New Warmachine faction- Convergence of Cyriss (Enigma Foundry, pg 24!)

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**Buzzsaw**

Bossk_Hogg wrote:
Its worth noting the cyriss models have more variance than other faction units. The infantry can change weapons, the warcaster changes the unit stats, etc. Each new unit is effectively several from what I understand. That's got to take more design time to avoid breaking the game, particularly with the new focus mechanic. Building slower after release makes the most sense.

On the other hand, they really need to give minions some extra releases to catch up in any kind of variety. If they are thornfall or blindwater specific, they dont require to be balanced for inclusion in every other faction. Each pact only got 2 in the last book, which is just sad.

It's probably important to note that, as a faction (we think) intended to run jack heavy, adding a single warcaster changes the options for the army in a way that is very different from adding a caster to another faction.

Because of the shared stats and Field Marshal ability, PP has the ability to dramatically change the way the army plays with just a warcaster.

That said, it's unlikely that PP would allow the faction to languish if it turned out that a quirk of the metagame really turned it into a poor play choice.

**Surtur**

Well, on the plus side, at least they're up front and honest about this.

**Sidstyler**

Gentleman_Jellyfish wrote:
Just because they didn't say that as soon as the faction was released doesn't mean they wanted to pull a fast one on us.

I disagree, personally. Just because they willingly revealed the information now doesn't mean they weren't initially being deceptive. Otherwise why not reveal the info along with the initial wave of model pics, video, etc.? Because it's obviously information that could cause someone to think twice about spending the cash on a new faction, and putting that news out there along with all the pretty pictures would immediately kill the hype they were trying to build. So they show people all the good and get them drooling over model pics, then hit them with the bad news later in hopes that most people will be committed to buy it regardless, and fewer people will be turned off than would be initially.

Still better than how GW would handle something like this, but is that really saying much?

**PhantomViper**

Sidstyler wrote:
Gentleman_Jellyfish wrote:
Just because they didn't say that as soon as the faction was released doesn't mean they wanted to pull a fast one on us.

I disagree, personally. Just because they willingly revealed the information now doesn't mean they weren't initially being deceptive. Otherwise why not reveal the info along with the initial wave of model pics, video, etc.? Because it's obviously information that could cause someone to think twice about spending the cash on a new faction, and putting that news out there along with all the pretty pictures would immediately kill the hype they were trying to build. So they show people all the good and get them drooling over model pics, then hit them with the bad news later in hopes that most people will be committed to buy it regardless, and fewer people will be turned off than would be initially.

Still better than how GW would handle something like this, but is that really saying much?

There are still close to 2 months to go until the models are PRE-released, that is plenty of time for people to change their minds.

Its not like they released this information the week before Lock & Load.

**RiTides**

I've come completely 'round on it

and if it pushes a few people away from the already LARGE number who are going to be picking up Cyriss at my local store

so much the better. I'd rather not be playing mirror matches all the time...!

And as others have pointed out, if this works it gives PP the flexibility to introduce new things without over-burdening the normal production/release schedule. I think it's a win-win, personally.

I also think they should've made it a bit clearer in the initial anouncement, but their clarifying it now is just fine, imo.

**Gentleman_Jellyfish**

Sidstyler wrote:
Gentleman_Jellyfish wrote:
Just because they didn't say that as soon as the faction was released doesn't mean they wanted to pull a fast one on us.

I disagree, personally. Just because they willingly revealed the information now doesn't mean they weren't initially being deceptive. Otherwise why not reveal the info along with the initial wave of model pics, video, etc.? Because it's obviously information that could cause someone to think twice about spending the cash on a new faction, and putting that news out there along with all the pretty pictures would immediately kill the hype they were trying to build. So they show people all the good and get them drooling over model pics, then hit them with the bad news later in hopes that most people will be committed to buy it regardless, and fewer people will be turned off than would be initially.

Still better than how GW would handle something like this, but is that really saying much?

I keep seeing people on their forums say that they said they were getting a limited release in the Templecon Keynote, but I haven't seen it so I'm not sure.

**OrlandotheTechnicoloured**

If people want to see stuff before it's fully fleshed then they've got to be prepared for it to change

WIPs may not be identical to final models

Projected release dates may change

Rules may not be the same as originally planed

Future plans may evolve (what was originally meant to be a major faction becomes a smaller 'splash release')

**RiTides**

Gentleman_Jellyfish wrote:
I keep seeing people on their forums say that they said they were getting a limited release in the Templecon Keynote, but I haven't seen it so I'm not sure.

I was at TempleCon and heard the Keynote, and I didn't hear that / none of the people I was with heard it. None of the people I geeked out with about the Convergence at the Con mentioned it. *shrug* Maybe in private conversations or maybe it was a side comment that only a few picked up on, but really, I think it's a stretch to say that it was in the Keynote personally... since I was there and all

But it really doesn't matter to me, I'm excited about the more one-shot nature of it anyway

and having a lot of options released right away instead of slowly.

**happygolucky**

I think the CoC units look class, but would love to see the Angels (Angels in wargames give me a good feel and enthusiasm for an army

).

My prediction (or thoughts) for the next book for the Warmachine saga fluffwise (concering CoC) is that it will be a few months or a year after the colossals timeline and Cryx will have a bigger expansion of there ground after their fortress castle being revealed, and Khador and Cygnar being hard pressed by current ongoing attacks by Cryx, little do they know that the Cults of Cyriss have been working a lot to contact their godess on Urcean and suceed after a while trying, they then proceed to decent into the Heart of Cryx terratory (I.E Big fortress/castle) and obliterate it forcing Cryx to make a massive retreat back to whence they came, however CoC will take the ground, Cryx have lost and establish a base from there giving CoC a land on the current world, and Cygnar and Khador face a new threat (as well as leaving Nemo wanting answers from the Cults).

Just what I think may happen in the next expansion book, so not trying to say that this is what is going to happen, just my opinion on what may happen.

**Gentleman_Jellyfish**

RiTides wrote:
Gentleman_Jellyfish wrote:
I keep seeing people on their forums say that they said they were getting a limited release in the Templecon Keynote, but I haven't seen it so I'm not sure.
But it really doesn't matter to me, I'm excited about the more one-shot nature of it anyway and having a lot of options released right away instead of slowly.

And if it sells as good as the internet makes it seem, I'm sure PP wouldn't let the opportunity to cash in on more models pass.

**Wehrkind**

I am curious to see if they will change up their expansion book strategy in general, given how many factions there now are and how much ground there is to cover. Considering the models for each book are pretty much released in a bell curve around the book release date, they could probably swing a different structure and still get good results.

**Gentleman_Jellyfish**

Wehrkind wrote:
I am curious to see if they will change up their expansion book strategy in general, given how many factions there now are and how much ground there is to cover. Considering the models for each book are pretty much released in a bell curve around the book release date, they could probably swing a different structure and still get good results.

According to PPS_Simon, the anthology books will continue on as normal, CoC just isn't guaranteed to be in all of them.

**Wehrkind**

Yea, I am just rolling to disbelieve

If only because it still seems odd to me how they maintain a wall between their two game systems that you play against each other, in the same world, at the same time, with only the slightest of mechanical differences.
My guess is they will start releasing books not by game, but by who is getting models that quarter, and who is relevant in the fluff, with the exception of "Big new rules!" books, though I don't see why that would be required either, really. And by "guess" I mean "what I would do"

**Gentleman_Jellyfish**

Wehrkind wrote:
Yea, I am just rolling to disbelieve If only because it still seems odd to me how they maintain a wall between their two game systems that you play against each other, in the same world, at the same time, with only the slightest of mechanical differences.
My guess is they will start releasing books not by game, but by who is getting models that quarter, and who is relevant in the fluff, with the exception of "Big new rules!" books, though I don't see why that would be required either, really. And by "guess" I mean "what I would do"

I'm sure it's for the legal flexibility that gives them. Maybe at this point it's too late to go back and rejoin them

**Wehrkind**

That's interesting, I hadn't considered that it would be a legal benefit. Do you think that benefit would dissolve if they released a book including both systems? Or models that worked in both? I have never run into this idea before!

**Platuan4th**

They already have models that work in both. There are a number of Mercs that are also Minions as well as Minions that are also Mercs(in fact, the very first release of Primal MkI contained them).

**TechMarine1**

So, are they going to come out with a lists of what mercenaries can work for Cyriss, or are they a "purist" faction?

**Polonius**

PhantomViper wrote:
Sidstyler wrote:
Gentleman_Jellyfish wrote:
Just because they didn't say that as soon as the faction was released doesn't mean they wanted to pull a fast one on us.

I disagree, personally. Just because they willingly revealed the information now doesn't mean they weren't initially being deceptive. Otherwise why not reveal the info along with the initial wave of model pics, video, etc.? Because it's obviously information that could cause someone to think twice about spending the cash on a new faction, and putting that news out there along with all the pretty pictures would immediately kill the hype they were trying to build. So they show people all the good and get them drooling over model pics, then hit them with the bad news later in hopes that most people will be committed to buy it regardless, and fewer people will be turned off than would be initially.

Still better than how GW would handle something like this, but is that really saying much?

There are still close to 2 months to go until the models are PRE-released, that is plenty of time for people to change their minds.

Its not like they released this information the week before Lock & Load.

Yeah, I can see being upset that it's not a fully supported faction, but I have a hard time mustering up any outrage about information released months before pre-orders. To do so, you're basically asking a company to reveal informaiton about their long term strategy when they first announce a product. Which is a bit much, IMO.

**spiralingcadaver**

TechMarine1 wrote:
So, are they going to come out with a lists of what mercenaries can work for Cyriss, or are they a "purist" faction?

Last I heard, purist.

**PhantomViper**

TechMarine1 wrote:
So, are they going to come out with a lists of what mercenaries can work for Cyriss, or are they a "purist" faction?

None of the current mercenaries will work for Cyriss.

Story reason: Cyriss doesn't like non-metallic beings that much.
Rules reason: It would be a PR and logistical nightmare to sort out which mercenaries should or shouldn't work for them and release new stat cards for those that do!

**malfred**

PhantomViper wrote:
TechMarine1 wrote:
So, are they going to come out with a lists of what mercenaries can work for Cyriss, or are they a "purist" faction?

None of the current mercenaries will work for Cyriss.

Story reason: Cyriss doesn't like non-metallic beings that much.
Rules reason: It would be a PR and logistical nightmare to sort out which mercenaries should or shouldn't work for them and release new stat cards for those that do!

I'm guessing we won't know until the book is out.

When Ret was released, the list of mercs was in the books iirc.

**PhantomViper**

malfred wrote:
PhantomViper wrote:
TechMarine1 wrote:
So, are they going to come out with a lists of what mercenaries can work for Cyriss, or are they a "purist" faction?

None of the current mercenaries will work for Cyriss.

Story reason: Cyriss doesn't like non-metallic beings that much.
Rules reason: It would be a PR and logistical nightmare to sort out which mercenaries should or shouldn't work for them and release new stat cards for those that do!

I'm guessing we won't know until the book is out.

When Ret was released, the list of mercs was in the books iirc.

I'm not making an assumption, I'm stating a fact, this information was release by PP during the Q&A part of the Templecon announcement.

**malfred**

Thanks!

**KarlPedder**

I do hope in light of this the "purist" aspect will be dropped as far as some future Merc releases go. Having existing Mercs errated into being able to be used by the faction is messy but I think having at least 1 Merc entry per anthology that could be used by CoC would take away some of the sting of this revelation.

**RiTides**

I'd rather Cyriss not be connected to mercs at all, personally.

**Gentleman_Jellyfish**

RiTides wrote:
I'd rather Cyriss not be connected to mercs at all, personally.

Yea I agree with this, I'm sure after two playtest cycles PP found a way to make an army diverse and interesting.

**Laughing Man**

Snipped from today's Insider, giving a look at 'Jack support solo and unit.

Today’s Convergence of Cyriss Insider shines the spotlight on the Optifex Directive and the Algorithmic Dispersion Optifex. Unlike the mighty chromed-steel clockwork soldiers of the Convergence who stride into battle heedless of death, the Optifex Directive and Algorithmic Dispersion Optifex are living warrior models with little to protect their vulnerable human bodies.

The Optifex are peerless engineers and mechanics that serve vital roles on and off the battlefield. The Optifex Directive is a three-man unit capable of repairing a clockwork soldier or vector, though the Repair [8] skill is far from their primary function. Rather, this unit is all about increasing the efficiency of their warcaster’s vectors and fine-tuning them for changing battlefield conditions. The All-Terrain special action allows an Optifex in B2B with a friendly Faction construct to give that model Pathfinder. Does your Cipher need to clear a linear obstacle on its way to wreck face? Or maybe the Iron Mother wants to show the opposing warcaster her fancy cloak of blades, but there’s some rough terrain in the way? A few adjustments from your friendly Optifex Directive and you’ll be off to the pain-race.

The Optifex Directive can also do a little short-term tinkering with Convergence weaponry to give it some magical punch. An Optifex Directive in B2B with a friendly Faction construct can use the Weapon Modulation special action to grant the Magical Weapon advantage. Need to get around a Wind Wall? Pesky Pistol Wraiths got you down? Call in the Directive and transform your mundane weapon woes into the joy of magical destruction!

Astute readers have probably noticed we’ve yet to mention a vector with an Arc Node. This is because the Convergence has found an altogether different solution for extending the reach of their warcaster’s arcane might.

The Algorithmic Dispersion Optifex solo has perhaps the most thankless and dangerous job in the Convergence. He accompanies his warcaster’s vectors into battle, tapping into their residual energy fields to empower his subharmonic tuning apparatus. This complex mechanikal device allows friendly Faction warcasters to channel spells through him while he is within 5˝ of a friendly Faction vector. With FA 4 and at a cost of only 1 point, the Algorithmic Dispersion Optifex grants Convergence warcasters a greatly increased threat range for their spells.

All this flexibility does come at a price. Both types of Optifex are rather squishy. The Iron Sentinel ability gives both the Optifex Directive and Algorithmic Dispersion Optifex a much-needed DEF and ARM boost while in B2B with a friendly Faction vector, but even that won’t protect them against a concentrated attack.

However, should the worst befall your faithful Optifex, never fear! For the Convergence has ways of making sure the souls of the faithful can continue the fight in the Maiden’s name, even in the heat of battle.

But that revelation is best saved for another time!

And concept art!

**cygnnus**

Laughing Man wrote:

And concept art!

I can't really say why, but to me that just screams...

IGNORE ME!!!

Cool design though...

Valete,

JohnS

**Grimtuff**

Theophony wrote:
I think the troopers might look cooler if the shields were made of some semitransparent plastic, don't know the story, but an energy wall is what I'd prefer.

Retribution say "Hi!".

**AduroT**

cygnnus wrote:

I can't really say why, but to me that just screams...

IGNORE ME!!!

Cool design though...

Valete,

JohnS