Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you: No adverts like this in the forums anymore. Times and dates in your local timezone. Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance. Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely. Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net. If you are already a member then feel free to login now.

MadEdric wrote:

I'm a generous tipper, usually about 20%, but I'm never going to look down on a person who refuses to tip.

If someone can't afford to tip, or refuses to tip decently, that person shouldn't eat at a restaurant where tipping is expected.

MadEdric wrote:
This is a typical example of Internet outrage.
I saw the post on Reddit and just shrugged. There will be jerks out there, no need to get bent about it, and certainly don't post it unless you want to get fired.
Then of course the gangs on the internet get all high and mighty about it, I'm sure most because it was a Pastor that did it (religion=evil to this group of people), blowing one small thing into a national crisis.

Yeah...
Not really. Most people would "get upset about it" because it's a Pastor (someone who is supposed to be setting a good example and to be an exemplar of their faith's teachings) disputing an automatic gratuity (which is standard policy in most large dining establishments that do not have playgrounds, happy meals with toys, or a drive through window) that was levied on her party because they had a large number of persons in the party.

To top it off, she then decided to make a smarmy remark on the receipt belittling the server.

People if you want to get upset, get upset that the serving industry is set up the way it is. That restaurants pay minimum wage and defend this because of tipping.
I'm a generous tipper, usually about 20%, but I'm never going to look down on a person who refuses to tip.

It has nothing to do with the tips or refusal to tip. It's the way the Pastor decided to refuse to tip.

As has been mentioned previously, a large party is going to take most of a server's attention during the time that party is present. That means less chances to get tips--or in some cases, only a single chance to get a tip depending on the size of the party and the length of time they spend at the establishment.

To counteract that, many establishments have an automatic gratuity which you are charged if your party is a certain size regardless of whether or not everyone gets a single check.
The pastor reputedly tried to get around this by requesting multiple checks, and when that failed she refused to authorize the gratuity and left a smart remark which clearly was belittling to the server.

MadEdric wrote:
This is a typical example of Internet outrage.
I saw the post on Reddit and just shrugged. There will be jerks out there, no need to get bent about it, and certainly don't post it unless you want to get fired.
Then of course the gangs on the internet get all high and mighty about it, I'm sure most because it was a Pastor that did it (religion=evil to this group of people), blowing one small thing into a national crisis.
People if you want to get upset, get upset that the serving industry is set up the way it is. That restaurants pay minimum wage and defend this because of tipping.
I'm a generous tipper, usually about 20%, but I'm never going to look down on a person who refuses to tip.

Hey, let's clear one thing up. We ("internet people") didn't make this about her religion. She did. She endorsed that message and her actions in her official capacity as pastor, representing herself, her constituency (I think there's a better word for that), and her religion. That's on her.

As far as it being internet outrage? Well, yeah, probably. Is it a valid target of internet outrage? Well, maybe some popular opinion to turn this wretch into a social pariah wouldn't be such a bad thing.

At any rate, beyond coming down from your ivory tower yourself to tell all us low people about how we're wasting our time feeding the hate machine, what's your point?

Tipping your waiter is good behavior. It is about customs and courtesies. This is how we do things.
Be nice.

castellan wrote:
Tipping your waiter is good behavior. It is about customs and courtesies. This is how we do things.
Be nice.

Very well said indeed.

castellan wrote:
Tipping your waiter is good behavior. It is about customs and courtesies. This is how we do things.
Be nice.

In the face of a bad waiter, I refuse to be "good"

Now by bad waiter, I don't mean tripping up on the order, or screwing up how they cooked my steak (that's most likely the cooks fault anyways). I don't even mind if the food is bad (I just won't ever come back). However, one of the biggest factors that lead to me slashing the tip amount is when a waiter basically ignores me when I need a refill. There was one particular time when the waitress walked past me several times during the course of my visit, and not once refilled my drink. I kept nudging it closer and closer to the table edge, and still she did nothing. Then she went and asked me if I wanted a to go cup when I left. She wound up with no tip, on top of some other jazz.

The whole tip out of pity does nothing for me either. If the job sucks so much, get a different one. Taking waiter out of the possible job choices will not shrink the pool to unacceptable levels.

I treat a tip much like respect. It is earned, not simply given.

Know, I always tip, Why? Because tips get pooled at the end of the day, So im stiffing the nice people aswell.
What i dont get is tips in places that dont serve you, like starbucks or subway.

 hotsauceman1 wrote:
Know, I always tip, Why? Because tips get pooled at the end of the day, So im stiffing the nice people aswell.
What i dont get is tips in places that dont serve you, like starbucks or subway.

Except that in those places, they do serve you. The hipster at the Starbucks is just as much a waiter/waitress as the guy that brings food and drinks to your table. A good "barista" (i.e. coffee maker at a coffee shop) is almost as important as a good bartender at a bar.

 Alfndrate wrote:
Except that in those places, they do serve you. The hipster at the Starbucks is just as much a waiter/waitress as the guy that brings food and drinks to your table. A good "barista" (i.e. coffee maker at a coffee shop) is almost as important as a good bartender at a bar.

We were told that you only tip if they bring food to your table because there's actually someone serving. If you wait until they call your number and then you grab it, like at Starbucks, then you don't tip. There is skill in coffee making, but that's what paying for the coffee is about.



Anyhow, as confusing as tipping was for us when we were in the US, I was won over pretty quickly to tipping. The strength of the system is clear in the results - service in the US is amazing. The worst service my wife and I got in the US was better than just about any service we've gotten here in Australia.

Necroshea wrote:

castellan wrote:
Tipping your waiter is good behavior. It is about customs and courtesies. This is how we do things.
Be nice.

In the face of a bad waiter, I refuse to be "good"

Now by bad waiter, I don't mean tripping up on the order, or screwing up how they cooked my steak (that's most likely the cooks fault anyways). I don't even mind if the food is bad (I just won't ever come back). However, one of the biggest factors that lead to me slashing the tip amount is when a waiter basically ignores me when I need a refill. There was one particular time when the waitress walked past me several times during the course of my visit, and not once refilled my drink. I kept nudging it closer and closer to the table edge, and still she did nothing. Then she went and asked me if I wanted a to go cup when I left. She wound up with no tip, on top of some other jazz.

The whole tip out of pity does nothing for me either. If the job sucks so much, get a different one. Taking waiter out of the possible job choices will not shrink the pool to unacceptable levels.

I treat a tip much like respect. It is earned, not simply given.

I don't have a problem with low tipping if the server himself or herself did a poor job or was rude or behaved inappropriately, although I've eaten in a lot of different restaurants in a lot of different places and can't remember ever getting a server that I thought did a bad enough job to warrant being stiffed or getting an especially low tip. It's also important to take how busy the restaurant is into account. A customer shouldn't realistically expect to have the same speedy service during a Friday or Saturday night dinner rush while the place is completely packed as on a Monday or Tuesday when no one else is in the restaurant.

And while I do think good servers should be attentive to a patron's needs, including drink refills, it's possible she jut didn't notice your cup was empty. Rather than silently nudging your glass, just asking, "Excuse me, could I please get a refill?" the next time the server came by would have been a better way to solve the problem, rather than continually waiting and saying nothing and just ending up giving a poor tip at the end. It could also be the case that she kept seeing you fiddle with your cup and just figured you still had something to drink.

hotsauceman1 wrote:Know, I always tip, Why? Because tips get pooled at the end of the day, So im stiffing the nice people aswell.
What i dont get is tips in places that dont serve you, like starbucks or subway.

Not all places pool or share tips. It varies depending on the restaurant and sometimes the location.



Automatically Appended Next Post:

 sebster wrote:

 Alfndrate wrote:
Except that in those places, they do serve you. The hipster at the Starbucks is just as much a waiter/waitress as the guy that brings food and drinks to your table. A good "barista" (i.e. coffee maker at a coffee shop) is almost as important as a good bartender at a bar.

We were told that you only tip if they bring food to your table because there's actually someone serving. If you wait until they call your number and then you grab it, like at Starbucks, then you don't tip. There is skill in coffee making, but that's what paying for the coffee is about.

As far as places like Starbucks go, you wouldn't normally tip on a whole order. Usually there is just a common tip jar. It's appropriate to leave a dollar now and then, especially if service was particularly good. It always is appreciated, but it's not as important as tipping at a sit down restaurant where the servers' hourly wage is under minimum. It also depends on what you're getting. If you order a bottle of water or a just a cup of filter coffee I wouldn't worry about it, but if you order a giant fancy espresso drink that takes forever, or if you order multiple drinks and several pastries, throwing a dollar in the jar is a nice gesture.

 Necroshea wrote:

castellan wrote:
Tipping your waiter is good behavior. It is about customs and courtesies. This is how we do things.
Be nice.

In the face of a bad waiter, I refuse to be "good"

Being nice is not the same thing as playing dumb.

 Hordini wrote:
As far as places like Starbucks go, you wouldn't normally tip on a whole order. Usually there is just a common tip jar. It's appropriate to leave a dollar now and then, especially if service was particularly good. It always is appreciated, but it's not as important as tipping at a sit down restaurant where the servers' hourly wage is under minimum. It also depends on what you're getting. If you order a bottle of water or a just a cup of filter coffee I wouldn't worry about it, but if you order a giant fancy espresso drink that takes forever, or if you order multiple drinks and several pastries, throwing a dollar in the jar is a nice gesture.

That makes sense, thanks.

 sebster wrote:

 Hordini wrote:
As far as places like Starbucks go, you wouldn't normally tip on a whole order. Usually there is just a common tip jar. It's appropriate to leave a dollar now and then, especially if service was particularly good. It always is appreciated, but it's not as important as tipping at a sit down restaurant where the servers' hourly wage is under minimum. It also depends on what you're getting. If you order a bottle of water or a just a cup of filter coffee I wouldn't worry about it, but if you order a giant fancy espresso drink that takes forever, or if you order multiple drinks and several pastries, throwing a dollar in the jar is a nice gesture.

That makes sense, thanks.

Yup, I rarely go into the local starbucks, but when I do, I get a coffee with a little bit of room for my creams and or sugars. Not enough time, effort, or imagination for me to feel the service was good enough. Though I have several co-workers that go around three times a day (I tend to drink the office swill), and they give tips to their favorite baristas, but it is far from a required thing. Tipping when a particular person is on shift, can tend to lead to things like the occasional free "tall" coffee (their smallest size), or even some pastry, but that is often the server returning the favor of tips and a hope for more down the road.

It's all up to you, hell I got tipped on my old paper route, even though I was "paid" in minimum wage (it was barely like 6 bucks an hour, considering I only worked 2 hours a week), I got tipped because the collection for bills would be 3.50, and it'd be easier to just hand me 4 bucks. There were several people during the holidays that would drop a 20 in my hand, and I'd listen to any complaints and write notes on their cards if they needed/wanted adjustments to their delivery. Tipping is meant to be a thank you for good service, and in a hope for better/continued tips, you provide good or better service than you did. I won't lie when I say that I gave preferential treatment to those that tipped over those that didn't.

 sebster wrote:

 Hordini wrote:
As far as places like Starbucks go, you wouldn't normally tip on a whole order. Usually there is just a common tip jar. It's appropriate to leave a dollar now and then, especially if service was particularly good. It always is appreciated, but it's not as important as tipping at a sit down restaurant where the servers' hourly wage is under minimum. It also depends on what you're getting. If you order a bottle of water or a just a cup of filter coffee I wouldn't worry about it, but if you order a giant fancy espresso drink that takes forever, or if you order multiple drinks and several pastries, throwing a dollar in the jar is a nice gesture.

That makes sense, thanks.

Speaking as someone who worked for quite some time at Starbucks, as well as at other coffee shops, this is basically it. Tips aren't generally expected, but they're certainly appreciated, especially if you have a huge group and you all order super complex and/or large drinks that take up more time than usual.

 Hordini wrote:
Not all places pool or share tips. It varies depending on the restaurant and sometimes the location.

When I know for certain a restaurant pools tips, I try to leave mine in cash.

Tipping in America is extremely weird.

Or rather, not actual tipping...

 Soladrin wrote:
Tipping in America is extremely weird.

Or rather, not actual tipping...

I went to a sports bar where a friend worked, and for tip I wrote down helpful life advice, "like always wrap it before you tap it" and then I gave her a monetary tip as well.

 Alfndrate wrote:

 Soladrin wrote:
Tipping in America is extremely weird.

Or rather, not actual tipping...

I went to a sports bar where a friend worked, and for tip I wrote down helpful life advice, "like always wrap it before you tap it" and then I gave her a monetary tip as well.

I would have given her the whole thing.

Servers in the US do not get paid much and tips are all they really have to go on.

Most people in the U.S. tip, some tip well, others tip not so great, but as a server you have to do your best and make sure everything went well. If you do your best you should be rewarded.

That said however if you do not like that people can just not tip you find a different job.

 DeathReaper wrote:
That said however if you do not like that people can just not tip you find a different job.

Spoken like one who hasn't had to look for a different job in the past five years...

I remember seeing this reciept a while back....how is this news again? This reciept pops up here and there with the OMG this just happened! when I read it somewhere months or a year ago.

I will absolutely never leave a dime in a Starbucks jar, to which I only ever get drive-through. it's not different than having a tip jar at McDonalds or Taco Bell. "Tipped employee" has a specific legal meaning in this country.

Paitryn wrote:
I remember seeing this reciept a while back....how is this news again? This reciept pops up here and there with the OMG this just happened! when I read it somewhere months or a year ago.

This story broke like a week ago. You're thinking of something else.

 DeathReaper wrote:
I would have given her the whole thing.

Snicker.

 Vulcan wrote:

 DeathReaper wrote:
That said however if you do not like that people can just not tip you find a different job.

Spoken like one who hasn't had to look for a different job in the past five years...

I have not had to look for a different job in the past five years.

I used to be a Bartender/Server at a restaurant next to the train line that serviced O'Hare Airport (One of the busiest airports in the world). I got tired of the foreign people not understanding that tipping was relied upon in the U.S. to earn a good wage.

I got tired of getting an 8% tip when I gave great service and the customer had no complaints.

So I got out of the bartender/server business and I am satisfied.

I loved being a server/bartender. Some lunch shifts (11 am- 2pm) I would make $50 in tips. Some dinner shifts (5-10) I would make $80 in tips. Once I had a party of 18 guests they arrived at 7pm and they were gone by 9:30 pm, I was the only server for that party, made $140. I tended bar one St Patty's day 11 am-6pm and made $200.

The money was great sometimes, but it was not consistent enough for me.

Plus after work we would go drinking and I would spend 30-40% of my cash I made any given day so I knew I had to get something else, But it sure was fun while it lasted.