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This came up today in my 2nd game in a tournament. The set up... Guy sets up his army and I set up my army I have no reserves, scouts, or infiltration. He then does his infiltrate guys exactly 18 inches or w/e it is. I steal the initive and get to go first. I move my thunder wolves Calvary 12 inches towards his guys and of course I am we'll within assault range so I declare my assault. My opponent swears that I cannot assault him first turn and says its in the MRB. The next 30 min or so was looking this up :( I found noting in the MRB, and the only information found was in the FAQ and it only refers to inflation and scouts not assaulting first turn. Pretty much everyone at the tournament said I could not or think not and one said no along with me, but I would not accept any answer until I saw hard evidence in the rules since I had never heard it before. The judge could not find anything saying I could not and was the one that found the FAQ rule and that was it. After about another 5 min the guy I was playing told me to go ahead, but he knows its in there made some phone calls trying to verify etc.

So what's the story morning glory? Can someone give me this rule in black and white with a page number or was I correct?

That's some wall of text...
But yes, you can assault on the first turn. There are a couple of exceptions (using scout or infiltrate), but in general there nothing stopping a first turn assault.

Cavalry or jump infantry that have moved 12" in their move phase can make a stab at assault in the 1st turn.

If you deploy normally you can always assault 1st turn.

He can't assault you first turn with his infiltrators, but there's no converse rule preventing you from assaulting said infiltrators on the first turn!

Okie dokie thank you guys. That's what I was thinking too.

This restriction also only applies if the Infiltrator has the first turn. If they go second they can assault on their turn one.

The restriction is that if a Scout or Infiltrator uses their rule, they cannot assault on the first player turn of the game. They can assault on the second.

And anything that deploys normally is perfectly allowed to assault on turn one if something is in range.

He may not have been but it sounds like the guy is trying (and failing) to rules lawyer his way out of a mistake.

 liturgies of blood wrote:
Cavalry or jump infantry that have moved 12" in their move phase can make a stab at assault in the 1st turn.

If you deploy normally you can always assault 1st turn.

Not true.

you must deploy more than 12" from the center dividing line.

So you will always be just over 24" from the enemy if you deployed correctly.

i do not believe there is anything in game that can move more than 12" and assault more than 12" first turn.

edit: i could be wrong though, i don't know every army, there may be a few special models that can.

With the proper trait you could move 12" and charge 13".

Stormboyz move 12+D6"

40k-noob wrote:

 liturgies of blood wrote:
Cavalry or jump infantry that have moved 12" in their move phase can make a stab at assault in the 1st turn.

If you deploy normally you can always assault 1st turn.

Not true.

you must deploy more than 12" from the center dividing line.

So you will always be just over 24" from the enemy if you deployed correctly.

i do not believe there is anything in game that can move more than 12" and assault more than 12" first turn.

edit: i could be wrong though, i don't know every army, there may be a few special models that can.

Then you cant assault because the target is out of range. Which isn't a problem witg infiltrating enemies

Red ork vehicles,
7" move + 2" pivot, 6" disembark,

15" down, 9" to go.

There is no such thing as a 2" pivot.

It is incredibly clear that you pivot a vehicle at their center point. If you pivot from the ******center******* you are equidistant from both ends. Ergo... you have gained anything.

paidinfull wrote:
There is no such thing as a 2" pivot.

It is incredibly clear that you pivot a vehicle at their center point. If you pivot from the ******center******* you are equidistant from both ends. Ergo... you have gained anything.

Deploy on the line with the side of the truck facing your opponent.
Pivot on the center. The front of the truck is now over the deployment line. Oh look, you're wrong - you've gained displacement toward your opponent.

Are you serious? You just described a pivot. I stated that there is no such thing as a 2" pivot. Read it again.

Dark Eldar gain a bit more. Their vehicle is skinnier and just as long.

40k-noob wrote:

 liturgies of blood wrote:
Cavalry or jump infantry that have moved 12" in their move phase can make a stab at assault in the 1st turn.

If you deploy normally you can always assault 1st turn.

Not true.

you must deploy more than 12" from the center dividing line.

So you will always be just over 24" from the enemy if you deployed correctly.

i do not believe there is anything in game that can move more than 12" and assault more than 12" first turn.

edit: i could be wrong though, i don't know every army, there may be a few special models that can.

You do realise that you need a target to charge, if there is nothing there then you cannot charge? So it is perfectly possible for a unit to charge turn 1 if there are models in range such as infiltrators, scouts etc.

paidinfull wrote:
Are you serious? You just described a pivot. I stated that there is no such thing as a 2" pivot. Read it again.

You turn a vehicle on it's centre, that move rigeld described is legal, you're a dick to do it with a crazy long vehicle, but it is legal. What you are mistaking his tactic for is the vehicle shuffle, where you pivot a model on it's corners to gain extra movement.

 liturgies of blood wrote:

paidinfull wrote:
Are you serious? You just described a pivot. I stated that there is no such thing as a 2" pivot. Read it again.

You turn a vehicle on it's centre, that move rigeld described is legal, you're a dick to do it with a crazy long vehicle, but it is legal. What you are mistaking his tactic for is the vehicle shuffle, where you pivot a model on it's corners to gain extra movement.

Only works if you deploy sideways for a one-off gain. Not something you can do mid-game.

 grendel083 wrote:

 liturgies of blood wrote:

paidinfull wrote:
Are you serious? You just described a pivot. I stated that there is no such thing as a 2" pivot. Read it again.

You turn a vehicle on it's centre, that move rigeld described is legal, you're a dick to do it with a crazy long vehicle, but it is legal. What you are mistaking his tactic for is the vehicle shuffle, where you pivot a model on it's corners to gain extra movement.

Only works if you deploy sideways for a one-off gain. Not something you can do mid-game.

Yep it's a turn one advantage only.
Though orks and DE have long enough vehicles that can get 2-3 inches extra due to the length, so 6" vehicle, 6" move, up to 12" charge plus the extra few inches.

Normal infantry cannot assault a unit that infiltrated over 18 away, they would need 18.1 inches on the charge.

 Grey Templar wrote:
This restriction also only applies if the Infiltrator has the first turn. If they go second they can assault on their turn one.

The restriction is that if a Scout or Infiltrator uses their rule, they cannot assault on the first player turn of the game. They can assault on the second.

And anything that deploys normally is perfectly allowed to assault on turn one if something is in range.

NM.

You all are forgetting bikes with scout. IE ravenwing and those stupid ork copter bikes. They can scout move so they start 12" on, move 12" scout move first turn and then you move 12" since it's his calv. They should now be in a one inch charge range of the bikes / coptas.

 juraigamer wrote:
Normal infantry cannot assault a unit that infiltrated over 18 away, they would need 18.1 inches on the charge.

Only if in LOS, otherwise they need to be >12" away.

also you can't charge your first turn if you infiltrate or scout move if you go first. If you go second then you can charge even if you did scout move or infiltrate on the offchance your opponent fails their charge

I'm just glad I was legal in how it went down. I don't like to cheat someone. He was 18 inches away and I was on thunder wolves so I was able to move 12 and assault 12. So I was in range easily. Also keep in mind I stole the initive so this is a rare case that I got a 1st turn assault. Just glad it was played correctly.

 juraigamer wrote:
Normal infantry cannot assault a unit that infiltrated over 18 away, they would need 18.1 inches on the charge.

Embarked in an assault Vehicle, my Boyz can do it just fine.

Move 7" Disembark 6" Assault 2-12"

 liturgies of blood wrote:

 grendel083 wrote:

 liturgies of blood wrote:

paidinfull wrote:
Are you serious? You just described a pivot. I stated that there is no such thing as a 2" pivot. Read it again.

You turn a vehicle on it's centre, that move rigeld described is legal, you're a dick to do it with a crazy long vehicle, but it is legal. What you are mistaking his tactic for is the vehicle shuffle, where you pivot a model on it's corners to gain extra movement.

Only works if you deploy sideways for a one-off gain. Not something you can do mid-game.

Yep it's a turn one advantage only.
Though orks and DE have long enough vehicles that can get 2-3 inches extra due to the length, so 6" vehicle, 6" move, up to 12" charge plus the extra few inches.

There seems to be a disconnect about what I wrote.

I'm not saying it's not legal/possible to use the deployment, uh, "exploit" (I suppose that's what you'd call it?). I was simply saying that there is no such thing as a 2" pivot.
If you're pivoting, you aren't gaining anything. When a player uses that "tactic/exploit" the vehicle isn't moving 2" more, or gaining 2", nor has the vehicle pivoted 2". The player is simply using a combination of the disembarkation rules and the length of the vehicle to have an advantageous/optimal charge distance. Again, a player could only do this from deployment as grendel083 has pointed out.

I felt that the way '2" pivot' was written, that it was misleading and more than possible that a new player could read that incorrectly. For example, I don't think that it's uncommon for a player to measure 12" from the front of a rhino and then place the vehicle sideways at that point. It's not a huge deal, but it's technically "cheating" as the rhino will have moved over 12" at that point. It's easier to see in a diagram, but if you were to pivot the vehicle to line up again and measure from the new front position you'll find it's > 12" from the point of origin. In a game of inches, and because obstruction is a common tactic, it can have an impact on the game.

icefire78 wrote:
You all are forgetting bikes with scout. IE ravenwing and those stupid ork copter bikes. They can scout move so they start 12" on, move 12" scout move first turn and then you move 12" since it's his calv. They should now be in a one inch charge range of the bikes / coptas.

Geez, nevermind again...

paidinfull wrote:
Are you serious? You just described a pivot. I stated that there is no such thing as a 2" pivot. Read it again.

Assuming that the vehicle is longer than it is wide (i.e. everything except a Monolith, more or less) you effectively gain distance when pivoting the way described, despite the center not moving.

While the venoms are superior on many ways, the dark eldar pivowting on their boats is one thing the boats got going for them. If you park your raider sideways and start by pivoting you sudenly gain a lott of movement that round.