Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you: No adverts like this in the forums anymore. Times and dates in your local timezone. Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance. Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely. Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net. If you are already a member then feel free to login now.

So I've been looking into the horus heresy a little and I've been wondering:

Although half the chapters rebelled, does this mean that every member of those chapters did too?

surely some of Horus' men would've turned against him for love of the emperor?

Yes. The traitor legions purged the disloyal members on Istvann 3

There were loyalist members of traitor legions as well. Mhotep of the Thousand Sons comes to mind.

Before and during Istavvan III (Sorry for misspelling)The traitor legion did a purging to all their brethren who were loyal to the EOM and not their primarchs

You may have heard the name Nathaniel Garro and Saul Travitz.

Garro was a Death Guard captain who escaped and informed the Imperium of Man of Horus and his betrayal and would later help in the founding of the Inquisition/Grey Knights

Saul Travitz was a Captain of the Emperor's Children who warned the loyalist to take shelter and commanded the loyalist forces on Istavaan III during Horus military actions against him.



By the end of the fighting on Istavaan III the traitor legions had lost 1/3 of their strength with the World Eaters losing even more




Also, at this time, everyone is a legion. Chapters exist INSIDE legions like Companies in Chapters

Every traitor chapter had loyalists who were purged. Some more then others. For instance, Alpha Legion, Night Lords, and Iron Warriors dissenters seem to be few and far between whereas the Death Guard and Sons of Horus had quite a few.

 Harriticus wrote:
Night Lords,

Night Lords were essentially traitors before the Heresy even happened. That being said, Sevatar did become a Grey Knight.

 DarknessEternal wrote:

 Harriticus wrote:
Night Lords,

Night Lords were essentially traitors before the Heresy even happened. That being said, Sevatar did become a Grey Knight.

Really? Which book was that in? If it was prince of crows, that gives me another reason to reread it...

 motyak wrote:

 DarknessEternal wrote:

 Harriticus wrote:
Night Lords,

Night Lords were essentially traitors before the Heresy even happened. That being said, Sevatar did become a Grey Knight.

Really? Which book was that in? If it was prince of crows, that gives me another reason to reread it...

It's not in any book.

Is it actually true then?

If you can stomach them, the HH books give all sorts of information (surprisingly ) on the HH.

Personally I would not bother as I did not really find any of them that enjoyable and some were just dire.

 4oursword wrote:
Is it actually true then?

No, it's pure speculation and a theory I've never heard before. Do you really think Sevatar, the man to coin the phrase "Death To The False Emperor", will become a Grey Knight?

 Just Dave wrote:

 4oursword wrote:
Is it actually true then?

No, it's pure speculation and a theory I've never heard before. Do you really think Sevatar, the man to coin the phrase "Death To The False Emperor", will become a Grey Knight?

I was really surprised when he/she said that, just figured that I had missed some 'flash forwards' or something

 motyak wrote:

 Just Dave wrote:

 4oursword wrote:
Is it actually true then?

No, it's pure speculation and a theory I've never heard before. Do you really think Sevatar, the man to coin the phrase "Death To The False Emperor", will become a Grey Knight?

I was really surprised when he/she said that, just figured that I had missed some 'flash forwards' or something

So was I! I've not heard it before or seen anything to imply that to be the case, minus the new(?) revelation about Sevatar's 'abilities' (see spoiler) in Prince of Crows, but considering the source of the theory, I'm not inclined to believe it.

Ahh remember the good old last stand of the still loyal World Eaters, using all those dead bodies of civilians (Dont know if it were civilians, but at least they were dead.) as some kind of barricade. They held out pretty long.

Err, Sevatar died and died very badly...

In the Night Lords novel trilogy, when Sevatar was first introduced, he was mentioned as being the possible only person to have fully kept the legion together. Except that he was very, very long dead.

ADB also mentioned that there's no real drama in heresy stories if the characters you're following end up being around 10000 years later.

 The Grumpy Eldar wrote:
Ahh remember the good old last stand of the still loyal World Eaters, using all those dead bodies of civilians (Dont know if it were civilians, but at least they were dead.) as some kind of barricade. They held out pretty long.

Did they? I always assumed they fell quite quickly since they were dealing with their Primarch.

Which makes me wonder, why didn't he (and the other Primarchs) attack the other Loyalists? Seems like they were just searching for a way for the Loyalists to deal real damage on the Traitors, when they really should've been destroyed a lot quicker, especially considering the way they did eventually end it.

SomeRandomEvilGuy wrote:

 The Grumpy Eldar wrote:
Ahh remember the good old last stand of the still loyal World Eaters, using all those dead bodies of civilians (Dont know if it were civilians, but at least they were dead.) as some kind of barricade. They held out pretty long.

Which makes me wonder, why didn't he (and the other Primarchs) attack the other Loyalists? Seems like they were just searching for a way for the Loyalists to deal real damage on the Traitors, when they really should've been destroyed a lot quicker, especially considering the way they did eventually end it.

Well, IIRC, Horus actually A) didn't expect anyone to survive (thanks Saul) and B) was just going to leave them there or nuke 'em some more; it's only because Angron went down to the surface and put a spanner in these plans that Horus had to commit forces to finishing them off at all. So yeah, they would've been destroyed a lot quicker (or left stranded) if it all went as Horus planned.

 Just Dave wrote:

Well, IIRC, Horus actually A) didn't expect anyone to survive (thanks Saul) and B) was just going to leave them there or nuke 'em some more; it's only because Angron went down to the surface and put a spanner in these plans that Horus had to commit forces to finishing them off at all. So yeah, they would've been destroyed a lot quicker (or left stranded) if it all went as Horus planned.

Yeah, but if the Primarchs themselves had gotten involved it would've ended a lot quicker. I mean, unless Angron spent ages fighting the World Eaters (unlikely) he stopped fighting well before the end and presumably did something else. Even still, the Emperors Children and Sons of Horus could easily have been bombarded from orbit even with Angron fighting elsewhere.

I dunno, I think as you said it was a bit of a plot element (for the loyalists to get some back and stretch it out), but I guess there could be some other variables we don't know of (I've not read the FW book for example)...? In the end it did have the benefit of getting the traitors used to being traitorous (as well as when they fought the aurelian technocracy) though.

 SilverMK2 wrote:
If you can stomach them, the HH books give all sorts of information (surprisingly ) on the HH.

Personally I would not bother as I did not really find any of them that enjoyable and some were just dire.

If you would like to read more check out the HH book series.

Its also a popular series that a lot of people enjoy for being well written

He uh, just said he didn't like them, lol.

 Void__Dragon wrote:
He uh, just said he didn't like them, lol.

I think that was his joke

I just wanted to shoot myself by the end of the books. Granted there are plenty of people who really enjoy them - just putting it out there that you might want to take it one book at a time if you are ordering them rather than getting the whole set at once to see if you like it

At a fun note Lawful Neutral Incubi seems to be a fad nowadays. Everyone seems to possess one, just like Space Marine Chapters.

 SilverMK2 wrote:

 Void__Dragon wrote:
He uh, just said he didn't like them, lol.

I think that was his joke

I just wanted to shoot myself by the end of the books. Granted there are plenty of people who really enjoy them - just putting it out there that you might want to take it one book at a time if you are ordering them rather than getting the whole set at once to see if you like it

Ya, I understand that not everyone likes them. Thats fine

It was just a light hearted statement, everyone has different oppinions.


I do agree that if someone does read the series, buy one book at a time and think about the topic before you buy it. Not every book is for everyone. I personally found Mechanicum a pain to finish, I was unable to even get halfway through Prospero Burns, find the idea of Outcast Dead boring, and I refuse to read Legion cause the story is awful sounding.

I'll read Legion just to get angry about something.

Apparently it started the process of inserting Highlanders into 40k. Which would be fine, if a certain background character was not later revealed to be one.

Legion is probably one book that I won't read no matter how much I love Abnett, because mission impossible marines and Cabal in general are IMHO awful....

Sergeant Revuel Arvida of the Thousand Sons Fourth Fellowship renounced Magnus as unworthy of his loyalty after returning to Prospero and noting Magnus' failure to protect the planet. He was also a rare Thousand Son who never shared his legion's devotion to their Primarch.



Captain Menes Kalliston of the Fourth Fellowship was accompanied Revuel Arvida, but he captured by the World Eaters and brought before Kharn. He learned of Horus' treachery and Magnus' actions, but he renounced Magnus internally, calling his actions as insane or so incomprehensibly evil that any further loyalty to his as meaningless. He was later killed by Kharn but before his death foresaw Kharn (and those like him) as ultimately bringing about their own destruction.

Captain Barabbas Dantioch of the Iron Warriors 14th Grand Company (or rather, its garrisoned elements on Lesser Damantyne) remained loyal to the Emperor.