Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you: No adverts like this in the forums anymore. Times and dates in your local timezone. Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance. Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely. Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net. If you are already a member then feel free to login now.

Rimmy, would you be upset to learn that in Canada, handguns are required to be kept unloaded, in gun safe, with trigger locks engaged? It's really a fantastic system- it'll take about 5-10 seconds for you to open the safe, disengage the trigger lock and feed in a magazine or speed loader. This provides a nice balance of availability/preparedness, with the safety of knowing that nobody but you will be using the firearm. You should think about measures such as that, rather than just spouting your own personal terror at the concept of handguns.

And you still haven't apologized for saying the dumbest thing I've ever heard in my life (your bit about the best defense is to run up and disarm your armed attacker with your bare hands).

 Kaldor wrote:
Hi. Former cop here.

A firearm for self/home defense is wasted money. The chances of someone breaking into your home are tiny. Truly tiny. And the overwhelming majority of criminals who attempt to break into your home will flee when confronted. A simple "Hey, get the hell outta here, I'm calling the cops!" is enough to send them running.

Not in Vancouver. Home invasions tend to target the elderly, or anyone the offenders suspect might be running a marijuana grow op (there's a lot of 'em). In both situations, the offenders actually intend to target people who are home. As such, shouting "Hey, get the Hell outta here, I'm calling the cops!" will be slightly less effective than shutting your eyes and recessing back to a time when you lacked object permanence. I'm not saying the odds of this happening are high- but I am saying that I'd rather not have a 1 in 50 chance of it happening.

And rape is a crime of hate; it is not a crime of lust. It doens't follow that rapes would be committed by people known to the victim.

As the posters around my campus say, Rape is a Violent Crime committed in a sexual manner. Now a good portion are commited by people the victim knows, but a good portion are also commited by someone the victim does not know.



Edit: Another good point about the elderly. An old person will almost certaintly not have the strength for a physical struggle, yet they will probably still be able to aim a gun and pull the trigger.

Guns level the playing field as far as physical power goes.

"God made man, but Samuel Colt made them equal"

I don't own a gun, but I'd go simple revolver for home protection. Probably a .38 or less.

 KalashnikovMarine wrote:

 Surtur wrote:

IronWarLeg wrote:
I saw or read somewhere that one way to see what a knife fight would be like and how badly you will get jacked up, is to:

1. Get a friend who has anger issues
2. Give friend a Giant marker, the ones with a giant chisel tip.
3. Get yourself another marker thats the same size, but make it a different color.
4. Put on a white shirt.
5. Have your friend attack you with his marker and you fend him off with yours.

Any mark on your clothing indicates a spot you were cut, any marks on arms or neck could be a show stopper, dropped knife or cut artery..

Dunno where I saw that at but its an interesting idea, and actually sounds like a bit of fun on a boring afternoon.

But none of that really matters if they shoot you, a la Indiana Jones style.

Anyway I would give that a shot if you wanted to see what knife fighting is all about on a level that you could reasonably expect to face in the event of a robbery.

This really won't help. Given what I know about stress, my personal fighting experience and jujitsu knowledge you aren't learning anything to help you. The way I've learned to disarm someone with a knife, they have to stab at you first and you have to catch them in the act of stabbing at you. The best solution is to not get there in the first place and give them what they want. The way to disarm a gun is to basically be in a stick up situation with the gun inches from you and pray you're fast enough. Again best solution is give them what they want.

Iron was suggesting this as a method to see just how screwed you are in a knife fight, not learn how to disarm a knife.

Oh sorry, I misread it. I guess I got confused with the earlier thing about someone disarming the attacker.

Found this article while killing time in the office:

http://www.foxnews.com/us/2012/12/06/texas-burglary-suspect-calls-11-on-homeowner-with-gun/


It's Fox News, so take it as you will, I just thought it relevant to this discussion

So did we ever decide on a gun?

How do flintlocks work as home defense?

Also, if you heard a classic pump action sound on a shotgun, would you gak your pants and run, or stand your ground?

 Alfndrate wrote:


How do flintlocks work as home defense?

Well, the obvious drawback to a flintlock, is that you cannot leave it loaded, nor can you "preload" the weapon in an emergency.. I mean, if you store it loaded, the weapon will "sweat" which will get your powder wet, and then you'll have what amounts to a fancy club to go after a would be intruder... though it would make a hilarious news story

Get a dog.

 Ensis Ferrae wrote:

 Alfndrate wrote:


How do flintlocks work as home defense?

Well, the obvious drawback to a flintlock, is that you cannot leave it loaded, nor can you "preload" the weapon in an emergency.. I mean, if you store it loaded, the weapon will "sweat" which will get your powder wet, and then you'll have what amounts to a fancy club to go after a would be intruder... though it would make a hilarious news story

But boy would the intruder get it when you finally got it loaded! Just tell them to start at the other side of the house.. I would go with a blunderbus though if it was me personally lol

We decided on 7 of these

And 2 of these (handler not included)

And one of these

We can discuss individual Items from FM 5-31 at a later time.

I like that gun, twice the failures in one handy weapon.

 d-usa wrote:
I like that gun, twice the failures in one handy weapon.

So given it's a 1911, none at all?

I have shot some crappy 1911. Shot my brothers 1911 that he got from Colt after being deployed and it jammed at least once everytime we emptied a mag.

Get a Remington 870, best 12 gauge for home defense in the world.

I think it has been said that a shotgun is not what you need/want in home defense... Though the sound of one getting ready can help you out...

 Alfndrate wrote:
I think it has been said that a shotgun is not what you need/want in home defense... Though the sound of one getting ready can help you out...

Many things have been said.

The important bit is use what is most comfortable

Alfndrate wrote:So did we ever decide on a gun?

How do flintlocks work as home defense?

I think they'd serve as a great teaching tool for not using black powder firearms indoors.

d-usa wrote:I have shot some crappy 1911. Shot my brothers 1911 that he got from Colt after being deployed and it jammed at least once everytime we emptied a mag.

Either that firearm has not been cleaned and cared for, pretty much ever, or else there is a weapon-specific defect in it.

There are a number of failure points in the 1911. Just because it's old and reliable doesn't make it faultless. There are a number of things it could have been, from cheap mags to a protruding slide stop. There's probably a dozen things I could think of off the top of my head.

Yeah jokes aside there's failure points in every weapons system. Certainly odd to here about that kinda serious malfunction from a Colt though. Heck my "junk" Rock Island eats garbage Tula ammo like it's going out of style.

Yup.

I wouldn't recommend 1911s for non-gun people.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 KalashnikovMarine wrote:
Yeah jokes aside there's failure points in every weapons system. Certainly odd to here about that kinda serious malfunction from a Colt though. Heck my "junk" Rock Island eats garbage Tula ammo like it's going out of style.

RIA 1911s are a heck of a value, from all I've seen and heard about them. If I wasn't a goon who liked to spend way too much money on his pistols, I'd own one, no question.

 AustonT wrote:

 azazel the cat wrote:

Captain Fantastic wrote:Colt makes this thing, although it seems a bit frankenstein to me. Plus, 8 rounds is really nothing special. There are better options... Like a Glock.

If you can't do the job in 8, what good is another 5 going to be?

I was busy chortling at some guy at a burger place when I pointed out to my wife his empty holster and empty mag holsters. He had an xd holster and four mag spots 75 rounds. Who is he planning in having a firefight with?

1. Tacticool mall ninja.
2. Someone really nearsighted.
3. An Eagle scout who took "awlays be prepared" to a whole notha level.

 Seaward wrote:
Yup.

I wouldn't recommend 1911s for non-gun people.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 KalashnikovMarine wrote:
Yeah jokes aside there's failure points in every weapons system. Certainly odd to here about that kinda serious malfunction from a Colt though. Heck my "junk" Rock Island eats garbage Tula ammo like it's going out of style.

RIA 1911s are a heck of a value, from all I've seen and heard about them. If I wasn't a goon who liked to spend way too much money on his pistols, I'd own one, no question.

I wouldn't recommend guns at all for home defence, and that not because I work for the UN or anything like that but other posters have pointed out that a shotgun going off in a confined space is likely to mess up your eardrums and leave you dazed. Show of hands: how many people think leaping out the dark with a knife would probably be more effeective i.e less to think about, instinct, fear, not used to violent situations etc etc

Too look somebody square in the eye and pull the trigger...well...it's not for everybody.

 kronk wrote:
I don't own a gun, but I'd go simple revolver for home protection. Probably a .38 or less.

Wait, wait you live in Texas - plrease call 911 and tell them of this emergency. They'll drop off a Glock.

 Frazzled wrote:

 kronk wrote:
I don't own a gun, but I'd go simple revolver for home protection. Probably a .38 or less.

Wait, wait you live in Texas - plrease call 911 and tell them of this emergency. They'll drop off a Glock.

Will they deliver it to Ohio?

Instead of buying a gun for home defence, wouldn't it be better for people to lobby their politicians to tackle the socio-economic problems that result in house-breaking, or is that just wishful thinking?

 Do_I_Not_Like_That wrote:
Instead of buying a gun for home defence, wouldn't it be better for people to lobby their politicians to tackle the socio-economic problems that result in house-breaking, or is that just wishful thinking?

Get your hippy logic out of here J.R!

 KalashnikovMarine wrote:
Yeah jokes aside there's failure points in every weapons system.

A dog never jams.

 Frazzled wrote:

 kronk wrote:
I don't own a gun, but I'd go simple revolver for home protection. Probably a .38 or less.

Wait, wait you live in Texas - plrease call 911 and tell them of this emergency. They'll drop off a Glock.

I'll stun them with my good looks then hit them with a hammer.

 kronk wrote:

A dog never jams.

Now, that depends on what you feed them

 kronk wrote:


A dog never jams.

My dog's jammed before. He smelled so bad it grossed him out.

 Do_I_Not_Like_That wrote:

I wouldn't recommend guns at all for home defence, and that not because I work for the UN or anything like that but other posters have pointed out that a shotgun going off in a confined space is likely to mess up your eardrums and leave you dazed. Show of hands: how many people think leaping out the dark with a knife would probably be more effeective i.e less to think about, instinct, fear, not used to violent situations etc etc

Too look somebody square in the eye and pull the trigger...well...it's not for everybody.

I'm curious how many of said posters have actually had to fire a shotgun or a pistol in confined spaces without earpro before.

I have. It's loud. Tweety Bird doesn't appear and start circling around your head. You can still function.