Eldar rumours (Preorder pics added to first post)

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**Popenfresh**

I don't know guy's... Individually locks may be subpar, but as a seer council? Maledictions and blessings are cumulative. With a bit of luck you'll have a unit with a 2++ save that can knock of 2 saving points from the enemy. Not to mention being able to reduce the enemy's strength ..., I wonder, if you reduce a terminator to str. 2, does that mean his fist hits at str. 4? I'm also curious if the 1+ str can be applied to armorbane? Then there's the potential to make them fearless, fast as hell and so on. Jetcouncils look dangerous as ever. And a footcouncils can be accompanied by a farseer, adding even more to the buffing/debuffing.

Seercouncils look like a very hard hitting, versatile, reasonably priced mini deathstar unit to me.

**BlueDagger**

Popenfresh wrote:
I don't know guy's... Individually locks may be subpar, but as a seer council? Maledictions and blessings are cumulative. With a bit of luck you'll have a unit with a 2++ save that can knock of 2 saving points from the enemy. Not to mention being able to reduce the enemy's strength ..., I wonder, if you reduce a terminator to str. 2, does that mean his fist hits at str. 4? I'm also curious if the 1+ str can be applied to armorbane? Then there's the potential to make them fearless, fast as hell and so on. Jetcouncils look dangerous as ever. And a footcouncils can be accompanied by a farseer, adding even more to the buffing/debuffing.

Seercouncils look like a very hard hitting, versatile, reasonably priced mini deathstar unit to me.

Incorrect. DIFFERENT blessing and maledictions are cumulative. You can't stack the same power.

**skarsol**

The Scorpion's Claw not being Unwieldy or Specialist is... kinda nice. Karandras is 5 WS7 S8 I7 AP2 attacks, SS Exarch is 3 S6 I6 AP2 attacks (plus their wonky I10 wuss attack).

**pizzaguardian**

Autarch Fiallathandirel wrote:
pizzaguardian wrote:
BlueDagger wrote:
Warlocks splitting off to other units = Took too big of a hit. Having 1 randomized power makes them completely unreliable for a specialized force such as Eldar. Attaching a warlock biker to a unit of GJB jsut to find out he gets power 3, 5, or 6 would heartly piss me off. Yes, you could just stick with shrouding but that kinda defeats the purpose of the other powers.

That said, a 10 man unit jetbike seer council is now 500pts and will likely be 2+ armor, 3+ cover (2+ when full out), S/I/WS +1, and inflict a -1 armor. That has a lot of potential to be rediculously mean. Attach a new kitted farseer and autarch... it could be one hell of a deathstar.

The farseer odds on going Fortune however... that is pretty much my sadest point about the entire damn dex.

Have 2 farseers

Excuse me guys but you are running ahead of yourself, it says warlocks are assigned immediately after you roll Warlord traits. Rolling for warlord traits says before either player deploys they must each determine warlord traits and it says this is done specifically because some warlord traits affect deployment. Rolling psychic powers just says before either player deploys. How does that make it that Warlocks can't choose where to go?

If I'm not being clear my meaning is the book doesn't say powers have to be rolled after warlord traits and before deployment, it just says before deployment. So why can't you roll power, warlord traits, assign warlocks then deploy?

Dont follow the thread that hard i see?

Check the game summary page please, (pg 424 on brb - for the lıttle one ıt ıs rıght after psychıc dıscıplınes), it will show you why i am not running ahead of myself, in fact i rarely do any running at all.

**Mr Morden**

Is the Iyanden Codex download only :( - thats rubbish

**Popenfresh**

Incorrect. DIFFERENT blessing and maledictions are cumulative. You can't stack the same power.

Makes sense, otherwise they'd be horribly OP. Nevertheless, seeing as each power can swing both ways (Eldar pun hurrhurr) their powers still synergize really well if you put them in a 10 man squad. Not to mention it gives you a fairly reliable pool to get a wide range of powers from.

A 10 man seercouncil still looks like a very mean unit, be it on foot or on jetbikes, for a reasonable price. Just imagine SM's wounding a jetlock on a 5+...

IMHO they're more unreliable but much more versatile.

skarsol wrote:
The Scorpion's Claw not being Unwieldy or Specialist is... kinda nice. Karandras is 5 WS7 S8 I7 AP2 attacks, SS Exarch is 3 S6 I6 AP2 attacks (plus their wonky I10 wuss attack).

I'm wondering does the I 10 mandiblaster attack have the same str and AP value as their regular attacks?Edit:
Nvm I just read it's unmodified.

**MasterSlowPoke**

Mr Morden wrote:
Is the Iyanden Codex download only :( - thats rubbish

No, it's not.

**kronk**

Mr Morden wrote:
Is the Iyanden Codex download only :( - thats rubbish

It's only download on initial release. The physical book will come out in mid/late June.

**Quark**

BlueDagger wrote:

Incorrect. DIFFERENT blessing and maledictions are cumulative. You can't stack the same power.

http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/527208.page

This is not clear cut like you make it out to be.

**Farseer Faenyin**

From that forum discussion, I find it pretty clear that the same powers don't stack. It all comes down to the interpretation of the phrase 'different maledictions'.

**Mr Morden**

kronk wrote:
Mr Morden wrote:
Is the Iyanden Codex download only :( - thats rubbish

It's only download on initial release. The physical book will come out in mid/late June.

Excellent - thanks

**The Spiritseer**

Just got a call from home. My Package from GW arrived. In 2-2.5 hours or so (traffic) I'll have my mitts on the Codex.

Come on clock, hurry, I want to leave work and get home...

**BlueDagger**

Quark wrote:
BlueDagger wrote:

Incorrect. DIFFERENT blessing and maledictions are cumulative. You can't stack the same power.

http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/527208.page

This is not clear cut like you make it out to be.

That is the typical 40k "reading what I want to" mentality. What purpose would the line "Note that bonuses and penalties from different maledictions are always cumulative..." be if it meant that different castings of the same power stack. You can't cast 2 powers at once and you can't cast the same power twice, so it's only possible intention is to state that different maledictions will stack and same ones do not.

**Autarch Fiallathandirel**

All I will say is it takes quite a lot of lascannon shots to even get a chance to roll on the vehicle penetration chart when it comes to holofield wave serpents. Depending on if you flat out or not it will take 6 or 9 shots from a bs4 lasscannon to glance a wave serpent and something like 70 to pen it. Also when you are packing even 5 wraithguard with 5 s4 ap2 flamers in the back you're talking some serious damage. Move 6 inches, swivel, disembark 6 inches, and then use the template which is roughly 8 inches long..... will destroy most anything you point it at especially as they have the distort rule. That's a 22 inch circle around the wave serpent that is basically suicide to get in range of.

**Mkvenner**

Farseers can still take Jetbikes btw. So you can do an all bike Council with Farseer. Just hope your luck is good enough to get Fortune.

**shade1313**

Dakkafang Dreggrim wrote:

In the case of the Jetbike you all keep complaining about and aspect warriors. Why would people RE-BUY units they all ready have ?

I don't know, why do I have three generations of Banshee models? Or two of Scorpions (the buck toothed ones were just...no)? Why have I got every Farseer they've made since I got into the hobby, and buying the new one, too? Or two generations of Rangers?

**Absolutionis**

Mkvenner wrote:
Farseers can still take Jetbikes btw. So you can do an all bike Council with Farseer. Just hope your luck is good enough to get Fortune.

And if you don't get Fortune, your points investment crashes and burns on your opponent's shooting phase.

Cinematic!

**Autarch Fiallathandirel**

pizzaguardian wrote:

Dont follow the thread that hard i see?

Check the game summary page please, (pg 424 on brb - for the lıttle one ıt ıs rıght after psychıc dıscıplınes), it will show you why i am not running ahead of myself, in fact i rarely do any running at all.

Even then ''before the battle, immediately after determining warlord traits'' is at the same time as psychic powers as psychic powers are rolled immediately after warlord traits before the game starts. I will play it rules as written though and assign them before giving them psychic powers because even though psychic powers are rolled immediately after warlord traits in the game summary via the sequence given it doesn't explicitly say immediately (although by the sequence it is inferred as it is rolled immediately after), I'll wait until GW faq it as I'm sure they didn't intend for this and was just an oversight. I guess the randomness of the allocation will add a little bit of fun in making me work harder.

**Popenfresh**

Mkvenner wrote:
Farseers can still take Jetbikes btw. So you can do an all bike Council with Farseer. Just hope your luck is good enough to get Fortune.

Rerollable 2+ and 3++ save? Neato!

Damn now I have to choose between a 10 man strong jetlock council with farseer support or a 10 man foot footsquad rolling with Karandras.

Honestly, the seercouncil as a whole looks great to me. I don't understand all the Warlock hate, autopassing powers would make this unit horribly broken, even with random powers. Ld 8 make them slightly more balanced.

**BlueDagger**

Autarch Fiallathandirel wrote:
All I will say is it takes quite a lot of lascannon shots to even get a chance to roll on the vehicle penetration chart when it comes to holofield wave serpents. Depending on if you flat out or not it will take 6 or 9 shots from a bs4 lasscannon to glance a wave serpent and something like 70 to pen it.

Old Serpent field rules = 7 shots for 1 pen
Old Serpent field rules w/ full out = 9 shots for 1 pen

New Serpent field rules = 5 shots for 1 pen, downgraded to glance
New Serpent field rules w/ holos = 6 shots for 1 pen, downgraded to glance
New Serpent field rules w/ holos and full out = 9 shots for 1 pen, downgraded to glance

However it's made a rather mute point by...

S4 melee attacks needed for a glance on a Wave Serpent = 7
S6 melee attacks needed for a glance or better on a Wave Serpent = 3

If someone is sitting back and getting shot at by a Wave Serpent then they are doing it wrong lol.

**pizzaguardian**

i don't think it is an oversight, it could have just been written as " assaign them immediately after rolling for psychic powers".

Even if it will be faq'ed it will be faq'ed the way i say it, since there is even precedence for the exact wording conflict with force weapons and feel no pain.

**skarsol**

And GW *always* follows precedence.

**Magc8Ball**

One thing that is going to be a BIG hassle in Warlock units is keeping track of WHICH specific Warlock has WHICH power. While it's less of a big deal in casual play, when things turn serious it might be really important to know whether you're killing the Warlock with (strong) power... rather than the Warlock player just saying "oh, that's the one with (insert less useful power here)".

There is lots of ground there for Shenanigans if people don't pay attention to tricksy, sneaksy Eldar players.

**pizzaguardian**

It used to be the same with the old warlocks(different powers), it effectively changes nothing imo.

**skarsol**

Well with the old system you could pick the powers beforehand and so you could model them appropriately.

**Popenfresh**

Old seercouncils had 8 destructors and only one enchance and embolden lock though. So you only needed 2 distinct models, usually the ones with spears. New seercouncils will have around 5-6 different powers most of the time.

**Autarch Fiallathandirel**

BlueDagger wrote:

Old Serpent field rules = 7 shots for 1 pen
Old Serpent field rules w/ full out = 9 shots for 1 pen

New Serpent field rules = 5 shots for 1 pen, downgraded to glance
New Serpent field rules w/ holos = 6 shots for 1 pen, downgraded to glance
New Serpent field rules w/ holos and full out = 9 shots for 1 pen, downgraded to glance

However it's made a rather mute point by...

S4 melee attacks needed for a glance on a Wave Serpent = 7
S6 melee attacks needed for a glance or better on a Wave Serpent = 3

If someone is sitting back and getting shot at by a Wave Serpent then they are doing it wrong lol.

Exactly the chance of a pen is roughly 1.2% now when it used to be 11% with old wave serpent rules when flat out. Holo-fields and new 2+ ignore glance means you are not very likely to lose your 3HP wave serpent to a lascannons in a round of shooting, which allows the WS to do its job of transporting. An enemy would need 27 BS4 lascannons shots a turn to even glance 1 WS to death or 18 if it didn't flat out. For comparison a LR would be taken out in roughly 18 as well (going by loss of hullpoints) so that is pretty good if you ask me. LR AV 14 (3 to hit, 5 or 6 to strip a HP) and if you account for the fact a lucky pen could destroy said LR then the WS looks even better.

**Magc8Ball**

pizzaguardian wrote:It used to be the same with the old warlocks(different powers), it effectively changes nothing imo.

skarsol wrote:Well with the old system you could pick the powers beforehand and so you could model them appropriately.

Popenfresh wrote:Old seercouncils had 8 destructors and only one enchance and embolden lock though. So you only needed 2 distinct models, usually the ones with spears. New seercouncils will have around 5-6 different powers most of the time.

Yeah, things are FAR more complex now given the rando... cinematic nature of the Warlocks' powers. It's also highly likely you'll have a couple powers you don't particularly care about, so the impetus is there to always remove them first as casualties...

It's just something to think about when you're playing with or against units with more than a couple of Warlocks.

**Crimson**

Am I correct in assuming that Illic has nothing that could stop the enemy using 'look out sir' to avoid his shots?

**MRPYM**

skarsol wrote:
The Scorpion's Claw not being Unwieldy or Specialist is... kinda nice. Karandras is 5 WS7 S8 I7 AP2 attacks, SS Exarch is 3 S6 I6 AP2 attacks (plus their wonky I10 wuss attack).

Its dandy but I just saw how much it costs for a scorpion claw upgrade and the points are big.