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I know very well these are not Infinity figures, my opinion still stands, the fewer parts a model has the better it looks, fused weapons and arms, great, at least they will look as if they hold the weapon instead of simply touching them.

 PsychoticStorm wrote:
I know very well these are not Infinity figures, my opinion still stands, the fewer parts a model has the better it looks, fused weapons and arms, great, at least they will look as if they hold the weapon instead of simply touching them.

That really is entirely up to how neatly you cut/file/glue separate weapons/arms (left hand a bit less, but take for example the new tau pathfinders - it works OK there...) rather than whether they're molded on or not.

Watched the Mantic Kings of War week vids on their youtube channel today. Pretty interesting seeing the process of casting metal minis, doing photo shoots and other graphical wizardry.

 Bolognesus wrote:

 PsychoticStorm wrote:
I know very well these are not Infinity figures, my opinion still stands, the fewer parts a model has the better it looks, fused weapons and arms, great, at least they will look as if they hold the weapon instead of simply touching them.

That really is entirely up to how neatly you cut/file/glue separate weapons/arms (left hand a bit less, but take for example the new tau pathfinders - it works OK there...) rather than whether they're molded on or not.

No, seriously. Moulded arm + weapon is a hell of a lot better. Anything else gives you the playmobil effect where the fingers aren't actually gripping all the way around the weapon.

 scarletsquig wrote:

 Bolognesus wrote:

 PsychoticStorm wrote:
I know very well these are not Infinity figures, my opinion still stands, the fewer parts a model has the better it looks, fused weapons and arms, great, at least they will look as if they hold the weapon instead of simply touching them.

That really is entirely up to how neatly you cut/file/glue separate weapons/arms (left hand a bit less, but take for example the new tau pathfinders - it works OK there...) rather than whether they're molded on or not.

No, seriously. Moulded arm + weapon is a hell of a lot better. Anything else gives you the playmobil effect where the fingers aren't actually gripping all the way around the weapon.

Now if you would, for example, oh I don't know, actually check out the new pathfinder kit (as I might have actually just mentioned... -_-' ) you'll see this is not actually true.

The reason it used to be the case is that manual sculpting techniques seem to lead to some laziness where. either in sculpting or tooling, the fit is not made sufficiently exactly flush.
Those pathfinders (one of GW's nicer kits in quite a while, actually!) demonstrate how nicely flush the fingers of a separate left hand can lie against the weapon.
Really, next time you care to blindly repeat an assertion you might want to check the counterarguments already given, first.

Left hands holding weapons, yes.

Not right hands, or any hand that needs to grip around the whole weapon rather than just 3 sides of it... that results in the playmobil effect, as modelled by this WGF orc:



I'll be getting around 150 baslieans with playmobil hands mailed to me in a couple of weeks, so I'm very keen to voice my opinion on this topic in the hopes that it doesn't happen again. Enforcers sprue layout as it stands looks perfect to me, very happy that the hands are gripping the weapons. Separate left hands on a 2-handed rifle is fine.

It's a relatively minor piece of quality/ polish in a kit, but it is important and is one of the little pieces of attention to detail that make, for example, Perry Minis kits that little bit better than Warlord Games kits.

Well as far as I can even figure out what the feth you're on about at this point, nice shifting of the goalposts. We were talking the enforcers' weapons; I hope you *will* agree that holding some kind of pistol grip in a molded hand (say space marine style for example) would be enough to get past that problem?

The great big fething problem here is the *left* hands around the guns. That makes them gak to convert. that the right hand is fine holding some pistol grip ish component was plainly not what any of us had issues with.

Oh and to get back to those space marines - those do fine with separate weapons. a matter of having that grip molded in the hand which is fine for conversion purposes as well as quick glue-together and play models just the same. the left hands are what will make these things horrible to work with.

I don't think it'll be a problem, looks fine to me.

Conversions where a 2-handed rifle is being held in 1 hand don't always look that great. Filing off the hand shouldn't be a problem if you do want a fire from the hip pose.

I'd rather have the basic minis looking good rather than a million different separate bits. Separate heads and arms is all I need, it's only just recently that mantic stopped making 2-part minis on its sprues, so as long as those don't make a comeback I'm happy.

I think Plastic Space marine hands do the job well, while still leaving enough options to do what you want to do without filing and cutting hands off weapons. Space marine option B where the hands are attached to the weapon (ie Plasma Pistols) but easily removed also works.

The thing is of course that the GW space marine setup does the job "done" only if you have low expectations.

I was not sure how to describe it but "playmobile" syndrome sounds about right, the hand does not grasp the rifles hand guard it is just around it, yes it is easier to "convert" this way, but at the expense of the models overall quality.

Personally I would rather have better sculpts than have many parts to glue together and say I have made a conversion.

As nice looking as the Enforcers are, they don't touch the GW plastic space marines. My opinion, of course.

Well they are more adventurous and modern design than GW sculpts, not that mantic is the best of the best out there regarding quality.

In any case I was discussing the merits of having hands sculpted on a weapon instead of having them separate and unnatural.

 Azazelx wrote:
As nice looking as the Enforcers are, they don't touch the GW plastic space marines. My opinion, of course.

Dreamforge Valkir (what we've seen of them) > Enforcers (what little I've seen of them) > SM imo. I've never liked the SM aesthetic sadly, or at least how it comes out on the tabletop. It looked (and felt!) pretty good in the Space Marine game.

I think that's kind of unfair to compare anything to the Valkir. They just look way better than pretty much anything else on the market right now.

This current argument... I'm having a hard time understanding it. Are we arguing about having fewer parts for a better sculpt being superior to more parts allowing more variety at the cost of the sculpt? If that's the argument, I think it's good to have a middle road and I think Mantic hit it. They've got just enough parts available to provide several different poses while keeping the leftovers limited.

The more I think about it, the concept of having the hand molded onto the gun with a clever connector design to the wrist could be perfect.

I'm not quite sure HOW you'd go about doing that wrist design but it could very well work...

Interesting bringing up the Valkir (from Dreamforge Wave 3... one day!). Between the Enforcers and those, players will suddenly have a plethora of alternate power armored models! Also including companies like Anvil.

It's a good time to be a wargamer

 Barzam wrote:
I think that's kind of unfair to compare anything to the Valkir. They just look way better than pretty much anything else on the market right now.

To be fair, though, the Valkir are not on the market right now.

Submitted a second survey this morning so as to drop the Enforcer Sergeant and Cypher Prime - they don't seem to be answering questions on the sprue changes and I guess I'm getting them on the sprues now so why pay more for them separately?

Saved me $10 (except I added another Ruined BZ so they got another $15 from me!). I wonder how many surveys they are going to have to work through when this finishes today a lot of people seem to be submitting multiple surveys.

EDIT:

So I guess the KS Enforcer starter will now contain

2 Enforcer Hard Plastic sprues - Parts to make 10 Enforcers with armed with Rifles, Assault weapons, Rocket launcher, Incinerator, Burst laser, Sergeant upgrade
1 Restic Captain
1 Restic Engineer with 2 Restic Sentry Guns
1 Restic Sniper

 scarletsquig wrote:
I don't think it'll be a problem, looks fine to me.

Conversions where a 2-handed rifle is being held in 1 hand don't always look that great. Filing off the hand shouldn't be a problem if you do want a fire from the hip pose.

I'd rather have the basic minis looking good rather than a million different separate bits. Separate heads and arms is all I need, it's only just recently that mantic stopped making 2-part minis on its sprues, so as long as those don't make a comeback I'm happy.

No, you don't quite get it.
I want to get the whole fething ridiculous rifle off of what is otherwise a decent mini and stick a decent gun up there. dremeling a gun out of a hand holding it if a pretty damn annoying yob, and it destroys the gun so it's not useful for scenery anymore. I'll admit the latter point isn't all that relevant but the former one damn well is...

Looks like there's going to be some deadzone testing next week if you have some models to test with, according to Quirkworthy.

With that in mind, you can treat this as a heads up, or a warning order (if you’re feeling particularly military) for some Deadzone stuff in the next week-ish. There will only be a very short window to test it out, so if you want to join in now’s the time to get the stuff ready that you’ll need.

 Azazelx wrote:
As nice looking as the Enforcers are, they don't touch the GW plastic space marines. My opinion, of course.

I would have to go for the Enforcers, simply on the basis that I've built at least 8 thousand space marines over the years, and if I ever pick up another one my head will explode like I've been punched by the Fist of the North Star!

Realise that it's purely subjective however, if I was a newbie coming into wargaming I guess the marine concept would have the edge (although both of them look cool).

 Pacific wrote:

I would have to go for the Enforcers, simply on the basis that I've built at least 8 thousand space marines over the years, and if I ever pick up another one my head will explode like I've been punched by the Fist of the North Star! .

I would pay good money for somebody to give me a tabletop Kenshiro. Maybe a few of the Nanto stars as well. Plus Raoh of course.

Kenshiro could put those pesky first gens down without breaking a sweat.

Does anyone know if anything that was slated for the second shipment got moved into the first shipment?

90% of my Mantic KS order is going to be from the Forgefather starter and booster, and I was wondering if they are coming any sooner than Q2 2014, on which case I would bump them up on my order priority to be on my first shipment survey, rather than the second.

Also, I'm confused as to what's going on with the hard plastic kits. They looks to contain models from both the starters and the boosters, so how is that going to affect ordering models from each set? For instance, all the Forgefather exo-armor troops are going to hard plastic, and they mention the missile launcher in the set, though it's a booster figure.

Update!

Mechanized Stunts
Update #104 · Aug 1, 2013 · 4 comments

After the exciting news of hard plastic Enforcers, Forge Fathers Forge Guard and Asterian Cyphers, we’ve got the first renders of the Goblin Stuntbot - check it out below:

Let us know what you think in the comments!

You know, I still don't quite understand what's going on with the plastic sprues. I ordered tons of Enforcer add-ons and some single poses, and I'm not sure what i'm getting anymore.

Hmm, that Stuntbot looks familiar, oh wait! http://www.kickstarter.com/projects/131182444/assimilation-alien-host/posts/342119

 Malika2 wrote:
Hmm, that Stuntbot looks familiar, oh wait! http://www.kickstarter.com/projects/131182444/assimilation-alien-host/posts/342119

Aside from very obvious differences in how the legs support it, the way the arms look and are armed, and the look of the torso, you are correct, it IS a sci-fi battlesuit!

The stuntbot looks cool! Which makes sense, since I love the concept art for the alien assimilation host one, too

Creator Mantic Games about 2 hours ago

Hey guys - the hatch is removeable and there is a goblin pilot sculpted into the torso, just like on the concept art It's identical to the concept art - in fact, it's sculpted BY the guy who did the concept art!

They probably should have included him in the picture, but, there you go!

I kinda like it. And yeah, I would like clarification on the plastic sprue thing as I'm going to dive in head first on the second survey for quite a bit.