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Made in us
Decrepit Dakkanaut






Omadon's Realm

http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-34222_162-57557024-10391739/fox-news-chief-urged-petraeus-to-run-for-president/

'Fair and balanced' 'news' channel Fox News and the powers behind it, Ailes and Murdoch, have been exposed trying to influence and offering to do anything to empower General Petraeus and entice him to run against President Obama in 2011.

Does anyone else think this might be an unusual or partisan position for a 'journalistic news reporting' tv channel?

Fox News chairman Roger Ailes urged Gen. David Petraeus to run for president last year, according to a digital recording of a conversation between Petraeus and an Ailes emissary obtained by the Washington Post.

The Post's Bob Woodward reported that Petraeus, then the U.S. Commander in Afghanistan, was contacted by Kathleen T. McFarland, a Fox news national security analyst and former Pentagon aide, during McFarland's visit to Afghanistan in 2011 and was given a message from Ailes: If President Obama offered Petraeus the job of CIA Director instead of the chairmanship of the Joint Chiefs of Staff, Ailes urged Petraeus to decline the offer, resign from the administration, and run for president as a Republican.

McFarland implied that Ailes, who was a Republican political consultant for decades prior to running Fox News, could resign from his position at Fox to run Petraeus' presidential campaign. McFarland and Petraeus also discussed the possibility that Rupert Murdoch, the head of Fox News parent Newscorp, would "bankroll" the campaign, according to the Post.

Petraeus did not heed Ailes' advice, saying he would entertain the idea of being CIA Director if Obama offered him he job, which the president did a few weeks later. Petraeus was sworn in as director on September 6, 2011, a post he held until November 9, 2012, when he resigned due to fallout from an extramarital affair with his biographer.

CIA Director David Petraeus resigns
Petraeus resignation takes WH by surprise
Of a presidential bid, Petraeus told McFarland, according to the Post, "It's never going to happen," explaining, "My wife would divorce me, and I love my wife. We have a beautiful house...I just want to live in it. I've never spent a night in it." Though disinclined to follow Ailes' counsel, Petraeus praised the Fox News head, saying, "I love Roger...he's a brilliant guy." He continued, "If I ever ran, I'd take him up on his offer."

When McFarland first told Petraeus she had been sent with a message from Ailes, Petraeus responded, "With no one else in the room, I hope."

McFarland explained, "I'm only reporting this back to Roger...his deal with me was that I was only supposed to talk to you, and he is a little paranoid, so believe me, he doesn't have anybody in that room."

Perhaps the most salacious detail to emerge from the conversation was an exchange in which Petraeus told McFarland that if he ran for president, Ailes would "quit Fox...and bankroll it."

"Bankroll it?" asked McFarland.

"Or maybe I'm confusing that with Rupert," said Petraeus, referring to Newscorp head Rupert Murdoch.

"I know Roger, he's done okay," replied McFarland. "But no, I think the one who's bankrolling it is the big boss.

"The big boss is bankrolling it, Roger's going to run it, and the rest of us are going to be your in-house."

Ailes denied any breach of propriety, insisting that while he did ask McFarland to pitch Petraeus on a presidential run, "It was more of a joke, a wiseass way I have." He told the Post he thought the Republican primary field "needed to be shaken up, and Petraeus might be a good candidate."

Ailes also disavowed McFarland's involvement, pointedly explaining that she is not an employee of Fox News but just a contributor who is paid less than $75,000 a year. "It sounds like she thought she was on a secret mission in the Reagan administration," scorned Ailes. "She was way out of line...It's someone's fantasy to make me a kingmaker. It's not my job."

Petraeus did have some editorial advice for Fox News. McFarland asked Petraeus whether there is "anything Fox is doing, right or wrong, that you want us to do differently?"

The general responded, "The editorial policy of Fox had shifted. It was almost as if, because they're going after Obama, they had to go after Obama's war as well," adding that he had discussed the problem with Bret Baier, a primetime anchor on the cable news channel.

Baier did not recall discussing Fox's coverage with Petraeus, but disputed the premise of the general's critique. "That's B.S.," he told the Post. "We cover the war the same way no matter what administration is in power."

The conversation between Petraeus and McFarland eventually made its way into an April 2011 piece McFarland wrote on FoxNews.com in which she wrote, "Our discussion was off the record, and to respect that I will not quote the general." The piece, which was written after it was obvious that Petraeus was headed for the CIA, continued, "I can't help thinking that the Obama administration has done something a bit underhanded but politically shrewd by tapping Petraeus for the CIA." In so doing, McFarland argued, Obama had removed a "potential rival" from the presidential race.

On Monday, Ailes offered perhaps the simplest explanation of why he would not have deputized McFarland to speak as she did. The Fox News head said there was "zero chance" he would reenter politics because in his current job, "The money is too good."



 
   
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Petraeus did have some editorial advice for Fox News. McFarland asked Petraeus whether there is "anything Fox is doing, right or wrong, that you want us to do differently?"


That sounds like a thing a legitimate journalism outlet would do to me.

 lord_blackfang wrote:
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 Flinty wrote:
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I remember Fox once said that they are fair in balanced in a way. That since EVERY other news station is liberal, they are conservative to make up for it.

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 hotsauceman1 wrote:
I remember Fox once said that they are fair in balanced in a way. That since EVERY other news station is liberal, they are conservative to make up for it.


It can be argued, fairly strongly, that if they believe other news is flawed in being partisan, that the counter isn't to be partisan themselves, but to report the news without propaganda or bias...



 
   
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Indeed, it's like saying, when faced with one sharp knife and one dull one, to balance it out you must dull the sharp one.

The best antidote to bad reporting is good reporting.

Unfortunately, that's not actually what Americans want (they are liars, for the most part). And so it goes.

 lord_blackfang wrote:
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 Flinty wrote:
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 hotsauceman1 wrote:
I remember Fox once said that they are fair in balanced in a way. That since EVERY other news station is liberal, they are conservative to make up for it.

lol sounds about right to me. I don't watch much Fox News or any news for that matter, but I will say it's nice to see someone going against the left wing media machine, which is obviously very powerful when they can get a nobody from Chicago elected not once, but twice. And people complain about Fox "trying" to get Petraeus to run for Prez? Please.

I will say this: glad to see Petraeus resigned; I don't want the director of the CIA unable to cover up his own affair. That's just plain poor CIA work right there.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2012/12/04 17:30:36


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 Lt. Coldfire wrote:
I don't watch much Fox News or any news for that matter, but I will say it's nice to see someone going against the left wing political machine, which is obviously very powerful when they can get a nobody from Chicago elected not once, but twice.


How many electoral votes does NPR have?

 lord_blackfang wrote:
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 Flinty wrote:
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I don't think the News is hat liberal.

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 Lt. Coldfire wrote:
 hotsauceman1 wrote:
I remember Fox once said that they are fair in balanced in a way. That since EVERY other news station is liberal, they are conservative to make up for it.

lol sounds about right to me. I don't watch much Fox News or any news for that matter, but I will say it's nice to see someone going against the left wing media machine, which is obviously very powerful when they can get a nobody from Chicago elected not once, but twice. And people complain about Fox "trying" to get Petraeus to run for Prez? Please.


"Left Wing Media Machine", that's just plain silly. There is no left wing to speak of in America, or at least anything that would constitute a "left wing" doesn't have any level of influence that could be considered consequential in any capacity.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2012/12/04 17:35:56


 
   
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 Lt. Coldfire wrote:
And people complain about Fox "trying" to get Petraeus to run for Prez? Please.


Do you understand the ramifications of the largest 'media machine' in the business bankrolling and promoting a presidential candidate and portraying what they are doing on television as 'reporting' instead of 'promoting'?


This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2012/12/04 17:45:57




 
   
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 MeanGreenStompa wrote:
 Lt. Coldfire wrote:
And people complain about Fox "trying" to get Petraeus to run for Prez? Please.


Do you understand the ramifications of the largest 'media machine' in the business bankrolling and promoting a presidential candidate and portraying what they are doing on television as 'reporting' instead of 'promoting'?



Traditional American politics?

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The Washington Post's opinion page has a great analysis of this story.

Five takeaways from the Fox News-David Petraeus conspiracy

http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/erik-wemple/wp/2012/12/04/five-lessons-from-fox-news-roger-ailes-david-petraeus-conspiracy/

It's a bit long so let me summarize

Lesson 1: Fox News is corrupt.
Lesson 2: Fox News is corrupt.
Lesson 3: Fox News is corrupt.
Lesson 4: Fox News is corrupt.
Lesson 5: Fox News is corrupt and nasty.


Full text

Five takeaways from the Fox News-David Petraeus conspiracy
By Erik Wemple , Updated: December 4, 2012

The Washington Post’s Bob Woodward has dropped a nice little headline for the world’s media nerds. “Fox News chief’s failed attempt to enlist Petraeus as presidential candidate.” Turns out that Roger Ailes, who runs Fox News, was terribly impressed with the political credentials of Gen. David Petraeus. So in the spring of 2011, Ailes entrusted Fox News analyst K.T. McFarland to pass along a message from Ailes to Petraeus while the general was stationed in Afghanistan: If the president offers you the chairmanship of the Joint Chiefs of Staff, grab it; if not, bag the military and run for president. I might even quit and join your campaign.

This is no flimsy allegation here, either. Woodward scored a 13:46 audio excerpt of the chat between Petraeus and McFarland. It yields several discrete lessons about Fox News.

Lesson 1: Fox News is corrupt.

The top executive at a cable news network passed along unsolicited advice to a general — boosterish, adoring advice. Mind you, the person to whom he passed along this boosterish, adoring advice was at the center one of the country’s most stubborn and critical news stories. No need to consult Poynter.org to determine whether this was a colossal conflict of interest. Don’t get too breathless about this spasm of Ailes political activism, however: It’s not the first time..

Lesson 2: Fox News is corrupt.

The audio of the conversation between McFarland and Petraeus is a must-hear, if only because you can hear the Fox News analyst telling Petraeus: “Everybody at Fox loves you.”

Wonder how that adoration might affect Fox News coverage of the good general. Here’s a notion, from a McFarland piece:

I spent 90 minutes with General Petraeus at his office in Kabul last week. He is truly a asset to our country. Petraeus is a brilliant general and tactician. He’s an inspirational leader. And finally, he’s also got that indescribable something “extra.” His earnest demeanor and intensity make everyone around believe in him and want him to succeed, including all of us here at Fox News.

Bolded add-on inserted for purposes of retroactive accuracy.

Lesson 3: Fox News is corrupt.

Ailes’s craving for the respect and admiration of a military hotshot like Petraeus emerges with Memorex clarity in this recording. For instance, McFarland tells Petraeus that she has a request “directly from [Ailes] to you: First of all, is there anything Fox is doing right or wrong that you want to tell us to do differently.”

Unpacking the depravity in that one is a multi-part process.

No. 1: Real journalists don’t act as supplicants, no matter how wonderful and powerful may be the official they’re interviewing. Real journalists publish their journalism and move on to the next story. If people have problems with or plaudits for the work, they can send an e-mail.

No. 2: Note the promise in McFarland’s proffer. She invites the general to “tell us” to adjust coverage in whatever way he may see fit, in effect soliciting an order from a general. What an affirmation of journalistic independence.

No. 3: To which individuals has Ailes “indirectly” advanced this offer?

Lesson 4: Fox News is corrupt.

The counterarguments against the allegations of corruption above aren’t hard to summon: Ailes is a former Republican operative, so he’ll always have a hand in the game. A journalist buttering up a source in an off-the-record interview is common practice. Hey, all journalists need feedback.

Now, try to fashion an excuse for the offer that McFarland advanced in this exchange:

Petraeus: I actually thought in a sense sort of the editorial policy of Fox had shifted. Now, that…

McFarland: On the online or on the news channel?

Petraeus: Well, I only watch the—I mean, it’s your stories that are online here. But it just struck me it was almost as if because they’re going after Obama, they had to go after Obama’s war as well, actually. And I told that to Bret [Baier] when he was out here. That, again, some of it was headlines….

McFarland: The headlines are easy to fix because the lady who does that is the desk next to mine….

There’s an idea: Invite the general to edit your headlines.

Lesson 5: Fox News is corrupt and nasty.

To listen to the exchange between McFarland and Petraeus is to come away with the distinct impression that McFarland was under specific and binding orders from Ailes. She repeatedly invokes Ailes’s name, his advice and his interest in the career of Petraeus. The mandate to return to Ailes’s New York office with a mouthful of feedback from Petraeus rings from these words of McFarland’s: “So what do I tell Roger when he says…?” She continues spelling out the rules of engagement — how she was supposed to present the advice, and how she was supposed to report back.

Given that dynamic, have a look at how Ailes responded when Woodward asked about the advice-giving mission:

In a telephone interview Monday, the wily and sharp-tongued Ailes said he did indeed ask McFarland to make the pitch to Petraeus. “It was more of a joke, a wiseass way I have,” he said. “I thought the Republican field [in the primaries] needed to be shaken up and Petraeus might be a good candidate.”

Ailes added, “It sounds like she thought she was on a secret mission in the Reagan administration. . . . She was way out of line. . . . It’s someone’s fantasy to make me a kingmaker. It’s not my job.” He said that McFarland was not an employee of Fox but a contributor paid less than $75,000 a year.

Such noble and classy details there from the head of Fox News. Woodward nails you sullying your employer and the industry of journalism, and you tar the messenger. That’s outrageous enough that it could dog someone as untouchable as Roger Ailes.

 
   
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Who taped the conversation?

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 AustonT wrote:
Who taped the conversation?


How did that argument work for Mitt Romney when the 47% comment came to light?


Unless this was less a feint, and more a question? Which, after re-reading it, seems likely. And also, mysterious since no place does it say so.

This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2012/12/04 22:24:01


 lord_blackfang wrote:
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 Ouze wrote:
 AustonT wrote:
Who taped the conversation?


How did that argument work for Mitt Romney when the 47% comment came to light?


Unless this was less a feint, and more a question? Which, after re-reading it, seems likely. And also, mysterious since no place does it say so.

Yeah that was a serious question. I will attempt to frame it more clearly.
If I was a journalist floating the idea of running for office to a general and making some pretty obvious attempts to lay myself and my organization at his feet, how much of a moron would I have to be to record it. If I was the general, why would I keep it if I did record it?
So I assume it wasn't them, and we aren't talking about a fund raiser at a hotel. If an adjunct or staffer in uniform recorded the generals conversations without his knowledge I'm pretty sure there's an article offense for that.
It begs the questions:
Where did it happen
who was there
who taped the conversation
how the hell did Bob mothereffing Woodward get it

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Well yeah. FOX isn't just biased, it's an active player in Republican politics, picking and choosing which people it boosts and who it attacks, largely to further Ailes own political standing (Murdoch has reportedly threatened Ailes in the past when he's been too overtly partisan, but ultimately FOX brings in money, and Murdoch won't change anything as long as the cash rolls in).

One of Romney's biggest problems during the primary was that FOX news gave him terrible coverage, they kept searching around for someone, anyone, that could beat him. It was only when it became clear everyone else running for the Republican nomination was KNOCK OFF THE PROFANITY-Mannahnin crazy and Romney was going to win that they fell into line and started boosting him.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
 Lt. Coldfire wrote:
lol sounds about right to me. I don't watch much Fox News or any news for that matter, but I will say it's nice to see someone going against the left wing media machine, which is obviously very powerful when they can get a nobody from Chicago elected not once, but twice. And people complain about Fox "trying" to get Petraeus to run for Prez? Please.


When you have footage of media networks going to potential Democratic presidential candidates and telling them if they run the network will be behind them, and the owner of the network will bankroll the campaign, then maybe you'll have some kind of point.

Even then you still wouldn't have an excuse for FOX news' corrupt, deceitful practices, just a claim that other organisations are also corrupt and deceitful.

This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2012/12/05 06:36:31


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Adam Smith, who must have been some kind of leftie or something. 
   
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Well...

I mean, we could separate an individual's behavior from the over-arching goals of the company they own though, couldn't we?

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2012/12/05 06:22:41


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We're not talking about the owner right now, though, but rather the guy he employs to run the news network.

Also the general editorial policy of that news network, and this interesting disclosure of how eager and willing the folks running it were to offer favors and support to a candidate, in contradiction to journalistic principles of honesty and independence.

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That makes sense.

Still, and I don't watch or listen to Fox any more than any other news source, but I think if you read the statements in the story in the OP without prejudice you might see them as simply the words of a reporter who genuinely admires their interviewee. Also, without context, some of those statements could pertain to any number of things.

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KNOCK OFF THE PROFANITY-Mannahnin


Sorry, that was careless of me.

“We may observe that the government in a civilized country is much more expensive than in a barbarous one; and when we say that one government is more expensive than another, it is the same as if we said that that one country is farther advanced in improvement than another. To say that the government is expensive and the people not oppressed is to say that the people are rich.”

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MR- Maybe I have an excessively idealistic concept of journalism, but telling a political figure that you can get headlines changed if he doesn't like them seems kind of appalling to me. And that was just one of several things in there.

Seb- The filter can't catch all the compound word variants. People need to police themselves on those.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2012/12/05 06:55:54


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 Monster Rain wrote:
That makes sense.

Still, and I don't watch or listen to Fox any more than any other news source, but I think if you read the statements in the story in the OP without prejudice you might see them as simply the words of a reporter who genuinely admires their interviewee. Also, without context, some of those statements could pertain to any number of things.


Are you claiming the context given isn't accurate?

I mean, the idea that FOX is playing a role in lining up its preferred candidates for office is on the 'well, yeah, we know that already though it's nice to have more concrete substantiation' side of the scale, not the 'oh my god this shocking claim is totally outrageous and if true will break my understanding of the modern media entirely' side.

“We may observe that the government in a civilized country is much more expensive than in a barbarous one; and when we say that one government is more expensive than another, it is the same as if we said that that one country is farther advanced in improvement than another. To say that the government is expensive and the people not oppressed is to say that the people are rich.”

Adam Smith, who must have been some kind of leftie or something. 
   
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My question would be whether the reporter was asking what Fox could do differently in regard to potential political advancement for a particular candidate, or whether they were asking in regard to their coverage of the military in general.

Let us not forget the Geraldo incident.

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 Howard A Treesong wrote:
People who think there's a left wing bias that needs balancing out in the American media simply have a distorted sense of the political spectrum. If you're a frothing right winger everyone seems to the left of you, it doesn't mean they are actually left wing...


Honestly, can you not see your own bias in your posts at all? Any of you? Are the insults aimed at the other side necessary?

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 Luco wrote:
 Howard A Treesong wrote:
People who think there's a left wing bias that needs balancing out in the American media simply have a distorted sense of the political spectrum. If you're a frothing right winger everyone seems to the left of you, it doesn't mean they are actually left wing...


Honestly, can you not see your own bias in your posts at all? Any of you? Are the insults aimed at the other side necessary?


Look at his flag. Over here in europe we have political parties that span the entire political spectrum, rather than "right" and "further right". Also, "socialist" isn't a dirty word and a valid insult of someone who advocates something you don't like.

   
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Monster Rain wrote:Well...

I mean, we could separate an individual's behavior from the over-arching goals of the company they own though, couldn't we?

Only in the sense that you can tell your limo driver to run someone down, and claim the car's behaviour was separate from your own.
   
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 azazel the cat wrote:
Monster Rain wrote:Well...

I mean, we could separate an individual's behavior from the over-arching goals of the company they own though, couldn't we?

Only in the sense that you can tell your limo driver to run someone down, and claim the car's behaviour was separate from your own.


OT, but we actually had a politician do that over here in PIG country. Not actually run someone down but run a red light while speeding which caused a rather serious and predictable car accident.

The driver was found guilty and sentenced to jail with a suspended sentence, the politician in the back of the car walked away stock free...
   
 
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