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Continued from http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/485570.page

A 1/100 scale gundam is actually 4-5 inches taller (depending on the gundam) than the plastic daemon prince kit, although a 1/144 would fit fairly well.

It honestly just kills everyone else there that either buys the actual kits, or takes the time to bash together a decent proxy. One of the guys there actually did one that would function as a Harpy and a Helldrake, the dimensions are perfect on it.

I could buy a pet turtle and glue guns on it's back and use it as a Squiggoth as long as the other player is fine with it. Also as long as PETA. (c) Don't remember who.

CainTheHunter wrote:
I could buy a pet turtle and glue guns on it's back and use it as a Squiggoth as long as the other player is fine with it. Also as long as PETA. (c) Don't remember who.

I understand that as long as the other person is fine with it, but he keeps badgering everyone to play against him and none of us will (other than his friend that he brings with him), because of said scale discrepancies.

I could bet that turtle would smash his gundam into oblivion!

My fiancee keeps trying to get me to use live mice for my Skaven.

I guess the pictures for Daemon Princes I've seen are misleading, never having really seen one closely, and only having distant memories of my own 1/100 kits xD

I want to make a Tau army using 1/144 kit's one day though
'course that'll be properly converted, based, etc....

At the end of the day - talk to the other people at the store and/or the owner - it's flagrantly breaking the rules and spirit of the game, it needs to be stated he has to use appropriately sized, and represented models ( correct base size, correct size 'footprint' (height/width/depth) give or take a little bit, correct weapons ) and not multiple units represented by the same, incorrect model.

I'm a budget gamer. I buy second hand, I use counts-as and conversions...
It's not exactly hard to get a decent cheapo army using ebay, trading on forums / local stores / etc.
I have 12,000 points of Dark Eldar - spent a little over £400 on it over 2-3 years.
I mean your 'retail average' buying from Games Workshop direct works out at around 5 points per £1 you spend or 5pt/£, a 1500pt army averaging £300 (Codex, models, glue, paint)...
My Dark Eldar work out at about 30pt/£, and it's all WYSIWIG.

If somebody proxies a based clanrat as a daemon prince, I'll throw something at them. Probably a sock or something, but still. If they proxy a fiend of slaanesh as a rat ogre though, sure. Sizes are close. Sizes don't need to be exact, but a rough ballpark is okay. Even a dreadnought as a bloodcrusher is totally cool.

As always, rule of cool applies... if there's no effort being put in, then it's usually not going to be cool.

Rule of cool.

There is a huge difference between using a Mr. Potatohead as a Stompa and using a "Mr. Potatohead" stompa.

 RiTides wrote:
As always, rule of cool applies... if there's no effort being put in, then it's usually not going to be cool.

This, so much this. Just like the Necron Command Barge that he made out of bases. it's bases and a warrior. no other effort.

It even makes the shop look bad for it....
He needs to pick an army and work on it, build it up to 1500, then 2000pts of reasonably WYSIWIG models (be it actual, converted or countsas) (or 500-1000 if an allied detachment), then move onto the next army if he wants more....

Honestly, if you're only playing a friendly game and not a tournament, I don't see what the big deal is. My Bloodthirster is a six inches tall Rackam miniature with a six inch wingspan. People love playing against it because it's so damn hard to find cover for it. At the same time, it looks great.

And in games where I'm not using it, it doubles up as a great piece of statury/ chaos shrine.

I suppose it all comes down to the social contract. If only one person is enjoying the game, then something is wrong. If your opponnents proxies spoil the game for you, don't let him use them. If they don't spoil the game for you, let him.

Laziness is a big factor. A friend of mine loves the death out of his "Scratchbuilt Eldar Titan" (read: Painting mannequin 2/3 the side of the real titan that has tamaya airplane bits glued to it.)

I usually don't say anything, but I do like to point out the scale difference every time he puts out the huge ruins so he can find cover for it. Personally, I feel dirty making any substitutes, no matter how close to size and shape they are.


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Of course, this is also the same guy who puts out his wave serpents without flight stands "to save time", and conveniently forgets/remembers they're an inch and a half taller based upon the terrain and whose turn it is.

 LeadLegion wrote:
Honestly, if you're only playing a friendly game and not a tournament, I don't see what the big deal is. My Bloodthirster is a six inches tall Rackam miniature with a six inch wingspan. People love playing against it because it's so damn hard to find cover for it. At the same time, it looks great.

And in games where I'm not using it, it doubles up as a great piece of statury/ chaos shrine.

I suppose it all comes down to the social contract. If only one person is enjoying the game, then something is wrong. If your opponnents proxies spoil the game for you, don't let him use them. If they don't spoil the game for you, let him.

That's the thing though - you use an awesome looking mini, that's roughly the right size-ish and looks right in its role. You put in the effort so it's fine

It's like coke can/bottle drop pods, whacking down empty bases, etc. Unless it's a one-off thing, either wanting to try it out to see if it's worth buying, just bought it and is still on the sprue/half made, etc.... as a stopgap, I have no issue with it...

But whacking down a pile of bases and calling it something, with no intention of acquiring the actual unit, using a random other toy as-is, out of the box, with no conversion work, as several different things (that you have no intention of actually getting or converting it into...) none of which has anything in relation to the unit it's representing, and generally just ends up being confusing...

Ultimately, it's lazy and looks terrible.

 Ovion wrote:

It's like coke can/bottle drop pods, whacking down empty bases, etc. Unless it's a one-off thing, either wanting to try it out to see if it's worth buying, just bought it and is still on the sprue/half made, etc.... as a stopgap, I have no issue with it...

Heh, well, and I feel a little guilty, but I have occasionally thrown down a vodka bottle (Booze Angels) drop pod or two.

I have the models, they're just not assembled yet!

 daedalus wrote:

 Ovion wrote:

It's like coke can/bottle drop pods, whacking down empty bases, etc. Unless it's a one-off thing, either wanting to try it out to see if it's worth buying, just bought it and is still on the sprue/half made, etc.... as a stopgap, I have no issue with it...

Heh, well, and I feel a little guilty, but I have occasionally thrown down a vodka bottle (Booze Angels) drop pod or two.

I have the models, they're just not assembled yet!

If you're sharing, you've met the Rule of Cool requirements...

 kronk wrote:

 daedalus wrote:

 Ovion wrote:

It's like coke can/bottle drop pods, whacking down empty bases, etc. Unless it's a one-off thing, either wanting to try it out to see if it's worth buying, just bought it and is still on the sprue/half made, etc.... as a stopgap, I have no issue with it...

Heh, well, and I feel a little guilty, but I have occasionally thrown down a vodka bottle (Booze Angels) drop pod or two.

I have the models, they're just not assembled yet!

If you're sharing, you've met the Rule of Cool requirements...

xD
Also, it's a stopgap, you do have the models at least, so it's not that bad.

On a side note, does anyone know of an alternate Rhino Chasis proxy / countsas?
The standard rhino is such an ugly box xD

Just as annoying as people who use inappropriate proxies are the whiners who don't accept appropriate proxies.

At a local game store (when they still did GW stuff regularly before they switched the gaming days to PP and Dystopian Wars) a participant was warned by the league organizer that his scratch built Killa Kans would not be allowed anymore and was told not to bring them again.

They were scratch built from plastic card and were the same height, profile, base size, as the normal killa kans, but were hexagonal in shape. He even used the killa kans weapon arms he got from another guy who wanted a different load out. They were well riveted and full of interesting scrap metal texture and well painted.

The reason? "It's not fair that someone else pays money for killa kans and you don't." The store owner apologized profusely when word got back to him about it. The guy had bought about 10K of orks at that store and some moron control freak league organizer tells him about fairness related to paying for killa kans.

My take on the issue:

It should be the right size, have the right weapon load out, the right base and be painted. It should probably also aesthetically match the rest of the army.

Well, that's not a proxy. THat's a scratchbuild and the LO is a dick.

What pretre said.

 kronk wrote:

 daedalus wrote:

 Ovion wrote:

It's like coke can/bottle drop pods, whacking down empty bases, etc. Unless it's a one-off thing, either wanting to try it out to see if it's worth buying, just bought it and is still on the sprue/half made, etc.... as a stopgap, I have no issue with it...

Heh, well, and I feel a little guilty, but I have occasionally thrown down a vodka bottle (Booze Angels) drop pod or two.

I have the models, they're just not assembled yet!

If you're sharing, you've met the Rule of Cool requirements...

Hey, so long as the bottle's empty before it hits the table, I don't care what happens to it.

i want to use gundam heavy arms as a model

for some reason i had the urge to post Flyrant here. It is scratch built, and it is build inspired by gundam wing custom.

It is by no means a proxy. it is the real deal.

 frozenwastes wrote:

It should be the right size, have the right weapon load out, the right base and be painted. It should probably also aesthetically match the rest of the army.

As long as this is met, I'm fine. If you follow the "Rule of Cool", I might let a weapon slide.

nkelsch wrote:
Rule of cool.

There is a huge difference between using a Mr. Potatohead as a Stompa and using a "Mr. Potatohead" stompa.

Holy gak.

I have seen this online 10-20 times and never realized what it was!


Did GW make a deff dread that looked similiar in the past before the current one? I feel like GW makes something that has this feel but on a smaller scale?




sorry to hijack!


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 Ovion wrote:
What pretre said.

Also, I am guilty of drop pod booze bottles... Hell sunday I surprised my friend and fielded a proxy BA list instead of my usual orks. Ran 3 pods, 1 gatorade bottle, 1 cotton ball jar, and a drinking cup!


He was cool about it. We were scouring the house to find something appropriately sized.




To be clear, I purchased 1 pod and hadn't assembled it yet and wanted to see if I wanted to get more or not with the test game etc. To be honest though I have done the same thing prior to buying the first pod, which is what lead me to buy my first one to begin with... So I think friendly games allowing genuine proxies is perfectly acceptable, and more than gentleman-like... In that same sense though, I haven't built my Looted landraider-battlewagon yet, because I know some friends might think the size/LOS advantages are just that. It's one I will reserve for games with friends who don't mind as much, or in games were we rule it as same size of a stock wagon etc.


That being said... some of the examples in here are funny.. painting mannequin 2/3 size etc... but some... like the aforementioned mr. potato - stompa... make me yearn to be better... The stock GW stompa does not inspire that in me, at all. lol

Ovion wrote:

On a side note, does anyone know of an alternate Rhino Chasis proxy / countsas?
The standard rhino is such an ugly box xD

M113 series in 1/35 or 1/48 scale, depending on how large or small you want it. Though it is still a box.

If that is too boxy you should just look around for APC kits until you find something you like.

I'd play with him and recomdend getting decent models for it. Depends on his attitude truthfully.

For example, I wanted to try an IG/SW list, however I don't own any Vendettas.

Going to use Stormravens as them, even though they're a different size/shape etc.

I'll be using mortars as Autocannons
and other special weapons as this and that.

It's agreed to before the game and that's all that matters really

jdjamesdean@mail.com wrote:
I'd play with him and recomdend getting decent models for it. Depends on his attitude truthfully.

We've tried that... The last time someone mentioned anything about his "proxies", he chewed them out about how he can't afford models (he's 33, makes more than me, and lives rent-free with his parents), and that they're fine as proxies.

I remember when he was proxying one of the P-51s as a Doomscythe, he tried to say it could get cover behind a small building. A real one wouldn't have, however.

nkelsch wrote:Rule of cool.

There is a huge difference between using a Mr. Potatohead as a Stompa and using a "Mr. Potatohead" stompa.

Yep, This is it. To elaborate, Rule of Cool boils down to a few things for me.
1) Does it look cool
2) Is it the right size
3) Does it show some effort
4) Is it painted

If it meets 3 of those 4 I'm game.

Kilkrazy wrote:

Ovion wrote:

On a side note, does anyone know of an alternate Rhino Chasis proxy / countsas?
The standard rhino is such an ugly box xD

M113 series in 1/35 or 1/48 scale, depending on how large or small you want it. Though it is still a box.

If that is too boxy you should just look around for APC kits until you find something you like.

For the 113 series, 1/48 is probably your best bet. I've got a 1/35 a Rhino proxy and it always seems a bit big. 1/48 will probably be just a touch small, but it will be less out of scale than 1/35.

Check out Atenociti's Workshop and Old Crow Models for other Sci-Fi APC's in 28mm scale.

 Kilkrazy wrote:

Ovion wrote:

On a side note, does anyone know of an alternate Rhino Chasis proxy / countsas?
The standard rhino is such an ugly box xD

M113 series in 1/35 or 1/48 scale, depending on how large or small you want it. Though it is still a box.

If that is too boxy you should just look around for APC kits until you find something you like.

Word of warning, 1/35 scale is frakking HUGE for 40k, I got a 1/35 scale MLRS launcher with an eye to making it a manticore proxy and it was appropriately scaled in the sense that it looked like it would actually fit the appropriate amount of IG crewmen in the cab, the issue is it was significantly larger then any other vehicle on the field. I'd encourage 1/48 scale.

nkelsch wrote:
Rule of cool.
There is a huge difference between using a Mr. Potatohead as a Stompa and using a "Mr. Potatohead" stompa.

sorry. I don't think this qualifies as a proxy.

THIS, is a full on scratchbuild, and I think its the most amazing Ork piece i've ever seen.

Using a transformer toy would be a proxy.

I think its all up to the people you play with. We used an old Macross battlesuit as a Wrath lord once (titan scale) as long as everyoens ok its cool, roll them dice.