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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2012/10/26 05:45:18
Subject: God-hood
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Paramount Plague Censer Bearer
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I'm gone for literally 12 hours and there's a thesis paper on Imperial religion as a response to my response... ugh.. I'm not even sure if I want to read all of this lmao.
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This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2012/10/26 05:45:31
Meet Arkova.
or discover the game you always wanted to:
RoTC. |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2012/10/26 05:46:58
Subject: God-hood
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Decrepit Dakkanaut
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As far as I am concerned, the Emperor is (and perhaps was) the Chaos God of Oppression.
Glory to the Emperor!
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2012/10/26 05:54:32
Subject: God-hood
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Ancient Venerable Dreadnought
Thousand Sons Battleship wandering the galaxy...
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Void__Dragon wrote:
Magnus hates the Imperium now, he didn't then. And was the only one not blind to Horus's treachery, hence trying to save Horus himself and then warning the Emperor of Horus's treachery.
A Thousand Sons puts a twist on this - Magnus may hate the Imperium now, but only because its no longer the Imperium he and his father built. His comments during Battle of the Fang also seem to support this. Magnus never hated his father, and never will. But he will never forgive the Imperium for throwing away his father's dreams and ideals. And this may be another reason Dorn went emo after the Siege of Terra (especially after the events of the The Last Remembrancer) - his honor wouldn't let him hate the Imperium for what it was becoming (a complete perversion of what he, and his father and brothers built, not to mention giving victory in all but name to Horus and his cohorts).
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I should have left him there. He had served his purpose. He owed me nothing - yet he gave himself to me willingly. Why? I know not. He is nothing more than a pathetic human. An inferior race. A mon-keigh. But still I broke off my wings so that I might carry him easier. I took him from that place, into the snowstorm where our tracks will not be found. He is heavy. And he is dying. And he is slowing me down. But I will save him. Why? I know not. He is still warm. I can feel his blood ebbing across me. For every beat of his heart, another, slight spill of heat. The heat blows away on the winter wind. His blood is still warm. But fading. And I have spilled scarlet myself. The snow laps greedily at our footsteps and our lifeblood, covering them without a trace as we fade away.
'She sat on the corner, gulping the soup down, uncaring of the heat of it. They had grown more watery as of late she noted, but she wasn't about to beggar food from the Imperials or the "Bearers of the Word." Tau, despite their faults at least didn't have a kill policy for her race.' |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2012/10/26 06:04:14
Subject: God-hood
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Banelord Titan Princeps of Khorne
Noctis Labyrinthus
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I'm a lazy assrammer and haven't actually read Battle of the Fang yet, lol.
That sounds neat though. Based on what little I've read about Magnus in the current timeline, he doesn't seem happy with his lot in like (Unlike, say, Angron, who seems to be having the time of his life).
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2012/10/26 06:15:41
Subject: God-hood
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Paramount Plague Censer Bearer
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Lynata wrote:This is an interesting exchange, by the way. Our interpretations seem to be quite different on a number of sub-topics, but it's a fun exchange.  Lynata, I don't have time to do a full exchange atm, but I do have to agree with you, it's fun seeing a contrasting view that is well supported, but because it's GW and cannot be "proven" like science, allows us to both be right, and both be wrong. For example, Lynata wrote:"If an Eldar's spirit is not captured by his waystone it is sucked into the nightmarish depths of the Warp. To a Human, such a fate means nothing, for virtually no Human mind is strong enough to retain a sense of consciousness after death - the psychic energy of the Human mind being paltry compared to that of an Eldar." - 4E Codex: Eldar, p14 Spirit Stones Sure, but it doesn't tell us where human souls go when they die. Do they disintegrate and simply feed the warp? Are they drawn to a certain section? Does the hypothetical God-Emperor claim their essence as Slaanesh claims an unbound Eldar? If enough human souls are sent into the warp, does a human orientated avatar in the form of a Living Saint then appear as en echo to their emotional turmoil- regardless of prayer? If so, then is this simply an exaggeration of how much stronger an Eldar is than a human in a piece of propaganda meant to instill loyalty to the xenos- and therefore mislead how powerful human's and their emotions actually are? Lynata wrote:"The destruction of a Daemon's physical form will banish it from realspace, but will not end its existence. The malefic presence will gradually reform again in the Warp, nursing its hatred and its grudge for long decades or even centuries. If such an entity gets a chance, it will return, its hatred further stoked with a horrible vengeance in mind." - 6E 40k Rulebook That does not explain why the demon, who uniquely inhabits a dead body, returns in that dead body even after the corpse is utterly destroyed - when all other demons may rejuvenate dead flesh, but cannot truly resurrect the dead - and certainly cannot do what Living Saints can - I.e. retain the memories and passions of those vessels they seem to make truly indestructible. What then sets them apart from the other demons - such as a Bloodthirster, who takes the same form no matter what vessel it tears it's way through into realspace? Would it be the power of the God-Emperor, or something else? If it was not the God Emperor, why would other demons seemingly be incapable of this deceitful use of a corpse, especially Tzeentch? Lynata wrote: ENOZONE wrote:If emotion from living beings, not just psykers, creates things that inhabit the warp, then can emotions directed by religion create a Deity, or even a pantheon of Deities, such as the God-Emperor and his most adored martyrs? The emotion itself, yes, I would say. Religion will ultimately be unable to directly influence whatever the emotions conjured by worship create, but it can be used to steer things into a certain direction, if you get my drift. Just like the many Pleasure Cults among the Eldar eventually resulted in the birth of Slaanesh. Ok, but that doesn't explain why certain demons seem to be able to target individuals of the IoM for a cause that is meant to destroy what lies within the warp - refer to the problem above - why would a demon, be banished back into the warp, and retain the memories of it's dead host, only to return and in the embodiment of the host and continue to fight as the host would, especially if the host's soul merely disintegrates when it strikes the warp? Now do you see the discrepancy between the how religion and thought doesn't affect the warp as much as emotion does? On one hand, either the Eldar codex is exaggerating the Eldar vs Human souls in the warp - making a human's soul not only a lot more powerful and influential, but also the indoctrination of human religion brought into the warp with the banishment of a human vessel makes religion suddenly EXTREMELY important to the warp because suddenly thoughts and ideas truly matter as much as emotion with an "enlightened" demon running around. On the other, if the soul of a Living Saint's vessel is obliterated as it enters the warp, how then does a Living Saint retain the memory of it's host when neither its body, nor its spirit remain if thought's do not influence that particular demon and by extension, the warp?
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This message was edited 9 times. Last update was at 2012/10/26 06:32:30
Meet Arkova.
or discover the game you always wanted to:
RoTC. |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2012/10/26 06:33:56
Subject: God-hood
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Hallowed Canoness
Ireland
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ENOZONE wrote:but because it's GW and cannot be "proven" like science, allows us to both be right, and both be wrong.
Like every so often, a matter of interpretations. As the maker intended, I'd say.
ENOZONE wrote:Sure, but it doesn't tell us where human souls go when they die.
Ugh ... I would actually expect this is said somewhere, one would just have to look it up and find the reference. I'd say they are gobbled up (i.e. claimed/absorbed) by the beings of the Warp, but don't ask me for a quote on this now.
In a twisted way, this could actually mean that human souls do end up at the Emperor's side after death - just not exactly the way the Ecclesiarchy suggests.
ENOZONE wrote:That does not explain why the demon, who uniquely inhabits a dead body, returns in that dead body even after the corpse is utterly destroyed - when all other demons may rejuvenate dead flesh, but cannot truly resurrect the dead - and certainly cannot do what Living Saints can - I.e. retain the memories and passions of those vessels they seem to make truly indestructible.
Oh, I would assume that the Living Saint does not actually return to a dead body (after all, it may have been disintegrated completely, plus it is bound to a specific location in realspace), but rather that it recreates its form from scratch. Like ... a copy, you know? As for the memories, I do think daemonic possession includes a mindmeld of sorts, and the passion is there anyways as it was this which conjured the spirit in the first place.
ENOZONE wrote:If it was not the God Emperor, why would other demons seemingly be incapable of this deceitful use of a corpse, especially Tzeentch?
Actually, I would assume they are not incapable of doing so. It's just that their own power always twists and warps the host in a way befitting the respective Chaos God. The most prominent example would be Horus suddenly growing fanged teeth and getting all glowy red eyes, and so on. Each daemon's form resembles the linked Chaos power, and if a daemon possesses someone, their form changes as well. Isn't this what happened in a few stories? I also recall the Nurgle Zombie Plague now. Check out this story for how Chaos can raise the dead.
ENOZONE wrote:Ok, but that doesn't explain why certain demons seem to be able to target individuals of the IoM for a cause that is meant to destroy what lies within the warp.
Hmm, what are you referring to, exactly?
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2012/10/26 07:09:15
Subject: God-hood
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Willing Inquisitorial Excruciator
Croatia
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Void__Dragon wrote: DarthMarko wrote:1. clumsy red zit (pushed by Tzeench) destroyed webway portal and fethed imperuim for life (Russ was with the Emp when that happened based on old codex astartes - @pilau correct me if im wrong)
In the old Index Astartes articles and IIRC in Collected Visions Russ was there, HH doesn't tell us either way. Tome of Fate, a Black Crusade supplement (Or it might have been First Founding, a Deathwatch supplement) also says Russ was there.
Magnus destroyed the Webway portal that he didn't know existed. One would think that the Emperor would tell the guy who was supposed to sit on it.
2. clumsy red zit had a choice to die or to sell his arse - he sold it (Russ and every loyal primarch would rather die)
Magnus chose to save his Legion, not himself. He had no intention of leaving Prospero alive. Tzeentch had other plans.
3. Russ sobs "Oooooo Father why did you give me that order" in Prospero burns so do the math,Horus just pushed him further
No he doesn't, never does he explicitly state that the Emperor gave him the order, and Horus outright confirms that it was he who gave the order in Galaxy in Flames, and indirectly the Daemon in Prospero Burns says the same (While acting as Horus).
4. Magnus ADMITED that he put spies into SW (just it wasn't Hawser, EPIC fail for the Wolves ) and also was a pervert because he did study Russ from his tower
Prove that Magnus put spies into the SW.
5. Magnus hates Imperium and he is utterly stupid or blind by Horus treachery OR simply just a traitor
Magnus hates the Imperium now, he didn't then. And was the only one not blind to Horus's treachery, hence trying to save Horus himself and then warning the Emperor of Horus's treachery.
You should probably read the fluff first, before you comment on it. Also, you're sad and pathetic.
This is about spies
And saving his legion was fething crap - o yeah he waited while 9/10 legion gets stomped and then he acts (and loses)
and btw read the damn books for Pete sake, he cared more for the knowlege in his libraries then his sons
thats why 4th fellowship had a good opinion on him
P.S. you are pathetic and always bitching about Magnus but you are teen I' get it you have issues
now go squeeze your pimples or start reading before you turn another thread into "Magnus was martyr"...
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This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2012/10/26 07:38:49
ADB: I showed the Wolves revealing the key weakness at the heart of the World Eaters; showing Angron that his Legion was broken and worthless compared to the others; that he was the one primarch who couldn't trust his own warriors, and that they didn't care if he lived or died; showing that loyalty to brothers and sons is the heart of success for the Legiones Astartes, to the point even Lorgar makes a big deal out of saying the World Eaters and their primarch were massively outclassed by Russ, and Angron was too stupid to see the lesson Russ had sacrificed time, sweat, and blood, to teach. We're talking about a battle the Wolves won, by isolating the enemy general through pack tactics, and threatening to kill him, without a hope of defending himself. It was a balance, 50/50 - Angron overpowered Russ, and the Wolves were losing ground to the World Eaters; but Russ and his warriors had Angron by the balls, and barely broke a sweat. They won, no question. Lorgar even says: "The Wolves won, meathead."
Dorn won’t help you either. He’s too busy being the Emperor’s groundskeeper, hiding behind the palace walls. The Wolf is too busy cutting off heads as our father’s executioner, while the Lion holds on to his secrets, and has no special fondness for you. Who else will come? Not Ferrus, certainly. Nor Corax either. Even as we speak, I suspect he flees for Deliverance. Sanguinius?’ Curze laughed cruelly. ‘The angel is more cursed than I. The Khan? He does not wish to be found. So who is left? No one, Vulkan. None of them will come. You are simply not that important. You are alone.’ Konrad Curze to Vulkan
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2012/10/26 07:34:47
Subject: God-hood
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Banelord Titan Princeps of Khorne
Noctis Labyrinthus
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He is talking about actual Space Wolves, like Wyrdmake. Not fiddling with the mind of a mortal and then sending him to the Space Wolves.
It's ironic you use him as an example, since Leman Russ explicitly used Wyrdmake to spy on and then testify against the Thousand Sons. At best, they are equally treacherous towards eachother.
He intended to die, this is what the text states, and Magnus and Ahriman's minds linked when Magnus finished the spell to send away his Legion.
"This is my gift to you."
You have no leg to stand on short of bias. Magnus intended to sacrifice himself and his legion, as stated by him and made clear by his actions (Telepathically blocking his sons from being alerted by the Space Wolf ships appearing in realspace or divinating their approach, etc).
He was horrified by the brutality of the Space Wolves, and decided to save his sons at the cost of his soul. Don't get me wrong, it was foolish of him to not act sooner (Unlike you I can admit the faults of my favorite characters and armies), and Magnus deserved his fate. His sons didn't.
He cared everything for his sons. That's why, despite how arrogant he was of his power, he shamefully accepted the aid of forces he did not understand to save them from the Flesh Change.
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2012/10/26 07:41:34
Subject: God-hood
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Ancient Venerable Dreadnought
Thousand Sons Battleship wandering the galaxy...
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Ironically enough, the most dangerous pairing of Primarchs and legions, everything else aside, would have been Magnus and Russ, and the Thousand Sons and Space Wolves. Nothing would have stopped them.
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I should have left him there. He had served his purpose. He owed me nothing - yet he gave himself to me willingly. Why? I know not. He is nothing more than a pathetic human. An inferior race. A mon-keigh. But still I broke off my wings so that I might carry him easier. I took him from that place, into the snowstorm where our tracks will not be found. He is heavy. And he is dying. And he is slowing me down. But I will save him. Why? I know not. He is still warm. I can feel his blood ebbing across me. For every beat of his heart, another, slight spill of heat. The heat blows away on the winter wind. His blood is still warm. But fading. And I have spilled scarlet myself. The snow laps greedily at our footsteps and our lifeblood, covering them without a trace as we fade away.
'She sat on the corner, gulping the soup down, uncaring of the heat of it. They had grown more watery as of late she noted, but she wasn't about to beggar food from the Imperials or the "Bearers of the Word." Tau, despite their faults at least didn't have a kill policy for her race.' |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2012/10/26 07:47:44
Subject: God-hood
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Wight Lord with the Sword of Kings
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Thousands Sons having spies in Space Wolves?
It's an Alpha Legion trap!
Magnus is Omegon!
Omegon is Alpharius!
Herzog is Herzog!
Run!
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2012/10/26 07:49:05
Subject: God-hood
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Willing Inquisitorial Excruciator
Croatia
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Void__Dragon wrote:He is talking about actual Space Wolves, like Wyrdmake. Not fiddling with the mind of a mortal and then sending him to the Space Wolves.
It's ironic you use him as an example, since Leman Russ explicitly used Wyrdmake to spy on and then testify against the Thousand Sons. At best, they are equally treacherous towards eachother.
He intended to die, this is what the text states, and Magnus and Ahriman's minds linked when Magnus finished the spell to send away his Legion.
"This is my gift to you."
You have no leg to stand on short of bias. Magnus intended to sacrifice himself and his legion, as stated by him and made clear by his actions (Telepathically blocking his sons from being alerted by the Space Wolf ships appearing in realspace or divinating their approach, etc).
He was horrified by the brutality of the Space Wolves, and decided to save his sons at the cost of his soul. Don't get me wrong, it was foolish of him to not act sooner (Unlike you I can admit the faults of my favorite characters and armies), and Magnus deserved his fate. His sons didn't.
He cared everything for his sons. That's why, despite how arrogant he was of his power, he shamefully accepted the aid of forces he did not understand to save them from the Flesh Change.
You know that for a fact? Based on what ? Your "impartial" opinion  ?
Even if it was so (and it's BIG NOT) you dont consider probing trough warp as spying ??? ****Slow clap*****
I sometimes feel sorry for you...your unlimited hate towards the SW is really sad...
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ADB: I showed the Wolves revealing the key weakness at the heart of the World Eaters; showing Angron that his Legion was broken and worthless compared to the others; that he was the one primarch who couldn't trust his own warriors, and that they didn't care if he lived or died; showing that loyalty to brothers and sons is the heart of success for the Legiones Astartes, to the point even Lorgar makes a big deal out of saying the World Eaters and their primarch were massively outclassed by Russ, and Angron was too stupid to see the lesson Russ had sacrificed time, sweat, and blood, to teach. We're talking about a battle the Wolves won, by isolating the enemy general through pack tactics, and threatening to kill him, without a hope of defending himself. It was a balance, 50/50 - Angron overpowered Russ, and the Wolves were losing ground to the World Eaters; but Russ and his warriors had Angron by the balls, and barely broke a sweat. They won, no question. Lorgar even says: "The Wolves won, meathead."
Dorn won’t help you either. He’s too busy being the Emperor’s groundskeeper, hiding behind the palace walls. The Wolf is too busy cutting off heads as our father’s executioner, while the Lion holds on to his secrets, and has no special fondness for you. Who else will come? Not Ferrus, certainly. Nor Corax either. Even as we speak, I suspect he flees for Deliverance. Sanguinius?’ Curze laughed cruelly. ‘The angel is more cursed than I. The Khan? He does not wish to be found. So who is left? No one, Vulkan. None of them will come. You are simply not that important. You are alone.’ Konrad Curze to Vulkan
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2012/10/26 07:52:12
Subject: God-hood
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Wight Lord with the Sword of Kings
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Let's face it, the SW are barbarians. 'Ohh, it's a Library full of knowledge and with a capital L, let's destroy it!'
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2012/10/26 07:56:31
Subject: God-hood
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Willing Inquisitorial Excruciator
Croatia
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thenoobbomb wrote:Let's face it, the SW are barbarians. 'Ohh, it's a Library full of knowledge and with a capital L, let's destroy it!'
Yeap , burn it...especially if it has codex insignia on it...:-)
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ADB: I showed the Wolves revealing the key weakness at the heart of the World Eaters; showing Angron that his Legion was broken and worthless compared to the others; that he was the one primarch who couldn't trust his own warriors, and that they didn't care if he lived or died; showing that loyalty to brothers and sons is the heart of success for the Legiones Astartes, to the point even Lorgar makes a big deal out of saying the World Eaters and their primarch were massively outclassed by Russ, and Angron was too stupid to see the lesson Russ had sacrificed time, sweat, and blood, to teach. We're talking about a battle the Wolves won, by isolating the enemy general through pack tactics, and threatening to kill him, without a hope of defending himself. It was a balance, 50/50 - Angron overpowered Russ, and the Wolves were losing ground to the World Eaters; but Russ and his warriors had Angron by the balls, and barely broke a sweat. They won, no question. Lorgar even says: "The Wolves won, meathead."
Dorn won’t help you either. He’s too busy being the Emperor’s groundskeeper, hiding behind the palace walls. The Wolf is too busy cutting off heads as our father’s executioner, while the Lion holds on to his secrets, and has no special fondness for you. Who else will come? Not Ferrus, certainly. Nor Corax either. Even as we speak, I suspect he flees for Deliverance. Sanguinius?’ Curze laughed cruelly. ‘The angel is more cursed than I. The Khan? He does not wish to be found. So who is left? No one, Vulkan. None of them will come. You are simply not that important. You are alone.’ Konrad Curze to Vulkan
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2012/10/26 07:57:39
Subject: God-hood
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Wight Lord with the Sword of Kings
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DarthMarko wrote: thenoobbomb wrote:Let's face it, the SW are barbarians. 'Ohh, it's a Library full of knowledge and with a capital L, let's destroy it!'
Yeap , burn it...especially if it has codex insignia on it...:-)
Ofcourse it's knowledge. Pass me another beer mate
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2012/10/26 07:58:30
Subject: God-hood
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Ancient Venerable Dreadnought
Thousand Sons Battleship wandering the galaxy...
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DarthMarko wrote:
Even if it was so (and it's BIG NOT) you dont consider probing trough warp as spying ??? ****Slow clap*****
I sometimes feel sorry for you...your unlimited hate towards the SW is really sad...
Technically, the Space Wolves' continued use of Rune Priests after the Edicts of Nikaea were passed make them as guilty as the Thousand Sons...I also hate the Space Wolves for their actions on Prospero. Their opposition to the Inquisition's frak-headed approach on things goes some way to make up for it, but not completely.
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I should have left him there. He had served his purpose. He owed me nothing - yet he gave himself to me willingly. Why? I know not. He is nothing more than a pathetic human. An inferior race. A mon-keigh. But still I broke off my wings so that I might carry him easier. I took him from that place, into the snowstorm where our tracks will not be found. He is heavy. And he is dying. And he is slowing me down. But I will save him. Why? I know not. He is still warm. I can feel his blood ebbing across me. For every beat of his heart, another, slight spill of heat. The heat blows away on the winter wind. His blood is still warm. But fading. And I have spilled scarlet myself. The snow laps greedily at our footsteps and our lifeblood, covering them without a trace as we fade away.
'She sat on the corner, gulping the soup down, uncaring of the heat of it. They had grown more watery as of late she noted, but she wasn't about to beggar food from the Imperials or the "Bearers of the Word." Tau, despite their faults at least didn't have a kill policy for her race.' |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2012/10/26 07:59:04
Subject: God-hood
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Banelord Titan Princeps of Khorne
Noctis Labyrinthus
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DarthMarko wrote:You know that for a fact? Based on what ? Your "impartial" opinion  ?
Even if it was so (and it's BIG NOT) you dont consider probing trough warp as spying ??? ****Slow clap*****
I sometimes feel sorry for you...your unlimited hate towards the SW is really sad...
Based on the fluff. I comprehend it better than you do.
Leman Russ used Wyrdmake to spy on the Thousand Sons via his bond with Ahriman. This is a fact.
Magnus went into battle with no intention of leaving alive and sought only to save his sons. This is a fact.
Magnus the Red is far more attractive and the ladies want his big angry cyclops for themselves. This is a fact.
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2012/10/26 08:00:52
Subject: God-hood
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Willing Inquisitorial Excruciator
Croatia
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Tadashi wrote: DarthMarko wrote:
Even if it was so (and it's BIG NOT) you dont consider probing trough warp as spying ??? ****Slow clap*****
I sometimes feel sorry for you...your unlimited hate towards the SW is really sad...
Technically, the Space Wolves' continued use of Rune Priests after the Edicts of Nikaea were passed make them as guilty as the Thousand Sons...I also hate the Space Wolves for their actions on Prospero. Their opposition to the Inquisition's frak-headed approach on things goes some way to make up for it, but not completely.
Now tell me, how the hell did the use of rune priests get by Custoidians and SoS....?
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ADB: I showed the Wolves revealing the key weakness at the heart of the World Eaters; showing Angron that his Legion was broken and worthless compared to the others; that he was the one primarch who couldn't trust his own warriors, and that they didn't care if he lived or died; showing that loyalty to brothers and sons is the heart of success for the Legiones Astartes, to the point even Lorgar makes a big deal out of saying the World Eaters and their primarch were massively outclassed by Russ, and Angron was too stupid to see the lesson Russ had sacrificed time, sweat, and blood, to teach. We're talking about a battle the Wolves won, by isolating the enemy general through pack tactics, and threatening to kill him, without a hope of defending himself. It was a balance, 50/50 - Angron overpowered Russ, and the Wolves were losing ground to the World Eaters; but Russ and his warriors had Angron by the balls, and barely broke a sweat. They won, no question. Lorgar even says: "The Wolves won, meathead."
Dorn won’t help you either. He’s too busy being the Emperor’s groundskeeper, hiding behind the palace walls. The Wolf is too busy cutting off heads as our father’s executioner, while the Lion holds on to his secrets, and has no special fondness for you. Who else will come? Not Ferrus, certainly. Nor Corax either. Even as we speak, I suspect he flees for Deliverance. Sanguinius?’ Curze laughed cruelly. ‘The angel is more cursed than I. The Khan? He does not wish to be found. So who is left? No one, Vulkan. None of them will come. You are simply not that important. You are alone.’ Konrad Curze to Vulkan
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2012/10/26 08:01:36
Subject: God-hood
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Ancient Venerable Dreadnought
Thousand Sons Battleship wandering the galaxy...
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Void__Dragon wrote:
Magnus went into battle with no intention of leaving alive and sought only to save his sons. This is a fact.
Of all the Primarchs, none cared as much for his gene-sons as Magnus did, and that makes him all the more tragic.
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I should have left him there. He had served his purpose. He owed me nothing - yet he gave himself to me willingly. Why? I know not. He is nothing more than a pathetic human. An inferior race. A mon-keigh. But still I broke off my wings so that I might carry him easier. I took him from that place, into the snowstorm where our tracks will not be found. He is heavy. And he is dying. And he is slowing me down. But I will save him. Why? I know not. He is still warm. I can feel his blood ebbing across me. For every beat of his heart, another, slight spill of heat. The heat blows away on the winter wind. His blood is still warm. But fading. And I have spilled scarlet myself. The snow laps greedily at our footsteps and our lifeblood, covering them without a trace as we fade away.
'She sat on the corner, gulping the soup down, uncaring of the heat of it. They had grown more watery as of late she noted, but she wasn't about to beggar food from the Imperials or the "Bearers of the Word." Tau, despite their faults at least didn't have a kill policy for her race.' |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2012/10/26 08:03:31
Subject: God-hood
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Banelord Titan Princeps of Khorne
Noctis Labyrinthus
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Eh, I don't know if I would go quite that far, if only because I don't think a definite answer on that sort of thing could be found.
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2012/10/26 08:12:48
Subject: God-hood
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Willing Inquisitorial Excruciator
Croatia
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Tadashi wrote: Void__Dragon wrote:
Magnus went into battle with no intention of leaving alive and sought only to save his sons. This is a fact.
Of all the Primarchs, none cared as much for his gene-sons as Magnus did, and that makes him all the more tragic.
That is why he allowed them to die,oooo wait 1000 he did save, waaaait did he?
"Thousand sons" is a story about loyal legion and a primarch with giant hubris and questionable will who dragged them down....
even 1ksons fans tend to agree with this...
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This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2012/10/26 08:29:08
ADB: I showed the Wolves revealing the key weakness at the heart of the World Eaters; showing Angron that his Legion was broken and worthless compared to the others; that he was the one primarch who couldn't trust his own warriors, and that they didn't care if he lived or died; showing that loyalty to brothers and sons is the heart of success for the Legiones Astartes, to the point even Lorgar makes a big deal out of saying the World Eaters and their primarch were massively outclassed by Russ, and Angron was too stupid to see the lesson Russ had sacrificed time, sweat, and blood, to teach. We're talking about a battle the Wolves won, by isolating the enemy general through pack tactics, and threatening to kill him, without a hope of defending himself. It was a balance, 50/50 - Angron overpowered Russ, and the Wolves were losing ground to the World Eaters; but Russ and his warriors had Angron by the balls, and barely broke a sweat. They won, no question. Lorgar even says: "The Wolves won, meathead."
Dorn won’t help you either. He’s too busy being the Emperor’s groundskeeper, hiding behind the palace walls. The Wolf is too busy cutting off heads as our father’s executioner, while the Lion holds on to his secrets, and has no special fondness for you. Who else will come? Not Ferrus, certainly. Nor Corax either. Even as we speak, I suspect he flees for Deliverance. Sanguinius?’ Curze laughed cruelly. ‘The angel is more cursed than I. The Khan? He does not wish to be found. So who is left? No one, Vulkan. None of them will come. You are simply not that important. You are alone.’ Konrad Curze to Vulkan
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2012/10/26 08:51:56
Subject: God-hood
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Longtime Dakkanaut
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DarthMarko wrote: Tadashi wrote: Void__Dragon wrote:
Magnus went into battle with no intention of leaving alive and sought only to save his sons. This is a fact.
Of all the Primarchs, none cared as much for his gene-sons as Magnus did, and that makes him all the more tragic.
That is why he allowed them to die,oooo wait 1000 he did save, waaaait did he?
"Thousand sons" is a story about loyal legion and a primarch with giant hubris and questionable will who dragged them down....
even 1ksons fans tend to agree with this...
No no, it is the story of a poor marty primarch and his poor martyr sons who secretly long for nothing but being allowed to serve the Carriongod once again.
Oh wait, that was the Alpha Legion...or the Word Bearers, no, certainly the Nightlords? These days I sometimes get confused :(
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2012/10/26 09:51:29
Subject: God-hood
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Alluring Sorcerer of Slaanesh
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Lynata wrote:
Pilau Rice wrote:I don't see how he would return to Great Crusade release Emperor, if his body dies, then he will have to start afresh if he doesn't become a god. Would he be able to reincarnate himself like the Shamans were able to, I'm not so sure. He would either become a God in the warp or like any other mortal, fade away.
Well, I think it's obvious that he is special. What that means in detail, however, is anyone's guess...
"The Golden Throne works", one said, his voice aged and cracked. "The Emperor's life can be sustained indefinitely."
"His soul lives on?", another inquired, his long, sharp nose protruding from under the lip of his hood. "It is not an empty husk?"
"It is not", the first confirmed. "The Emperor has ascended to the next plane, but the link 'twixt body and spirit remains strong."
"Then it can be brought back", suggested the third, a young woman whose flowing white hair spilled from her hood and down to her waist. "The Emperor need not suffer this hideous eternal life in death."
"We cannot rish such a thing!", the first voice hissed. "What if the spiritual link were severed? What if the person brought back was not the man we once knew? Changed? News of the Emperor's ... ascension is already widespread. He is being revered as a god already on a hundred worlds. In this time of rebuilding, we need a symbol. The Emperor has shown us the way."
(from GW's Inquisitor RPG)
Ah yes, but do they know this for sure? I guess we do, as there are sources likes Codex: Chaos Daemons that say as much. But they are worried themselves that should he be bought back he might be changed. Perhaps he gets bought back as a Mortal with no memory of his life. If the Golden Throne was shut down would he recover enough for his soul to return, the whole reason he was incarcerated was because he was near death. All unanswerable I know, but we can hypothesize.
Lynata wrote:Pilau Rice wrote:So does worship count as an action or is an action regarded as slaying someone and then the worship is to get the respective Gods attention?
Personally, I think the act of worship as well as the thoughts connected to it are just a "vessel" to carry the emotion that is the true source of power. And the God's attention is called forth by creating a large enough source?
Not sure I follow you, sorry Lynata. The way I see it for Khorne as an example is - Beserker takes skull > action > feeds Khorne / Beserker offers to Khorne > worship > gets Khornes attention.
Khorne doesn't necessarily care that you have taken a skull, what's another skull when you have a whole deck chair made out of them, it's when the Beserker says 'it's for for Khorne' that makes him Squee.
Lynata wrote:Pilau Rice wrote:Do we know if she was tortured or if she let Slaanesh whisper to her? I've not been able to find any source that tells us how she actually fell, just that she did.
Hmm. I've checked her story again, and indeed it does not tell us details. That's what I get for just believing something fans enter into a wiki, I suppose - and here I thought I was cured of that.
Where are you, Miriael? Karamanz wondered. That wasn’t the real question. The real question was what did they do to you?
What did the vile powers of Chaos manage to do to you when they held you in their clutches? Verdicon. That’s where it happened. Miriael Sabathiel, sister superior, had been reported as missing in action during the vicious fighting against the unholy Emperor’s Children.
And then this. Back from the dead. Back, but changed. Changed in ways no other sister of battle had ever been changed.
Second only to the mighty Astartes, the sisters of battle were the most perfect fighting mechanisms of the Imperium of Man. Unlike the Astartes, none of them had ever fallen to corruption. What a trophy for Chaos. What a twisted champion.
Now, of course one could say the story kinda implies it, given that we're talking about the Emperor's Children and a Sister's purity here, but ... yeah, interpretations.
I'm sorry, I thought it was more solid. :I
Oh yeah, I see where you are coming from, but this is the thoughts from a Canoness who cannot fathom a Sister ever falling to Chaos, [SARCASM ENGAGED] surely the only way a sister to turn from the light of the Emperor would be by some dark act, never willingly, oh no, Emperor forbid  That's how I believe it happened anyway, it's certainly more delicious to bring one to the Dark Prince by more subtle means rather than force them into submission, especially one so blinded by the bile preached by the Ecclessiarchy. Slaanesh didn't win Fulgrim by beating him with a dong, he waved it in his face a bit and he went over willingly, after some petty daemon tried to have his flesh, but that's neither here nor there.
ENOZONE wrote:
Sure, but it doesn't tell us where human souls go when they die. Do they disintegrate and simply feed the warp? Are they drawn to a certain section? Does the hypothetical God-Emperor claim their essence as Slaanesh claims an unbound Eldar? If enough human souls are sent into the warp, does a human orientated avatar in the form of a Living Saint then appear as en echo to their emotional turmoil- regardless of prayer? If so, then is this simply an exaggeration of how much stronger an Eldar is than a human in a piece of propaganda meant to instill loyalty to the xenos- and therefore mislead how powerful human's and their emotions actually are?
Codex: Chaos Space Marines 4e
When followers of Chaos die, their souls do not fade and disappear like the spirits of others ...
So from this, if you do not worship a Chaos power, your soul fades and disappears, I guess it's also backed up by
RoC: LatD p174
The warp is an alternative universe composed entirely of psychic energy generated by the thoughts, emotions and intellectual activity of living beings.
So you have to be alive to have a signature in the warp, if you aren't alive then you fade away or get eaten by a warp predator.
ENOZONE wrote:That does not explain why the demon, who uniquely inhabits a dead body, returns in that dead body even after the corpse is utterly destroyed - when all other demons may rejuvenate dead flesh, but cannot truly resurrect the dead - and certainly cannot do what Living Saints can - I.e. retain the memories and passions of those vessels they seem to make truly indestructible. What then sets them apart from the other demons - such as a Bloodthirster, who takes the same form no matter what vessel it tears it's way through into realspace? Would it be the power of the God-Emperor, or something else? If it was not the God Emperor, why would other demons seemingly be incapable of this deceitful use of a corpse, especially Tzeentch?
Once the host vessel is destroyed I don't believe they can reinhabit the same body. It would have to find another meat puppet to possess, unless it's a Daemon prince that retains its mortal form.
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2012/10/26 15:50:27
Subject: God-hood
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Mutated Chosen Chaos Marine
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KingDeath wrote: DarthMarko wrote: Tadashi wrote: Void__Dragon wrote:
Magnus went into battle with no intention of leaving alive and sought only to save his sons. This is a fact.
Of all the Primarchs, none cared as much for his gene-sons as Magnus did, and that makes him all the more tragic.
That is why he allowed them to die,oooo wait 1000 he did save, waaaait did he?
"Thousand sons" is a story about loyal legion and a primarch with giant hubris and questionable will who dragged them down....
even 1ksons fans tend to agree with this...
No no, it is the story of a poor marty primarch and his poor martyr sons who secretly long for nothing but being allowed to serve the Carriongod once again.
Oh wait, that was the Alpha Legion...or the Word Bearers, no, certainly the Nightlords? These days I sometimes get confused :(
The Alpha Legion believe they still are serving the Emperor, since his primary wish was the destruction of Chaos as far as Alpharius was concerned.
The Word Bearers hate the Emperor and the Imperium now, and have found gods who actually want to be worshipped.
The Night Lords are pretty splintered AFAIK, but Kurze saw the state of the Imperium as justification for his prior actions.
@DeathMarko: Maybe Magnus was unwilling to fight the Space Wolves because he actually thought it was wrong to fight his brother, something Russ clearly had no problem with. The Thousand Sons fell because the Emperor refused to give any guidance to the primarchs about Chaos, despite making Magnus a psyker almost as powerful as the Emperor himself.
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Arguing with some people is like playing chess with a pigeon. You can play the best chess in the world, but at the end of the day the pigeon will still knock all the pieces off the board and then gak all over it. |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2012/10/26 16:11:26
Subject: God-hood
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Hallowed Canoness
Ireland
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Pilau Rice wrote:Not sure I follow you, sorry Lynata. The way I see it for Khorne as an example is - Beserker takes skull > action > feeds Khorne / Beserker offers to Khorne > worship > gets Khornes attention.
Khorne doesn't necessarily care that you have taken a skull, what's another skull when you have a whole deck chair made out of them, it's when the Beserker says 'it's for for Khorne' that makes him Squee.
Nah, I meant that, to expand on your example, Khorne doesn't care at all whether or not the Berserker says 'it's for Khorne'. It's the emotions spilling forth from the event that trigger his attention. This is how the Chaos Gods can feed on the actions of a cult that doesn't even know Khorne under that name but rather worships some sort of berserker bull or whatever. This is also how those Plague Orks fed Nurgle even though they thought they were worshiping Gork and Mork - their mistake was they did this at an altar of Nurgle (thought to be Gork or Mork, I forgot) and got corrupted by it.
Also, this is what makes things so deliciously ironical - many of the actions the Imperium undertakes to defend itself against its enemies (including Chaos) actively feed one or another Chaos God purely by accident. Also, see the Dark Eldar's relationship to Slaanesh.
Just thinking out loud, of course. I don't have anything at hand that would count as evidence right now, I just think it works nicely with what I've read so far.
Pilau Rice wrote:Oh yeah, I see where you are coming from, but this is the thoughts from a Canoness who cannot fathom a Sister ever falling to Chaos, [SARCASM ENGAGED] surely the only way a sister to turn from the light of the Emperor would be by some dark act, never willingly, oh no, Emperor forbid
Well, what sort of dark act would you assume could cause this? Sisters of Battle possess a superior resistance to the lure of Chaos, and the studio material never mentions even one of them turning from the Emperor's light, whereas in Abnett's story, Miriael is said to be the only exception from a rule that has been in effect for 4.000 years.
Proud Fulgrim was won because he harboured aspirations and feelings alien to a Sororitas, whose whole lifestyle is focused on humility and devotion. I would agree that this may not rule out the chance of mental corruption completely, were it not for the utter lack of practical examples and the focus on purity in their fluff.
Pilau Rice wrote:Once the host vessel is destroyed I don't believe they can reinhabit the same body. It would have to find another meat puppet to possess, unless it's a Daemon prince that retains its mortal form.
Hmm, so do Daemon Princes "reform" the body they had as mortals even when their corporeal presence in realspace is destroyed? My knowledge on Chaos is a bit lacking ...
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This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2012/10/26 16:12:29
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2012/10/26 16:44:47
Subject: God-hood
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Alluring Sorcerer of Slaanesh
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Lynata wrote:Pilau Rice wrote:Not sure I follow you, sorry Lynata. The way I see it for Khorne as an example is - Beserker takes skull > action > feeds Khorne / Beserker offers to Khorne > worship > gets Khornes attention.
Khorne doesn't necessarily care that you have taken a skull, what's another skull when you have a whole deck chair made out of them, it's when the Beserker says 'it's for for Khorne' that makes him Squee.
Nah, I meant that, to expand on your example, Khorne doesn't care at all whether or not the Berserker says 'it's for Khorne'. It's the emotions spilling forth from the event that trigger his attention. This is how the Chaos Gods can feed on the actions of a cult that doesn't even know Khorne under that name but rather worships some sort of berserker bull or whatever. This is also how those Plague Orks fed Nurgle even though they thought they were worshiping Gork and Mork - their mistake was they did this at an altar of Nurgle (thought to be Gork or Mork, I forgot) and got corrupted by it.
Also, this is what makes things so deliciously ironical - many of the actions the Imperium undertakes to defend itself against its enemies (including Chaos) actively feed one or another Chaos God purely by accident. Also, see the Dark Eldar's relationship to Slaanesh.
Just thinking out loud, of course. I don't have anything at hand that would count as evidence right now, I just think it works nicely with what I've read so far.
I still don't know, I am not sure whether or not it's the actual action or the worship that would grant you a gift. The action would clearly get you noticed, but unless you are actually praising your lord, your not going to get anything other than Spawndom.
A Champion of Chaos does not simply praise and venerate the Gods of Chaos, he swears his life and soul to their service, bargaining his own being in exchange for power and patronage
I guess it's all part of the deal ...
Lynata wrote:]Well, what sort of dark act would you assume could cause this? Sisters of Battle possess a superior resistance to the lure of Chaos, and the studio material never mentions even one of them turning from the Emperor's light, whereas in Abnett's story, Miriael is said to be the only exception from a rule that has been in effect for 4.000 years.
How about ... none. Miriael was shown the life she leads and what she could be should she be unbound, she chose the Dark Prince and a life of achieving what ever she desired. Miriael might be the only one ever, but even one is a testament to the Dark Prince and his unholy glory.
Lynata wrote:
Proud Fulgrim was won because he harboured aspirations and feelings alien to a Sororitas, whose whole lifestyle is focused on humility and devotion. I would agree that this may not rule out the chance of mental corruption completely, were it not for the utter lack of practical examples and the focus on purity in their fluff.
You pick up on virgins having sex with pigs but not dongs being used as weapons
Lynata wrote:
Pilau Rice wrote:Once the host vessel is destroyed I don't believe they can reinhabit the same body. It would have to find another meat puppet to possess, unless it's a Daemon prince that retains its mortal form.
Hmm, so do Daemon Princes "reform" the body they had as mortals even when their corporeal presence in realspace is destroyed? My knowledge on Chaos is a bit lacking ...
No I didn't mean that I don't think, I think what I mean is as they still have mortal ties they retain some form of that body and are able to manifest an aspect of it. But then I remembered that Magnus in Battle for the Fang has to possess a Sorcerer to be able to manifest on Fenris, but is able to appear as he was on Prospero.
In Priests of Mars,
I don't think they seem to have the same restrictions as regular daemons, but the more powerful Princes do  It's awfully confusing. Voldorius doesn't seem to have problems with being killed and then bringing himself back.
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This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2012/10/26 16:49:20
No pity, no remorse, no shoes |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2012/10/26 18:30:54
Subject: God-hood
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Paramount Plague Censer Bearer
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Powerful discussion taking place here.
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Meet Arkova.
or discover the game you always wanted to:
RoTC. |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2012/10/26 19:30:12
Subject: God-hood
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Hallowed Canoness
Ireland
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Pilau Rice wrote:I still don't know, I am not sure whether or not it's the actual action or the worship that would grant you a gift. The action would clearly get you noticed, but unless you are actually praising your lord, your not going to get anything other than Spawndom.
Possibly, but this then is just a conscious decision by that entity - in other words, the Chaos Gods probably like being worshipped and thus may reward faithful followers that do very specific things for them - but in the end, they'd get their power either way, because the emotions do not change regardless of whether you're having fun killing someone for Khorne, or you're simply having fun killing someone.
Pilau Rice wrote:How about ... none. Miriael was shown the life she leads and what she could be should she be unbound, she chose the Dark Prince and a life of achieving what ever she desired. Miriael might be the only one ever, but even one is a testament to the Dark Prince and his unholy glory.
Eh, don't buy it. If it would be that easy, there'd be whole armies of Chaos Sisters by now.
Ignorance is one of their virtues.
Pilau Rice wrote:No I didn't mean that I don't think, I think what I mean is as they still have mortal ties they retain some form of that body and are able to manifest an aspect of it. But then I remembered that Magnus in Battle for the Fang has to possess a Sorcerer to be able to manifest on Fenris, but is able to appear as he was on Prospero. In Priests of Mars,
I don't think they seem to have the same restrictions as regular daemons, but the more powerful Princes do  It's awfully confusing. Voldorius doesn't seem to have problems with being killed and then bringing himself back.
We probably have to keep in mind that every novel author has his own idea on how this works, too, much like the fans.
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2012/10/26 19:54:56
Subject: God-hood
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Willing Inquisitorial Excruciator
Croatia
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Durza wrote: KingDeath wrote: DarthMarko wrote: Tadashi wrote: Void__Dragon wrote:
Magnus went into battle with no intention of leaving alive and sought only to save his sons. This is a fact.
Of all the Primarchs, none cared as much for his gene-sons as Magnus did, and that makes him all the more tragic.
That is why he allowed them to die,oooo wait 1000 he did save, waaaait did he?
"Thousand sons" is a story about loyal legion and a primarch with giant hubris and questionable will who dragged them down....
even 1ksons fans tend to agree with this...
No no, it is the story of a poor marty primarch and his poor martyr sons who secretly long for nothing but being allowed to serve the Carriongod once again.
Oh wait, that was the Alpha Legion...or the Word Bearers, no, certainly the Nightlords? These days I sometimes get confused :(
The Alpha Legion believe they still are serving the Emperor, since his primary wish was the destruction of Chaos as far as Alpharius was concerned.
The Word Bearers hate the Emperor and the Imperium now, and have found gods who actually want to be worshipped.
The Night Lords are pretty splintered AFAIK, but Kurze saw the state of the Imperium as justification for his prior actions.
@DeathMarko: Maybe Magnus was unwilling to fight the Space Wolves because he actually thought it was wrong to fight his brother, something Russ clearly had no problem with. The Thousand Sons fell because the Emperor refused to give any guidance to the primarchs about Chaos, despite making Magnus a psyker almost as powerful as the Emperor himself.
He wanted to sacrifice entire legion without asking them and killed poor Uthizzar just for knowing the truth...
But punishment was his, and his alone.. if he listened Ahriman this mess wouldn't happen Automatically Appended Next Post: Lynata wrote:Pilau Rice wrote:I still don't know, I am not sure whether or not it's the actual action or the worship that would grant you a gift. The action would clearly get you noticed, but unless you are actually praising your lord, your not going to get anything other than Spawndom.
Possibly, but this then is just a conscious decision by that entity - in other words, the Chaos Gods probably like being worshipped and thus may reward faithful followers that do very specific things for them - but in the end, they'd get their power either way, because the emotions do not change regardless of whether you're having fun killing someone for Khorne, or you're simply having fun killing someone.
So Lynata what do you think Emp was trying to do with the " IT"? IMHO he simply wanted to starve the warp....after all, worshiping is an emotion....
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This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2012/10/26 20:06:55
ADB: I showed the Wolves revealing the key weakness at the heart of the World Eaters; showing Angron that his Legion was broken and worthless compared to the others; that he was the one primarch who couldn't trust his own warriors, and that they didn't care if he lived or died; showing that loyalty to brothers and sons is the heart of success for the Legiones Astartes, to the point even Lorgar makes a big deal out of saying the World Eaters and their primarch were massively outclassed by Russ, and Angron was too stupid to see the lesson Russ had sacrificed time, sweat, and blood, to teach. We're talking about a battle the Wolves won, by isolating the enemy general through pack tactics, and threatening to kill him, without a hope of defending himself. It was a balance, 50/50 - Angron overpowered Russ, and the Wolves were losing ground to the World Eaters; but Russ and his warriors had Angron by the balls, and barely broke a sweat. They won, no question. Lorgar even says: "The Wolves won, meathead."
Dorn won’t help you either. He’s too busy being the Emperor’s groundskeeper, hiding behind the palace walls. The Wolf is too busy cutting off heads as our father’s executioner, while the Lion holds on to his secrets, and has no special fondness for you. Who else will come? Not Ferrus, certainly. Nor Corax either. Even as we speak, I suspect he flees for Deliverance. Sanguinius?’ Curze laughed cruelly. ‘The angel is more cursed than I. The Khan? He does not wish to be found. So who is left? No one, Vulkan. None of them will come. You are simply not that important. You are alone.’ Konrad Curze to Vulkan
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2012/10/27 01:13:11
Subject: God-hood
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Hallowed Canoness
Ireland
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DarthMarko wrote:So Lynata what do you think Emp was trying to do with the "IT"? IMHO he simply wanted to starve the warp....after all, worshiping is an emotion....
I'm not buying this "Imperial Truth". Granted, I've not read those novels myself, but from what I have learned here on these forums, this IT was specifically intended to do as you say - "starve the warp". And from what I have read in GW's books, it just doesn't work that way, so personally it is really just one of many things from some novel that I simply ignore for my own perception of the setting.
I mean, honestly. Whoever came up with that idea ... I'd love to hear how he thinks Slaanesh came to be. Obviously people didn't worship him/her/it before its existence.
The only possible way this could tie in with GW's own material is that the Emperor simply erred and did not fully understand how Chaos and the Chaos Gods work, thinking that the IT would work when it doesn't. *shrugs*
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2012/10/27 01:15:33
Subject: God-hood
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Banelord Titan Princeps of Khorne
Noctis Labyrinthus
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The Imperial Truth prevented active worship of Chaos, while the Emperor was busy blasting it to bits from the safety of his big chair.
This fluff is in both Collected Visions and in the Horus Heresy novels.
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