found dakka seems to delete it an everything after it in a cut/paste quote unless you manually delete it before posting

ah spot on there's a smiley face at the cut point I'll remember to remove them in future thanks.

**Gallahad**

Kudos to Mantic for doing this. I'm really happy that Vanguard is selling well for them!

**NTRabbit**

AegisGrimm wrote:
Uncharted Empires starter warband lists – some of you insist on playing with miniatures that went OOP in 1973. Well everyone is welcome at house Mantic, so as part of our 12 Days of Christmas, we’ll be unleashing a free PDF download for the remaining factions from the Kings of War supplement, Uncharted Empires. Time to literally blow the dust off those minis

Kinda snarky considering what some of their official minatures look like.

Light hearted bants, haven't you seen Ronnie on youtube interviews before?

**.Mikes.**

Just got my VanguardNightsalker pledge this morning (I piggybacked off another backer - Australian shipping is a killer) and it looks awesome. So can't wait to get this game going.

**Danny76**

NTRabbit wrote:
AegisGrimm wrote:
Uncharted Empires starter warband lists – some of you insist on playing with miniatures that went OOP in 1973. Well everyone is welcome at house Mantic, so as part of our 12 Days of Christmas, we’ll be unleashing a free PDF download for the remaining factions from the Kings of War supplement, Uncharted Empires. Time to literally blow the dust off those minis

Kinda snarky considering what some of their official minatures look like.

Light hearted bants, haven't you seen Ronnie on youtube interviews before?

Definitely intended as jovial.
I always remember the seminar just after the Old World blew up, when he was announcing Uncharted and general Fantasy list support. It was so fun being in there and making light of a real sad point, kinda made it better ya know

**pancakeonions**

Just played my first game last night, my friend's Goblins vs. my Elves. Holy smokes, the Elf Prince is a brute! (didn't hurt that he didn't have too many units with crushing strength - so my armor saves were quite obnoxious!)

The game is really fun! Taking a group activation with my Kindred Archers (two of 'em, adding a third would just be nuts) was also crazy - they got MVP for their precision bloodshed and surgical strike mayhem.

Can't wait to play again!

**Gimgamgoo**

Cheap affordable gaming...?
I liked it when Mantic was.

For a full set of Dwarf warband cards, you need to spend £95 on figure packs.
This only gets you 18 figures. 10 of these are the old mantic plastic or metal.

So, 8 new 20mm base size resin models, 10 old models and the cards for £95.

Mantic are starting to make GW look like the cheaper option.

**NTRabbit**

Gimgamgoo wrote:
Cheap affordable gaming...?
I liked it when Mantic was.

For a full set of Dwarf warband cards, you need to spend £95 on figure packs.
This only gets you 18 figures. 10 of these are the old mantic plastic or metal.

So, 8 new 20mm base size resin models, 10 old models and the cards for £95.

Mantic are starting to make GW look like the cheaper option.

All the card info will be on easyarmy per the latest blog

**H0neyBe4r**

Some people appearantly do not want free stats and rules over the internet, but purchaseable cards or army lists. If enough people are getting vocal about it, Mantic might print and sell seperate card sets.

I don´t see the point, as they will be outdated when things get rebalanced.

**.Mikes.**

As much as I hated PP dropping cards from warmachine hordes and going with their app (which is great, but I like cards) with state of Malifaux and having to keep track of changes to models on cards which haven't changed since their release was a pain. I undersatnd what Mantic have done, but also that it may not sit well with everyone.

**Monkeysloth**

would be easy to solve if they just set up print on demand with a US and European company. If you want cards for $25 feel free to click and have a partner print them for you. Ya you might be doing that every 4-6 months but it's optional.

**DarkBlack**

Gimgamgoo wrote:
Cheap affordable gaming...?
I liked it when Mantic was.

For a full set of Dwarf warband cards, you need to spend £95 on figure packs.
This only gets you 18 figures. 10 of these are the old mantic plastic or metal.

So, 8 new 20mm base size resin models, 10 old models and the cards for £95.

Mantic are starting to make GW look like the cheaper option.

Exaggerate much?

Do you need a full set to play the game?

**Sarouan**

DarkBlack wrote:
Gimgamgoo wrote:
Cheap affordable gaming...?
I liked it when Mantic was.

For a full set of Dwarf warband cards, you need to spend £95 on figure packs.
This only gets you 18 figures. 10 of these are the old mantic plastic or metal.

So, 8 new 20mm base size resin models, 10 old models and the cards for £95.

Mantic are starting to make GW look like the cheaper option.

Exaggerate much?
Do you need a full set to play the game?

It is not exaggeration to want the full rules of your faction. His concern is valid - and yes, what Mantic Games asks for their Vanguard miniatures is significantly more expensive in comparison to what they have done before. We're paying the "Skirmish Tax" here for the same miniatures, let's be clear.

**daisuke serizawa**

Of course there is a skirmish tax! Everybody does it and there may even be a reason besides greed behind it. The funny part of it is that these are still half the cost at what GW prices their heroes (i just checked 40k preorders over there to make sure).

There is no way for mantic to come out on top in this.
People want better material than pvc but don t want to pay resin prices. It's basicly either "Mantic is beeing cheap" or "This isn t affordable wargaming!".
Mantic simply has to choose how they want to be bashed and stand by their decission.
I just wish they would go back to pvc for their starters coming forward, but i think that is not an option now considering every release outside of Kickstarter(and Walking Dead) has been resin or metal.
I personally have no problem with pvc-cleaning. I really and unironically prefer Pvc. Both materials are not very fun to clean up and the brittleness of resin is way more problematic for me.

For the card-"problem": I wonder why Mantic didn t see that coming after 2 Editions of Deadzone.
Cards are just Trouble, especially if you don t print them in house. The DZ-community settled after they got rid of the cards in 2nd Edition.
If somebody wants cards just pdf or print easy army lists and slap a picture on it. Done! Or look for cards made by others(there are some undead cards flying around the inet for example). There are companies who will print these out on playingcards if you really want it...

**DarkBlack**

Sarouan wrote:
DarkBlack wrote:
Gimgamgoo wrote:
Cheap affordable gaming...?
I liked it when Mantic was.

For a full set of Dwarf warband cards, you need to spend £95 on figure packs.
This only gets you 18 figures. 10 of these are the old mantic plastic or metal.

So, 8 new 20mm base size resin models, 10 old models and the cards for £95.

Mantic are starting to make GW look like the cheaper option.

Exaggerate much?
Do you need a full set to play the game?

It is not exaggeration to want the full rules of your faction. His concern is valid - and yes, what Mantic Games asks for their Vanguard miniatures is significantly more expensive in comparison to what they have done before. We're paying the "Skirmish Tax" here for the same miniatures, let's be clear.

All the rules are free on EasyArmy. Having all the models and options for a faction is a luxury and far more than you need to play a game.

The miniatures are significantly nicer than the models from the KoW range too.

**Manchu**

Doesn’t change the fact that Mantic is charging £95 for 18 figures. Gimgamgoo is right. And those figures are nowhere near as good as what GW (or various other companies) offers, we’re talking miles off. Mantic started as an alternative to the GW business model but now seems trying to scramble after GW’s famous theory that miniatures can never actually cost “enough” ... all while showing only very modest improvement in quality and to be honest basically no improvement in design.