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so what are the chances of getting a penn and teller set of minis and a Jay and Silent bob set? with jay and bob holding a hockey sticks.



'

 Piston Honda wrote:
so what are the chances of getting a penn and teller set of minis and a Jay and Silent bob set? with jay and bob holding a hockey sticks.

IMO Jay and Silent Bob with bong sabers would be better.

It is all well and good the people in the U.S. have had pleasant experiences but as an international customer the reviews are mostly not in the positive.

Granted people have eventually gotten their stuff but after a lot of back and forth so I was posting to gain an insight as someone who might drop a few hundred over a few people on the next KS if it is something that won't wind up totally stressing me out having to chase things up or cross my fingers.

I just want to know if it is worth the effort or not basically and so far international customers come across with a firm "eeeeeeh maaaaaaaybe"

*edit* bluntman and chronic but also dante and randall with hockey sticks

As an EU backer I haven't had any issues with both Zombicide KS everything arrived exactly as it should sure it was a bit later delivery than US backers but that was the trade off for no import charges so that's fine by me. They sold at Gencon before I got mine but I got mine plus all that extras the retail set didn't get I don't need to be the first person with the game in my hand.

The only real issue for me is the misprinted numbers on the cards but as I'm going to back season 3 it will get sorted and I get $10 credit.

CMoN have been hit and miss on their KS but Zc is in the hit category for me and I get the feeling that Guillotine Games are as much behind that plus you don't mess up your biggest cash cow.

Anytime I have had an issue CMoN have sorted it okay it took a little time and if you want something done right away you'll probably get stressed out over chasing it - they do come through in the end though (in my experience). I'm not CMoN biggest fan by any means there's some projects I wish they'd never got their hands on but it won't stop me backing/buying games thet publish that I like.

 Trapthem wrote:
It is all well and good the people in the U.S. have had pleasant experiences but as an international customer the reviews are mostly not in the positive.

Customer reviews in general are mostly written by people who were unhappy with a service.

8,944 backers Season 2, and I'm willing to bet we see less than 100 people who had legitimate complaints about it, that keep bringing it up.

Most of the complaints I recall were of the following nature

"I really , really want it, why isn't it here yet?"
"Even though they are insanely busy, why haven't they responded to my email?"
"How dare they sell box sets at a convention, before I got mine. I'm a KS backer Gosh darn it !!!"

-----------------

Personally, When I received Season 2 wave 1, I had one wrong 1 model in it. I waited until they said everything was shipped and emailed them about it. I got a responce within 48 hours, a confimration that my model was shipped within 48hours later, and the model at my door within 48 hours later.

If I had any real complaint about the Season 2 fulfillment process it's that they shipped the smallest orders first. The people who had invested the most, were the last to get their models.

I actually just emailed them over a figure that I had ordered 2 of (overpledged) but only got one. They got back to me within hours. I've had nothing but good communication for Cmon kickstarters after they are out. Havent tried while it is ongoing though.

I think it's important to remember that they only have like, 16 total employees, only 3 of which are (I believe) dedicated to shipping and inventory.

I think they've continued to get better at managing KS projects as a whole. I'm looking forward to Z3.

 adamsouza wrote:

Customer reviews in general are mostly written by people who were unhappy with a service.

This is not especially true. Many people who are unhappy with a service will just suck it up quietly just as satisfied customers will often say nothing. Unhappy people will, by and large tell more people about their experiences than happy ones, though. However, "most" is pushing it. Especially in threads where people ask for others' experiences with a company or product.

8,944 backers Season 2, and I'm willing to bet we see less than 100 people who had legitimate complaints about it, that keep bringing it up.

Here, though, you're pulling numbers out of your arse/passing your opinions off as "fact".
Speaking for myself, I bring my CMON shipping experiences up when people ask about others' experiences, or when it's pertinent to the discussion. I haven't written a blog post about "my terrible experiences with CMON" or anything. Once I got in contact with someone who was able to actually help me rather than stall and bs me, it was resolved very quickly and to my satisfaction. I've also stated plenty of times that my subsequent shipments arrived with no problem at all. Frankly, if CMON are going to continue to ship Non-US orders from China it'll be a vast improvement in many ways, and was a welcome development to see during the ZCS2 fulfilment.

Most of the complaints I recall were of the following nature

"I really , really want it, why isn't it here yet?"
"Even though they are insanely busy, why haven't they responded to my email?"
"How dare they sell box sets at a convention, before I got mine. I'm a KS backer Gosh darn it !!!"

I mostly recall legitimate ones. It probably helps that I didn't start browsing the comments section at all until they screwed up my initial shipment, and for the weeks thereafter while trying to get it resolved. I also tended to ignore the first two of those, excepting when people were hoping to get responses for screwed-up orders like my own.

While I'm not too fussed about the GenCon thing personally, I certainly see how people can legitimately take issue with it. It's good to see that you've decided for the rest of us that it's not a "legitimate" complaint though.

You seem to be drifting towards becoming an apologist for CMON lately. The "less than 100 people" and "legitimate" stuff above is not helping your credibility.

Azaz- I think your concerns were always perfectly reasonable. I was really glad to hear that they resolved stuff for you.

I think part of it with Zombicide is that people just have to realize that shipping for that monstrosity takes some time. There were, what? 8000 backers on ZC:S2? Each person with the potential for a different order.

And CMoN only has 3 or 4 full time warehouse employees.

I've personally never been bothered by a company selling product at at Con before it arrived to backers. I think it would behoove many to complete a survey first to get a general temperature of how the backer group as a whole feels, but for some of the smaller companies, it would be foolish for them not to take new product to the 2nd largest tabletop gaming convention in the world.

 Azazelx wrote:
While I'm not too fussed about the GenCon thing personally, I certainly see how people can legitimately take issue with it. It's good to see that you've decided for the rest of us that it's not a "legitimate" complaint though.

I didn't participate in either KS, but I do have strong feelings about this. People need to be more understanding about this sort of thing.

When the act of packing and shipping a huge amount of pre-orders can take weeks, and the shipping on certain items can take weeks beyond that, expecting a company to miss out on thousands of dollars in sales and absolutely crucial exposure so you feel like you're special just seems wrong. GenCon is a massive once a year event - the sort of event that companies count on for both revenue and buzz. To "sit it out" or deliberately hamper yourself to make a small group of people happy just isn't right. In fact, as supporters/backers, you would think they would want the company to do the thing that gives them the best leg up.

Twisted Key Entertainment wrote:
Hello Zombiciders,

We owe you an update and also an apology for not having published the new Zombicide Companion just yet:

The app is technically finished, but right now we are facing some bureacratic issues with setting up a new company ...in the US and getting it registered with Apple.
We understand you have been waiting on this for quite a while and we deeply apologize for missing our intended deadline.

We estimate no more than 2 weeks and you’ll be getting your hands on version 2.0, both for iOS and Android which should have very close release dates.
Remember though: Apple’s approval can take a while sometimes. We will update again when we’ve uploaded the binaries, rest assured.

But for those who just can’t wait we’ll be giving away 5 copies, as a preview, to the first 5 people to send us their iOS devices’ UDIDs.
Head to http://whatsmyudid.com/ to find out how to get your device’s UDID! Then shoot us an e-mail at zombicide@twistedkey.com
By the end of Sunday EST (see? we’re working weekends even!) the lucky ones will receive an e-mail with instructions on how to download and install the app.

IMPORTANT:
Do NOT post your UDID here, send it to the e-mail above!
The app requires iPad 2 or newer or iPhone 5 or newer.
This is only available to iOS users.
This preview will only be valid until the official app is released, then you will have to download it from the App Store to obtain future updates.
Your UDID will only be used for the purposes of sending you a version of the app, and nothing else. See More

Well, no way I'm in The first 5, but never know if they feel bad for me.

 cincydooley wrote:
Azaz- I think your concerns were always perfectly reasonable. I was really glad to hear that they resolved stuff for you.

I think part of it with Zombicide is that people just have to realize that shipping for that monstrosity takes some time. There were, what? 8000 backers on ZC:S2? Each person with the potential for a different order.

And CMoN only has 3 or 4 full time warehouse employees.

I've personally never been bothered by a company selling product at at Con before it arrived to backers. I think it would behoove many to complete a survey first to get a general temperature of how the backer group as a whole feels, but for some of the smaller companies, it would be foolish for them not to take new product to the 2nd largest tabletop gaming convention in the world.

xNickBaranx wrote:

 Azazelx wrote:
While I'm not too fussed about the GenCon thing personally, I certainly see how people can legitimately take issue with it. It's good to see that you've decided for the rest of us that it's not a "legitimate" complaint though.

I didn't participate in either KS, but I do have strong feelings about this. People need to be more understanding about this sort of thing.

When the act of packing and shipping a huge amount of pre-orders can take weeks, and the shipping on certain items can take weeks beyond that, expecting a company to miss out on thousands of dollars in sales and absolutely crucial exposure so you feel like you're special just seems wrong. GenCon is a massive once a year event - the sort of event that companies count on for both revenue and buzz. To "sit it out" or deliberately hamper yourself to make a small group of people happy just isn't right. In fact, as supporters/backers, you would think they would want the company to do the thing that gives them the best leg up.

Of course. With any shipping job of any significant size, someone has to be last, and that's completely understandable. On the other hand, I do think that hiring temps/getting in the casuals/part-timers full-time for a week or two is a reasonable proposition and even expectation for something like this, rather than simply saying "We only have three staff and ten thousand orders! Oh noes! We could never have planned for this!" when they generally have a year or so to plan it.

I think the issue for people with regard to GenCon seems to be that as backers, we're usually promised the toys first, and we usually paid a year in advance (or more!) and so I do think it's a legitimate/reasonable concern when companies might air-freight in a pile of stuff so that they can sell them to con-goers while people who "made it happen" and paid upfront 6-12-18 months might still be waiting a month or even several months more for their stuff. As I've said, it doesn't personally bother me too much, (well, most of the time - Palladium would be an exception) but I can respect those who have an issue with it rather than write them off as entitled or whingers or illegitimate or what have you.

 cincydooley wrote:

And CMoN only has 3 or 4 full time warehouse employees.

I don't know how many people they have running part time, but since it seems like I get a "we're doing a kickstarter for such an such" every other month or so, they should probably hire a few more...

 Azazelx wrote:

 cincydooley wrote:
Azaz- I think your concerns were always perfectly reasonable. I was really glad to hear that they resolved stuff for you.

I think part of it with Zombicide is that people just have to realize that shipping for that monstrosity takes some time. There were, what? 8000 backers on ZC:S2? Each person with the potential for a different order.

And CMoN only has 3 or 4 full time warehouse employees.

I've personally never been bothered by a company selling product at at Con before it arrived to backers. I think it would behoove many to complete a survey first to get a general temperature of how the backer group as a whole feels, but for some of the smaller companies, it would be foolish for them not to take new product to the 2nd largest tabletop gaming convention in the world.

xNickBaranx wrote:

 Azazelx wrote:
While I'm not too fussed about the GenCon thing personally, I certainly see how people can legitimately take issue with it. It's good to see that you've decided for the rest of us that it's not a "legitimate" complaint though.

I didn't participate in either KS, but I do have strong feelings about this. People need to be more understanding about this sort of thing.

When the act of packing and shipping a huge amount of pre-orders can take weeks, and the shipping on certain items can take weeks beyond that, expecting a company to miss out on thousands of dollars in sales and absolutely crucial exposure so you feel like you're special just seems wrong. GenCon is a massive once a year event - the sort of event that companies count on for both revenue and buzz. To "sit it out" or deliberately hamper yourself to make a small group of people happy just isn't right. In fact, as supporters/backers, you would think they would want the company to do the thing that gives them the best leg up.

Of course. With any shipping job of any significant size, someone has to be last, and that's completely understandable. On the other hand, I do think that hiring temps/getting in the casuals/part-timers full-time for a week or two is a reasonable proposition and even expectation for something like this, rather than simply saying "We only have three staff and ten thousand orders! Oh noes! We could never have planned for this!" when they generally have a year or so to plan it.

I think the issue for people with regard to GenCon seems to be that as backers, we're usually promised the toys first, and we usually paid a year in advance (or more!) and so I do think it's a legitimate/reasonable concern when companies might air-freight in a pile of stuff so that they can sell them to con-goers while people who "made it happen" and paid upfront 6-12-18 months might still be waiting a month or even several months more for their stuff. As I've said, it doesn't personally bother me too much, (well, most of the time - Palladium would be an exception) but I can respect those who have an issue with it rather than write them off as entitled or whingers or illegitimate or what have you.

Yeah, I disagree with most of this. What you described is absolutely a feeling of entitlement. BUT... I also don't think a company should screw over their backers. Its just that I don't think missing out on a once a year event is a reasonable expectation on the part of backers.

There is a synergy... A give and take... That I feel goes along with Kickstarter. You are backing a product or an idea because you want it to succeed, and as such, you should be understanding when hiccups happen along the way or when the company makes a decision for the absolute good of the company, like attending GenCon to promote themselves. Conversely, the company should be 100% communicative about what they are doing, why, and how it will affect their backers. They aren't mind readers and they need to know that they backed the right team. Essentially, both sides of the equation need to be community minded and respectful to each other. I think that's absolutely essential.

And yes, a company can say, "wow, how are we going to ship all this crap with only 3 people?" and then hire temps. But of course, when they ran the KS, they don't factor into the equation, "Okay, we need to hire 3 temps at $10/hr for 3 weeks, 40 hours per week.... With taxes and temp fees, that's only $4000-$5000 we didn't account for. Damn it."

Yeah, they raised over $1M and 4K-5K seems like a drop in the bucket, but with shipping, production, etc on everything they promised... I don't think they're lining their pockets just yet. I could be wrong. But the overhead when you explode that quickly has to be enormous.

Long story short, both sides need to set reasonable expectations of each other and behave like a community and a team - not work against each other.

xNickBaranx wrote:

 Azazelx wrote:

Of course. With any shipping job of any significant size, someone has to be last, and that's completely understandable. On the other hand, I do think that hiring temps/getting in the casuals/part-timers full-time for a week or two is a reasonable proposition and even expectation for something like this, rather than simply saying "We only have three staff and ten thousand orders! Oh noes! We could never have planned for this!" when they generally have a year or so to plan it.

I think the issue for people with regard to GenCon seems to be that as backers, we're usually promised the toys first, and we usually paid a year in advance (or more!) and so I do think it's a legitimate/reasonable concern when companies might air-freight in a pile of stuff so that they can sell them to con-goers while people who "made it happen" and paid upfront 6-12-18 months might still be waiting a month or even several months more for their stuff. As I've said, it doesn't personally bother me too much, (well, most of the time - Palladium would be an exception) but I can respect those who have an issue with it rather than write them off as entitled or whingers or illegitimate or what have you.

Yeah, I disagree with most of this. What you described is absolutely a feeling of entitlement. BUT... I also don't think a company should screw over their backers. Its just that I don't think missing out on a once a year event is a reasonable expectation on the part of backers.

There is a synergy... A give and take... That I feel goes along with Kickstarter. You are backing a product or an idea because you want it to succeed, and as such, you should be understanding when hiccups happen along the way or when the company makes a decision for the absolute good of the company, like attending GenCon to promote themselves. Conversely, the company should be 100% communicative about what they are doing, why, and how it will affect their backers. They aren't mind readers and they need to know that they backed the right team. Essentially, both sides of the equation need to be community minded and respectful to each other. I think that's absolutely essential.

And yes, a company can say, "wow, how are we going to ship all this crap with only 3 people?" and then hire temps. But of course, when they ran the KS, they don't factor into the equation, "Okay, we need to hire 3 temps at $10/hr for 3 weeks, 40 hours per week.... With taxes and temp fees, that's only $4000-$5000 we didn't account for. Damn it."

Yeah, they raised over $1M and 4K-5K seems like a drop in the bucket, but with shipping, production, etc on everything they promised... I don't think they're lining their pockets just yet. I could be wrong. But the overhead when you explode that quickly has to be enormous.

Long story short, both sides need to set reasonable expectations of each other and behave like a community and a team - not work against each other.

I guess we'll just have to agree to disagree then, broadly speaking. I also don't think a feeling of entitlement is out of place when you've paid for a product upfront. CMON stuff is pretty much in pre-order territory these days. (though DUST takes the cake there!) I think a reasonable compromise would be to say upfront on the KS page that they will be at Gencon regardless of anything else or where backer shipping is at that point. Wouldn't effect me in the slightest and automagically cuts off that particular line of complaint from anyone who is to be up in arms about it. It also lets anyone who would be dissatisfied with it to vote with their dollars as well. Don't like it? Don't back it. But again, until that sort of this is said upfront I think it's wrong to disregard those who have issues there. (And like I've said a few times, I'd have an issue with Palladium there but not any other project that I've backed- and that's because Palladium has been lying to their backers since the inception of their campaign.)

At this point as well, though - I think CMON kickstarters (and Zombicide in particular) are at least as much about getting the limited-edition figures the only way they're reasonably available on the backers' side and getting a pile of that sweet, sweet cash a year upfront on CMON's. - we're not really in "it could never happen without your support" territory any more. I don't think Season 3/4/5 would have any trouble if they went through traditional channels and skipped kickstarter entirely at this point.

I do however agree with you 100% on the importance of open, honest and regular communication. The KS that seem to attract the most ire are the ones where the communication is lacking, and deservedly so.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Schlyne wrote:

 cincydooley wrote:

And CMoN only has 3 or 4 full time warehouse employees.

I don't know how many people they have running part time, but since it seems like I get a "we're doing a kickstarter for such an such" every other month or so, they should probably hire a few more...

I figure you'd get a somewhat regular crew of casuals that you could call in for busy periods rather than randoms or volunteers. Do this so that you have the same, competent people rather than unknowns. Get the KS of the day shipped more quickly. More satisfied backers = more money for future campaigns.

Anyone else getting a bit burnt out on Zombicide for them to already be talking about season 4?

Nope.

They are a year apart.

 gunslingerpro wrote:
Anyone else getting a bit burnt out on Zombicide for them to already be talking about season 4?

A little. People will still buy it and eat it up with a spoon for the time being, though. Smart for Guillotine to make as much off it while they can - people will either burn out on it if they keep pumping out annual updates (with only 6 months or so between final fulfilments and new campaigns launching) or just lose interest if they leave it for too long.

 gunslingerpro wrote:
Anyone else getting a bit burnt out on Zombicide for them to already be talking about season 4?

At first, yes. But after reading this thread and the Season 3 news thread at Boardgame Geek I'm seriously considering pledging again. Originally, my attitude was I've got enough Z-cide stuff so there's no point in getting more, but with the new Skinner and Crawler zombies, and new equipment ... being seduced by the shiny again.

adamsouza wrote:Nope.

They are a year apart.

Yeah, I guess they are. Maybe I just haven't played a lot of Season 2 yet, so it seems like I've barely scratched the surface of that one (haven't even used Toxic Mall yet). But that may just be me.

Azazelx wrote:

A little. People will still buy it and eat it up with a spoon for the time being, though. Smart for Guillotine to make as much off it while they can - people will either burn out on it if they keep pumping out annual updates (with only 6 months or so between final fulfilments and new campaigns launching) or just lose interest if they leave it for too long.

It definitely makes sense from a business perspective. Though I think it may benefit slowly transitioning to have some more RPG elements, as the constant updates mean I'll never use half the survivors with the amount of games I play a year. That way I could get some more mileage out of them. Again, this may be due to me moving away from my primary playing group.

Ancestral Hamster wrote: At first, yes. But after reading this thread and the Season 3 news thread at Boardgame Geek I'm seriously considering pledging again. Originally, my attitude was I've got enough Z-cide stuff so there's no point in getting more, but with the new Skinner and Crawler zombies, and new equipment ... being seduced by the shiny again.

Ack! That's what I was afraid of. I don't frequent Geek and the photos on here are work blocked for me, so I've been able to resist. Thus far, anyway...

 gunslingerpro wrote:

Azazelx wrote:
A little. People will still buy it and eat it up with a spoon for the time being, though. Smart for Guillotine to make as much off it while they can - people will either burn out on it if they keep pumping out annual updates (with only 6 months or so between final fulfilments and new campaigns launching) or just lose interest if they leave it for too long.

It definitely makes sense from a business perspective. Though I think it may benefit slowly transitioning to have some more RPG elements, as the constant updates mean I'll never use half the survivors with the amount of games I play a year. That way I could get some more mileage out of them. Again, this may be due to me moving away from my primary playing group.

The Kickstarters really play to the Poke'Mon "gotta catch em all"/collector mentality that so many of us have. Otherwise they wouldn't be absolutely brimming with Kickstarter exclusive "homage" characters. They'll keep going to the well until it's dry, I fear.

On the plus side, they are planning on having a longer period of time between seasons 3 and 4 during which time they will focus on the new horror property they have been working on with studio mcvey.

Anyone have a date/time more specific than late June for the S3 KS?

Nothing more than last week of June and with Xenoshyft starting late it might slip a week but KS creators no longer need KS approval to launch new projects under the new rules they can use Launch Now and start when ever they like so no more waiting for approval excuses.

New previews the Heilpad tile



At least 2 of the new Survivors have the Helicopter pilot skill

I have stacks of season 2 stuff, and we've barely even touched it. We haven't done much other than play with the base game, partially due to different locations and the fact that we also own zpocalypse.

Both of the zombie games we have take up a decent amount of room, so if we take board games to one of the local coffee shops, they're usually not going (table size), or we take zpoc instead. I haven't followed all the other websites out there saying "this is coming out for season 3/4/etc." So I'm kinda of waiting for the KS to see what I'll pledge and for what.

Eagles? I haven't even really used the dogs yet..while I can see a use for the dogs, what on earth am I going to do with birds?

In this game I haven't see as much of a need for the doors and stuff, but it would be useful...

I've got my $10 credit for the card number screwup, so I'll probably back something, but I have no idea what.

The Dog companions are great. We used them quite a bit the last time we played. Still haven't used the Prison Stuff (other than a scattering of Red Zombides in our last set of games), but the main thing we have an abundance of is Survivors. 40+. Don't know when we're going to use all of them, especially when we fall into patterns over the characters we like (like Wanda and CTS for me).

We use all the survivors, the dog companions, beserkers, toxic, and hound zombies, as well as all of the equipement cards on a regualr basis.

We don't use the prison and mall tiles all that much, as they seem congested with lots of tiny rooms that it's hard to fit zombies in once you get to red.

I actually mix the dogs in to the equipment pile. I also turned some of the non-English cards into "Found a survivor" cards to get a few more on the board. They start a 0 xp and no equipment, it can change the flow quite a bit.

The equipment cards are becoming a big of a problem now that there are so many of them. If Guillotine's intention is to release a kind of RPG-level expansion that encourages linked play, then they're going to need to release a whole stack of non-weapon equipment cards (like the bottled water, bags of rice, canned food, etc. cards from the original game) and make those sorts of cards intrinsic to survival within the RPG.

Right now, aside from the odd mission objective, those cards are dead cards. If you don't need any and find one whilst searching, then you just discard it. It's not a "health pack", so it doesn't do anything. Making those cards important would be a good first step.